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[Teknoman]

Whats so spoilierish about that?

Edit: Never mind I think I sorta see.

 

[madmook]

I wish Eva didn't have to be so tits-out in this game. ;_; Old lady with a juicy rack made her cutscenes weird. Should've been Rose with her funbags on display.

 

[Xtyle]

I really don't have that many problems with the plot of MGS4 and I actually like how it all comes together conceptually, despite my earlier criticisms. (The only real problems I have there are

Spoiler

Ocelot's immunity to Foxdie until, conveniently enough, the climax, as opposed to every other target of it, and Ocelot's seemingly willingness to kill Snake with Outer Haven at the end of Act 4.

) No, my major problems with the narrative aren't the actual major story points, but the execution in Acts 4 and 5. Like I've said before, they raise the stakes too high over and over again and put several characters through near-death experiences time and time again and then expect us to feel any tension/worry/concern over their fate. (And that's not even to mention the way the narrative is distributed- with some better editing, I really think the ending could have been made WAY better- even using the exact same story. Too many characters repeat the same explanations and the game cuts to abstract charts and diagrams with voiceovers too many times.)

I feel that's too nitpicky...I mean the charts don't show up more than a few times in the 23 hours I played. They are usually not overly long too...maybe you are right they can do without them, but I don't think it hurts the game as it is.
A lot of people who finished it shed tears the more towards the end (myself included)...it is obviously the story actually works, at least for most people as it seems.

 

[Solo]

Worst game, because how the hell am I meant to play any other game without a tinge of disappointment now? Dammit Kojima! Your bar is too high!

Just wait for Hideo Kojima's next game,

Spoiler

Metal Gear Solid 5. Come on, who believes HK anymore when he says he's done directing these games? We heard that after MGS2, MGS3, and MGS4. I fully expect "MGS5 - a Hideo Kojima game" to be unveiled at E3 or TGS or something like that in 2009.

 

[EekTheKat]

Checking it out.



First paragraph: Knowing what we know now, Snake's adventures seem to have been seriously degraded, in my opinion. Their impact lessened.

Spoiler

He's nothing but a pawn, and it seems everyone else was in on it, Otacon excluded. That element makes both Snake and Otacon seem like chumps. I don't like that. It's like taking a giant dump on a storied character. All the stuff that happened in MGS1 and 2 seems so, for the lack of a better word, pointless.

I can see how some will see brilliance in Kojima's decision, calling it gutsy and whatnot, but it's not quite sitting well with me. I feel so disillusioned. :lol

Snake (or soldiers/people)

Spoiler

being a pawn is a common theme

in every Metal Gear game.

The difference between MGS4 and the previous games is that this time Snake

Spoiler

is given the choice to live life as a man and not a snake, once it all ended

 

[boco77]

Spoiler

Ocelot woulda been pissed if he was still alive and found out he had gone into all that trouble into bring Big Boss back only to have him die by Snake at the end with FOXDIE.

The other thing I didnt really get was why Eva/Big Mama was killed by Snake..she knew? Why would she want to die? And she also believed it was the real body of Big Boss that got burnt right? So at the end of Act 3 Liquid Ocelot knew that the Big Boss body that got burnt was fake too?

 

[Steiner_Zi]

I agree with EekTheKat. Snake was a pawn in MGS1 when he activated REX just as Liquid wanted him to, Raiden was a pawn in MGS2 and Big Boss along with his great mentor are pawns of American and Russian politicians.

boco,

Spoiler

BB willingly died by the end. All he wanted was see the Patriots gone along with Zero and meet his son once more to tell him the whole truth and finally make peace with hum. The final realization of the mistake he made when he killed the Boss ("since I killed you, I was already dead") is a very important point in the plot.

 

[SRG01]

I finished the game over the weekend and here's my thought:

Spoiler

Ocelot has the exact same role The Boss had in MGS3.

Think about it: In order to fool the Patriots and the AIs, he would have to become the most villified person in modern history. In the end, it was all a big show to distract everyone else while Snake got the job done.

There were two big clues mid-game as to who Ocelot really was. The first was EVA directly calling him ADAM, and the second was when Ocelot use the hand-gestures to blow everything up.

Now here's what I feel is the bigger question: Did Vamp know what was going on too?

 

[Gribbix]

I have a question about incapacitating soldiers. I'm currently on my second playthrough and I'm going for no alerts/kills. I assume that if a soldier appears unconscious and has no stars or 'zzz' above his head, then he's dead. It seems that I keep accidently killing them whenever I use the CQC move where you wrestle them face down to the ground. Am I correct in assuming that's a lethal move and that I'd be better off using the throw down move?

 

[Guled]

Spoiler

Ocelot woulda been pissed if he was still alive and found out he had gone into all that trouble into bring Big Boss back only to have him die by Snake at the end with FOXDIE.

