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Metal Gear Solid 4 |OT| No Place to Hide, No Time for a Legend to FoxDie

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B

boco77

Banned
The story to this series is quite easily the best in a videogame I ever come come across. When you look at the series as a whole it it simply amazing. It covers on so many different things. When I finished MGS4 I was like wow what a epic ride that was.
 
P

Phatcorns

Member
When does Snake say "Kept you waiting, huh?" in the entire series besides after the initial install. I swear I remember hearing him say it in the Japanese version sometime, only it was 待たせたな
 
D

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
gbovo said:
Just finished the game. This was my first MGS game, though I've known about the series since MGS1. What more can I say, it's the best game released this generation and one of the greateset games of all time.
Click to expand...
Interesting. You enjoyed it that much without having played the other games? I honestly surprised by that. Glad you enjoyed it, though.
 
C

Cartman86

Banned
boco77 said:
The story to this series is quite easily the best in a videogame I ever come come across. When you look at the series as a whole it it simply amazing. It covers on so many different things. When I finished MGS4 I was like wow what a epic ride that was.
Click to expand...

Agreed and no matter how many plot holes there might be I just don't care. This is a videogame and there is nothing like it in the medium. And nothing as emotionally fulfilling as MGS4 was for me.
 
B

boco77

Banned
Cartman86 said:
Agreed and no matter how many plot holes there might be I just don't care. This is a videogame and there is nothing like it in the medium. And nothing as emotionally fulfilling as MGS4 was for me.
Click to expand...

Totally agree.
 
Huggers

Huggers

Member
Help me out here Gaf. How do you hold up an enemy at gun point. Whenever I sneak up behind one and press L1 nothing seems to happen, so I get a bit closer and try again but still no joy, then they spot me and I'm forced to murder them, what am I doing wrong?
 
N

Ninja Kn1ght

Member
The Hug Dog said:
Help me out here Gaf. How do you hold up an enemy at gun point. Whenever I sneak up behind one and press L1 nothing seems to happen, so I get a bit closer and try again but still no joy, then they spot me and I'm forced to murder them, what am I doing wrong?
Click to expand...

You have to be really close. L1 is what you need to press so just keep trying till you get the hang of it.
 
6

65536

Banned
The Hug Dog said:
Help me out here Gaf. How do you hold up an enemy at gun point. Whenever I sneak up behind one and press L1 nothing seems to happen, so I get a bit closer and try again but still no joy, then they spot me and I'm forced to murder them, what am I doing wrong?
Click to expand...
You have to hit R1 to grab them and then L1 to aim, don't you?
 
A

archnemesis

Member
The Hug Dog said:
Help me out here Gaf. How do you hold up an enemy at gun point. Whenever I sneak up behind one and press L1 nothing seems to happen, so I get a bit closer and try again but still no joy, then they spot me and I'm forced to murder them, what am I doing wrong?
Click to expand...
Don't press L1 until you are really close to the enemy. If you want to search him/her you need a free hand, so equip a handgun or a SMG.
 
6

65536

Banned
U K Narayan said:
L1 will do just fine. R1 is if you want to use CQC on them.
Click to expand...
Oh right, I read that wrong actually. I thought he meant to grab them and then be able to use a gun. (use them as a human shield basically)
 
G

Gremmie4

Member
I'm reposting this to see if someone can help me with some info since this thread was moving fast yesterday.

Gremmie4 said:
Has somebody here imported the soundtrack from play-asia to the States? I live in Ohio and I'm curious how much the shipping costs would be. The price is already $29, and if shipping isn't too much I might bite the bullet and buy it since I really want it. I wish KojiPro, or whoever is responsible for the soundtrack, would release it in the US so I wouldn't have to worry about this crap.
Click to expand...
 
