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Metal Gear Solid 4 |OT| No Place to Hide, No Time for a Legend to FoxDie
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dermannmitdemcolt
Member
Gamer @ Heart said:
Like every game that ever was or will be created. What's your point? It's still miles better than everything else this gen.
Brandon F said:
The year has another 6 months to go.
Anyways, its the best thing so far this year, but at the same time, 3 of the 5 acts are "meh". So while another game this year may not hit the heights of MGS4 at its best, I find it hard to believe that something more consistently great won't come along before the end. Through Act 1 and 2, MGS4 is worthy of all the hype, but Act 3 thru 5 really are inferior.
Torquill
Member
jjasper said:
One possible answer is the same reason for Ocelot's act, to fool the Patriots. Perhaps she knew she was dead from Foxdie already anyway and just wanted to put on a show.
Really? I liked 4...
And that's on it's own merits as a sneaking exercise and the boss fights, not just because of where it was. It was cool that it was Shadow Moses, but I dind't have quite the uber hard-on some other folks here did for that particular element 
Gamer @ Heart said:
Really? I see the same people posting over and over again complaining. Odd. The number isn't really growing.
The talk of the Ocelot shit is fucking stupid, if you don't get it, you really REALLY must have some troubles grasping basic concepts. Ocelot couldn't take the patroits head on. No one could, they controlled everything. But, if he could gain access to the system, he could take it out.
He turns the patriots against themselves. The Patriots use Snake to take out GW, they don't know that taking out GW will take them out as well. It's pretty fucking simple. It would have been harder for Ocelot to take them out himself, so he uses the Patriots (who use Snake) against themselves. They give snake weapons support and intel via Drebin. Basically snake, in a sense, was the Patriots 'foxdie' and they didn't even know it. They use him thinking he'll take out ocelot, while ocelot is playing him, knowing he'll eventually take out the patriots.
The Patriots Never Know that Ocelots goal is to take them out. The entire time they think he is trying to gain access to the system so he can control it, not destory it. Which is why they send Snake to kill him, to stop outerheaven.
Very simple. Get over it.
He turns the patriots against themselves. The Patriots use Snake to take out GW, they don't know that taking out GW will take them out as well. It's pretty fucking simple. It would have been harder for Ocelot to take them out himself, so he uses the Patriots (who use Snake) against themselves. They give snake weapons support and intel via Drebin. Basically snake, in a sense, was the Patriots 'foxdie' and they didn't even know it. They use him thinking he'll take out ocelot, while ocelot is playing him, knowing he'll eventually take out the patriots.
The Patriots Never Know that Ocelots goal is to take them out. The entire time they think he is trying to gain access to the system so he can control it, not destory it. Which is why they send Snake to kill him, to stop outerheaven.
Very simple. Get over it.
dermannmitdemcolt
Member
Solo said:
That may be your opinion. For me the last three Acts are even more awesome than the beginning of the game and I'm certanly not the only one who thinks so.
I think the story is quite flawed for sure. Its pretentious, its convoluted, its Metal Gear. I feel, in the realm of storytelling in videogames, its three steps forward and one step back. Overall I suppose I'm happy with it. But you can tell that they could've done much more.
I kind of wish we got an ending like the one from the suppose'd Escape from New York prequel. It would've kept the legend going in a great way. Honestly I was kind of hoping for something like that. But ya never know, I'm sure they'll think of something. They just have to get back to something more simplistic.
I kind of wish we got an ending like the one from the suppose'd Escape from New York prequel. It would've kept the legend going in a great way. Honestly I was kind of hoping for something like that. But ya never know, I'm sure they'll think of something. They just have to get back to something more simplistic.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
Nah, we just don't need to post repeatedly about the same things. Doesn't change the fact that this is the best game this year so far.Gamer @ Heart said:
Torquill said:Really? I liked 4...And that's on it's own merits as a sneaking exercise and the boss fights, not just because of where it was. It was cool that it was Shadow Moses, but I dind't have quite the uber hard-on some other folks here did for that particular element
Not to mention how amazingly cinematic Act 3 became.
Dabookerman
Member
Gamer @ Heart said:
Not me! It still is better than Zeruda No Densetsu!
dermannmitdemcolt said:
Of course its my opinion - who else's would it be?
I can't picture anyone enjoying following that resistance member for 20 minutes in Act 3. I couldn't get past the fanservice in Act 4, and as for Act 5, you barely play at all.
Act 1 and Act 2 are solid gold, though, no complaints there.
