I tried doing that with every single frequency, and no it doesn't.
Bizzyb said:
OK I will give you
Sokolov being alive after the torture as a retarded plot twist.
But Zeros plans were set in motion well before Portable Ops.
Whoever in MGS4 stated that it was the CIA that had the Boss killed was obviously misinformed, as EVA was about the true happenings of BB. It may have been the CIA to call the shot but it was Zero who put the pieces in place, the gears in motion so to speak.
Zero knew that with Boss gone, the last living member of the Philosophers, he could use her death and memory as an institute for starting up his OWN organization. One that would, "uphold the ideals and wills of the Boss"...of course we know that didn't go as planned, as he got more Greedy and Corrupt with Power. BB saw this and disagreed with Zeros intentions, both thinking the other was not working in the true intentions of the Boss' will. I'm willing to bet BB had the better idea of what her true wills were seeing how they lived and trained 10 years together.
And yeah, he basically used Her and Ocelot to obtain the money (The Legacy) he would need to start his Organization
As for BB deciding to start Outer Heaven, think about it, before Portable Ops he had no real reason to want to do something like that, (despite being shitted on by the US govt) nor could he attain the vast amount of money and resources to ever make something like that happen. Not on his own. He doesn't have that type of influence or deep connections. But someone like Gene, who could easily influence others could very well be able to.
In POps, BB was thrusts into a position where he had hundreds of men fighting and dying for him and his cause. Prior to that he lived and worked alone, only for himself. And to top it off, he was shitted on a 2nd time by the US govt.
The problem I have is that none of this is even remotely hinted in MGS3, and you couldn't pay me to give a shit about Portable Ops. It just reeks of retconning, and of Kojima making it up all as he goes.
Im going through youtube right now, looking for the Portle ops story sequences and there seem to be alot more results with the same titles than i was expecting. Should i just watch the ending cutscenes or wacth them all. If you could link me to the one you guys have seen, that would be great.
My goodness the sound in this game is unmatched.
The weather sound fx the guns the explosions the damn flys. I am playing with these hella nice headphones
and I actually started feeling cold playing
The problem I have is that none of this is even remotely hinted in MGS3, and you couldn't pay me to give a shit about Portable Ops. It just reeks of retconning, and of Kojima making it up all as he goes.
Well the problem here is that Portable Ops IS cannon, despite you wanting to give a shit or not about it. Who are we to say that Kojima did not have the story of Portable Ops planned at the same time he did Snake Eaters? It is entirely possible. I'm sure it was more convenient of him to put it on a handheld and not have to make another big budgeted Epic just to flesh out a bit more of the plot.
Besides, MGS4 had MANY revelations that were not necessarily hinted at in the other games,
(Darpa chief being Sigint, anyone?)
but does that make it any less cannon? or is it because it's on a console and had a much larger budget that you can accept that?
Now, can someone PLEASE explain to me Why Ocelot would
Kill his fellow Patriot (Donald Anderson aka Sigint) during a torture session at Shadow Mosses. If he and Signit were in on the whole thing did he really have to kill Sigint??
SIGINT being Darpa Chief made no sense. There was a huge conversation back on the IGN Metal Gear boards a while ago and it was concluded that the age difference between the two characters was too big. Revising Dr. Clark to be Paramedic (Dr. Clark was a man in the original MGS) was also a bit of a stretch.
Personally, the game would've been much better if Zero was part of a few other players that formed the Patriots. Or at least play up the Pentagon/CIA involvement a bit since P.Ops was barely mentioned in MGS4.
The problem I have is that none of this is even remotely hinted in MGS3, and you couldn't pay me to give a shit about Portable Ops. It just reeks of retconning, and of Kojima making it up all as he goes.
Guy's, you're not doing me any favors by quoting Solo and his ridiculous idea that HIS taste in music is far superior to everyone else's, and that you're wrong if you like anything outside of his taste.
Has everything from the original metal gear up to MGS3 in full story/video format on youtube, including portable ops. You can watch the whole PO story (they cut out the boss fights and regular gameplay stuff).
Has everything from the original metal gear up to MGS3 in full story/video format on youtube, including portable ops. You can watch the whole PO story (they cut out the boss fights and regular gameplay stuff).
