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[Green Mamba]

It's more important that it works rather than to be memorable. Other M did a great job with the music.

Yes, it's important to work.

But seriously, I've never played a Metroid where the music doesn't work. They worked, and they went above and beyond that. Other M doesn't. Like I said, it merely works.

 

[Kai Dracon]

Negatrons

There are a truly baffling number of areas in which Metroid Prime is clearly and massively superior: Level design, variety of levels themes, artwork, music (!!!), game mechanics, atmosphere, diversity of enemies, ball puzzles, scale of world, story, innovating new abilities (visors!) and is a wholly richer, deeper game. I can appreciate taking a different direction for the series (and I'll emphasise that I did quite like this game) but there's no excusing being inferior in so many ways to an eight-year-old game. This is shocking.

Most of this comes down to the fact that Retro has 1: some amazing artists and 2: an amazing level construction system. I keep referencing this, but it was noted at several times through the years that Retro devised a system that allowed map builders to slap down and tweak maps without getting in the way of the artists and vis versa. Tons of flexibility in how to sculpt the environments and in how to construct level flow.

This game was always going to roll back to something simpler, both because of Retro's departure from the series, and the focus being very different. I think it's pretty clear that they wanted to focus on translating 2D Metroid into a 3D and 3rd person game and so started almost from scratch.

Like I said before in the thread, the biggest negative in Other M isn't its new directions but that it doesn't go far enough; you can see shades of its full potential in the late stages when level design begins to get really creative and elaborate for a few areas. It's very conservative on their first try, as it were. While it's true the game has to stand in the shadow of the Prime trilogy, Prime /is/ a parallel series by a totally different creative team.

The real shame would be if the negative backlash against Other M scares Nintendo back into their conservative shell and they like, turn around and have Retro make a Prime-like game after Donkey Kong Country - which would likely be quality yet wouldn't go anywhere new.

Due to the history of this franchise, it seems for so many people, it is hard or impossible to see Other M as the initial stage in a new branch.

memorable>"works", asshole

Keep it classy boys!

 

[Haunted]

oh man, i wish the embarrassing story, laughable characterization and the complete lack of subtlety actually were the game's main problems for me. all of that i can ignore, but the unexciting gameplay, awkward controls and limited interactivity i can't. i had very low expectations as it is... now that i've played it, many of the mechanics make even less sense to me than they did in theory. the first person switching is distracting and disorienting, the over the shoulder sections unnecessary, the automated shooting makes every fight boring; i'm really bothered by the fact that i can't target individual enemies without going into fps mode, especially when i want to focus on the bigger ones. and the d-pad controls don't feel right, this just isn't a 2.5d game. i'm fighting a horde of small enemies and all i can think about is: how much fun would it have been to target them with the remote and shoot them one by one? there is so little satisfaction in "aiming" in a general direction with the d-pad and mashing the shoot button. right now, i feel like i don't even wanna go back to the game.

ah yes, walking around in dark rooms where you can't see shit, bumping into walls and corners, then awkwardly changing directions. sounds just like my experience with other m.

other m's in-game music is at best forgettable, generic and boring and at worst out of place and cliched. the music during cutscenes is another story altogether: truly awful. an entirely unfitting orchestral hollywood blockbuster assault that never fails to announce and underline every little shift in emotion, every camera pan, every cut, every close-up, every reaction shot, no matter how trivial. yet it still manages to sound hilariously out of place in its over-the-top seriousness and complete lack of subtlety. when samus approached the space station in her ship and the nervous horns and strings on speed wouldn't stop playing MENACE and MILITARY ACTION i couldn't help but laugh. kind of reminded me of carter burwell's parody of military thriller scores in "burn after reading".

*cocks head* Hm hm, I can't quite get a read on your opinion of Other M.

