Doom: The Dark Ages - 3 Million Players Already - 7x Faster than Doom: Eternal

Killjoy-NL said:
Maybe this is why people keep getting confused:
Putting far too much importance on reviewscores.

At the end of the day, only sales matter to these companies.
And people can argue all day that they "don't play sales", sales are what prevent your favorite studios/games from being discontinued.
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if the the review scores are high, there is a higher probability that game also sells better.

In the case of this game and Xbox, they will need to figure out why there is this narrative of game being a flop.
 
Loomy said:
According to SteamDB(pulled from a bunch of sites):
  • Frostpunk owner estimation between 3.25m and 7.29m
  • Frostpunk 2 owner estimation between 583k and 997k

  • Cities Skylines owner estimation between 10.10m and 17.89m
  • Cities Skylines 2 owner estimation between 1.69m and 2.35m

Depending on the number you use for an argument, the narrative shifts quite a bit, doesn't it?

What are we even doing here?
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Games that have accumulated sales for more years have more owners, news at 11
 
Brakum said:
Games that have accumulated sales for more years have more owners, news at 11
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Iron Man Eye Roll GIF
 
Great game. I bought the $30 Premium upgrade on GP PC, and then a physical copy on PS5.

I feel like Clair Obscur and Oblivion Remaster took some of the wind out it's sales. Also, despite the fact that I now think Dark Ages is fucking awesome, the previews weren't great when I first saw them. The game looked slow and boring compared to Eternal. In reality it's really intense in it's own way, but watching journos playing on easy like they were playing Halo made me doubt the game. Once I played it on Nightmare I loved it.
 
Here we go again with this "players" bullshit. The game is on gamepass so it means even less than it did with AC Shadows.
 
What $ value can be assigned to a 'player' on game pass?

How many of these 'players' played the game for ten minutes to check it out and then never touched it again? How many of those would not have played it at all if they'd had to buy it? Counting these browsers as 'players' is like counting the people who only played the demo unit set up in a physical store as 'players' - it's technically true but pretty misleading...

So not only can we not treat 'players' and 'sales' as the same, we should not treat 'subscription players' and 'non-subscription players' as the same either.

If they broke these announcements into 'subscription players' and 'non-subscription players' it would be more meaningful, but it would be much harder to make people believe a game is doing better than it really is.
 
Three said:
I'm sure I was hearing this from the regulars regarding crackdown 3 too. It's the go to response when it doesn't do so well.
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Unfortunately so, especially when you see the "support group" banging up the "number of players" drums in chorus in a new thread…
 
I really don't get what's the problem, MS clearly don't give a shit about game sales because they're too focused on Game Pass, as long as the game help people start/keep a subscription is all what matters and studio should be safe... If they cared about sales (therefore, low sales would mean a failure) then they wouldn't be putting it on Game Pass day 1, whether "gamers" like it or not
 
Skifi28 said:
Interestingly enough, the "flop" that is AC Shadows has twice the steam concurrent users.
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Makes sense, but Ubisoft+ does not have as many users, so the number of players playing the game via Ubisoft+ would be much smaller than the number of players playing Doom on Game Pass (which has more users than Ubisoft+).

So it would make sense if Doom sold even less than AC Shadows.
 
Players metric doesn't make much sense with Game Pass to measure the success of a game. Some may have played it for like 2 minutes and uninstalled. But the same applies to Steam ccu. Who pays 80 Euro when you can play it for 10 Euro? Or even nothing like the Asscan.
 
Cakeboxer said:
Players metric doesn't make much sense with Game Pass to measure the success of a game. Some may have played it for like 2 minutes and uninstalled. But the same applies to Steam ccu. Who pays 80 Euro when you can play it for 10 Euro? Or even nothing like the Asscan.
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We know that Indy has 4+M players and 'only' sold 117K during it's launch on PS5.

3M players for Doom + day1 PS5 release means it probably performed similarly as Indy on PS5.

This can only mean disastrous sales.
 
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Hollowpoint5557 said:
Only 45% of Doom Dark Ages players have unlocked the achievement for completing chapter 5. That means over half of the players who have booted up the game dropped it before 1.5 hours into the game.

