FeastYoEyes
Member
Haven't had time to read myself but it's lengthy.
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Mick Gordon publishes full statement on Doom Eternal soundtrack
- Thread starter FeastYoEyes
- Start date
- News Drama
Little Mac
Gold Member
Not knowing anything about the drama, I'm siding with whoever created the Doom 2016 soundtrack. I bought that game based on the music in the beginning when you are in the elevator ...
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Yeah, F-offf id on this one sorry…
Kacho
Gold Member
Mick should have taken that hush money IMO. I know he's trying to undo the damaged reputation but I don't think that's a battle he'll win. Digging up this drama two years later will only make people even more cautious to work with him.
It's interesting to see that he admitted this damaged his professional career. I figured that would happen.
MiguelItUp
Member
Yeah, 2016 had so many more memorable tracks that Eternal, that OST was SO forgettable. I think there was ONE song that people were throwing around everywhere. But that was it? For someone that couldn't careless for the whole Djent tone, it grew on me in some parts.
I feel like Mick is most certainly the one to side with here. I always thought it was so bizarre to know that the 2016 process went smoothly and did a WHOLE lot for Mick's career. But then with Eternal they made it sound like he wasn't professional, and didn't give a shit. The guy is clearly passionate with what he does, and always has been. There's plenty of interviews and panels displaying that. Why would he just completely throw another opportunity to boost his career out the window?
Good on him for NOT taking that hush money. I mean, he was already seeing his reputation getting damaged at that point.
If he took the hush money, I'm sure things still would've spilled out more so, and damaged his career to some degree. This allows him to at least air everything out, and maybe help fix his career in areas where it was damaged.
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anthony2690
Member
After reading that I'm on Mick's side for now, intially I thought Mick was to blame.
CuteFaceJay
Member
TintoConCasera
I bought a sex doll, but I keep it inflated 100% of the time and use it like a regular wife
Know nothing about all this drama. Also I love Eternal's soundtrack.
I like this OST much better than the previous game's. It's more metal and less weird noises.
DLC's soundtrack was done by two other composers and is also great, but I also love Mick's work on the base game.
I like this OST much better than the previous game's. It's more metal and less weird noises.
DLC's soundtrack was done by two other composers and is also great, but I also love Mick's work on the base game.
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Kacho
Gold Member
Attempting to remove the Reddit post myself
I’d had enough. I grew tired of having the respect I afforded Marty, and his employer, with attempts to resolve the dispute privately, get turned into a giant waste of time, effort and money. The Reddit post had been up for 15 months and attempts to resolve the dispute with Marty had gotten me nowhere. With my patience stretched to the absolute limit, I decided to take steps to remove the Reddit post myself.Reddit Moderator: I reached out to one of the r/DOOM moderators. We made contact and arranged a call via Discord.
The moderator introduced himself and spoke about his love for the DOOM franchise and its fanbase. Along with the r/DOOM subreddit, he told me he also moderated the official DOOM Discord server.
- I told him how Marty’s Reddit post had affected me deeply, both professionally and personally. It was a source of ongoing stress and harm, and I asked if he’d consider removing it.
But within 12 hours, the post was reinstated. The moderator blocked me on Discord and didn’t reply to my emails.
- A few days later, Marty’s lawyers contacted me and said removing the Reddit post had greatly offended him. He was furious and made it clear in the strongest terms that an amicable resolution would be impossible.
Damn bro. That Reddit post really did a number on Mick.
Doom 2016 OST is still one of the best in gaming, I found a download and listen to it on long trips in the car, it's pretty incredible. If you watch the doc on how Mick made it by creating instruments it's pretty amazing.
Shitty music is just another aspect that made Doom Eternal the ping micromanagement platform fps game awful.
I bet there are more dissidents at id that would tell how that project got so far from the originals plans.
Shitty music is just another aspect that made Doom Eternal the ping micromanagement platform fps game awful.
I bet there are more dissidents at id that would tell how that project got so far from the originals plans.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
I clicked the link and there’s a giant book of info. I’m not gonna read all that.
But what’s the gist of it? Bethesda is wrong and owes him money? Or does ot sound like he’s trying to worm his way into a payout?
