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[radcliff]

Just started the epilogue and I have 100% items in Sector 1, 2, and 3. But there is 1 item in the Main Sector I can't access. The room that contains the item is inaccessible due to the elevator being powered down. Any help on how to get into this room?

 

[Loam]

Just started the epilogue and I have 100% items in Sector 1, 2, and 3. But there is 1 item in the Main Sector I can't access. The room that contains the item is inaccessible due to the elevator being powered down. Any help on how to get into this room?

Spoiler

You cannot get this item until after you beat the bonus boss

 

[GrotesqueBeauty]

I honestly feel blessed to be devoid of farce beliefs from the past that would cloud rational judgement, at least when it concerns Metroid.

I've adored almost every entry in the series post Metroid II. I even recognize and accept what Hunters tried to do instead of forcing the game into a category it doesn't belong in (it was nothing more than a multiplayer game). I can only imagine the profound sadness those that feel differently must be going through; that they, be it for rational or irrational (delusional) reasons, were unable to receive the unmitigated joy those of us that liked the games have experienced over the past decade.

So what I'm hearing is that if you don't agree with someone's reasoning, it's a farce, or at best clouded judgment, but in any case a "delusion" (and of course you'd think that... we certainly can't all be "blessed" with your apparent freedom from all bias and dogmas ).

Meanwhile, you bring up Hunters in the context of forcing the game into a category it doesn't belong in, but amazingly your ire is directed at the audience rather than the developers. I guess I feel blessed to not be as blessed as you.

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

I went looking via search for some games etiolate likes to try to turn the tables on him and show him why everything thinks he's being an arseface, but etiolate, dude, you never post about games except Other M. And Guild Wars I guess? But that would be like picking on the retarded kid. You seem to hold Metroid Prime in high esteem, and while I really dislike the game, I have a feeling if I pick on it, I'm going to get jumped on by *everyone*, so I'll just let that be.

All I can say is this: Every game has problems. Every game has some areas where it's not up to snuff. And every person holds those areas to different standards and expectations. Basically, if we hold every game to the ideal that in having flaws it is a game that is holding back the standards and keeping things from moving forward, then we cannot enjoy *anything*. You think the story in Other M is terrible. You think the characterization is awful. You think the game on the whole is lacking. Cool. Some other people don't, and you go after them like they're objectively wrong for thinking the story and characterization is fine. Don't try to deny it, you've done it many times throughout this thread.

Essentially the problem is that you think there is some kind of objective criteria, some academic truth, which can be applied to people's experiences with an entertainment product. That's fatally flawed thinking. You can scream until you're blue in the face that Twilight is an objectively terrible story, but people who like it are never going to see it your way, and your constant insistence that people shouldn't enjoy it or that they are stupid for enjoying it or that they have some kind of standard that is holding back the entire art of storytelling by enjoying it serves absolutely no purpose but to try to annoy people, tear them down, or ruin their enjoyment.

You aren't happy with the direction Metroid took. Believe me, I can understand. I went through the same thing with Metroid Prime, which in my eyes took one of my favourite series out behind the woodshed and did naughty Thunder Monkey things to it. You voiced your opinions here, many times, so you've certainly made your feelings known. I'm sure you've written a letter or two to Nintendo, because if you haven't, that would be pretty silly. At the end of the day, as far as this thread goes, as far as this audience goes, you've done your job. You've expressed your dissatisfaction very strongly and nobody here is going to go around saying Etiolate is down with the Other M.

But you've also continued past that point. You've run around, nay, made continuous laps of the circuit, pissing in everyone's Cheerios, calling them stupid, uneducated, or backwards for not seeing things your way, and man, that's shitty. It's a pretty rotten thing to do. And in the end it does not help your cause. It does not make people sympathetic to your angle or your plight. All it results in is everyone thinking you're an asshole, and I've known you on GAF long enough to know that can't be what you want.

 

[Koodo]

Just started the epilogue and I have 100% items in Sector 1, 2, and 3. But there is 1 item in the Main Sector I can't access. The room that contains the item is inaccessible due to the elevator being powered down. Any help on how to get into this room?

You know, I was wondering what would happen if that upgrade wasn't acquired before the elevator gets (permanently) shut off.

And I'm guessing you need to defeat that last boss and acquire the upgrade en route to the check point, since you'll be passing through that room.