The other thing I didnt really get was why Eva/Big Mama was killed by Snake..she knew? Why would she want to die? And she also believed it was the real body of Big Boss that got burnt right? So at the end of Act 3 Liquid Ocelot knew that the Big Boss body that got burnt was fake too?

Spoiler

I don't think that they wanted him alive, just free from zero so he could pick. remember, he couldn't die, or live, he was trapped. They both knew the body was solidus, not fake. Eva knew she was going to die, so she made it more believable and she played her role (just like the boss in mgs3). she was willing to lose her life to bring down the patriots.

 

[EdgeTurn]

Snake (or soldiers/people)

Spoiler

being a pawn is a common theme

in every Metal Gear game.

The difference between MGS4 and the previous games is that this time Snake

Spoiler

is given the choice to live life as a man and not a snake, once it all ended

I agree with Eek - hasn't the main character (Snake/Raiden/Big Boss) of every single Metal Gear game been

Spoiler

an unwitting pawn in the plans of some mastermind? Snake was working for Big Boss in the original MG games, and then in MGS1 he was accidentally helping Liquid (by activating Metal Gear) and the Patriots (by spreading FoxDie). Raiden was helping the Patriots to kill Solidus and advance the System for Societal Sanity in MGS2. And Big Boss was aiding the Boss in completing her mission in MGS3 - she even says that it is the fate of soldiers to always be pawns of those above them. Big Boss's whole dream revolved around freeing soldiers from the shackles of policymakers and putting them in charge of the world through Outer Heaven. In MGS4 it's the first time Snake's actually been able to escape from being a pawn and achieve a normal (albeit short) life. I'd say everything that happens thematically in MGS4 is entirely appropriate.

 

[EekTheKat]

Spoiler

Ocelot woulda been pissed if he was still alive and found out he had gone into all that trouble into bring Big Boss back only to have him die by Snake at the end with FOXDIE.

The other thing I didnt really get was why Eva/Big Mama was killed by Snake..she knew? Why would she want to die? And she also believed it was the real body of Big Boss that got burnt right? So at the end of Act 3 Liquid Ocelot knew that the Big Boss body that got burnt was fake too?

I can't answer the whole thing (I really need to play through it again to watch for some of the details),

but ...

After watching the ending again though

Spoiler

it's implied that Ocelot had split from Eva before Eva managed to retrieve Big Boss's body (which IIRC had something to do with Raiden, and the rescue of Sunny). So Ocelot really had no idea that it was Solidus on that rack thing.

 

[traveler]

I feel that's too nitpicky...I mean the charts don't show up more than a few times in the 23 hours I played. They are usually not overly long too...maybe you are right they can do without them, but I don't think it hurts the game as it is.
A lot of people who finished it shed tears the more towards the end (myself included)...it is obviously the story actually works, at least for most people as it seems.

The charts bit is nitpicky- it was just an example of issues I had with the execution of the story. There were far more serious problems I had with the story than them. (As I illustrated in that same post.)

 

[Ephemeris]

Finished the game with the Eagle rank.

After replaying the previous games prior to playing 4, sometimes playing this game seemed a little surreal. Welcome to next-gen Snake.

I wouldn't say the ending was as emotional as MGS3's but for what it had to do - that is, wrap up some loose ends - it accomplished its mission.

Paired with MGO, it's simply the best game this gen so far.

 

[Brandon F]

So this game is pretty much a lock for GAF GotY I presume?

 

[traveler]

I think you guys are bought by obviously pandering endings way too easily- MGS3's entire final sequence is basically "The Boss underwent the worst things possible- cry for her now." They could have made the

Spoiler

EXACT same ending for MGS4 had they wanted to, only subbing in Ocelot- a character who has actually been given some development throughout the series unlike the Boss who, from her first moment, we're supposed to accept she's a great figure- for every instance of the Boss instead. But since we didn't get that extremely heavyhanded "Don't you understand, Snake? Ocelot was a true Patriot!" speech with overbearing music playing over it, you guys don't feel as moved? :lol

 

[Slurmer]

Just wait for Hideo Kojima's next game,

Spoiler

Metal Gear Solid 5. Come on, who believes HK anymore when he says he's done directing these games? We heard that after MGS2, MGS3, and MGS4. I fully expect "MGS5 - a Hideo Kojima game" to be unveiled at E3 or TGS or something like that in 2009.

MGS5:

Spoiler

The Bucket List

 

[Liabe Brave]

The other thing I didnt really get was

Spoiler

why Eva/Big Mama was killed by Snake..she knew? Why would she want to die? And she also believed it was the real body of Big Boss that got burnt right? So at the end of Act 3 Liquid Ocelot knew that the Big Boss body that got burnt was fake too?

