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Media Create Sales Jan 22 - 28
- Thread starter Cheesemeister
- Start date
Joe Molotov
Member
pollo said:
No, this is the biggest baby ever.
AlternativeUlster
Absolutely pathetic part deux
ethelred said:
Man, you should be a lawyer.
AlternativeUlster
Absolutely pathetic part deux
Joe Molotov said:No, this is the biggest baby ever.
I really hope people don't start posting pictures of fat people in diapers. I am not ready for that.
AlternativeUlster
Absolutely pathetic part deux
AniHawk said:
Jesus christ that is humorous. Laugh emotioncon.
Joe Molotov
Member
AniHawk said:
Is there a situation that GIF can't be made to fit? :lol
Joe Molotov
Member
VicAlpha said:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070201/ap_on_fe_st/mexico_big_baby
It's actually not the biggest baby ever, but it is quite large.
Cosmonaut X
Member
cvxfreak said:I guess something bad for Nintendo?
Just paste drohne's icon over her head & you'd be good to go... ;-)
Cosmonaut X
Member
lawnjam said:
Nope - based on official 2007 NeoGAF figures with a 3% adjustment to account for underreporting...
MrSardonic
The nerdiest nerd of all the nerds in nerdland
Jonnyram said:
It would be a shame if someone accidently emailed CESA, it really would
BrodiemanTTR
Member
cvxfreak said:I guess something bad for Nintendo?
Just put the bad news first, and then have the screen show worldwide DS LTD.
Jonnyram said:
I'm not publicising any copyright, non-public data, I am publicising my data, some of which is BASED ON research from a number of sources - one of which being the CESA research that I PAY to subscribe to (along with many others). I fully understand the copyright agreements and do not reproduce any data. All the numbers on VGCharts are estimates from myself. For example, the Japanese data uses public figures from MC / Famitsu / Dengeki + others as well as CESA estimates (which can be found on the Internet if you look hard enough) as well as manufacturer shipments. CESA have publicised their estimated sales per year (totals) which have been used on my site to tie up with my weekly amounts. The data I listed is just the raw yearly data which as I say can be found on many Japanese sites and blogs.
You sit here making Media Create threads and posting all sorts of 'non-public' data, that is much much worse than anything I am doing.
If you think I aim to make money of VGCharts you are seriously deluded. The hundreds of hours spent so far putting snippets and scaps of data together and producing the site, along with other site-related investments, hosting and so on far outweigh any money that has been made by the site so far. I recently purchased over 500 old Famitsu magazines and have been sitting with each one in turn gathering as much data as possible to use in the site. Square has been doing similar things with North American charts so we can estimate those also. You guys have no appreciation for the work and effort that is going on here. VG Charts should be seen as a saviour for all you sales-obsessed gamers, not ridiculed because a number is 473 copies higher than the number elsewhere.
The intention is to provide a FREE SERVICE for people like yourselves who are interested in this info. It does get my back up when people start picking holes and throwing accusations and totally missing the point of the site. It clearly says on the site (at the recommendation of people on here) that the data is unofficial and incomplete and if anything it would be nice to get some support from you guys rather than this all the time.
fly high ~ayunite~
Member
Joe Molotov said:
The poor woman who had to push that thing out! Ouch!
MrSardonic
The nerdiest nerd of all the nerds in nerdland
ioi said:
he doesn't make M-C threads and the data in these threads is public.
ioi said:
you don't seem to understand that when someone modifies numeric data without explaining the source data or the methodology, then it is no longer reliable. the "secrecy" surrounding the data and methods on your site is precisely why it cannot be taken seriously.
until you clear it all up, you will always have these self-inflicted problems
MrSardonic said:
I wasn't referring to 'him' specifically, although he has often posted non-public data on here.
I don't mind if you guys don't think the data is reliable. I don't mind if you don't use it as a rigorous source of data. But to totally dismiss it, even though most data is 99% the same as all the other data you use, is what makes no sense.
I always said from the beginning that the site is not an official source. It is not official data, it is a collection of data and a labour of love for 2 people who want to try and make as much data as accurate as they think possible and obtainable for the general public
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
98% of all statistics are made up.lawnjam said:
DefectiveReject
Banned
Bit harsh i know, but i'm sick of threads getting derailed because of your site.ioi said:
Pureauthor
Member
ioi said:
I think I have to jump over on ioi's side of the fence in his recent defensive argument. No one can get certifiable proper sales, let alone data from a decade back. I may dismiss VG Charts as much as the M-C lovers do in this thread but there comes a time when issues like that are just starting to lean to the obnoxious side.
And DefectiveReject, sp0rsk already laid down the law about the no VGC in M-C threads.. to which I am guessing ioi is abiding by (if I'm mistaken, then forgive me as I don't troll these threads when it hits 10 pages+). It's the random joe who seems to be resurrecting it.