So what I'm hearing is that if you don't agree with someone's reasoning, it's a farce, or at best clouded judgment, but in any case a "delusion" (and of course you'd think that... we certainly can't all be "blessed" with your apparent freedom from all bias and dogmas ).

Meanwhile, you bring up Hunters in the context of forcing the game into a category it doesn't belong in, but amazingly your ire is directed at the audience rather than the developers. I guess I feel blessed to not be as blessed as you.

Ire?

:lol

 

[Boney]

Excellent. I'm so much more used to making enemies in these threads. :lol

Really? I think we've kept it as civilized as can be with all the trouble makers runnin 'round.

 

[Lan_97]

Around 4 hours in. The game is ok so far. It's failing so far as a cinematic story driven game and somewhat as a metroid game.

Gameplay wise, I find the wiimote-only and first person view bearable and adaptable, but it doesn't add to the simplicity or fun of the game. The forced first person exploration scenes I find completely out of place and would have been better served with a quick cut scene (

Spoiler

i got stuck for 5+ minutes on the Lyle death scene because I mistook the green blood as poor grass textures

)

By now I've decided I don't like the concentration mechanic much. It doesn't make any more sense than enemies dropping health and missiles, but the latter sure makes combat more rewarding.

Alright game so far. Hopefully it picks up later on. I am somewhat interested in what the story behind the white critter is.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Oooo.

He used Thunder Monkey as a verb.

 

[etiolate]

So you didn't enjoy most of the game mechanics either. Not that we all didn't know that already. Could you at least admit that you might see where other people would enjoy some of the game's quick action, enough that they'd be willing to set aside a cliche video game story? Like I said, if not, then there really must not be very many games that you truly enjoy.

I also hope I'm not the only one that takes a sense of amusement out of seeing etiolate calling most people in the thread closed-minded when he's been largely unwilling to budge at all throughout this discussion, even on matters that largely boil down to personal opinion.

I just don't see anything but mediocrity in the gameplay, I can't find anything that makes it stand out from many action titles. I wish the people who liked it could explain what about it they like. I am not into "I like it" without a "because". I can understand liking the finishing moves, because those feel rewarding and offer something new that doesn't detract from the overall game. In fact, I thought I'd hate them since they look out of place for Metroid, but I grew accustom to them. The other things, like wheres waldo, stalking, the linearity, only subtract from the game. To say "I don't mind linearity" is one thng, but non-linear designs add to a game. The game is still really small and linearity has to do with that, because the linear areas make less of their space than a non-linear design. A non-linear design requires the elements of the space to fit into a more complex puzzle, so the rooms normally have more going on in them. The combat is more involved than Prime or Super, but I am not sure it is better than Corruption. The combat as compared to non-metroid action titles isn't all that super.

I just don't normally buy average games. I am picky on what I spent my time on since I have less time to spend.

As for me being close minded, well, I don't see it. I was just as negative going into Prime but the game redeemed itself. Other M did not.

I am discussing this with you because you provide something to discuss. If someone responds to me with a bunch of nonsense, ad hominem and strawmen, or just clearly doesn't understand the separation of theory from value judgement, then no I am not going to give them much credit. There really isn't any reason to. You can't have any discussion based solely on opinion. It goes nowhere.

 

[quadrax1s]

The people crying about "standards of quality" for a damn video game story are ridiculous. Even the best narrative in a video game is still a damn joke compared truly great pieces of literature.

So if you want you're great standard of narrative quality I suggest you stop looking for it in video games, put the controllers down and pick up something like Crime and Punishment. Which shits all over every story ever written for any video game ever.

The rest of us will go back to discussing the game with an open mind, with out acting like giant pompous d-bags.

Just because video games haven't evolved to the point where their stories can be comparable to classic literature or even movies doesn't mean they can't be criticized in that regard. I don't mind games that have flimsy stories, but I do mind games that have flimsy, poorly written stories that are forced onto the player by making them a major part of the game's experience (though I'm not saying that Other M does this because I haven't played it yet).

 

[Boney]

I just don't see anything but mediocrity in the gameplay,

Stopped reading there, because frankly, you make no sense about the gameplay part.

"I was like holding down the d-pad all the time, and the game didn't made the sense move and I died. So I was like wtf man. It doesn't even register stuff ok!"

 

[Ridley327]

Just because video games haven't evolved to the point where their stories can be comparable to classic literature or even movies doesn't mean they can't be criticized in that regard. I don't mind games that have flimsy stories, but I do mind games that have flimsy, poorly written stories that are forced onto the player by making them a major part of the game's experience (though I'm not saying that Other M does this because I haven't played it yet).