Started my second run through the game this weekend, this time on The Boss Extreme.
I'm not really going for any emblems or anything. If I happen to unlock some, great, but I really just want to experience the gameplay again, this time on a much harder difficulty. One thing I am trying to do is a no alert run this time (but I plan on killing plenty of people since my first playthrough was originally a zero kill but ended up with 11 because of stupid helicopters and mech soldiers, etc).
Took me hours just to get to the middle of Act 1 without an alert. But the gameplay is so good I really don't care. Sneaking around feels so good. The gunplay can still get a little unintuitive when there's too much happening, but I don't think MGS4 was built as a shooter so I don't hold that against the game.
Now a request: Does anyone have a hi-res (or native res) image of the Sunny & Naomi egg accident picture?
The irony, of course, is that Johnny was a genome soldier, meaning part of him is genetically the same as Solid Snake/BigBoss, right? I mean, you have to admit, he does kind of look like the MGS2 version of Snake with blonde hair (and diarrhea inducing bowels).
The irony, of course, is that Johnny was a genome soldier, meaning part of him is genetically the same as Solid Snake/BigBoss, right? I mean, you have to admit, he does kind of look like the MGS2 version of Snake with blonde hair (and diarrhea inducing bowels).
All I'm gonna say is, like all decent multiplayer games, get in there with a group of people you know (preferably with headsets). That way when you SOPup and communicate with each other, you actually have a huge advantage over everyone else.
...plus you can shoot the shit when the action is slow.
Is that a joke? He can't reproduce meaning he doesn't have to worry about accidental preggers, which is already a huge bonus (for him). On top of that, have you seen him lay down and creep along the ground? He can hump with the best of us... and if the Solid Eye picture thread on gaf is any indication, he loves getting a face full of Beauty-Form B&Bcorp ass.
All I'm gonna say is, like all decent multiplayer games, get in there with a group of people you know (preferably with headsets). That way when you SOPup and communicate with each other, you actually have a huge advantage over everyone else.
...plus you can shoot the shit when the action is slow.
said something about how all the PMCs (she called them children sometimes too) were just the siblings of people who died from the war economy -- they wanted to get back at those that killed their families, but that just fueled the war economy more. Ironic, huh?
Genome soldiers were a failed experiement because they didn't have the experience needed to make them decent soldiers (which is touched on and implied in MGS1 and 2). In MGS4, the experience is given to all people (no genome therapy required) via virtual experience through SOP.
That's the kind of doublethink I love kojima for... I mean, the huge metaphors, like the players being similar to the PMCs under SOP (except instead of nanos, we've gotten similar "war/combat" experience virtually through the MGS games). There's a word for it... meta-something...not post modern, but something where it's a recipricol of life and the game. I dunno, but that's why MGS4, despite all it's cutscenes, is the perfect example of an interactive narrative.
Genome soldiers was just an experiment and collectivization of data towards creating PMCs. PMCs didn't undergo gene therapy, but were implanted with nano machines which enhances some aspects and suppressed the others.
Random complaint: The sections seem overall too big this time around. In MGS3, I completed once doing a shadow run (ie, no alerts, no kills, no tranqs. As if the guards would never know someone was there if this were real life.). Every section felt like a small puzzle to try to sneak through.
Trying to do so in MGS4 is an excersise in futility. I was able to get through Act 1, but am stuck on the beginning of Act 2. The sections are too long, chock full o' men.
Genome soldiers was just an experiment and collectivization of data towards creating PMCs. PMCs didn't undergo gene therapy, but were implanted with nano machines which enhances some aspects and suppressed the others.
Ah, so Genome Soldiers were in MGS1 and MGS2 only?
What happened to them? There must've been hundreds if not thousands of them. Did they get integrated into the PMCs or just go and retire into the suburbs?
Ah, so Genome Soldiers were in MGS1 and MGS2 only?
What happened to them? There must've been hundreds if not thousands of them. Did they get integrated into the PMCs or just go and retire into the suburbs?
Random complaint: The sections seem overall too big this time around. In MGS3, I completed once doing a shadow run (ie, no alerts, no kills, no tranqs. As if the guards would never know someone was there if this were real life.). Every section felt like a small puzzle to try to sneak through.