Spoiler

Sucks that you feel that it's such a disappointment. I enjoyed it. :/

 

[MadOdorMachine]

the dissatisfaction some people experience is not just rooted in a dislike of turning the wiimote to point, but in wanting a typical Metroid combat logic of shooting missiles as much as beams and/or wanting absolute and precise control over which enemy in a pack you are attacking - even if it's not the closest enemy or the most immediate threat in terms of how the game is intended to see it..

The aiming in first person is wonky sometimes. You can only use your missiles while locked on. The problem is, you're often locked onto the wrong target as a result of having to hold down the B button to free look. I just think it's odd that they didn't copy Metroid Prime 3's aiming in this regard. I don't know why they would change the mechanics of something that's pretty much set the standard for aiming with the Wii remote. On top of that, it's another Metroid game which they were clearly pulling inspiration from.

Oh no I don't think you hate the game at all. It's more to do with the controls - you don't like them and I do. That said, I do think a control scheme with the nunchuck - even if it were just mimicking the D-pad - would've been nice for some people. The game seems to be missing options as a whole I guess.

That's my biggest complaint. I even modded out a Wii remote with a classic controller d-pad because I hate it so much.

 

[bon]

God damn I miss scanning.

I don't. I played through Prime 2 right before I started this, and I was so relieved to not have to stop and scan every little thing when I entered every new room. Scanning was cool for the Prime games, but honestly it is a mechanic that I wouldn't mind never seeing again.

 

[Poyunch]

Maybe I'm just a sucker for the piano but I loved the Theme of Samus in this game. Even if it's unfitting for the series. A lot of stuff in this game already is so whatever. :lol

 

[Boney]

Yes, it's important to work.

But seriously, I've never played a Metroid where the music doesn't work. They worked, and they went above and beyond that. Other M doesn't. Like I said, it merely works.

That's getting hunged up on videogames should give memorable tunes, especially franchised ones. We've gotten past the bleeps and bloops. Action and music must intertwine now. Super had terrific soundtrack, every area oozed personality on music alone, but you guys are getting to hunged up on that. There's definately room for it, but it's not a requirement.

Its like somebody dissed on REmakes music because they can't hum it.

Keep it classy boys!

He's just joking.. well kinda..

 

[jarosh]

*cocks head* Hm hm, I can't quite get a read on your opinion of Other M.

Spoiler

Sucks that you feel that it's such a disappointment. I enjoyed it. :/

you just made me realize that the score actualy does fit the cutscenes somewhat: they both share the complete lack of subtlety.


honestly though, yes, i'm just massively disappointed. i've gotten used to the controls by now. they do seem to work most of the time and the constant switching to fp is not a big deal anymore. i just hate nothing more than when a big chunk of interactivity and precision is taken away from me in the name of "accesibilty". the remote is RIGHT THERE. the pointing is even IN THE GAME. they made this game for a system that is all about the FUCKING POINTER. they made a 3rd person shooting game. WHY CAN I NOT AIM WITH THE WII REMOTE?

and what's with those long drawn out over the shoulder sections? wtf? is that supposed to create a creepy atmosphere? because it doesn't, since i KNOW that i can't shoot anyway in this mode. nothing truly dangerous can happen. although it would have been kinda awesome if we got an re4 style metroid with over the shoulder shooting.

have i said how ugly the game is most of the time? how laughable the creatures look? have you seen the "lava"? have you seen doshin the giant emerge from the lava? have you seen the big outdoor area? the wildy different resolution textures on certain floors and ledges that are connected? did i say how boring and sterile the level design is?

ok ok. i'll stop now. it's not the WORST game in the world. but it's certainly the worst METROID game so far.

 

[The Technomancer]

Okay, at this point its fairly obvious but just to check, are

Spoiler

small furry critter, furry lizard beast, and flying tentacular laser blaster dude all various stages of Ridley's development?

EDIT:

Spoiler

oh wait, it seems maybe tentacular laser blast beast wasn't? He was the odd one out anyway. (just got to the fight against what looks like Ridley in the geothermal power plant)

 

[Poyunch]

Okay, at this point its fairly obvious but just to check, are

Spoiler

small furry critter, furry lizard beast, and flying tentacular laser blaster dude all various stages of Ridley's development?