Myself, I am struggling to get through it and forcing myself to plod along. I'm on chapter 19/22 and it's a chore. Eternal was 10/10 masterpiece, 2016 was 9/10 masterpiece, Dark Ages 6.5/10 borefest.
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I'm in the Cosmic Realm now and it's getting really long in the tooth. I just don't find the level design engaging in any way. There are some sparks of 'brilliance' here and there but otherwise you're constantly running across flat planes, insta killing hordes of enemies which have been placed there in a stationary position waiting to die. Even with the impressive backdrops the world just feels static and lifeless.
 
The whole gamepass concept is such a joke because it's obvious that it can't sustain such huge AAA games but they are so deep in it that they can't backtrack it because they are already among the biggest jokes. So they keep pushing their bullshit, like engagement numbers. I really hope it's not id that will suffer for MS' braindead ideas.
 
Killjoy-NL said:
We know that Indy has 4+M players and 'only' sold 117K during it's launch on PS5.

3M players for Doom + day1 PS5 release means it probably performed similarly as Indy on PS5.

This can only mean disastrous sales.
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I have no idea how all that Game Pass math works out for Microsoft. Maybe it's worth it, maybe they lose money on games like Doom and Indiana. I don't think they spend 300 million + 50 million on marketing per game tho.
 
Cakeboxer said:
I have no idea how all that Game Pass math works out for Microsoft. Maybe it's worth it, maybe they lose money on games like Doom and Indiana. I don't think they spend 300 million + 50 million on marketing per game tho.
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But even if they spend $150M total on those games, if the games sell >1M at launch (definitely the case) a game like Doom at $80 will generate $80M across all platforms.

That's probably the reason Doom is $80 to begin with.

GP really must be worth it, but I doubt Nadella and shareholders will be happy with these results.
 
Killjoy-NL said:
But even if they spend $150M total on those games, if the games sell >1M at launch (definitely the case) a game like Doom at $80 will generate $80M across all platforms.

That's probably the reason Doom is $80 to begin with.

GP really must be worth it, but I doubt Nadella and shareholders will be happy with these results.
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It's really hard to tell, but at the end of the day luckily not our problem.
 
Killjoy-NL said:
True, but it's fun to follow everything that's happening, isn't it?
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For sure, the whole gaming industry is crazy right now. No idea how it's in like 15 years. Maybe no Microsoft at all, maybe Microsoft making the most money. Maybe Nintendo games on Pc, maybe a new big player on the market, maybe someone buying and changing Steam, maybe shifting aways from hardware to Streaming only. Who knows.
 
Negotiator101 said:
I'm sorry but what do think engagement means for a video game? Everyone taking stupid pills around here?
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This is played not playing. It may even be just downloads on account, nobody knows. playing is CCU, played is a tally including those who may have dropped off it. Engagement itself has different metrics.
 
Skifi28 said:
Interestingly enough, the "flop" that is AC Shadows has twice the steam concurrent users.
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Its actual flop, not a "flop", same like new doom, cant be helped, sales numbers or rather lack of sales announcement is self evident, if at least we got some solid revenue announcement(like 450m usd revenue eternal did in under a year) or some 10m+ players then u could easily draw conclusion those games were succesful, but no such luck.
 
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PeteBull said:
Its actual flop, not a "flop", same like new doom, cant be helped, sales numbers or rather lack of sales announcement is self evident, if at least we got some solid revenue announcement(like 450m usd revenue eternal did in under a year) or some 10m+ players then u could easily draw conclusion those games were succesful, but no such luck.
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It topped number 2 on Circana for March despite releasing on March 20th, we'll see if Doom enters the top 10.
 
Three said:
"Playing"

Yeah right bud. That's not what this is. For that we have steam CCU and it's not that great. It's not terrible but it's not that great either.
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Its godawful, man, ppl dont like the game at all https://steamdb.info/app/3017860/charts/
Remember we not talking about 2years old port of a console exclusive or some french indie 50$ game :messenger_sunglasses: , we talking full fat 70$ day1 AAA game from id/bethesda.

It barely just launched few days ago and its 24th peek of 16k ccu is at 108th place, beaten by gems such as: Russian Fishing4 (place 103 with 17k 24h peak) or Crab Game (place 92 with 18k 24h peak).

Hell over 10yo by now witcher3 has 28k last 24h peak and its only 61st place, think of it this way, in last 24h 50% more ppl played witcher3 than brand new doom...
 
It's my favorite of the new Doom games. I really like the shield gameplay loop. In many ways, it slightly reminds me of the original Hako but much, much faster.
 
