that's not really true, your top male talent tends to be in the mid 80s and the fastest underhand fastball is 104 apparently.
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MLB 2014-2015 Offseason |OT| Playoff Dreaming
- Thread starter chicagocubsfan
- Start date
that's not really true, your top male talent tends to be in the mid 80s and the fastest underhand fastball is 104 apparently.
I don't remember what they're actual ranks are, but it feels like they've gone from one of the youngest teams in baseball to one of the oldest in one offseason.
Frozenprince
Banned
There's no way he hit 104 MPH, no way. In the low 90's I'd believe with proper balancing and body mechanics, but 104 is absurd. Chapman hits that once in a blue moon and he's got the strongest arm arguably in the history of the sport.
That's why a pitcher who relies on breaking stuff (I tend to) will usually have a lower release point instead of the traditional overhead or 3/4 delivery. You put less strain on your elbow that way.
Huh, didn't realize they got that fast. Wonder if anyone could reliably do it with a baseball with enough accuracy for the big leagues. I'd assume not or someone would have done it
fake edit:
Googled a bit and softball mound to plate: max of 43ft and baseball is 60ft 6in, so the ball does not slow down as much while traveling a shorter distance in softball. And some MLB pitchers have done underhand before but it's not hugely popular or successful. And the motion seems to fuck up their back http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine_(baseball)
Frozenprince
Banned
I pitch submarine, the back strain is manageable (and usually caused either in the stretch or when you have to pull up quickly to field) compared to the strain on your elbow. At least in my experience.
Is this where tipping pitches comes from? Unknowingly trying to save your elbow from strain and so you drop the arm slot?
Frozenprince
Banned
Yeah, it's why fireballers tend to have such erratic forms, coaches don't get them consistent because if they do, they'll revert when the strain sets in (around 50 pitches is when you can feel it, again personal experience) so you try to alter your mechanics to be both unpredictable and to hide your arm slot on your stuff. A slider has to come out slightly lower than a FB for instance, or a change sweeps down like a FB but has a slightly different angle of release.
Interesting stuff. I mostly look to see if the ball breaks toward the pitcher's opposite side or stays flat/breaks outward to get a sense of what's going on pitch-to-pitch, but that makes sense too. Also interesting that you will feel it when your arm starts to go, that's kind of a weird thought that makes the beastly inning-eaters seem even more macho.
Frozenprince
Banned
A lot of it depends on the pitcher. I know guys that hit 120 constantly and never feel stress on their arm until they've been iced down. And I know relievers that feel it literally right after their first breaking pitch. Most guys just "know" when they can't get it up a full tick and lose some gas as it hits about 45 ft. That's where the mind games come into play. You can fake doing that to take a guy out of his rhythm (Jon Gray reportedly did this all last year as he rehabbed). True if your in the box you can read it's vertical and horizontal break to try and break apart where a guy is liking to sit that day (everybody has a spot on a particular day, if they tell you otherwise they're liars). But a lot of reading into a pitcher comes from where his mechanics are, what is tells are in relation to his pitches, and if you can tip one based on what you think is a pattern.
But yeah it's definitely a thrill, for me at least, to watch these guys chew through innings and line-ups when you just know the batters are furious they can't even read his stuff.
Frozenprince
Banned
I would crap myself if I had to pitch against a guy with his batspeed.
Gagne hit 101 against him and he hit it I think like 500 feet.
He wasn't human, it's a travesty he isn't in when he was never once CAUGHT using PED's. Suspicion is not the same as being caught.
Yet the TJ rate is lower in Japan. I think overuse is going to happen no matter what, because it's just what happens as a result of competition, but that slicker ball thing might be a real lead.
Even if he had been caught he should still be in the HoF. Nobody, clean or dirty, ever did what Bonds did, and ever will again. On steroids, he was the most dominant player ever (in an era where power hitting was at its peak, no less). That should be good enough.
indeed, they really should make a ball that is a bit more sticky and a little smaller (the japanese ball was smaller right?) and hand it off to like the AA guys and see if there is a reduction in pitcher related injuries.
Frozenprince
Banned
They can't though, with the spit-ball rules in place after a guy was killed, using any surface altering methods on the ball will never be cleared.
I think they should just allow guys to use pine tar, personally. Also the TJ rate is lower in Japan because pitcher attrition is also lower. The net rate might be lower but overall it's still a really large problem in the HS/Middle high and Pro level. Company teams don't release stats on it either.
to be fair helmets protect the head a lot better than a hat did when the guy died form being hit, and helmets have gotten a lot better in general.
beyond that it's not like it would so much be a surface altering method as much as a slightly different surface.