Yes.

 

[Boney]

people that want to slap on the pointer shooting in third person as is makes me shake my head.

 

[Gravijah]

He's just joking.. well kinda..

Hahaha, not about this. I hate movie music.

 

[Boney]

Hahaha, not about this. I hate movie music.

yeah I know, meant about the asshole or whatever, we're playful.

 

[DigitalDevil]

Just completed this 100% and am thus entering the thread for the first time.

Probably going to repeat what has been said but here goes anyway: I had fun playing the game.

Plusses

They've got a third-person mechanic that works reasonably well.

I died a lot, I like that there was a challenge.

Voice acting was functional, not stellar but not bad.

Story was interesting in its own way.

Some wonderful nods to past games that had me very intrigued.

Spoiler

The returning bosses were very nicely imagined from their 8-bit origins, especially the Metroid Queen

.

FMV sequences were very nicely made.

Anthony is a good character. Adam was an interesting character.

Some really fun bosses.

More game

Spoiler

after the credits

is a pleasant idea I'd like to see return.

Negatrons

There are a truly baffling number of areas in which Metroid Prime is clearly and massively superior: Level design, variety of levels themes, artwork, music (!!!), game mechanics, atmosphere, diversity of enemies, ball puzzles, scale of world, story, innovating new abilities (visors!) and is a wholly richer, deeper game. I can appreciate taking a different direction for the series (and I'll emphasise that I did quite like this game) but there's no excusing being inferior in so many ways to an eight-year-old game. This is shocking.

"Samus, what's happening....!?" most of the time when you die. Don't ever do this again.

TOO MANY LOCKED DOORS.

The absolutely ridiculous "authorised" idea, possibly the most bizarre and questionable thing they've ever done in a Metroid game.

Instant death when an

Spoiler

elevator fell on my head

. I don't like that in my Metroids, thank you very much.

The invisible walls were a persistent nuisance, kept taking me out of the game. As did temporary lock-ups while the game got confused trying to load.

The idea of Samus as "The Hunter", the silent merciless unstoppable killing machine who terrorised the Space Pirates in the previous games, is gone forever. Her established personality, while not offensive, is certainly less mature than I'd have imagined.

There isn't that much exploring. The enviroments weren't that interesting. The music was forgettable. Too many dull metal corridors.

God damn I miss scanning.

Overall

Probably a 7 out of 10. I went in with no expectations and came out with a game I enjoyed. Possibly a weaker point in the franchise, but by no means a disaster. An enjoyable experiment for the series, and could be a stepping stone to better games.

Wow, this post from you was all I needed. This game is a definite pass for me, and that's really sad... I'm a huge Metroid fan.

 

[Stallion Free]

On a positive note, I did feel satisfied with the game after 100% completion. I would have felt far less satisfied if it had ended with ending 1. And at the end of the day it was a fun experience that I am glad I had.

 

[Boney]

Wow, this post from you was all I needed. This game is a definite pass for me, and that's really sad... I'm a huge Metroid fan.

Rent it. It's entirely divisive. No reason for passing it up yourself.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

Iwata Asks: Metroid Other M Volume 2
http://us.wii.com/iwata_asks/metroid-other-m/vol2_page1.jsp

Members of the development team including Nintendo SPD Group No. 1, Team Ninja, and Taiyo Kikaku Co., Ltd.

 

[Boney]

Iwata Asks: Metroid Other M Volume 2
http://us.wii.com/iwata_asks/metroid-other-m/vol2_page1.jsp

Members of the development team including Nintendo SPD Group No. 1, Team Ninja, and Taiyo Kikaku Co., Ltd.

wow that's a lot of people there.

Iwata
Today I'm visiting TECMO KOEI's offices. I feel I'm intruding rather, coming here at nine in the morning, but I need to leave at 11am because of something I have to do in Kyoto this afternoon. Are you usually here from 9am, by the way?


he the man

 

[Wizpig]

I find it kind of sad that power-ups are useless in Normal mode (the game is already easy), but you would need them in Hard mode... and... you can't get them.

