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My Little Pony FiM Community |OT2| I just don't know what went wrong!

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DrForester

Kills Photobucket
There are many pony Sailor Scouts in the amazing Celestia micro comic that hit today. And being about the best pony, it is fantastic.
 

Orcastar

Member
As the good doctor just said, issue 8 of the My Little Pony Micro Series was released yesterday:

6vAsfAG.jpg

This one focuses on Celestia as she deals with school politics.

There are many pony Sailor Scouts in the amazing Celestia micro comic that hit today. And being about the best pony, it is fantastic.

I disagree. In fact, I think this was the second worst micro series comic so far (Rainbow Dash being the worst). An uninteresting premise that fails to evolve into an interesting story. In fact, the story ends up being just as boring as the premise implies. And last, but not least, the resolution does not work.

So the comic revolves around Professor Inkwell, a formerly brilliant teacher at Celestia's School fo Gifted Unicorns, who has grown senile in her old age and subsequently become the laughingstock of both the faculty and the students. The situation comes to a head when she makes a bit of a scene during a fancy parent/teacher luncheon, and as a result, an influental member of the pony-teacher committee pulls her daughter out of the school, saying that she will not return until the incompetent Inkwell retires.

So what does Celestia, the wise and cunning ruler of Equestria, the master manipulator, do? Does she come up with some kind of brilliant plan that satisfies all parties?

No.

Instead, she reminds the members of the committee what a profound influence Inkwell had on them back when they themselves studied at the school. As a result, the committee agrees to let Inkwell continue teaching at the school until she herself wants to retire.

I don't know about anyone else, but I think that's a terrible resolution. Inkwell is still an incompetent and erratic teacher who has lost the respect of the students. This apparently doesn't matter, however, because she used to be brilliant and helped save Canterlot once. For Celestia, past glories apparently excuse current failings.

In my opinion, Celestia should have come up with a solution that would somehow honour Inkwell while at the same time restoring her respect among both teachers and students. Celestia convincing the committee what a great teacher Inkwell used to be is just a slight of hand that doesn't solve tha actual issue, which is the fact that Inkwell is no longer fit to teach. The other teachers might stop laughing at her erratic behaviour for a while, but students will still think that she's a senile old fool that doesn't have anything worthwhile to teach them. Celestia, in her wisdom, should have come up with something better.

So yeah, boring premise, boring story, weak resolution, some nice visual details and cameos. Do not buy.
 

Orcastar

Member
I'm with Celestia.

So you think it's OK to provide students with inadequate teaching in order to let some senile old teacher save face? It's OK for several people to suffer so that one person doesn't have to face the truth about her own condition?

I've actually been in a situation that was somewhat similar to the premise of the comic. When I was in gymnasium (roughly equal to senior high school or junior college in the US), we had an old English teacher who was widely regarded as the worst teacher at the school. Her teaching methods were erratic, she would repeat the same nonsensical sentences over and over and generally just failed at her duties. On several occasions, parents even wrote to to the local newspaper asking for the school to do something about her since her inadequate teaching methods resulted in poor grades for her students. However, the school's stance was that she would retire in a few years anyway, so there was no need to do anything, despite the fact that this one teacher adversely affected the English skills of hundreds of students and most likely killed many students' interest in the English language and caused them to get bad grades in their matriculation exams.

So yeah, maybe the comic hit a little too close to home for me, but in my opinion the resolution was bad and didn't consider the students' perspective on the issue at all.
 

brian577

Banned
Just watched the first episode of Craig McCracken and Lauren Faust's new show Wonder Over Yonder. Does this look familiar to anyone?
tumblr_mszpmx37Zm1stejdko1_500.png
 

akira28

Member
So yeah, maybe the comic hit a little too close to home for me, but in my opinion the resolution was bad and didn't consider the students' perspective on the issue at all.

I said I agree with Celestia, but not necessarily the author's way of dealing with the issue. I think maybe they ran out of space before they could fully delve into it. If she was having problems with organization and all the responsibilities she held, they could have found a place for her somewhere, with a job that she could do. I agree with the Princess's ideal of loyalty and not just tossing people away when you think they're useless. Or forced retirement, especially for people who have helped you get where you are, have helped build the community, and helped save it too. You don't pretend there isn't a problem, but talk to the person and find a good way to deal with it, if at all possible. These are ponies not programs or appliances or tools. Acting like they're a malfunctioning refrigerator you can just allow to putter along until they finally break down is just as bad.