I mean we aren't talking about allowing
but just a slightly different finish on the ball.
Frozenprince
Banned
I'm not saying people would die. I'm just saying that it's like, the cardinal rule of modern baseball. Nobody is going to be willing to make those kinds of sweeping changes.
I wouldn't call a small alteration to the ball a sweeping change... I mean they have changed the ball plenty over the last 20 years by winding it tighter and tighter so it flies better. (actually I just looked that up and despite plenty of evidence (kenny rogers Billy Koch ) that it happened it was never officially done and passed off as a conspiracy so I take that back but I will leave it hear as a thought that they could make the minor alteration without telling people like in the past.) that aside due to circumstances they have been alterations to the ball made since the original 1920s rule, one of them is really relevant from 1975 "The ball was permitted to be covered with cowhide because of the shortage of horses." which if they performed studies and they did indeed show a decreased risk of arm injury they could potentially make an exception to alter the casing due to special circumstances again.
a sweeping change would more be what the introduction of instant replay was...
or perhaps the NL getting the DH rule (which is seeming more likely with each passing year)
Sadly, suspicion IS the same as being caught to most voters, so deserving people like Bagwell also get wrongfully shunned.
Dmncnby2k9
Banned
Cal Quantrill who some consider top pitcher in 2016 is having TJ surgery. At this point, turn 18, voting rights and mandatory TJ surgery. Put a metal rod in there or something. Keeps getting worse.
Robert Whitting had an interesting article recently about this. That the pro game has changed a ton in ways that don't cause pitchers to flame out at 26 anymore, but the high school game remains a concern. A few players suggested that they're teaching better mechanics and that's helping keep the injury rate lower, but really that's just random anecdotes and like you point out there's a not a lot of data. Still something is happening when guys come over to MLB and their arms blow up.
The stories he tells about NPB in the 60s are crazy. Pitchers becoming national heroes by pitching insane pitch numbers back to back, then their careers over at age 25 or 26.
Rafa=FedKilla
Banned
Manfred needs to get on top of this...
Sir Alemeth
Member
That was fun!
Brings back so many good moments
Rafa=FedKilla
Banned
The Jacob Turner experiment is over....
chicagocubsfan
Member
He's only being shut down for 6 weeks. No damage supposedly. Worried about our 5th spot now though. I would prefer Wood right now.
Rafa=FedKilla
Banned
Wada brah.
chicagocubsfan
Member
Idk Wood looked really good his last outing.
Frozenprince
Banned
Yeah it was nuts. Koshien stories from then are equally nuts, guys pitching 23 innings and 250 pitches. It's absurd, I'm amazed nobody died.
Frozenprince
Banned
Give it two weeks in before his arm falls apart.
He hit 93 last season too. This is a guy who would hover around 95 on average with his velocity and could hit 97-98.
Frozenprince
Banned
His arm is basically constantly one pitch away from being done. I'm sure he already feels it.
Dominican Power
Member
Look, Stephen Drew gets a hit.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I legitimately do not understand this complaint: "Everyone who loves the sport should be sick of the charade in which a hot prospect tears up spring training, then returns to the minors for at least two weeks to delay his free agency by one year." The teams themselves and the fans of said teams who don't want their stars leave via Free Agency a year earlier, do not in fact get sick of this. Its just the players and their agents.
broken clock is right twice a day
chicagocubsfan
Member
Fuck Scott Boras.
Damn but that snuck up quickly. Now to get someone to cover my shift since I thought the end of March was still like weeks away. Anyway, looking forward to it again this year!
Really he's the only one being a dumbass about Bryant. I fail to see how any fan can fault Theo or anyone else in the org for trading 12 games for ~162. Really?
I remember!
...then I have another one on Wednesday. (That one I didn't expect to get renewed because the league manager is a writer at deadspin. (With whom I've been acquainted with before hand))
Then another on April 2nd.
I need help.
It's actually really only 9 games considering the off-days count, but I doubt the Cubs call Bryant up immediately after that point unless they stage a phantom injury or something.
It'll more likely be late April/early May
Frozenprince
Banned
April 26th is the cut-off date.
I have no doubt Boras will get a nice little under the table gift and he'll quit bitching almost immediately. He always does.
I have no doubt Boras will get a nice little under the table gift and he'll quit bitching almost immediately. He always does.