D

drohne

hyperbolically metafictive
finished it last night, best game ever etc, but the last segment of the ending is bothering me

i expect mgs to be ridiculously convoluted and implausible -- i can take that in stride -- but the idea that ocelot deliberately took on or feigned the liquid persona is such total nonsense that one's brain recoils from it. why, for pity's sake? what did this accomplish that he couldn't have accomplished in some infinitely simpler way? i can't come up with anything resembling an answer. did kojima and murata even think this through in some casual way before they threw it in? sometimes i wish that my favorite game development genius would behave more responsibly
 
D

Dragon

Banned
drohne said:
finished it last night, best game ever etc, but the last segment of the ending is bothering me

i expect mgs to be ridiculously convoluted and implausible -- i can take that in stride -- but the idea that ocelot deliberately took on or feigned the liquid persona is such total nonsense that one's brain recoils from it. why, for pity's sake? what did this accomplish that he couldn't have accomplished in some infinitely simpler way? i can't come up with anything resembling an answer. did kojima and murata even think this through in some casual way before they threw it in? sometimes i wish that my favorite game development genius would behave more responsibly
Click to expand...

He had to fool the Patriots, so he went through hypnosis and other things in order to be Liquid. The plan all along was to have Snake help Otacon upload the virus. Otacon thought it was going to disable just GW ( I think), but instead it spiderwebbed out from GW to the other AI and disabled them too. Which was Ocelot's plan all along
 
G

Gamer @ Heart

Member
I just played Twin snakes for the past hour. I went through all the debriefings before playing all the way to the chief dying. Man this did not age well. Its not ugly....but considering MGS3 still looks amazing and it came out only 8 months later, its not good looking. Camera didnt drive me crazy like i thought it would but not being able to crouch and walk was incredibly annoying.
 
D

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
Gamer @ Heart said:
I just played Twin snakes for the past hour. I went through all the debriefings before playing all the way to the chief dying. Man this did not age well. Its not ugly....but considering MGS3 still looks amazing and it came out only 8 months later, its not good looking. Camera didnt drive me crazy like i thought it would but not being able to crouch and walk was incredibly annoying.
Click to expand...
Twin Snakes was dated immediately upon release. It looks significantly worse than MGS2.

The actual visuals are less detailed and often ugly while the framerate chugs on a regular basis.
 
S

Steiner_Zi

Member
TheBranca18 said:
He had to fool the Patriots, so he went through hypnosis and other things in order to be Liquid. The plan all along was to have Snake help Otacon upload the virus. Otacon thought it was going to disable just GW ( I think), but instead it spiderwebbed out from GW to the other AI and disabled them too. Which was Ocelot's plan all along
Click to expand...
But not why not just tell them to do it and instead deceive them?
And why pretend to be Liquid, since being a villain by himself would also drive Snake against him.
 
J

jonhuz

Member
Attempting Big Boss emblem. Regarding Act 1 where you meet up with the Mk II. The amoured tank that appears, can you destroy it (won't count as a kill), in order to get the militia on side. It would make the run to Drebin much easier.
 
D

Dabookerman

Member
Steiner_Zi said:
But not why not just tell them to do it and instead deceive them?
And why pretend to be Liquid, since being a villain by himself would also drive Snake against him.
Click to expand...

It's almost The Boss all over again. You have The Patriots helping Snake and the gang trying to defeat "Liquid". Ocelot is manipulating Snake in a way so Snake is the one who disables The Patriots. It's kinda difficult to explain, but once you get your head around it, it makes perfect sense
 
Â

∀ Narayan

Member
Steiner_Zi said:
But not why not just tell them to do it and instead deceive them?
And why pretend to be Liquid, since being a villain by himself would also drive Snake against him.
Click to expand...
Because it would obviously
tip off The Patriots, and they would find some way to circumvent the oncoming crisis affecting them exclusively.
 
D

Double D

Member
dark10x said:
Is that a positive or negative feeling? :p
Click to expand...

Kind of indifferent, I guess. I'm really enjoying the game, but I'm at the point where I just kind of want the story to unfold a little quicker to me, really only because I just want to have the knowledge under my belt.
Also, the structure of Act 2 kind of bothered me. By the time I got to the battle with
Laughing Octopus
, I was more than ready to move on to the next area. I enjoyed the content after that (holy shit
Raiden!
), but at that point I just kind of had a bad taste in my mouth after assuming that would be the end of Act 2. I guess it's a pretty trivial thing, but it's just how I felt.
 