So it was half a lesson, but at least it was the better half. It's definitely a real world problem, and our kids are being trained by sink or swim meritocracies that have no value for history. It's something that the comic industry is dealing with now, and I wonder if this is the author's opinion of sorts.

I like to think in magical pony land they don't have to worry about the grim realities of staffing and municipal funding.
 

Orcastar

Member
I said I agree with Celestia, but not necessarily the author's way of dealing with the issue. I think maybe they ran out of space before they could fully delve into it. If she was having problems with organization and all the responsibilities she held, they could have found a place for her somewhere, with a job that she could do. I agree with the Princess's ideal of loyalty and not just tossing people away when you think they're useless. Or forced retirement, especially for people who have helped you get where you are, have helped build the community, and helped save it too. You don't pretend there isn't a problem, but talk to the person and find a good way to deal with it, if at all possible. These are ponies not programs or appliances or tools. Acting like they're a malfunctioning refrigerator you can just allow to putter along until they finally break down is just as bad.

So it was half a lesson, but at least it was the better half. It's definitely a real world problem, and our kids are being trained by sink or swim meritocracies that have no value for history. It's something that the comic industry is dealing with now, and I wonder if this is the author's opinion of sorts.

I like to think in magical pony land they don't have to worry about the grim realities of staffing and municipal funding.

OK, I agree with all of this. Like I said earlier,
Celestia should have come up with a solution that would somehow honour Inkwell while at the same time restoring her respect among both teachers and students. Somehow changing her role and responsibilities at the school would have been preferable, but instead of doing that, Celestia only changed the other teachers' views on the issue without addressing the problem itself. A sun goddess with wisdom spanning several millenia should be able to do better than that.

When they introduced the conflict in the comic, I was actually really looking forward to seeing what kind of solution the writer would come up with, but in my opinion the one they ended up using was nowhere near good enough. Perhaps they simply ran out of space as you said.
 
GAF, I love watching My Little Pony with my daughter, and i am confirmed Brony now.

I love Pinkie Pie and I find myself making puns from the show and its confusing my wife.
 

judhudson

Member
About the ending to the Celestia Micro Series comic...

I'd like to think that the artist's original intention at the very end is that she passed away at her desk due to old age, and ended up having to add the ZZZZZ (sleeping text) over her once that was shot down by Hasbro.

I just feel thats the way it was suppose to be (a little dark but touching). Thats what I interpreted anyhow. And hey, it works.
 

Orcastar

Member
About the ending to the Celestia Micro Series comic...

I'd like to think that the artist's original intention at the very end is that she passed away at her desk due to old age, and ended up having to add the ZZZZZ (sleeping text) over her once that was shot down by Hasbro.

I just feel thats the way it was suppose to be (a little dark but touching). Thats what I interpreted anyhow. And hey, it works.

An ending like that would only work if Celestia knew that Inkwell was going to pass away. If she didn't know, it would have just been a coincidence that conveniently solved the problem for her. The issue here is that the comic makes Celestia look bad because she diverts the teachers' attention away from the problem (Inkwell no longer being fit to teach) instead of actually doing something to solve it.
 

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
On the micro...

You kind of missed the entire point. Inkwell wasn't incompetent or senile. She's telling the Hewey, Dewey and Louie ponies the same story she did the first time when Celestia hired her. it's just they aren't interested in it since they didn't live in that time. It's a bit like with Grant Smith in Family Appreciation Day. Celestia got the other teachers to remember that this is Inkwells style. That she's always mind I'd been that fun, goofy teacher.
 

Orcastar

Member
On the micro...

You kind of missed the entire point. Inkwell wasn't incompetent or senile. She's telling the Hewey, Dewey and Louie ponies the same story she did the first time when Celestia hired her. it's just they aren't interested in it since they didn't live in that time. It's a bit like with Grant Smith in Family Appreciation Day. Celestia got the other teachers to remember that this is Inkwells style. That she's always mind I'd been that fun, goofy teacher.

I disagree.

The two panels of Inkwell teaching class in Celestia's flashback suggest that her teaching has deteriorated. In the first panel, the picture of Discord is better drawn and there are more details. Also, if she can no longer hold students' attention and/or if the things she teaches have become irrelevant, then she is incompetent for not adapting her teaching methods accordingly.