Trying to do so in MGS4 is an excersise in futility. I was able to get through Act 1, but am stuck on the beginning of Act 2. The sections are too long, chock full o' men.
There are some checkpoints within levels.
While i didnt mind all the guys, i did mine having to load from the main menu every time i failed.
I tried doing a shadow run while Playing subsistance and having to wait and get myself killed to restart at the main menu was annoying as hell and was killing the fun. How did you deal with it?
The way I saw it was this (spoiler regarding Big Boss and
Zero
).
They both started with a common goal, but soon realized they both had different interpretations of the "will of the Boss," and wound up splintering into two opposing factions.
It's a lot like religion, with The Boss as the central mythical figure used to rally people behind.
Basically Metal Gear Solid (the series as a whole) can be seen as one long
chess match between Zero and Big Boss, all gloriously entangled in government conspiracies and themes of loyalty and betrayal. With Solid Snake being the pawn (or the X factor) in their battles.
Solid Snake was actually being used as the tool this time
by both sides - Patriots/AI injected him with a new Foxdie to kill Team Big Boss (Ocelot, Big Boss, Eva), while Team Big Boss ultimately used Solid Snake to "cripple" the Patriots.
The ending of MGS4,
serves as a way to clear the slate by killing the two central figures in the series
.
There are probably quite a few reasons as to why Kojima found it necessary to
revive Big Boss
, the obvious one is that gamers have notoriously short spans and wouldn't pick up on a few things.
It also serves as an epilogue to the Big Boss vs. Zero story, with Big Boss coming to terms with his mistakes and learning to accept things the way they are (or "to leave the world be").
Also, on a side note - I think we need to step back and put things into perspective a bit
Back when Metal Gear Solid came out, it was literally groundbreaking in terms of visuals, presentation, gameplay and story. A lot of us who are in this thread now were probably fairly young when we started MGS1, and that game had left a profoundly huge positive impression on us.
Since the first game fans have started to expect Metal Gear Solid to be Metal Gear Solid , and while in the process they've all gotten a good 10 or 20 years older (depending on if you started during the MSX days or so).
Every time fans have had to wait for a sequel they've all been pretty much just playing through each and every possible scenario in their heads, and if the sequel actually doesn't play out the way they expected it to, they usually wind up hugely disappointed (it's a lot like Lucas/Spielberg fan syndrome).
Given how sequels are usually more scrutinized than the original, it's remarkable that Kojima Pro still managed to deliver MGS4 to such critical acclaim and praise.
I would much rather see Kojima Productions move on to a new IP
or ZOE3!
It almost sounds like Kojima wants his team to keep making Metal Gear games while he moves on to something else but honestly I would much rather see what the entire team could do with a new IP.
Ah, so Genome Soldiers were in MGS1 and MGS2 only?
What happened to them? There must've been hundreds if not thousands of them. Did they get integrated into the PMCs or just go and retire into the suburbs?
The way I saw it was this (spoiler regarding Big Boss and
Zero
).
They both started with a common goal, but soon realized they both had different interpretations of the "will of the Boss," and wound up splintering into two opposing factions.
It's a lot like religion, with The Boss as the central mythical figure used to rally people behind.
Basically Metal Gear Solid (the series as a whole) can be seen as one long
chess match between Zero and Big Boss, all gloriously entangled in government conspiracies and themes of loyalty and betrayal. With Solid Snake being the pawn (or the X factor) in their battles.
Solid Snake was actually being used as the tool this time
by both sides - Patriots/AI injected him with a new Foxdie to kill Team Big Boss (Ocelot, Big Boss, Eva), while Team Big Boss ultimately used Solid Snake to "cripple" the Patriots.
The ending of MGS4,
serves as a way to clear the slate by killing the two central figures in the series
This is actually the best summary of the entire saga that I've seen yet and thinking about it in this light actually makes the ending of MGS4 much more elegant.
I think the story overall does make sense (and it's amazing the writing team was able to piece it all together since I'm sure a lot of plot points early on were improvisational) if you don't dwell too much on the little tiny details.
Definitely makes MGS3 the most important game in the series.