G

Guled

Member
The LE guide has a very nice synopsis and interpretation that clears up everything. I could post some if it up if ppl want it.
 
B

boco77

Banned
drohne said:
finished it last night, best game ever etc, but the last segment of the ending is bothering me

i expect mgs to be ridiculously convoluted and implausible -- i can take that in stride -- but the idea that ocelot deliberately took on or feigned the liquid persona is such total nonsense that one's brain recoils from it. why, for pity's sake? what did this accomplish that he couldn't have accomplished in some infinitely simpler way? i can't come up with anything resembling an answer. did kojima and murata even think this through in some casual way before they threw it in? sometimes i wish that my favorite game development genius would behave more responsibly
Click to expand...


I had no idea Ocelot
actually feigned and orchestrated the whole Liquid persona from the start. He did this from MGS2 onwards? I dont remember it being mentioned in MGS4...I guess this must have just flew past me because after finishing MGS4 as I thought Ocelot's personality only come through at the end when you fight him? Didn't Liquid and Ocelot want the same thing after all? He grafted Liquid's arm onto himself and when you heard Liquid's voice on MGS2 when Ocelot spoke that was fake too?
 
J

jjasper

Member
boco77 said:
I had no idea Ocelot
actually feigned and orchestrated the whole Liquid persona from the start. He did this from MGS2 onwards? I dont remember it being mentioned in MGS4...I guess this must have just flew past me because after finishing MGS4 as I thought Ocelot's personality only come through at the end when you fight him? Didn't Liquid and Ocelot want the same thing after all? He grafted Liquid's arm onto himself and when you heard Liquid's voice on MGS2 when Ocelot spoke that was fake too?
Click to expand...

Big Boss mentions it in at the end. Also is it even Liquid's arm? It looked mechanical (nonhuman) to me during the fight
 
T

TheWolf

Banned
boco77 said:
I had no idea Ocelot
actually feigned and orchestrated the whole Liquid persona from the start. He did this from MGS2 onwards? I dont remember it being mentioned in MGS4...I guess this must have just flew past me because after finishing MGS4 as I thought Ocelot's personality only come through at the end when you fight him? Didn't Liquid and Ocelot want the same thing after all? He grafted Liquid's arm onto himself and when you heard Liquid's voice on MGS2 when Ocelot spoke that was fake too?
Click to expand...

yeah. it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

if Ocelot's plan was to have Snake upload the virus, he wouldn't have tried to charge him with the boat since there is no way he could have known Raiden would cut his own arm off and save Snake.

also, the new FoxDie sure took a long time to kill Liquid Ocelot considering he was exposed to it in act 3.
 
D

Darkpen

Banned
drohne said:
finished it last night, best game ever etc, but the last segment of the ending is bothering me

i expect mgs to be ridiculously convoluted and implausible -- i can take that in stride -- but the idea that ocelot deliberately took on or feigned the liquid persona is such total nonsense that one's brain recoils from it. why, for pity's sake? what did this accomplish that he couldn't have accomplished in some infinitely simpler way? i can't come up with anything resembling an answer. did kojima and murata even think this through in some casual way before they threw it in? sometimes i wish that my favorite game development genius would behave more responsibly
Click to expand...
boco77 said:
I had no idea Ocelot
actually feigned and orchestrated the whole Liquid persona from the start. He did this from MGS2 onwards? I dont remember it being mentioned in MGS4...I guess this must have just flew past me because after finishing MGS4 as I thought Ocelot's personality only come through at the end when you fight him? Didn't Liquid and Ocelot want the same thing after all? He grafted Liquid's arm onto himself and when you heard Liquid's voice on MGS2 when Ocelot spoke that was fake too?
Click to expand...
TheWolf said:
yeah. it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

if Ocelot's plan was to have Snake upload the virus, he wouldn't have tried to charge him with the boat since there is no way he could have known Raiden would cut his own arm off and save Snake.

also, the new FoxDie sure took a long time to kill Liquid Ocelot considering he was exposed to it in act 3.
Click to expand...
It makes plenty of fucking sense.