As for always being goofy, booby trapping your front door due to angry letters is one thing but mistrusting pastries because there might be something lurking in the filling or saying that gopher holes in the garden are breach of security are quite another. In my opinion the comic clearly suggests that she has grown more erratic in her old age.
 

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
Well, if you think of the school as like Hogwarts, (easy since pony versions of the main trio and others show up in this), Inkwell is basically Mad Eye Moody.
 
Yeah, I read Inkwell's paranoia as more constructive and realistic than the ponies who had grown up in a time of relative security gave it credit for.
 

$200

Banned
GAF, I love watching My Little Pony with my daughter, and i am confirmed Brony now.

I love Pinkie Pie and I find myself making puns from the show and its confusing my wife.

Yay, welcome!

And nice choice of best pony. Come join us in irc when you have the time :)
 

PaulloDEC

Member
This comic is great but it gets extra bonus points for calling Twilight just "Sparkle."

And I'm gonna post one more page of Three Apples and then stop forever but I really like the writing and the art style so I have to give it a little extra love.

I've just gone back and read all of the "Three Apples" pages, and it's pretty great stuff. The art is starting to grow on me, and I really like the slightly sarcastic tone of the writing.

I think it might be one to bookmark.
 
Yay, welcome!

And nice choice of best pony. Come join us in irc when you have the time :)

Thanks!

I love your avatar. Rainbow Dash is my second favorite. I bought the Rainbow Dash hug me backpack and my little girl wears it on our walks. I'm gonna buy a pinkie pie one to match with her. :)

Friendship is magic
 

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
Luna will be the focus of micro 10 and will be about her handeling Celestia's duties when Celestia is gone for a few days.

She kills everyone in ten seconds flat.
 

Orcastar

Member
Luna will be the focus of micro 10 and will be about her handeling Celestia's duties when Celestia is gone for a few days.

She kills everyone in ten seconds flat.

Looks like Andy Price and Katie Cook are doing this one, so it's guaranteed to be at least ten times better than Celestia's micro.
 

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
Looks like Andy Price and Katie Cook are doing this one, so it's guaranteed to be at least ten times better than Celestia's micro.

Not necessarily. Price could just make it a Luna fanboy issue. If it's over the top comedy Luna like we saw in the Luna bits from the Big Macintosh arc, then I think that could get a bit old. I would like to see a serious Luna story, but wonder if Price has it in him.

And it will be tough to beat the Celestia micro. I have to give the edge to the Rarity one for the best Micro still, but Celestia's was close.

But it won't come out until December 11th, and that makes me a sad pony.

Well, they had to do the CMC, the best Princess and the best Dragon before they got to Luna.

Also of note, the Luna micro might be the last one. They were only picked up for 4 micros after the initial six. Hope they continue. Outside the Twilight and Rainbow Dash ones (which were both still OK)< the micros have been pretty good.
 

judhudson

Member
Not necessarily. Price could just make it a Luna fanboy issue. If it's over the top comedy Luna like we saw in the Luna bits from the Big Macintosh arc, then I think that could get a bit old. I would like to see a serious Luna story, but wonder if Price has it in him.

And it will be tough to beat the Celestia micro. I have to give the edge to the Rarity one for the best Micro still, but Celestia's was close.



Well, they had to do the CMC, the best Princess and the best Dragon before they got to Luna.

Also of note, the Luna micro might be the last one. They were only picked up for 4 micros after the initial six. Hope they continue. Outside the Twilight and Rainbow Dash ones (which were both still OK)< the micros have been pretty good.

Can't really fault Andy for the writing - he doesn't write, just the art. That's Katie Cook's department.

Talked to Andy earlier today, Luna is indeed the last one, after I asked if he has future plans to claim an AppleJack micro series. No idea if they'll want to restart the Micro series over...I personally think they should. It was a treat getting two MLP comics a month.
 

Cheerilee

Member
Hey guys, I've got my NeoGAF voice back.

...

I watched Equestria Girls in the downtime, so I guess I can give my impressions on that.

Overall I thought it was enjoyable, not nearly as bad as I was braced for it to be, but I still think it fell short of it's potential. Some spoilers below.

The visual style, I think was lacking. Not as appealing as any upper-level human-pony fanart that I've seen, but I was able to ignore that and just go with the flow (hey, I watched Littlest Pet Shop, I can handle this). Quality-wise, as an MLP movie, I wish it would've had a budget that allowed it to look significantly better than any episode of the TV show ever could, but any budget increase for the movie apparently got eaten up by the new art style. But at least the general level of quality didn't drop (which would've been really bad), and now we won't have to worry about the TV show looking pale by comparison (which is small comfort).