Also thanks for the news about the new "Iwata Should Have Said: fu Sakamoto"
I mean Iwata asks.
Will read

 

[FunkyPajamas]

Wow, this post from you was all I needed. This game is a definite pass for me, and that's really sad... I'm a huge Metroid fan.

Yeah, kind of the same here. Won't pass up because I'm a huge fan, but will get it after a price drop (no renting games where I live).

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

Wow, this post from you was all I needed. This game is a definite pass for me, and that's really sad... I'm a huge Metroid fan.

How can you be a huge Metroid fan and not try the game for yourself. There are people who love it. Several well established reviewers who loved it. If you are a fan of 2D Metroids, this is the sequel. Period.

I think it is a great game.

 

[Teknoman]

The idea of Samus as "The Hunter", the silent merciless unstoppable killing machine who terrorised the Space Pirates in the previous games, is gone forever. Her established personality, while not offensive, is certainly less mature than I'd have imagined.

I dunno about all that. Her personality is only different in the flashbacks before she was a hunter at the very beginning of the game. Kinda the same way she acts in the comics that talk about her history before joining the GF army. That was a decent amount of time before the first Metroid game.

During the main game, she doesnt really act any different than before. And with these killer finishes, shes even more ruthless than before.

Sure, her younger immature years could've been expressed better than some doofy thumbs down scene, but it does nothing to change the way she conducts herself throughout the Metroid series/future titles post Fusion.

 

[The Technomancer]

Whoa wait, fucking

Spoiler

Metroids?

Do people never learn?
And a

Spoiler

Mother Brain AI

to boot? The Galactic Federation is made of idiots.

Also, I do not trust

Spoiler

Madeline

EDIT: And as the cutscene continues I am proven right....I think. I'm always right.

 

[Boney]

Whoa wait, fucking

Spoiler

Metroids?

Do people never learn?
And a

Spoiler

Mother Brain AI

to boot? The Galactic Federation is made of idiots.

:lol

loving the iwata asks btw!

 

[BorkBork]

The real shame would be if the negative backlash against Other M scares Nintendo back into their conservative shell and they like, turn around and have Retro make a Prime-like game after Donkey Kong Country - which would likely be quality yet wouldn't go anywhere new.

Due to the history of this franchise, it seems for so many people, it is hard or impossible to see Other M as the initial stage in a new branch.

I think the sales will dictate if they will push on in this direction. I hope they do and they refine and polish the shit out of the sequel.

 

[Haunted]

About the music

... apparently this is the guy to blame. Chief sound engineer at Tecmo, responsible for Other M.

I thought I'd be fine with mostly ambient sounds, but in hindsight I think that the complete lack of memorable tunes along with the removal of several key jingles makes this one of the weaker Metroids, sound-wise.

 

[Boney]

About the music

... apparently this is the guy to blame. Chief sound engineer at Tecmo, responsible for Other M.

I thought I'd be fine with mostly ambient sounds, but in hindsight I think that the complete lack of memorable tunes along with the removal of several key jingles makes this one of the weaker Metroids, sound-wise.

Except he first proposed a similar Metroid sounding theme and was dismissed, and was asked to create a soundtrack with ambient noises.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

Well the actual music composer is Kuniaki Haishima of Taiyo Kikaku Co., Ltd. The other guys from Tecmo Koei did the ambiance soundtrack.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

My problem with you, Kaijima, is that you sit up on a pedestal at the moment thinking you're passing over some high-critique on a fanbase because of your extraordinary analytical skills. Being able to predict a negative fan reaction after the first trailers doesn't mean you have the amazing ability to predict the future and behaviour patterns of fans any more than seeing a cloudy sky and thunder gives you the awesome ability to predict rain. Liking something that many consider to be mediocre doesn't make you more open-minded, it just means your standards are lower or your tastes are simply different. Saying it has to be expectations that are holding back fan reaction is hypothetical, childish, arms-crossed-feet-planted-firmly-on-the-floor stubbornness, and painting people with that broad a brush isn't ever going to help change anyone's mind about a game or offer anything charming or compelling to read.