:|

Jesus, you guys are awfully picky about the "reality" that the MGS universe exists in.

Its one thing to argue corniness and deus ex machina, its another thing to argue about the plausibility of it all.
 
B

boco77

Banned
TheWolf said:
yeah. it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

if Ocelot's plan was to have Snake upload the virus, he wouldn't have tried to charge him with the boat since there is no way he could have known Raiden would cut his own arm off and save Snake.

also, the new FoxDie sure took a long time to kill Liquid Ocelot considering he was exposed to it in act 3.
Click to expand...

Yeah this part of the plot doesnt make a lot of sense and is a bit too pretentious.
 
J

jjasper

Member
Ocelot wanted the patriots AI destroyed but he knew Snake was the Gun of the Patriots and attempting to stop him from doing it. Snake mission was never to destroy the AI it was to take out the remaining Patriots. From Ocelot's prospective Snake was on the Patriots side.
 
T

tha_con

Banned
Steiner_Zi said:
But not why not just tell them to do it and instead deceive them?
And why pretend to be Liquid, since being a villain by himself would also drive Snake against him.
Click to expand...

Because theeeen....the story would be boring, there would be no purpose to play the game, etc? I mean, that's like asking why they don't just nuke Raccoon City in Resident Evil. Kind of pointless, right?
 
D

drohne

hyperbolically metafictive
wait, maybe it's like this:

when liquid ocelot runs off with gw at the end of mgs2, iirc he says that he intends to extract the names of the patriots and hunt them down. this wouldn't worry the patriots, since they're actually AIs -- but ocelot running off with gw would worry them. that, i suppose, is ocelot's initial motivation. and he keeps up the act because the patriots would respond to liquid's insurrection plot by sending snake in, thereby giving him an opportunity to plant naomi's virus -- whereas they'd take more decisive measures against any attempt by ocelot to plant the virus himself. generally he pretends to be liquid because the patriots wouldn't perceive liquid as a serious threat.

that's still awfully silly, but i think i can live with it. as for why l.o. tries to kill snake at the end of act 4, i don't think we should suppose that ocelot is in complete control of his liquid persona.

...i still don't understand why eva jumped into the flames at the end of act 3 when there's no way she could think that was actually big boss's body
 
D

Darkpen

Banned
foxdie took forever to kill Ocelot, fairly long to kill Eva, and not all that long to kill Big Boss

:|

WHO CARES. MGS AM MELODRAMA. Shakespeare says hi.
 
D

Dragon

Banned
TheWolf said:
yeah. it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

if Ocelot's plan was to have Snake upload the virus, he wouldn't have tried to charge him with the boat since there is no way he could have known Raiden would cut his own arm off and save Snake.

also, the new FoxDie sure took a long time to kill Liquid Ocelot considering he was exposed to it in act 3.
Click to expand...

Ocelot took on Liquid, he became Liquid's personality in order for Snake to do what he did. He didn't "fake" anything. Through hypnosis and psychotheraphy he became Liquid, his personality, his mannerisms everything. So he wasn't going about it half ass at all. He was planning beforehand for all this to happen, before he became Liquid and figured out that this was the best way for it to happen.
 
B

burgerdog

Member
I got the Altair costume last night, wonder if I should go for bandana and optical camo now >.> Hm, does anyone know if 'alerts' count during the intro?
 
J

jjasper

Member
drohne said:
...i still don't understand why eva jumped into the flames at the end of act 3 when there's no way she could think that was actually big boss's body
Click to expand...

This is the only thing that didn't make any sense to me.

Gamer @ Heart said:
I see people are slowly losing their MGS4 highs. Its a great game, but its got some flaws.
Click to expand...

It is mainly with the story. But this was bound to happen. It's a videogame series that had a continuous and interlinking storyline, spanned 7 games and 20 years there are bound to be plot holes.
 
A

Aeonin

Member
Ok, I seriously wasn't thinking when I did this. But I got one kill and one alert during the
Shadow Moses dream sequence
. Do you guys think that counts? Technically it isn't
real
. I'd be pissed if I finished the whole act only to find out I have one kill and one alert.
 
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