Baemono said:
It topped number 2 on Circana for March despite releasing on March 20th, we'll see if Doom enters the top 10.
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Bro, we talking worldwide sales, AC:S had to sell(not active players, sold copies) gangbusters, like 10m+ to be profitable(thats about 500m profit, aka likely around game's budget), its nowhere near that- its big flop, just like unfortunately new doom is.

Remember we decide if game is a flop not arbitrary but its directly associated to game's budget, 2h credits mainline AC:S has to make tons of profit(not revenue, profit), to make up for its humongous budget.

Thats why if GTA6 only sells 30m copies ltd it will be considered a flop too, and thats 30m x 80usd= 2,4b usd in revenue, when it comes to profit tho u gotta imediatelly include 30% cut platform holders take, so u are left with 1,6b usd of actual profit, now compared to its likely 2b usd budget(and lets be generous and say that 2b is already adjusted for inflation) 30m copies gta6 sold still puts rockstar at 400m usd in the red.

Now actual investors/shareholders dont wanna invest 2b usd only to make back same 2b usd 5-10years later, they wanna make back 2-3x more, and thats number needed for game to be succesful- profit(not revenue, profit) has to be 2-3x bigger from money invested in game's budget.

Just quick TLDR for u so u dont keep spewing meaningless data next time, remember u are not mat piscatella, u arent paid crazy money to spin bad gaming sales and confuse ppl, let the man do his job, he is earning plenty already so let him work for it :D
 
Killjoy-NL said:
At the end of the day, only sales matter to these companies.
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Is this why all the companies do not report sales data, but "engagement" numbers and always a few months down the line the studio lays off people and shuts down?

Granted, this will not happen to Bethesda, but the pattern is always the same.
 
Cyberpunkd said:
Is this why all the companies do not report sales data, but "engagement" numbers and always a few months down the line the studio lays off people and shuts down?

Granted, this will not happen to Bethesda, but the pattern is always the same.
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Alot of these companies are obssesed with showing their shareholders big numbers, if i was a shareholder i wouldn't be easily fooled by these smoke and mirrors metrics.
 
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Cyberpunkd said:
Yes, and every time engagement is used in place of sales it means the game sold badly.
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Yes, ofcourse.

Any reason why you quoted me? Because I said sales matter.🤨

Edit:

Having said that, engagement might be important for live services, ofcourse.

"Only sales matter" might be a bit hyperbolic.
 
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Realistically, what else are they supposed to show ? They have to use the 'Players'

They can't only say Sales on Steam which is a lower number. They can't highlight the distribution between GP and Steam because we literally not have a single comparison of any game with that split, and Microsoft isn't going to give us one now.

GP people can pickup the game for 1 mission and leave BUT as easily can pick it up again also Gamepass. That is not true for Steam Sales/Players.
I HATE non definite sales number but what would be the ideal number game without going against a trillion dollar company ?
 
Shubh_C63 said:
Realistically, what else are they supposed to show ? They have to use the 'Players'

They can't only say Sales on Steam which is a lower number. They can't highlight the distribution between GP and Steam because we literally not have a single comparison of any game with that split, and Microsoft isn't going to give us one now.

GP people can pickup the game for 1 mission and leave BUT as easily can pick it up again also Gamepass. That is not true for Steam Sales/Players.
I HATE non definite sales number but what would be the ideal number game without going against a trillion dollar company ?
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Don't forget PS5. It makes playercount look even worse.
 
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jm89 said:
Alot of these companies are obssesed with showing their shareholders big numbers, if i was a shareholder i wouldn't be easily fooled by these smoke and mirrors metrics.
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During the quarterly results calls the execs are usually grilled on this by analysts. Lately Ubisoft handled it really...badly.
 
Three said:
This is played not playing. It may even be just downloads on account, nobody knows. playing is CCU, played is a tally including those who may have dropped off it. Engagement itself has different metrics.
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You have no idea what you're talking about, are you kidding me with might just be download's? Stop while you can.
 
Baemono said:
I mean that's pretty much what you're doing by saying if the games doesn't reach 10+ million in one month it's a flop
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If a game with huge budget doesnt make profit thats substantially above its budget, then yup, its a flop, companies are the definition of for profit organisations. Already 2 months passed from AC:S launch so we can assume it should at least break even by now if its wanna be succesful game in the future, its not an evergreen title after all, its very heavy frontloaded.
 
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