The game doesn't answer quite everything in detail. For example, I don't think we can know

Spoiler

whether Ocelot knew it was Solidus rather than Big Boss. They're genetically identical, and it's not like you could tell by the face. The extent of Ocelot's self-belief of himself as "Liquid Ocelot" goes unexplored.

As for Big Mama, she may not have wanted to die, but a 78-year-old woman getting motorcycle-wrecked and impaled and burnt is liable to go out, FoxDie or not. It's not like Solid Snake had a choice, or even knew that he was dooming her. As for why she'd go into the fire, she might be Solidus' surrogate mother too; in that case she'd be trying to save her "son" rather than her lover.

The game is really concerned with explaining things, but it also wants to set up parallels to the events of the various previous games. Those two goals are at odds, and sometimes they cause a little uncertainty.

Spoiler

Making Ocelot into a Boss-esque figure is one of those clashes.

 

[Teknoman]

So this game is pretty much a lock for GAF GotY I presume?

Should have an honorary position as such. Gears 2, Resistance 2, or even RE5 might kick tons of ass, but nothing is coming out this year to close off a saga like this.

Im wondering what the next Metal Gear saga will be though. I still think they should've saved Ac!d for the saga after the Solid series was over. Not the gameplay, but the name itself.

Also i read earlier...even though I didnt want to that

Spoiler

EVA was killed by Snake's New FoxDie virus contagion, however it just looked like she suffered bad burns and already had a gaping wound from being thrown off the bike via Raging Raven

So is that something that is revealed later? If so, dont explain, yes or no will be fine.

 

[traveler]

So this game is pretty much a lock for GAF GotY I presume?

It's my favorite game of the year so far, but, given Acts 4 and 5, I wouldn't be surprised if something else beats it out by December.

Edit: Yes, teknoman.

 

[Greg]

It's my favorite game of the year so far, but, given Acts 4 and 5, I wouldn't be surprised if something else beats it out by December.

Haven't finished Act 5, but I feel the same way - both have fallen short of the previous 3 acts...

 

[Steiner_Zi]

LOL, GTA4 seems already to have been forgotten as contender for GOTY.

 

[Teknoman]

It's my favorite game of the year so far, but, given Acts 4 and 5, I wouldn't be surprised if something else beats it out by December.

Act 4 seems pretty great so far, unless it dies down later on.

EDIT: There are two many contenders this year. So much great stuff released this year.

 

[JCtheMC]

Finished Act 1 for my no Alerts, Kills, Continues or Recovery items run, but need some help going forward. Where can i find more chaff grenades? ACT 4 Spoilers:

Spoiler

I know you can pick some up in the MGS1 "dream"... but how do i get through that area without any alerts? I've never played the original and i'm pretty sure an alert there would count toward the total

 

[traveler]

Act 4 seems pretty great so far, unless it dies down later on.

Lots of people here have enjoyed it, so I wouldn't be surprised if you did as well. I'd explain my reasons again, but they might be spoilerish to you still and I've already elaborated plenty of times- no need for me to take up more space right now complaining. (If you give a crap, just check out my post history when you're done with it)

Edit: JC, alerts- as well as deaths- there do NOT count towards your rank. (At least, that's what the guide says.)

 

[Teknoman]

Lots of people here have enjoyed it, so I wouldn't be surprised if you did as well. I'd explain my reasons again, but they might be spoilerish to you still and I've already elaborated plenty of times- no need for me to take up more space right now complaining. (If you give a crap, just check out my post history when you're done with it)

Gotcha. Also whoever said you cant buy more tranq.bullets, thats not true.

 

[traveler]

Gotcha. Also whoever said you cant buy more tranq.bullets, thats not true.

You can't buy more tranq bullets (difficulty spoiler)

Spoiler

on The Boss Extreme setting,

so for those interested in Big Boss rank runs, be sure to stock up on tranqs, as well as

Spoiler

emotion bullets

, before you start your run.

 

[JCtheMC]

Edit: JC, alerts- as well as deaths- there do NOT count towards your rank. (At least, that's what the guide says.)

I'm going for the

Spoiler

Stealth Camo

, that's the reward for a no Alerts run, right? I needz cuz i is n00b.

 

[Slurmer]

I loved Act 4

 

[traveler]

I'm going for the Stealth Camo. I needz cuz i is n00b.

I'm pretty sure they don't count for that either. (Although the stealth camo will prevent you from getting some of the ranks- but I'm guessing you're getting it to screw around and not for a Big Boss emblem or something)

Edit: Yes, you get it for a no alert run.

 

[JCtheMC]

I'm guessing you're getting it to screw around and not for a Big Boss emblem or something.

Um.. i was actually getting it for a completely clean run on the

Spoiler

The Boss Extreme

difficulty level.. What are the requirements for the Big Boss emblem? You can't use the stealth camo at all?

 

[traveler]

Um.. i was actually getting it for a completely clean run on the

Spoiler

The Boss Extreme

difficulty level.. What are the requirements for the Big Boss emblem? You can't use the stealth camo at all?