No, it does force it on you, so don't feel bad for going on the offensive.

 

[thecouncil]

You've expressed your dissatisfaction very strongly and nobody here is going to go around saying Etiolate is down with the Other M.

But you've also continued past that point. You've run around, nay, made continuous laps of the circuit, pissing in everyone's Cheerios,...

:lol :lol :lol :lol ...i literally broke out laughing at this point...

 

[GrotesqueBeauty]

Really? I think we've kept it as civilized as can be with all the trouble makers runnin 'round.

You've kept it light, to be sure. It's a nice counterbalance to some of the blatant vitriol floating around. I try, but in my weak moments irritability creeps in. Usually after I've put some effort into expressing myself clearly and intelligently and 3 posts later someone starts making offhanded remarks about how crazy and dumb everyone involved with the discussion obviously is. Nothing erodes a decent conversation more quickly than implying everyone who shares their thoughts is a moron.

 

[Salsa]

Just because video games haven't evolved to the point where their stories can be comparable to classic literature or even movies doesn't mean they can't be criticized in that regard.

Okay so let me get this straight.

Games will never be "as good as books or movies", they dont have to "evolve" to that. The only way one could compare a book or a movie to a videogame is when the videogame is trying to imitate those mediums of storytelling, or using tools inspired by film/books.

Its like if you play a game where everything is dialogue, everything. The whole story is told to you through dialogue. And its the fuckin greatest story ever. Would you then say that the story is "as good as a book" ? no, because then the story would be a fuckin book, not really a videogame.

Seriously, i dont get how in this day and age we still get crossed wires on this, i cant see for the life of me what you guys are trying to compare here. Going by what you are saying, every movie could be an awesome book ? every book could be an awesome movie ? fuck no, because they do whats in their strenght, and use its methods of storytelling to form a unique experience. Stories are not words on a screen, or dialogue, or characters, or whatever. One of the biggest aspects of a good story is how you tell it, what tools do you use to say what you want to say to the viewer/reader/player/etc.

You know why there isnt a Half-Life movie or book ? because they are fuckin impossible to make. You take away HL´s environmental storytelling, the way you interact with the thing, and it just becomes what one could call "a pretty regular sci-fi story", if you go in your way of comparing stuff, that is.

 

[Koodo]

Just because video games haven't evolved to the point where their stories can be comparable to classic literature or even movies doesn't mean they can't be criticized in that regard. I don't mind games that have flimsy stories, but I do mind games that have flimsy, poorly written stories that are forced onto the player by making them a major part of the game's experience (though I'm not saying that Other M does this because I haven't played it yet).

The game doesn't force the story onto the player. The cutscenes are only of a noticeable length during the beginning and end. Hour long, MGS-esque cutscenes are nowhere to be found. That's why all the rage directed at the story still baffles me; there's not even enough of a story to warrant all the controversy.

Oh, another reason why the story is inoffensive: the transition from gameplay to cutscene is fabulously seamless. You won't find any eternal loading a lá Final Fantasy XII.

I suppose for some people 3 letters can still constitute a "big word". Lol, I said "constitute" lolololll11one11!1

Honey, it's not that ire is a big word (I would be baffled if anyone thinks it's anything beyond common), it's that you think I was actually angry.

I'm not that type of gaffer. :lol

 

[GrotesqueBeauty]

Ire?

:lol

I suppose for some people 3 letters can still constitute a "big word". Lol, I said "constitute" lolololll11one11!1

 

[Red]

You've kept it light, to be sure. It's a nice counterbalance to some of the blatant vitriol floating around. I try, but in my weak moments irritability creeps in. Usually after I've put some effort into expressing myself clearly and intelligently and 3 posts later someone starts making offhanded remarks about how crazy and dumb everyone involved with the discussion obviously is. Nothing erodes a decent conversation more quickly than implying everyone who shares their thoughts is a moron.

I've disagreed with a few of your points but meant to apologize earlier for something I said in response to your post stating the last decade of Metroid games have steadily been becoming more "commercial." In my initial post I just ended myself with an "oh my god," but meant to have more typed up. I had to leave my computer for a while and decided to finish my thoughts later.

Really the only person I'm taking issue with in this tread is etiolate, and not because of what his thoughts actually are, but because of how he's treating every single person that tries to counter one of his arguments. At this point I am convinced that saying anything at all to him is literally a waste of time.