Sunset Shimmer has a great visual design, which translated very well into human form (referring mostly to the hair), but her writing was terribly weak. Just a generic bitch. And her face-turn at the end was cringeworthy. I think they tried to give her a character with the "Celestia's student" thing, but they didn't try nearly hard enough. Villains are very important, and I think the potential was there for a fantastic villain, and a fantastic villain would have easily flipped this movie from "kind of weak" to "great".

Speaking of great villains, Trixie was underutilized. She's just a meme now, apparently. Luna was woefully underutilized too. And Celestia carried some gravitas that wasn't nearly supported by her actions (which is more than Luna had, but not quite awesome enough for my liking).

I like that they gave Twilight a romance subplot, but they really should have jacked it up a notch or two to make it unique and memorable, because as-is it's just a throwaway nothing that maybe happened, I guess. I also think they missed a reference opportunity with MLP:FIM's very first episode, where Twilight told Spike that they didn't have time to waste on romance (seeing as how Twi reasoned that they had enough time for a dance before the portal closed).

The wall-to-wall references in this movie were great.

The music seemed... below average for MLP. The opening remix was the best song, IMO.

Overall, I would put this movie beside MLP:FIM Season 3. Not bad, but I expect more. If they want to follow this up with a whole season (or more) of Equestria Girls, I'm game for that.

I've previously endorsed Trixie as a replacement for Shark-Jumping Twilight's position as the lead character of the show, and I can endorse Sunset Shimmer for that same role in Equestria Girls (which seems likely, given how the movie ended), despite my complaints about her writing in this movie. There's plenty of groundwork there for some really interesting stuff going forward. If they take the easy way out and build the show around the Twilight-doppelganger they referred to, I'll be disappointed. I'd prefer to see the universe-native version of Sunset Shimmer show up, rather than the universe-native version of Twilight.

...

I also read the Celestia micro comic. In addition to the previous debates, I didn't really like how Celestia was portrayed.

It starts out with Celestia disingenuously describing yawning boredom as "a little less exciting, perhaps". Then her inner monologue says it eternally gives her "great pride" to open the ceremony. Even though in S1, she described a very similar ceremony as "always terrible" and was glad that the mane six destroyed it. This comic version of Celestia just feels... saccharine... while at the same time being rather two-faced. The TV version of Celestia seems more genuinely nice, while at the same time being completely open and honest.

Celestia welcomes an overbearing and insulting woman, and she's shown to have difficulty keeping a false smile on her face. After the woman leaves, one of Celestia's more-experienced teachers makes a tension-breaking remark about the woman's marital relationship, and Celestia chides her underling for speaking out of turn. But what she actually says in her attitude-correction is that the woman has political importance? Not "don't be cruel" or "don't talk behind people's backs" or "her family relationships are none of your business"... Celestia's disciplinary response to an unwelcome joke is "I tolerate her because I have to"?

Then the rookie teacher says she's glad that she doesn't have to deal with this nonsensical political minefield of Celestia's apparent making, since she'll be working over at the kiddy table, and the experienced teacher jokes that kids can be an even bigger terror than politics. But don't worry, Celestia has total confidence that the rookie can handle the kiddy table just fine...

Then Celestia wants to know where Inkwell is, and the experienced teacher tells her, as if it's been obvious to everyone except Celestia for a long time, that kids are making fun of her. It seems that the only kids in the school who are willing to listen to Inkwell are the mean-spirited ones who are making a game out of observing how far Inkwell can fall into madness. Celestia shoots the kids a dirty look.

While socializing at the party, the experienced teacher is overheard expressing her frustration with Inkwell, and Celestia shoots the teacher another dirty look? Apparently Celestia's incompetent friends are an off-limits subject for party gossip. Celestia counters this insult by inviting her old friend to dine at the Princess' table.

Celestia also apparently invited the tiresome PTA leader to her table, and is going out of her way to make everyone miserable by dragging unwilling conversation out of her, instead of trying to cheer up her miserable, downtrodden husband, who is seated right next to Celestia, and seems to be happy for the opportunity for friendly conversation with anyone, even senile old people.