I left out what you said about Metroid Prime because as far as I'm concerned calling it Super Metroid in 3D is, no offence, nonsense. I mean, I guess it is Super Metroid in 3D, except for the way the character moves and generally controls, the way the fiction is presented, the way the power-ups work and the order in which they're found, the style of combat encounters you face, the beat-to-beat feeling of exploration, the level design, the visor perspective and the beam selection. Which is to say, while it sticks very closely to the formula (Samus finds powerups and beats bosses to progress to the next area), the only thing it has over Other M as far as difference to Super is concerned is a more open-world to explore.

Sit up there on your high horse and look down on the people all you want, that's fine. We'll probably have forgotten about this game in a week or two and moved onto the next flavour of the month. Just don't be under any pretension that your love of the game can be chalked up to anything more a) simply a taste thing; b) an overwhelming WANT to like Metroid; c) bad taste or lowered standards; or d) all of the above. What a lot of us are saying about this game has nothing to do with wanting to hate the game or being unwilling to accept change and has everything to do with the content of the game presented to us.

 

[Haunted]

Except he first proposed a similar Metroid sounding theme and was dismissed, and was asked to create a soundtrack with ambient noises.

Sakamoto you fiend! *shakes fist*

Cutting out the item found jingle, smh.

 

[L00P]

Except he first proposed a similar Metroid sounding theme and was dismissed, and was asked to create a soundtrack with ambient noises.

LAME

 

[Green Mamba]

That's getting hunged up on videogames should give memorable tunes, especially franchised ones. We've gotten past the bleeps and bloops. Action and music must intertwine now. Super had terrific soundtrack, every area oozed personality on music alone, but you guys are getting to hunged up on that. There's definately room for it, but it's not a requirement.

Sure, it doesn't need to me memorable. It's not a requirement. But it really would have been appreciated.

I'm not getting hung up on Super Metroid having a good, memorable soundtrack. I'm getting hung up on Metroid, Super Metroid, Metroid Fusion, Metroid Prime, Metroid Zero Mission, and Metroid Prime 3 having good, memorable soundtracks. Music on the quality of Prime 3 is hardly ancient history we've "gotten past."

Other M's is just generic atmosphere and action tracks. The music is merely adequate and the game is worse off for it. Can we agree there?

 

[Wizpig]

Except he first proposed a similar Metroid sounding theme and was dismissed, and was asked to create a soundtrack with ambient noises.

:lol :lol :lol

Boney, you crack me up.

You're kidding, right?

 

[farnham]

How can you be a huge Metroid fan and not try the game for yourself. There are people who love it. Several well established reviewers who loved it. If you are a fan of 2D Metroids, this is the sequel. Period.

I think it is a great game.

I agree with this post

First i was skeptical but it totally convinced me. Especially the controls which were my primary concern.

 

[Boney]

Sure, it doesn't need to me memorable. It's not a requirement. But it really would have been appreciated.

I'm not getting hung up on Super Metroid having a good, memorable soundtrack. I'm getting hung up on Metroid, Super Metroid, Metroid Fusion, Metroid Prime, Metroid Zero Mission, and Metroid Prime 3 having good, memorable soundtracks. Music on the quality of Prime 3 is hardly ancient history we've "gotten past."

Other M's is just generic atmosphere and action tracks. The music is merely adequate and the game is worse off for it. Can we agree there?

Oh don't get me wrong. I never intended to say you're wrong or anything like that. It's that just me, personally speaking do not think that's having it being memorable is any plus on the side. And when I meant Super Metroid, well I was implying most videogames, especially those that come from franchise games (Fusion is big on ambient soundtrack as well though).

As I said, one of my most memorable part in the game for me is this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNAKFKRtUEo (skip to the 10 minute mark).