 

[Nessus]

But some of us discussing this don't consider those good narratives since they don't really use the medium. This is about game narrative, ludo narrative, etc. Not cinematic plots. The whole baby metroid element of Other M was explained in Super Metroid via playing it. It accomplishes what the monologues and cinematics do in a much more fitting and rewarding way for a game player.

Hey, preaching to the choir. You don't have to convince me.

I hate non-interactive cinematics, and I think video games as a medium should play their strengths, and use the one advantage they have over other media: the level of immersion, being there.

One of the reasons I generally love Valve games, as they tend to do scripted events in lieu of cinematics whenever possible. And as you point out, so did Super Metroid.

But Fusion didn't, and Zero Mission didn't, so it was pretty clear the direction Sakamoto was heading, I think.

I was also sad when Prime 2 and Prime 3 went even more in the direction of cinematics (the best parts of Prime 1 were scripted events: when you open the field and let the Metroids out to attack the Space Pirates, the entire opening sequence on the Frigate, turning on the gravity in the air lock instead of watching a cinematic of it).

And from the moment they showed the first Other M trailer I knew it was going to be very cinematic-heavy.

But I accepted it, because I love the Metroid style of gameplay so much, and that is retained, however compromised, in this game.

First and foremost, starting off weak and becoming strong via gaining new abilities and not some arbitrary stat boost like in RPGs.

Second part being the interconnectedness of the world and seeing areas you can't reach and coming back later with new abilites, and yes, Other M comes up short in this area, my single biggest gripe with the game.

Yeah, I dunno. I guess I'm good at ignoring the parts I don't like to get to the parts I do.

The game really "clicked" for me when you get the Plasma Beam. With the exception of two really poor decisions regarding them not giving you any hint how to defeat the last bosses, I pretty much loved the rest of the game.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

I didn't quote the post, Nessus, but I liked what you were saying about this being a sort of greatest hits version of a lot of the ideas Sakamoto had for all the other Metroid games. It seems like the most likely scenario.

 

[Snuggles]

Jeez. Here I am waiting to take care of the final fight and this goddamn cutscene will not end.
Good thing my laptop is so close to the TV so I can just GAF instead of watch it/stare at the wall.

 

[Boney]

I still want to know about what plot holes we are talking about.

Spoiler

the whole adam shooting her on the back thing? Is that even a plot hole

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Jeez. Here I am waiting to take care of the final fight and this goddamn cutscene will not end.
Good thing my laptop is so close to the TV so I can just GAF instead of watch it/stare at the wall.

I don't think I've watched a cutscene since Uncharted 2.

I just turn to the computer and do something else.

 

[Red]

Jeez. Here I am waiting to take care of the final fight and this goddamn cutscene will not end.
Good thing my laptop is so close to the TV so I can just GAF instead of watch it/stare at the wall.

Finally Kojima's influence has been realized.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

I don't think I've watched a cutscene since Uncharted 2.

I just turn to the computer and do something else.

Red Dead?

 

[Ridley327]

Finally Kojima's influence has been realized.

Actually, the MGS series has allowed you skip the cutscenes since day 1.

And if that guy is OK with players missing out on the plot...

 

[brandonh83]

The problem with games being compared to films (lol) boils down to one huge issue: with videogames, the developers are, first and foremost, making a videogame. A filmmaker is focused 100% on the film (most of them) whereas a videogame developer has to actually make the game. It's not all about the quality of the movie sequences. This is why some of us don't really care if the cutscenes aren't that great, but people who need for videogame cutscenes to be on the level as something you'd see in a theater need to wake the fuck up. Even what I consider to be the very best of videogame cutscenes still pale in comparison to a standard film. I think it's fine for games to have movie-style scenes, in fact I enjoy them most of the time, but I don't sit there and think "well it was okay but didn't quite compare to any scene from whatever movie I saw last night." That's just dumb.

Other M's cutscenes, I'd say, are more comparable to a Saturday morning cartoon-- along with many other videogame cutscenes. Some people like that, some don't, but I don't really understand what seems to be so confusing about the argument. The problem I have is that I don't think a Metroid game needs to be full of this anime-style horse shit. Metal Gear Solid is fine with it because its been there since day one of the Solid series, but Metroid, not so much.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Red Dead?

Oh, right. That had good cutscenes. I think I also stopped watching those sometime around the 5th "I'm a bad guy, but you need my help!" ones.