But what’s the gist of it? Bethesda is wrong and owes him money? Or does ot sound like he’s trying to worm his way into a payout?
larkwaffle
Member
Summary I copied and pasted from someone on Reddit:
TL;DR
Summary of Facts
DOOM Eternal
I haven’t been paid for over half of DOOM Eternal’s music: The game includes more than double the music I was contracted to produce. Rejects, mockups, demos, many of which were never meant for public release. I created this music as part of the development process and shared it with id Software in good faith. But id Software used the music in the game, marketing and soundtrack and still refuses to pay me for it.
The DOOM Eternal OST was a mess
It was announced, with my name attached, and made available for pre-order before I was contracted to produce it. Despite my alarm and constant appeals Marty refused to do anything about the situation, leading to a nine-month delay before I could start work.
After seven months of inaction, I reported my concerns to Bethesda.
Bethesda and I negotiated the DOOM Eternal OST directly, without Marty’s involvement.
I received the contract on March 18, 2020, just 48 hours before DOOM Eternal was released. The delay was announced a week earlier before I was under contract.
The deadline was April 16 (29 days later) and the contract stipulated id Software had complete creative control and would aquire access to all my source material.
Marty withheld crucial details from me until 13 days before my deadline, such as:
Potential legal trouble they faced for taking pre-orders before it was under contract.
Details about their internally-produced OST: an alternative edited from my in-game score, which they’d worked on for at least six months without my knowledge or involvement.
I didn’t approve the release: In the days leading up to April 16, Marty cut me out of the process and decided to release their alternative version instead, reducing my direct contributions to filler. Both he, and id Software’s Lead Audio Designer, Chad Mossholder, didn’t allow me to hear the final album and didn’t seek my approval; they weren’t contractually required to do so.
OST release
Their poor-quality release immediately drew criticism, and a worried Marty personally asked me for assistance in addressing the situation. I made myself entirely available to Marty and committed to satisfying disappointed customers with a better OST. Marty made it clear he wanted me involved, saying he wanted a positive outcome, had no ill intentions and wanted to resolve the issue professionally.
He offered to draft a joint statement addressing the situation and announcing plans to move forward.
He requested I hold off on making further public comments until we could address the public together.
Marty told me to expect the draft within hours, but it never arrived.
Reddit
Instead, days later, he published a 2500+ word “open letter” on a fan-run Reddit page that singled me out as the sole cause behind the botched OST. The post attracted thousands of comments and news articles and severely damaged my personal and professional reputation. Worst of all, he did it behind my back whilst leading me on with a bullshit story about working together on a professional solution to the problem.
His statement was full of lies, disinformation and innuendo, and when challenged, his company offered me a six-figure sum to shut up about it. When I tried, time and time again, amid a torrent of abuse, harassment and threats, to resolve the matter more amicably, he constantly refused, worried how addressing the Reddit post would damage his own reputation instead.
But as far as I’m concerned, truth and honesty are more important: Marty’s words damaged my character and attacked my reputation. I have afforded him ample opportunity to address this issue, but his refusal to do so has left me with no option other than to issue this statement.
In issuing this statement, I’m exercising my right to defend myself.
TL;DR
Summary of Facts
DOOM Eternal
I haven’t been paid for over half of DOOM Eternal’s music: The game includes more than double the music I was contracted to produce. Rejects, mockups, demos, many of which were never meant for public release. I created this music as part of the development process and shared it with id Software in good faith. But id Software used the music in the game, marketing and soundtrack and still refuses to pay me for it.
The DOOM Eternal OST was a mess
It was announced, with my name attached, and made available for pre-order before I was contracted to produce it. Despite my alarm and constant appeals Marty refused to do anything about the situation, leading to a nine-month delay before I could start work.
After seven months of inaction, I reported my concerns to Bethesda.
Bethesda and I negotiated the DOOM Eternal OST directly, without Marty’s involvement.
I received the contract on March 18, 2020, just 48 hours before DOOM Eternal was released. The delay was announced a week earlier before I was under contract.
The deadline was April 16 (29 days later) and the contract stipulated id Software had complete creative control and would aquire access to all my source material.
Marty withheld crucial details from me until 13 days before my deadline, such as:
Potential legal trouble they faced for taking pre-orders before it was under contract.
Details about their internally-produced OST: an alternative edited from my in-game score, which they’d worked on for at least six months without my knowledge or involvement.
I didn’t approve the release: In the days leading up to April 16, Marty cut me out of the process and decided to release their alternative version instead, reducing my direct contributions to filler. Both he, and id Software’s Lead Audio Designer, Chad Mossholder, didn’t allow me to hear the final album and didn’t seek my approval; they weren’t contractually required to do so.