:lol :lol :lol

Boney, you crack me up.

You're kidding, right?

What do you mean? Are you reading the Iwata asks?

Koike One of those songs was made with a similar atmosphere to the worlds of the previous games in the series, but that song wasn't given the OK.

You're kidding right?

 

[Wizpig]

Yeah i was
I know what you said was right, it's just that i don't want to accept the idea.

 

[JoeFu]

Beat the game last night with 56% and I really enjoyed it. The voice acting and all the cinematic stuff was weird at first but it eventually grew on me. I actually liked the story... The action was fun and all the power ups felt right. I dunno I think it's a solid game and worthy of the Metroid name.

Edit: how do you guys think this backlash is compared to Super Paper Mario? That's another game I enjoyed and many gaffers hated.

 

[Boney]

Yeah i was
I know what you said was right, it's just that i don't want to accept the idea.

:lol

oh boy, you'd better get yourself checked

 

[MadOdorMachine]

Except he first proposed a similar Metroid sounding theme and was dismissed, and was asked to create a soundtrack with ambient noises.

Sweet sassafras! Tecmo also recommended the nun chuck as well. It sounds like Sakamoto was unwilling to compromise on a lot of stuff.

 

[Wizpig]

Sweet sassafras! Tecmo also recommended the nun chuck as well. It sounds like Sakamoto was unwilling to compromise on a lot of stuff.

:lol

It also sounds like blaming Sakamoto for all of the game's faults wasn't that wrong after all.

Spoiler

I'm joking... kind of.

 

[Boney]

Sweet sassafras! Tecmo also recommended the nun chuck as well. It sounds like Sakamoto was unwilling to compromise on a lot of stuff.

Apparently he's a badass. Check the interview if you got the time. Cool stuff.

 

[mantidor]

I guess I'm the only who likes the soundtrack. I'm not far in the game, but what I've heard I've loved. I do like ambient a lot though.

 

[MadOdorMachine]

Apparently he's a badass. Check the interview if you got the time. Cool stuff.

I'm reading it right now. They mention that he's stubborn. I just think it's kind of odd that he would go to Team Ninja for their input and then not listen to it. Weird.

 

[Poyunch]

I'm reading it right now. They mention that he's stubborn. I just think it's kind of odd that he would go to Team Ninja for their input and then not listen to it. Weird.

Limitations usually bring the best out of developers. Maybe Sakamoto was hoping for this to happen with Team Ninja while they stuck to his strict design choices.

I say they succeeded but maybe Sakamoto was too tight with his design to make it totally enjoyable for everyone.

 

[Kai Dracon]

Beat the game last night with 56% and I really enjoyed it. The voice acting and all the cinematic stuff was weird at first but it eventually grew on me. I actually liked the story... The action was fun and all the power ups felt right. I dunno I think it's a solid game and worthy of the Metroid name.

Edit: how do you guys think this backlash is compared to Super Paper Mario? That's another game I enjoyed and many gaffers hated.

I'd say the backlash is worse on Metroid 'cause Super Paper Mario was never perceived as the continuation or future of Super Mario as a whole.

 

[Poyunch]

I'd say the backlash is worse on Metroid 'cause Super Paper Mario was never perceived as the continuation or future of Super Mario as a whole.

But it was perceived as the continuation of the Paper Mario RPGs.

 

[Boney]

An apt comparison would be with Mario RPG and Paper Mario. Even then, it wouldn't cut it.

 

[Kard8p3]

I guess I'm the only who likes the soundtrack. I'm not far in the game, but what I've heard I've loved. I do like ambient a lot though.

You're not alone at all. I thought the soundtrack worked great in the game. Sure it's not all your typical Metroid music but it works well.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

I'd say the backlash is worse on Metroid 'cause Super Paper Mario was never perceived as the continuation or future of Super Mario as a whole.

right at the top of this page, if you'd like to discuss why this might not necessarily true

 

[KevinCow]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8uyoeo3rnc