I don't see why people don't like the last 3 acts. I know the gamplay changed, but it was for the better. Act 4 had the best bosses in the game, act 3 had the
and awesome ending cutscene, and act 5 had the
and final fight. Those are the best moments of the game for me. If they kept the same formula for the entire game, then it would get repetitive fast. I like the varied gameplay, you never do the samething twice, and everything you do is awesome
bike chase
microwave room
but I can see why some people might not like the stalking part in act 3 (but I liked it)
Gamer @ Heart
Member
In time people, in time. I didnt say everyone was.
Anyway, Nothing could make me happier than to play a full game that played out like Act 2. So amazing.
Anyway, Nothing could make me happier than to play a full game that played out like Act 2. So amazing.
burgerdog said:
They don't.
P.S. For the 3 people who care, I'm installing Act 4 on my BB Rank Extreme run right now. Had to do all of Act 2 over yesterday, something was counted as a kill. :|
3 was hell. Pure hell. But its over now. Should be easy going from here until
possibly Rex Vs. Ray, and surely Ocelot.
Edit: Fucked up spoiler tag, was going too quick during an install, sososososo sorry. :|
TheBranca18 said:
then it's a really shitty plan since it's very possible that
the Liquid side could end up killing Snake thereby foiling Ocelot's reason for becoming Liquid in the first place and ruining all of his plans for destroying the AIs. as a matter of fact, he TRIED TO KILL SNAKE with a bunch of missiles in MGS2 but was stopped by Fortune (though we never know how she was able to deflect the missiles.)
really, it's all very sloppy.
Dabookerman
Member
Gamer @ Heart said:In time people, in time. I didnt say everyone was.
Anyway, Nothing could make me happier than to play a full game that played out like Act 2. So amazing.
I'm sure their will be. And instead you play as Raiden.
Dabookerman
Member
SnakeXs said:
NOOOO.. you spoilt me :_; how will I live with myself now <
Torquill
Member
TheWolf said:
Mmm, maybe. THat's the thing though, one of the aspects of Ocelot I consistently noticed the most was his penchant for NOT killing Snake. Perhaps you can think it as it was present, Liquid Ocelot, not Liquid Snake. Ocelot wearing the mantle of personality, but still in control of his own will. (Big Boss kind of drives at this as well, maybe). Also, what makes you think Fortunes sudden return of power wasn't Ocelot's doing in the first place? (perhaps that wasn't the original intent of the scene, but that certain makes the pieces fit together better)
Why do people try to analyze characters' reactions while being biased by their knowledge of later parts of the game / series. Some things could not make sense now that you know more stuff, but they did make sense when you played the game or part of the game at that time. The characters are in the exact same position.
Dabookerman
Member
TheWolf said:
"Our boy.. He's right on schedule."
MGS4 is definitely light on the gameplay. 8 hours of cutscenes and my first run through on solid normal left about 8 hours remaining for gameplay. I'd estimate MGS3 had about twice the gameplay time, and more like 3x if you compare my play times for each respective game on Extreme. Don't know how feasible it would be to really address that in a hypothetical MGS4:S, since the cutscenes and gameplay are woven so tightly together. And throwaway extra scenarios like Snake Tales or Snake vs Monkey tend to not excite.
This really all goes back to the point that MGS4 is a sequel to MGS2, not MGS3. I think that's going to be inherently disappointing on some level.
This really all goes back to the point that MGS4 is a sequel to MGS2, not MGS3. I think that's going to be inherently disappointing on some level.
dermannmitdemcolt said:
Ignore Solo, he's been on a mission since he came in this thread to tell us all how much the last 3 acts are terrible, and how all of us are wrong for liking them.
He also wants us all to know how much we're victim to hype and hyperbole, and the game didn't live up to it's expectations.
Darkpen said:
Gah, sorry. Posted these on another board, then copy/pasted the post here.
Anyway ...
2nd attempt here: Click on these pics only if you've beat Laughing Octopus:
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08252/south_america_research_lab525.jpg
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08252/south_america_research_lab_1875.jpg
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08252/south_america_research_lab_2973.jpg
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08252/south_america_research_lab_3343.jpg
http://xs128.xs.to/xs128/08252/south_america_research_lab_4475.jpg
tha_con said:
Good christ the defense force is out in full this morning. Do you react this same way in real life when someone doesn't share the same views as you? Also, how many times do I have to say that MGS is my favorite gaming franchise, and that I love a lot of what MGS4 is selling? But you must have your Solid Eye blinders on to gloss over the game's flaws like you are doing.