 

[GrotesqueBeauty]

I've disagreed with a few of your points but meant to apologize earlier for something I said in response to your post stating the last decade of Metroid games have steadily been becoming more "commercial." In my initial post I just ended myself with an "oh my god," but meant to have more typed up. I had to leave my computer for a while and decided to finish my thoughts later.

I appreciate the nod. It's cool. I actually have a folder of massive posts I've started in response to one thing or another and never got around to finishing because I get swept up in more pressing matters. I feel chronically guilty for not addressing everyone as completely as I'd like. Plus, once you've walked away for a bit it's difficult to recapture that initial energy that goes into a long winded post about how wrong someone else is. :lol

 

[Gravijah]

dunno if you guys know this, but boney is in fact an awesome dude.

 

[Red]

The problem with games being compared to films (lol) boils down to one huge issue: with videogames, the developers are, first and foremost, making a videogame. A filmmaker is focused 100% on the film (most of them) whereas a videogame developer has to actually make the game. It's not all about the quality of the movie sequences. This is why some of us don't really care if the cutscenes aren't that great, but people who need for videogame cutscenes to be on the level as something you'd see in a theater need to wake the fuck up. Even what I consider to be the very best of videogame cutscenes still pale in comparison to a standard film. I think it's fine for games to have movie-style scenes, in fact I enjoy them most of the time, but I don't sit there and think "well it was okay but didn't quite compare to any scene from whatever movie I saw last night." That's just dumb.

Other M's cutscenes, I'd say, are more comparable to a Saturday morning cartoon-- along with many other videogame cutscenes. Some people like that, some don't, but I don't really understand what seems to be so confusing about the argument.

What frustrates me about game narratives is that so many developers try to emulate film. The strength of a game is in its interaction. That's what makes it a game. Tell the story through that interaction. I'm really surprised the trend seems to be moving in the other direction.

I appreciate the nod. It's cool. I actually have a folder of massive posts I've started in response to one thing or another and never got around to finishing because I get swept up in more pressing matters. I feel chronically guilty for not addressing everyone as completely as I'd like. Plus, once you've walked away for a bit it's difficult to recapture that initial energy that goes into a long winded post about how wrong someone else is. :lol

Yeah, absolutely. A lot of the time I type something up and just hit back because I've completely lost the urge to post it.

As much as I enjoy the community at neogaf, it's limited by the same restrictions every other online forum has: we're all anonymous users, channeling our thoughts through emotionless machines and hoping our thoughts will be noticed by someone down the line. I think a lot of the conflict here is due to misconstrued receptions of particular posts, users thinking someone is acting maliciously when really they're joking around or letting themselves get caught up in hyperbole.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

Oh, right. That had good cutscenes. I think I also stopped watching those sometime around the 5th "I'm a bad guy, but you need my help!" ones.

heh. not unreasonable.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

What frustrates me about game narratives is that so many developers try to emulate film. The strength of a game is in its interaction. That's what makes it a game. Tell the story through that interaction. I'm really surprised the trend seems to be moving in the other direction.

If anything I'd say the slow seep of Western design ideology corrupting Japanese design philosophy will push it further in the right direction next gen.

 

[Snuggles]

Wow.

This last part is really testing my patience. It's like they took all of the things about the game that don't work, and combined them into a big shit sandwich. Speaking of shit sandwiches, I've enjoyed the game but I have a feeling this part will leave a bad taste in my mouth.

 

[Ridley327]

What frustrates me about game narratives is that so many developers try to emulate film. The strength of a game is in its interaction. That's what makes it a game. Tell the story through that interaction. I'm really surprised the trend seems to be moving in the other direction.

You know what game actually surprised me in this regard, even if it was just one scene?

Sgt. Jackson's death in CoD4. For 30 seconds, the game finally got it.

 

[brandonh83]

What frustrates me about game narratives is that so many developers try to emulate film. The strength of a game is in its interaction. That's what makes it a game. Tell the story through that interaction. I'm really surprised the trend seems to be moving in the other direction.

Thing is, I don't think it's impossible for a videogame to have what many would consider a "legitimate" film-quality cutscene. It's just that they would need to hire legitimately good screenwriters and legitimately good directors, and that's not something that happens often, if at all. I agree with you, I like it when the story progresses naturally through the gameplay, but I don't necessarily think every game should have to follow that mold. Like I said, I like it in MGS because I see MGS as a crazy-eyed, over the top videogame action series with heavy anime inspiration and I was able to have loads of fun with that, but Metroid was doing a fabulous job without it.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

You know what game actually surprised me in this regard, even if it was just one scene?