I'm pretty sure you're not allowed to use any special items and I think the SC qualifies. Could be wrong though.

Edit: Yup, sorry. I just checked the guide- no Bandanna or Camo. You can still use it on that difficulty level- you just can't use it if you want the BB rank.

 

[Darkpen]

something I'd like to note:

During act 1, if you talk with Otacon sometime after the haven trooper mansion fight, he asks how Snake suddenly knows how to do CQC.

I'd like for everyone to listen to this codec conversation, because it puts MGS3, as a game, in an interesting light.

Spoiler

Its almost as if MGS3 was a fanciful interpretation of the past, as several MGS3 fans have speculated, based on how ridiculous the game is.

 

[bloody pirate]

what are special items?

 

[MiamiWesker]

something I'd like to note:

During act 1, if you talk with Otacon sometime after the haven trooper mansion fight, he asks how Snake suddenly knows how to do CQC.

I'd like for everyone to listen to this codec conversation, because it puts MGS3, as a game, in an interesting light.

Spoiler

Its almost as if MGS3 was a fanciful interpretation of the past, as several MGS3 fans have speculated, based on how ridiculous the game is.

Huh? I heard that codec call, I dont remember anything like that.

 

[Teknoman]

something I'd like to note:

During act 1, if you talk with Otacon sometime after the haven trooper mansion fight, he asks how Snake suddenly knows how to do CQC.

I'd like for everyone to listen to this codec conversation, because it puts MGS3, as a game, in an interesting light.

Spoiler

Its almost as if MGS3 was a fanciful interpretation of the past, as several MGS3 fans have speculated, based on how ridiculous the game is.

Anyone youtubed it? Im still on my first go, but missed this out. Didnt start calling otacon every so often until Act 2.

 

[JCtheMC]

Edit: Yup, sorry. I just checked the guide- no Bandanna or Camo. You can still use it on that difficulty level- you just can't use it if you want the BB rank.

Could you list the Big Boss requirements? Also, does the guide say anything about those damn Chaff grenades...

Spoiler

those Three-armed crawlers

are the fucking bane of Snake's alert-free existence, and chaff seems the only suitable weapon.

 

[Barakov]

what are special items?

Maybe it's the

Spoiler

bandanna or the stealth camouflage.

 

[dagZ]

All Face Camo (captured and cropped by me, save from someone else)



Or view in a page at imagevenue (safe for work)
http://img154.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=18231_mgs4-facecamo_122_985lo.jpg

anyone have that save?

 

[Metal Gear?!]

something I'd like to note:

During act 1, if you talk with Otacon sometime after the haven trooper mansion fight, he asks how Snake suddenly knows how to do CQC.

I'd like for everyone to listen to this codec conversation, because it puts MGS3, as a game, in an interesting light.

Spoiler

Its almost as if MGS3 was a fanciful interpretation of the past, as several MGS3 fans have speculated, based on how ridiculous the game is.

Actually it lends credence to the theory that MGS3 was

Spoiler

a VR simulation of the past

 

[Grayman]

LOL, GTA4 seems already to have been forgotten as contender for GOTY.

GTA backlash will ensure that it isn't in contention.

 

[Crayon]

These graphics.....

The biggest shock starting this game was how amazing the graphics are in person. The earlier media all seemed so flat. I think it blows everything on consoles out of the water.

 

[jjasper]

I just picked up the LE guide today. Jesus I missed so much stuff:lol

Also getting the

Spoiler

Big Boss emblem

is going to be hard.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

Actually it lends credence to the theory that MGS3 was

Spoiler

a VR simulation of the past

So what did they say?

 

[Shawsie64]

In the middle (i think) of act 3.. my god this game is awesome! had no hype whatsoever going in and picked it up on a whim

Spoiler

doing the motorbike section just now, soooo instense!

 

[Narag]

Actually it lends credence to the theory that MGS3 was

Spoiler

a VR simulation of the past

Spoiler

People have used the same notion regarding TTS implying that its more of a fanciful take on the actual events at Shadow Moses or Raiden's VR training. While I like the idea its getting a little out there.

 

[Captain Glanton]

The

Spoiler

giant mech fight

at the end of Act 4 was so much fun.

Spoiler

I want my next-gen MechAssault!

 

[Kintaro]

You can defeat the bosses with the tranq gun right? Anything special for doing so? I'm on Laughing Mantis and if you can, it must take forever. =x

 

[BigBlackGamer]

Just beat the game. not the greatest game I played so far this year and I still have many gripes with the gameplay and story. That being said this is the killer app for PS3 no doubt. However I will not be playing MGS4 again. Great Experience all around but not something I want to jump back into after Im done.

 

[maskrider]

Finished the first time. Heh ! Feeling great and am very sleepy.