And DefectiveReject, sp0rsk already laid down the law about the no VGC in M-C threads.. to which I am guessing ioi is abiding by (if I'm mistaken, then forgive me as I don't troll these threads when it hits 10 pages+). It's the random joe who seems to be resurrecting it.
I myself dont see what the big deal is, and some of you are bieng just outright mean to the guy. I dont think he even brought it up this time.
If I could I would put a week ban on some people here for starting the VG discussion, and for those instigating the problem, cuasing the discussion they so revile.
The numbers on his site, while off in some instances, are close to the real deal, and we NEVER get 100% accurate numbers anyway, from ANYONE. It IS, regardless of what some of you state, the best databade for sales numbers I've ever come across, and it has some pretty cool features ta' boot.
Lay the **** off the guy already, and return to normal discussion. You've all said your piece, as has he. Now STFU about it already.
If I could I would put a week ban on some people here for starting the VG discussion, and for those instigating the problem, cuasing the discussion they so revile.
The numbers on his site, while off in some instances, are close to the real deal, and we NEVER get 100% accurate numbers anyway, from ANYONE. It IS, regardless of what some of you state, the best databade for sales numbers I've ever come across, and it has some pretty cool features ta' boot.
Lay the **** off the guy already, and return to normal discussion. You've all said your piece, as has he. Now STFU about it already.
Square2005
Banned
Alright guys I feel I need to say some things about VGCharts:
ioi is actually doing the site for all of our benefit so we have a database of WW video game sales like we do with movies, etc.
Wouldn't you agree we could use something like that w/ the recent surge in interest in video game sales? The site has alotta potential but if he doesn't change/address our complaints it will become the jokesite among all gaming fanboys (not just gaffers).
Now, I've been making suggestions to ioi on how to improve his site and would now like gaffers to make some suggestions of things to change/add?
Think of me as the PR of the site:
Yes, I understand ioi can be very stubborn but if you are kinder in your complaints maybe he'll consider your suggestions...
If he continues to refuse and I think it's a good/reasonable idea; I'll get him to change his mind! I have the power
! And it's for his own good, right...?
Now, since most of the complaints are with the J. sales, I suggested he make it more like Shrine of Data/NOVA. He has a massive load of weekly Famitues back to 1989, I think he should create a section with actual/raw Famitsu/m-create charts untouched w/o any of his own estimates (w/ch should go in another section). Since it is J. sales he can make those exact figures public (unlike NPD). Then we could access data going back 18 years knowing it's straight from official sources (famitsu/m-create) instead of having to trust ioi's estimates...then at least part of his website will be of worth to gaffers (no offense ioi), right?
What else do you guys suggest (be nice/reasonable)?
ioi is actually doing the site for all of our benefit so we have a database of WW video game sales like we do with movies, etc.
Wouldn't you agree we could use something like that w/ the recent surge in interest in video game sales? The site has alotta potential but if he doesn't change/address our complaints it will become the jokesite among all gaming fanboys (not just gaffers).
Now, I've been making suggestions to ioi on how to improve his site and would now like gaffers to make some suggestions of things to change/add?
Think of me as the PR of the site:
Yes, I understand ioi can be very stubborn but if you are kinder in your complaints maybe he'll consider your suggestions...
If he continues to refuse and I think it's a good/reasonable idea; I'll get him to change his mind! I have the power
ie. more sales data
Now, since most of the complaints are with the J. sales, I suggested he make it more like Shrine of Data/NOVA. He has a massive load of weekly Famitues back to 1989, I think he should create a section with actual/raw Famitsu/m-create charts untouched w/o any of his own estimates (w/ch should go in another section). Since it is J. sales he can make those exact figures public (unlike NPD). Then we could access data going back 18 years knowing it's straight from official sources (famitsu/m-create) instead of having to trust ioi's estimates...then at least part of his website will be of worth to gaffers (no offense ioi), right?
What else do you guys suggest (be nice/reasonable)?
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Square, "which" cannot be shortened into "w/ch".
Believe me guys, I'm more sick of this whole debate than anyone else.
My intention never has been to derail threads and cause problems.
When I post something like:
"well that is more than the, say, 200,000 copies Mario World did in its first week"
I'd like people to go
"oh wow, it is doing well"
not
"well your numbers are bs, get out of this thread etc etc"
Yes the 200,000 figure or whatever isn't perfectly accurate, but it is a good estimate based on a Famitsu chart from the time and scaled based on good common sense and info about coverage at the time, matching up to total sales etc.
I don't want people to debate the source of numbers every time I post, but to realise that they are in the right ballpark and debate what the numbers mean - is the game selling well? Is it doing better than the last incarnation? That is surely the aim of these threads??
My intention never has been to derail threads and cause problems.
