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My PSN account was permanently banned for no apparent reason (100+ Games/DLC lost)
- Thread starter Tevious
- Start date
Oh man, good luck with this (sincerely)... I'm a big proponent of digital future for convenience / minimalist reasons, but this is the dark underside. I do find it almost impossible to wrap my mind around the idea of you never getting those games back, so I hope that logic does prevail here.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Welcome to the future of digital, where the consumer has no power and the ToS doesn't matter.
Also never use PayPal, they mascerade as a bank until it's inconvenient to do so. They give no fucks.
This is why digital for consoles is going to suck. Unlike PC it is a closed system where you can only pray nothing bad happenns. If Steam bans my account on bogus claims I at least have alternative methods to get my games back.
Also never use PayPal, they mascerade as a bank until it's inconvenient to do so. They give no fucks.
This is why digital for consoles is going to suck. Unlike PC it is a closed system where you can only pray nothing bad happenns. If Steam bans my account on bogus claims I at least have alternative methods to get my games back.
Yes. It's why a DD only future should be put on hold, until it's not the, wild wild fucking west for the end user, when something legitimately goes wrong. If current consumer options with physical are taken, forget DD only.
RoninChaos
Member
Congress is a bunch of 60 year old douche bags who think corporations are people. They won't EVER do this.
I agree.
They really dont, I know dude had his account frozen for like 6 months and like 90 dollars disappear after he sold a Runescape character to a soldier in Afghanistan. Something about it being suspicious.
After reading the OP, Here is my take on a digital only future.
I feel that this whole digital future is reliant on trust of the companies and ecosystems you choose.
Stories like these are inevitable, but the why, when and how they are approached by the respective company, as well as how often controversies / solutions / fixes occur, will push whether you remain somewhere or choose it in the first place.
On the PC this has been a common theme but the scenarios are different as there are multiple stores and platforms competing and now even GoG attempting to bridge between them. Each store has it's own system, where bans or other issues have a different outcome on access to content / ecosystem, if it all.
The console situation is a bit more extreme as you hardware is reliant on a single network and service. For now these situations seem rare but considering the low acceptance and reliance of consumers to digital only on these platforms are for now, much is still not clear and probably won't be for a while till more cases show up for a variety of reasons and people can see how they are responded to
Edit: For clarity, I definitely am for and happy with the digital only concept. However I am now PC only, and for the above reasons made decisions on which services I use. Currently using Steam, BattleNet, GoG & GmG.
After reading the OP, Here is my take on a digital only future.
because of this one guys experience?
i am all digital now and i love it. I will never ever go back unless forced to.
op did you ever do gaming sharing with anyone?
Only a little longer until people from our generation will be the congressmen lol.
After reading the OP, Here is my take on a digital only future.
Same here. I buy physical whenever it's available for others reasons too such as actual resale value but this type of stuff is why I'll never go balls deep digital unless it's forced. Even then I'll just be far more selective with purchases.
Death Metalist
Member
Not really but there has been many people who got fucked over their digital collection or some problem concerning their ID especially from Nintendo. To me though, I prefer a physical collection not just because i could call it mine 100% but i love to have something to hold, feel and see. Plus, love building my collection and filling up my shelfs.
So the thread title can be updated. "No apparent reason" is actually "tying your digital account to an unreliable payment system like Paypal and them initiating a charge-back" which we have now learned pretty much gets you banned from any digital service.
The lesson for others is get paypal off your important shit. Hope OP can resolve the issue. Sony needs to be more forthcoming about ban reasons.
The lesson for others is get paypal off your important shit. Hope OP can resolve the issue. Sony needs to be more forthcoming about ban reasons.
If you're in the US you'd be forced into arbitration and end up spending more on legal fees they the value of your PSN account.
If you have money to burn and want to make a point that is awesome for most people it isn't a practical solution.
Punkster_NY
Member
I would lawyer up and sue the fuck out of Sony.
My suggestion would be to get a specific explanation as to exactly the reason they banned the account. "Violation of terms of service" is not specific, they owe the details of the exact incident that caused it. Which is, as noted, probably the chargeback from Paypal. Once you've got that established, you can work with someone high up enough the chain, via email conversion between all three parties, including Paypal, to confirm that it was in fact Paypal who initiated the chargeback, and without your knowledge or consent (which is a whole other argument you get to have with Paypal... they shouldn't be doing that sort of thing without your permission since it can directly affect you). After all of that, Sony should see that the ban was unwarranted and restore it.
But you will have to go significantly higher than the reps on the phone. It's not that they don't care, they literally can't do anything to help you... they don't have the authorization to do it. What you've already gotten out of them ("Sorry, you're fucked." *click*) is about all you're ever going to get. It's not even a matter of just going up the chain, you'll probably end up talking to an entirely different department.
But you will have to go significantly higher than the reps on the phone. It's not that they don't care, they literally can't do anything to help you... they don't have the authorization to do it. What you've already gotten out of them ("Sorry, you're fucked." *click*) is about all you're ever going to get. It's not even a matter of just going up the chain, you'll probably end up talking to an entirely different department.
Azure Wolf
Banned
After reading the OP, Here is my take on a digital only future.
That would be close to my reaction if every single digital game I've ever bought suddenly manifested physically taking up an extra room's space and also required me to put the disc in every time I wanted to play them, or have to bring all of them with me if I wanted to play on my laptop, etc.
Digital games are supremely convenient, and if the PC is anything to go by, we'll only see it more and more as standard on consoles too. If Sony are totally locking the account with zero access to the OP's games, that sucks but it seems that Paypal are the main reason this has happened.
If the OP is innocent then with some badgering of Sony and Paypal then surely it could be sorted out and the account restored.