Then it seems that Celestia is somehow lacking in ability to quickly stop what basically amounts to a major food fight at the kids table, so Inkwell takes it upon herself to create a horrific monster that gets the job done, but traumatizes the children. "Your daughter was never in any real danger, she's just lying catatonic under a table, shivering." "I'm taking my kids home until I can be confident about this school's safety!" "I'm not going to let some know-it-all parents dictate my school's safety policies!" And then Emo Celestia needs some time alone to cry and convince herself that she's right.

"Every teacher wants to retire, but forcing her before she's ready would break her heart."

I don't think that's true. There are elderly people out there who refuse to believe that they've lost a step. Driving a car is a good example. If people don't keep an eye on their aging loved ones and draw attention to the signs of diminished capacity, many people will just get closer and closer to a very rude awakening. "Breaking their heart" is better than letting them kill someone, but an even better solution is to shine some light on the little mistakes, to make sure they don't just go into denial about them. Inkwell, I would say, is in denial. She's no longer effectively teaching anyone, and she seems to believe she's living on the frontlines of a warzone. She has obviously earned a place of distinction, and can involve herself with the school if she wants, but her role at the school is obviously not what it once was, and should officially be changed.

The resolution of the story, I wasn't too fond of either. Celestia gives Inkwell a very deliberately-chosen test, and Inkwell refuses to take the bait. Then Celestia gets way too ham-fisted in everybody's individual faces over "see see, did you get that point I was trying to make?" And then she puts on this false air of "Oh, but I follow my own laws, and Inkwell failed my test, so she's done for" and makes the parents beg for permission to have Inkwell continue traumatizing their kids. What would Celestia have done if the parents didn't beg? Or if Inkwell had turned the frog into another monster? That would've been rich.

Overall, I would say that (to me) this comic felt closer to fanart than it did to the show.

One other thought I had about the story, but it doesn't seem to be intentional, is that maybe
Celestia was projecting her own issues onto Inkwell.
 

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
I don't think it's fair to equate the Grand Galloping Gala and the Tea Ceremony. One is for Canterlot snobs, the other is for students and parents at her school. She has a much more vested interest in one than the other.
 
Thanks!

I love your avatar. Rainbow Dash is my second favorite. I bought the Rainbow Dash hug me backpack and my little girl wears it on our walks. I'm gonna buy a pinkie pie one to match with her. :)

Friendship is magic

Very cute...! also, your second choice of pony neutralizes the effects of the first! (long story.. just a burro complaining)

Hey guys, I've got my NeoGAF voice back.

.
Speaking of great villains, Trixie was underutilized. She's just a meme now

Great to see you back...

and regarding this one line... you can blame the one stupid site for that. (Seriously, calling someone stupid and ignorant because using the character his own way... they can...) AHEM! But yes, simply accept it. I sadly have.

Edit: I also truly do not get these micros.. I don't.
 

Orcastar

Member
Hey guys, I've got my NeoGAF voice back.

...

Great write-up, I agree with pretty much everything here.

On an unrelated note, Crystal Fair, Finland's first pony convention, just announced their first guest of honour: Tabitha St. Germain. Apparently she doesn't do conventions very often, so the fact that she's coming all the way here is pretty huge.

I might just have to check it out now.
 
D

Deleted member 10571

Unconfirmed Member
And back :)
Didn't miss too much it seems, just wanted to give a quick hi to Gotchaye, I completely understood your reasoning and I'm sorry for being annoying at times :)
I just feel like a lot of really hurtful things said in other threads get tossed under the pony carpet at times, maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm right, I dunno. It's just how I often feel.

Anyway, lesson learned (hopefully), carry on.
 
I never went anywhere, I just lurked, and did all of my talking on IRC. Wonderful thing, IRC. I was just blabbing away, all day long. I'm sure you guys got sick of me over there.

I keep forgetting about the IRC. Then someone mentions it and I feel bad. But then I'm mostly waiting for the new season to start so we can have some real discussion again.
 

Acerac

Banned
And back :)
Didn't miss too much it seems, just wanted to give a quick hi to Gotchaye, I completely understood your reasoning and I'm sorry for being annoying at times :)
I just feel like a lot of really hurtful things said in other threads get tossed under the pony carpet at times, maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm right, I dunno. It's just how I often feel.

Anyway, lesson learned (hopefully), carry on.

Glad to see you back Buf. It's best to try to not worry about it, I got my tag axed due to a pony topic.
 
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