EviLore said:
Speedruns of every game seem to get all the games down to about an hour and a half of gameplay. I'm pretty confident MGS4 will boil down to about that too ultimately. I think the proportion of cutscenes makes it feel differently, but-- and this is somewhat interesting-- Snake Eater can be beaten quicker than the original.
There might be quirks in the speed runs to cause this, but I always like to identify them as pure indicators of how much content in the game "isn't skippable."
TheBranca18 said:
Solidus came latter, but they don' say who the mother was. I'm sure its safe to say EVA since she was the mother for the other 2. Another reason why she jumped in the fire was that she knew she was going to die, so she jumped in to make it more convincing to the patriots.
Dabookerman
Member
Solo said:
I do. I pretty much beat the crap out of them, until they finally agree with my opinions.
But on topic regarding Solidus:
Big Mama did not birth Solidus, she does not mention it at all. The surrogate mother was probably a different pawn of The Patriots. It is never mentioned, because it probably isn't relevant.
The only things that get to me is how much potential act 3 had, given how big it is ;/ And act 5 only having two 'real' gameplay areas. Act 5 could be completed in less than 10 minutes flat. *
With that said, I absolutely love act 1, 2, and 4 because of the amount of gameplay in them.
not counting ocelot fight
With that said, I absolutely love act 1, 2, and 4 because of the amount of gameplay in them.
DemonSwordsman
Banned
Solo said:
Act 3 was amazing i dunno what your talking about. And i'm not saying only the end of act 3 but the whole atmosphere and gameplay was tons of fun especially the last part.
Act 4 the nostalgia is great but i do agree its kinda lame infiltrating an empty base, but it wasnt that bad just because of nostalgia.
I havent started act 5 yet so cant really comment. BUT i don't see any other game coming out this year that can match this. Gear of War 2 while being great i dont think its a GOTY type game, same with resistance 2
dermannmitdemcolt
Member
Solo said:
Then picture me. I love this Act mainly because of its atmosphere and the story development but I also enjoyed the mechanics of the chase sequence. Though I would agree that it is a tad too long.
I thought they handled it pretty well. And you throw this word (fanservice) around like an insult - I don't understand this attitude.
I agree.
But the whole Showdown with the Microwave Room and the fight against Ocelot was just too awesome.
If the whole game had been like that, it would've gotten very repetitive. For me at least. The same battlefield gameplay for every chapter? Not a good idea. Not at all.
Torquill
Member
TONX said:
I dont' think she did actually. She specifical mentions Solid and Liquid, not Solidus. Given the types of clones they are it would also make more sense if Solidus had a different surrogate. He's not involved in the twin snake dominiate/recessive hoopla, he's a seperate, pure clone. Likely born at the same time (roughly) but not from the same mother.
Wrestlemania
Banned
How do theytha_con said:
control Snake to their own ends then?
Dabookerman
Member
The plot drove the last two acts. I don't think they could of changed the acts to the war settings without having to completely alter the story. It is understanable, and personally, playing the game for the first time, the amount of varied gameplay is astounding. I am sure they will make another game that will purely cater the war mechanics, and everyone will be happy and laugh and cry and play soggy biscuit.
EviLore said:
Hmm, I felt more like MGS4 wasn't so much as a sequel to just MGS2, as it was a continuation of MGS2, 3, and Portable Ops, all wrapped into one package. It does a really good job of piecing together all 3 of those games into one package, and MGS1 is used only as fan service and backstory, with little influence on the game itself (or rather, the story).
As for MGS4: S or whatever it will be, I think there are certainly things they could address for a re-release.
One thing I would like to see is scenarios where the gameplay of Act 1 and 2 are fleshed out into larger missions. Think of a bunch of different battles against PMC's in those area's with different objectives, where you can either help the Militia, or just sneak past them all and get to your objectives, with different rewards (face camo and new weapons maybe?) for each different way you complete them.
Then of course, there is always the theater mode, out takes, and all that jazz.
Lastly, one thing I would improve in MGS4 is a change of pace for Act 3. It could have been better with more spice thrown in it. More helicopters and search lights, more alternate paths, and different methods of finding the Resistance HQ rather than just following one member. If they had something like following tips over radio frequencies, maybe listening to a few civilians (who may be resistance members) for hints, tips, a better use of the disguise system (the ability to dress as a soldier and civilian) and THEN following the Resistance member...that could work a little bit better and would certainly be more engaging.
Dabookerman
Member
Wrestlemania said:
Drebin.
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