OST release
Their poor-quality release immediately drew criticism, and a worried Marty personally asked me for assistance in addressing the situation. I made myself entirely available to Marty and committed to satisfying disappointed customers with a better OST. Marty made it clear he wanted me involved, saying he wanted a positive outcome, had no ill intentions and wanted to resolve the issue professionally.
He offered to draft a joint statement addressing the situation and announcing plans to move forward.
He requested I hold off on making further public comments until we could address the public together.
Marty told me to expect the draft within hours, but it never arrived.
Instead, days later, he published a 2500+ word “open letter” on a fan-run Reddit page that singled me out as the sole cause behind the botched OST. The post attracted thousands of comments and news articles and severely damaged my personal and professional reputation. Worst of all, he did it behind my back whilst leading me on with a bullshit story about working together on a professional solution to the problem.
His statement was full of lies, disinformation and innuendo, and when challenged, his company offered me a six-figure sum to shut up about it. When I tried, time and time again, amid a torrent of abuse, harassment and threats, to resolve the matter more amicably, he constantly refused, worried how addressing the Reddit post would damage his own reputation instead.
But as far as I’m concerned, truth and honesty are more important: Marty’s words damaged my character and attacked my reputation. I have afforded him ample opportunity to address this issue, but his refusal to do so has left me with no option other than to issue this statement.
In issuing this statement, I’m exercising my right to defend myself.
He was already offered a 6 figure payout to never speak of it again, he turned it down and this is him saying 'fuck those guys, they're incompetent, i was given a nightmare situation and for anyone who cares to know the truth, here's what it was'
It's a response to bethesda dragging his name through the mud and affecting his career. if you didnt follow the last part this isnt really relevant.
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ZoukGalaxy
Member
Why dig up randomly this ?
I don't get neither why make a poll if you "Haven't had time to read myself", seriously dude ?
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MiguelItUp
Member
Could very well be something related to legalities, contracts/NDAs, etc.
Drizzlehell
Banned
Honestly, having worked in dev environemnt for years myself, I can feel his pain and the frustration of dealing with "big picture" idealistic studio heads who always talk big ideas but then throw you under a bus as soon as things go south, and Marty Stratton sounds exactly like the kind of manager that I've dealt with many times before. Couple this with an incredibly in-depth and balanced post mortem written by Mick, I am absolutely behind him on this. He's just a professional who did his best to deliver his part of the project and had a very firm grasp on the kind of difficulties that he had to face while management kept fucking up on an organizational level. And this was absolutely a managerial fuck up and what's inexcusable that neither Marty, nor anyone else in Bethesda's management took any responsibility and instead they decided to throw Mick under a bus and jeopardize his entire career.
This is so fucking typical for video game industry as a whole.
This is so fucking typical for video game industry as a whole.
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SkeletonQuays
Member
The only person that picked Marty in the poll were prolly Marty and his fucking mom. People like that are akin to the Harvey Weinstein's of the world. There are artists who create out of love and fucking leeches like Marty Stratton who just feed off creatives and drain them of everything while not understanding that they can't actually survive without them. Parasites. Literally fuck that guy and fuck Bethesda for allowing it to happen.
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data_jack
Member
There is a TL;DR bookmarked section that takes about 3 minutes to parse through after the jump
Kacho
Gold Member
I skimmed through it and what I got from it is that Reddit post completely wrecked his career and he’s trying undo that by absolving himself of all blame and making Bethesda out to be the bad guys.
As I recall, this drama surfaced in 2020 because Mick went public with it. And as the story gained traction Bethesda understandably went to Reddit to clarify and defend themselves. He claims the Reddit post was a malicious thing that came out of the left field, and that they were talking in private and agreed to do a joint public statement.
Whether you believe him or not is up to you. IMO Mick Gordon comes across as an entitled, shit-stirring goon. He ends the article saying "It’s time to leave this sad state of affairs behind" so I'm not sure why he decided to do this. It only solidifies that he must be a nightmare to deal with.
FeastYoEyes
Member
Sorry bud, felt like I wanted to contribute a thread and saw no one had posted. Don't mean to offend.
Why dig up randomly this ?
I don't get neither why make a poll if you "Haven't had time to read myself", seriously dude ?