Sgt. Jackson's death in CoD4. For 30 seconds, the game finally got it.

it's a shame that one wonderful moment was revealed to be an accident when Infinity Ward decided to make MW2 bigger, better and more badass with a dramatic death scene at the end of every other mission.

 

[mentalfloss]

I wish I could insert the kaneclapping.gif right now for Segata's nuke-post.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

heh. not unreasonable.

To loop this back to Metroid, that's a problem I sometimes have with games. When a game gives me a blank slate, I subconsciously paint my own personality, principles, and morals on to that canvas. This was a problem in Red Dead, where I was free to decide whatever I want outside of the story, but inside of it, I was hamstrung to what the developer wanted.

I can definitely see people having that problem with Samus - not her being an avatar for the player to inhabit necessarily, but a vessel that the player has already filled (sexism~) with their ideas. When the game changes that presentation, whether it be in a cutscene between choices or in a game, it can be incredibly jarring and people very often won't like it.

I'll be honest: I was never that in to Super Metroid. I played it as a kid, found it a little above my level (I kept trying to play it like Mega Man X), and bought Prime off the hype. I think because of that, I'm willing to accept more interpretations of Samus, a character I first grew any sort of fondness for from Super Smash Bros. Melee. I can definitely see why other people, people who have been with this series for a long time, find this offensive.

tl;dr: opinions, dudes

 

[Ridley327]

it's a shame that one wonderful moment was revealed to be an accident when Infinity Ward decided to make MW2 bigger, better and more badass with a dramatic death scene at the end of every other mission.

A-fuckin'-men to that.

 

[Snuggles]

I think I just beat it but I'm not even sure what I did. I just hit the target button and it was over.
Weird.

 

[Ramirez]

Wow.

This last part is really testing my patience. It's like they took all of the things about the game that don't work, and combined them into a big shit sandwich. Speaking of shit sandwiches, I've enjoyed the game but I have a feeling this part will leave a bad taste in my mouth.

Which part are you talking about?

 

[jman2050]

What frustrates me about game narratives is that so many developers try to emulate film. The strength of a game is in its interaction. That's what makes it a game. Tell the story through that interaction. I'm really surprised the trend seems to be moving in the other direction.

Interestingly enough, I think some of the worst design decisions in Other M are a direct result of Sakamoto trying to make the story more "interactive" and failing. The Where's Waldo segments I assume are supposed to put the player in Samus's shoes by actually forcing you to "notice" what she is, except that it was executed in the worst way possible. I feel something similar about the over-the-shoulder segments, which I assume were meant to make the more "thrilling" parts of the story interactive in nature but, again, executed badly.

 

[Doorman]

Again, I haven't actually had a chance to play the game yet, so this is subject to change, but based on what I've seen and read, and applying it to my previous experiences with this series, I can try to at least provide an alternative viewpoint when it comes to the gameplay decisions Other M made.

For one, I'm pleased by the speed with which Samus moves, particularly when you compare that mobility to what was mostly on display with the Prime games. I think I said it once before that I played a large section of Prime 1 and maybe around half of Prime 3 or just a bit less, and never finished either of them because I just lost the desire to play them. I think a lot of it has to do with how slowly Samus trods around in them, and coupled with the more methodical combat and retraversal, I just couldn't motivate myself enough to keep up with it. Exploring the world was much more fun to me in Super, ZM, and Fusion, because Samus is able to cover ground quickly and can dispatch or avoid most typical enemies without spending a whole ton of time on it. So for me, seeing the Samus in Other M running down hallways and blasting things without missing a beat feels like a return to form from the action perspective.

I understand that the backtracking and secret-locating has been around in most games in the franchise, but looking back, those haven't been the things that I personally hold close as my most important tenets of Metroid. I thought about this quite a bit when I played Super Metroid all the way through for the first time last fall (I'd seen my sister go through it many a time when it first came out, so it's not like my exposure to the game is only recent). But to me, Metroid hasn't been about the silent and mysterious Samus, or being able to speedrun/sequence break/challenge run my way through. Even the backtracking and open-world approach take a backseat, though I do like the exploration aspect a lot. Most of all, my experiences with Super, Fusion, and Zero Mission are at their most memorable with each game's unexpected set-piece moments: The first time you uncover the mochtroid lab in Maridia, the obvious chain of events with the hatchling and Mother Brain, the walking chozo statue that gets you out of the wrecked ship, the encounters with the SA-X, the dramatic shift of gameplay style in Zero Mission when you have nothing but the flight suit and emergency pistol, and the rush of power you feel shortly thereafter once you receive the new suit...these are the sorts of moments that make up Metroid for me, more than anything else.