When I post something like:
"well that is more than the, say, 200,000 copies Mario World did in its first week"
I'd like people to go
"oh wow, it is doing well"
not
"well your numbers are bs, get out of this thread etc etc"
Yes the 200,000 figure or whatever isn't perfectly accurate, but it is a good estimate based on a Famitsu chart from the time and scaled based on good common sense and info about coverage at the time, matching up to total sales etc.
I don't want people to debate the source of numbers every time I post, but to realise that they are in the right ballpark and debate what the numbers mean - is the game selling well? Is it doing better than the last incarnation? That is surely the aim of these threads??
Good god. This is not going to end well.Square2005 said:
Anyway;
Just sync the numbers up with what IS KNOWN. It's very simple. Some of the numbers dont match what we get every week. That is the biggest complaint.
It's an awesome collection of data, and comparing tools(System VS system sales liftime, game vs game liftime e.t.c..) but of the Data is NOT what people see here, it will be laughed at as a wierd hybrid of real/made up numbers.
Fix that, and fix the problem.
ioi fix the damn japanese numbers. EVEN IF YOU DONT WANT TO. Your doing this so videogame fans can use your site in discussions, e.t.c. Your site is WORTHLESS unless you conform to the numbers that everyone else sees.
The only other option is to completly explain, and show how you get your data, but that doesnt sound like an option. You know what you have to do to make yourself a viable source, so go do it, or get laughed at.
That sounds harsh, but its the truth.
BTW, I use your site all the time, and IM SURE alot of other people who bitch about your site here, use it as well.
moku said:
This is more like it, maybe we can actually try and have a reasonable discussion this time? (In a new thread if people want...)
Let me know whether to continue in this or start a new, because I really want to try and sort all this out and fix whatever problems people have...
Pureauthor
Member
Alright, if you really want to work to get this site taken seriously, you basically have moku's options.
-Sync data to what we accept
or
-Explain how you received and arrived at your current numbers.
That's all.
-Sync data to what we accept
or
-Explain how you received and arrived at your current numbers.
That's all.
Cheesemeister
Member
Stop. Arguing. Already. FFS.
How can you sit there and say this with a straight face? MC, Famitsu and Dengeki get sales data from stores and extrapolate it into charts. The same goes for NPD. What are you doing? You're taking someone else's work and you're saying that you did it. Anyone could do the same. But we're not interested in it, because it lacks accuracy. You've had it pointed out time and time again, but you never accept it. You just secretly change your numbers without telling anyone and wait till you're outed again.ioi said:
How exactly is M.C. 'non-public'?
Since you started this project, we've been telling you it's nonsense, complaining that your numbers are inaccurate, but never once have you listened to any of our feedback. Your response has always been "mimimimimi, it's my work, BASED on other people's work, mimimimimi". You're stubborn as hell, and as someone who is supposedly making a site for US, you sure as hell don't listen to US much.
Jonnyram said:
Why is it nonsense? It is a collection of sales data going back 20 years that in most cases agrees 99% with whatever data you can find elsewhere. How can that be nonsense?
Which figures exactly are inaccurate? If you can take the time to list specific cases I will look into each. You said Genji was high compared to other data you obviously have so I went back and re-evaluated it. After week 4 i had just assumed a similar pattern over xmas weeks to the other PS3 launch games. Obviously it had more of a drop-off so I have changed it. I will do this whenever someone points out an error, I am only human and only have so much data to hand!! Help me fix any mistakes.
My work is the bit that compiles and averages all the data that I can get my hands on, codes a website and thinks of nice ways to tabulate and present the data.
I am listening to you. I am here. Talk to me and I'll listen.
Pureauthor
Member
*removes hat out of respect for ioi*
Wait... I'm not wearing a hat.
*one minute of silence*
Wait... I'm not wearing a hat.
*one minute of silence*
moku said:
no, it's not. he was warned over and over and banned for short periods of time over this very issue. over and ****ing over. he knows he's not even allowed to discuss his site in any context, no matter the situation. that was a privalege he lost because he refused to behave.
if you have any further questions, feel free to PM me or e-mail moderation staff.
VietBitter said:
GAF has a long memory.
I said this the last time this came up (and once again, it was shortly after ioi was banned
), but I think everyone would like his site much better if he offered the option of using non-adjusted data. The site's graphing capability is nice (just like joshuajslone's site for hardware), so it would be nice to graph easily with non-adjusted data.Maybe a compromise would be that only non-adjusted data was used until the data was 2 years old. Then adjustments would be made. ioi has admitted himself that the farther back you go, the more accurate the data would be (shipments vs. weekly totals from tracking services). Therefore the more recent data would have the most discrepencies from reality.
Just a thought.
Well, whats done is done. I'm not going to argue with you, as your a mod, and you'll do what you think is right to maintain balance here.Amir0x said:
ALL I am saying is that he didnt bring it up, someone else did. Nothing more, nothing less.
In any event, anyone have any new MC numbers? I know the sales dont hit untill wednesday, but we sometimes get a sneak-peek.