MiguelItUp
Member
Well, it's not entirely random, Mick posted the update today.
Why dig up randomly this ?
I don't get neither why make a poll if you "Haven't had time to read myself", seriously dude ?
\m/etalStorm
Member
kuncol02
Banned
Maybe that's the problem? Maybe he tried so hard to make better soundtrack that in the end he failed not only artistically but also burned trust ID had in him by failing to deliver music on time?
CuNi
Member
I'd say it's hard to make use of that advice when, the way it sounds like, he didn't even say he would work on it nor began work on it whilst the OST was already on Sale with his name on.
hyperbertha
Member
If his statement is to be believed, mick isn't to be blamed at all.
MiguelItUp
Member
IMO, I don't think that was ever an issue, more so everything around it. I can't help but feel if the quality was "better", this situation itself would be no different because it's a number of managerial + miscommunication related issues. Mick has done a number of OSTs for large games, and it didn't sound or seem like there were any issues with those.
hyperbertha
Member
did you even read the statement?
Griffon
Member
His reputation is worth much more than a one time 6 figure check. His reputation intact would let him get lucrative jobs for the rest of his life.
Refusing was a no brainer imo (or alternatively, he could've pushed them for a 7 to 8 figures settlement).
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Kacho
Gold Member
Assuming he restores his reputation, you’re absolutely right. I’m not convinced that will happen though.
However looking at the discussions on Twitter, Reddit and REE, people are siding with Mick so we’ll see.
sloppyjoe_gamer
Gold Member
As someone who read both the original Reddit post months ago, and Mick's full statement, Mick is in right here, and he has receipts to back up everything he says.
Marty Stratton sounds like a complete shitbag.
Doom Eternal was great too, enjoyed it alot and would've had the platinum on it too if not for the excessive and unnecessary multiplayer trophies that count towards it.
Marty Stratton sounds like a complete shitbag.
Doom Eternal was great too, enjoyed it alot and would've had the platinum on it too if not for the excessive and unnecessary multiplayer trophies that count towards it.
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ResilientBanana
Member
ipukespiders
Member
Marty getting roasted on that reddit post now with a slew of new comments. What a slimy piece of shit.
ShadowNate
Member
So sad how this seems to have played out.
Based on this new account of the events from Mick's post, it seems that Marty had multiple chances (with the first being after their skype call) to prevent all of this, and we'd might even get a definitive Doom Eternal OST that was not hacked together and butchered tracks.
And, yeah, after reading it, it definitely seems to me that Mick's side of the story is the more reliable one.
Based on this new account of the events from Mick's post, it seems that Marty had multiple chances (with the first being after their skype call) to prevent all of this, and we'd might even get a definitive Doom Eternal OST that was not hacked together and butchered tracks.
And, yeah, after reading it, it definitely seems to me that Mick's side of the story is the more reliable one.
sankt-Antonio
Banned
Always knew Mick was not to blame. I read it all, it’s an entertaining roller coaster.
Fuck Marty. I know cunts like this irl, these loud mouth manager types are the worst.
Fuck Marty. I know cunts like this irl, these loud mouth manager types are the worst.
SkeletonQuays
Member
Now that slimy bitch will probably pull it down.
FUBARx89
Member
Saw this earlier on. Been wondering when Gordon would reply, been worth the wait.
The dated contract email for the OST is just chefs kiss really. Makes Marty look like a right cunt.
I await the Reddit reply from Marty now, or the post just being flat out deleted.
Edit - meant contract, not NDA.
The dated contract email for the OST is just chefs kiss really. Makes Marty look like a right cunt.
I await the Reddit reply from Marty now, or the post just being flat out deleted.
Edit - meant contract, not NDA.
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Revolutionary
Member
I actually read the whole thing. I'm on #TeamMick
cireza
Member
Maybe try reading the statement ?
Philfrag
Banned
As a freelancer who's worked with many corporate media companies I can totally understand Micks issues in regards to scheduling, lack of clarity or support and ghosting. Thankfully I don't have any horror stories as bad as this one but the complete lack of accountability for bad managing decisions relating to budget and deadlines is something I've definitely experienced before. I really feel bad for the guy, I feel even worse for the thousands of people in the industry that have been treated the same but haven't had the opportunities or the platform to tell their stories. Stories like this just reaffirms by opinion that the AAA gaming industry is a cesspit that is in dire need of regulation and workers rights.