If Other M has nothing like that, then I may still walk away from it disappointed in the end. I'm going to stay optimistic about it for now, though, because the Prime subseries ultimately failed me despite the several chances I gave it, and if nothing else Other M looks to approach things very differently from that.

 

[Boney]

I wish I could insert the kaneclapping.gif right now for Segata's nuke-post.

notsureifserious.gif

 

[Snuggles]

Which part are you talking about?

I beat it, but it was the

Spoiler

first person part where you have to shoot at the bugs and the android or whatever the fuck lady. It was sloppy as hell, I failed the first few times because I couldn't keep up but then I just shot a few beams at her and locked on and it was over

Baffling ending to a solid game. Now I'm being rewarded with a new cutscene. The reward should be that there ISN'T a cutscene.

 

[Red]

If anything I'd say the slow seep of Western design ideology corrupting Japanese design philosophy will push it further in the right direction next gen.

It would be really great if a Japanese game tried to simulate a Japanese film. I guess my last post on the topic wasn't entirely on the money; many Japanese games (RPGs, MGS, Other M, etc.) are more anime-centric than they are film-centric. They're much less measured than what you'd expect from a Japanese movie (unless that movie is adopting animation tropes and philosophies).

Thing is, I don't think it's impossible for a videogame to have what many would consider a "legitimate" film-quality cutscene. It's just that they would need to hire legitimately good screenwriters and legitimately good directors, and that's not something that happens often, if at all. I agree with you, I like it when the story progresses naturally through the gameplay, but I don't necessarily think every game should have to follow that mold. Like I said, I like it in MGS because I see MGS as a crazy-eyed, over the top videogame action series with heavy anime inspiration and I was able to have loads of fun with that, but Metroid was doing a fabulous job without it.

As much as I dislike most of the MGS series, I agree with you. And I agree that Metroid's narrative seems to function better without being disrupted by cinematics. But in the case of Other M, that con doesn't really bother me. I thought it was a fantastic game despite the issues.

Interestingly enough, I think some of the worst design decisions in Other M are a direct result of Sakamoto trying to make the story more "interactive" and failing. The Where's Waldo segments I assume are supposed to put the player in Samus's shoes by actually forcing you to "notice" what she is, except that it was executed in the worst way possible. I feel something similar about the over-the-shoulder segments, which I assume were meant to make the more "thrilling" parts of the story interactive in nature but, again, executed badly.

True, the implementation was poor on some aspects. I didn't understand the slow shoes sections at all, and still don't. The Where's Waldo parts didn't bother me, but I've seen enough complaints here to realize they're a problem. It seems like whoever playtested this game was a bit lenient on their reports.

 

[Boney]

I beat it, but it was the

Spoiler

first person part where you have to shoot at the bugs and the android or whatever the fuck lady. It was sloppy as hell, I failed the first few times because I couldn't keep up but then I just shot a few beams at her and locked on and it was over

Baffling ending to a solid game. Now I'm being rewarded with a new cutscene. The reward should be that there ISN'T a cutscene.

You still got more to go

 

[Poyunch]

I beat it, but it was the

Spoiler

first person part where you have to shoot at the bugs and the android or whatever the fuck lady. It was sloppy as hell, I failed the first few times because I couldn't keep up but then I just shot a few beams at her and locked on and it was over

Baffling ending to a solid game. Now I'm being rewarded with a new cutscene. The reward should be that there ISN'T a cutscene.

That's just the wrapping paper.

 

[brandonh83]

it's a shame that one wonderful moment was revealed to be an accident when Infinity Ward decided to make MW2 bigger, better and more badass with a dramatic death scene at the end of every other mission.

Modern Warfare is shitty too, it's like every possible military Michael Bay cliche you can think of, and then some, rolled up into a six hour game. I mean, in MW2 when you

Spoiler

find Washington D.C. on fire

and it starts playing really dramatic music, it makes me giggle/cringe/eyeroll every single time.