Using 2 accounts to buy US content on Vita vs Australia home account due to game availability differing in regions is a ToS violation. It's not likely to result in a ban obviously, though adds to the burden of digital concerns.
You plan to keep at it OP? Despite ToS hopefully enough calls preferably emails to easily clarify the situation and to summarise the situation for referal sakes within Sony 'help department'.
If they don't want to give you your account back I'd push for a complete or partial refund over that bullshit.
You plan to keep at it OP? Despite ToS hopefully enough calls preferably emails to easily clarify the situation and to summarise the situation for referal sakes within Sony 'help department'.
If they don't want to give you your account back I'd push for a complete or partial refund over that bullshit.
Then maybe having the digital and physical options like we have now is best and this push to try to abolish physical from existence needs to end.
I have been digital only for quite some time now (I want to say it's been since around 2010), but I have to admit that stories like these really do scare me as well. When you combine these kinds of stories with how shitty ISP's are and are going to get, it gets more and more difficult to trust the digital only future. It is not in the customers best interest when you can lose thousands of dollars worth of digital content simply because your account was flagged for whatever reason the company see's fit, no matter how rare it is.
The fact is that the transition into the digital marketplace is filled with a lot of uncertainty, but unfortunately all of the risk is placed on the consumer instead of the company selling the content. We have transitioned from a marketplace where "the customer is always right" to a marketplace where "the company is always right", and it is a really shitty situation. I rather like having a digital library, but the more I learn about the shaky and uncertain future of consumer rights in the digital space the more I am weary of it.
People should treat digital purchases that are tied to a platform as long term rentals, not buying actual products. One little glitch or problem can lock you out of everything as seen here.
I have had issues with my steam and xbox live accounts in the past that made me start seeing it this way. Now I don't buy anything unless heavily discounted as thats what I feel comfortable with possibly losing one day.
I have had issues with my steam and xbox live accounts in the past that made me start seeing it this way. Now I don't buy anything unless heavily discounted as thats what I feel comfortable with possibly losing one day.
Memorabilia
Member
How the fuck does that even happen? Wow.
Memorabilia
Member
Pretty much this.
OP's situation is exactly why my max cutoff for any digital purchase is $10, no exceptions. Most of my digital purchases are $5 or less and a lot of those are double-dips of games I already have a physical copy for. I would be so fucking pissed off if this happened to me, but it'd be somewhat ameliorated by having lots of physical copies and having spent the least possible amount on my digital purchases.
if i had to guess, password for the same account name stolen from one of the forums or websites that have been broken into.
Commanche Raisin Toast
Member
I hope nobody thinks I'm blowing this all out of proportion, but a campaign to get Sony to address their awful account and customer service practices is long overdue. I'm talking like the NODRM thing or at least on that level. This kind of thing has gone on for far too long.
Even when there aren't serious issues like the OP is having its still a nightmare to try and get basic things done that any other company seems to accomplish with ease. I sold my PSP and had activated my account on a few friends PS3's, and when I realized they were all showing as registered to me, I tried going in and removing them.
Nope. The only thing you can do is deregister ALL PLAYSTATION DEVICES and then go and register them again manually. You have the ability to name each device, but without the site (or customer service reps) being able to show you a serial or mac address, you had no way of telling which device was which. Completely pathetic. The customer service reps are only as helpful and capable as the SEN account page. That's it. They're useless.
Will Yoshida or Boyes or Rhode or SOMEONE do something about this already?
Even when there aren't serious issues like the OP is having its still a nightmare to try and get basic things done that any other company seems to accomplish with ease. I sold my PSP and had activated my account on a few friends PS3's, and when I realized they were all showing as registered to me, I tried going in and removing them.
Nope. The only thing you can do is deregister ALL PLAYSTATION DEVICES and then go and register them again manually. You have the ability to name each device, but without the site (or customer service reps) being able to show you a serial or mac address, you had no way of telling which device was which. Completely pathetic. The customer service reps are only as helpful and capable as the SEN account page. That's it. They're useless.
Will Yoshida or Boyes or Rhode or SOMEONE do something about this already?
That seems to be the pattern with these things more often than not.
Irrelevant of the company you have a digital account with the owner of that account needs to play a leading role in the protection of it.
Things will go wrong from time to time irrelevant if how secure the company is if information had been sHred over more than one account it's just asking for trouble.
Everyone of my passwords is randomly generated and uses the maximum number of digits for each site, I change them when they're a few months old so it here isn't much more that I can do but there is no such thing as 100% secure whatever you do.
If there is a legal way into your account that means there is also an illegal way in for somebody who has the time, inclination and skill to get into it.
Memorabilia
Member
OP, have you solved Paypal's role in this yet? If the Paypal chargeback is the likely reason for the ban your best first move is escalating the problem with them until you get someone who knows their ass from a hole in the ground (difficult at PP, mind you) who will write PSN on your behalf to clear it up.
Beyond this, while Im not an attorney it would seem to me there should be some form of legal recourse here. If you cant get any movement on this next week at the very least I would threaten legal action if someone doesnt give you a legitimate explanation in writing why you were banned. Without due cause, what they have done very much constitutes theft. Many states have laws on the books which cover "unjust enrichment", which basically means they took money from you without giving you a good or service in return.
Beyond this, while Im not an attorney it would seem to me there should be some form of legal recourse here. If you cant get any movement on this next week at the very least I would threaten legal action if someone doesnt give you a legitimate explanation in writing why you were banned. Without due cause, what they have done very much constitutes theft. Many states have laws on the books which cover "unjust enrichment", which basically means they took money from you without giving you a good or service in return.
Kun Aguero
Member
I don't know if the op is in the right or wrong, but he should at least be given the reason for his ban. Anything less is completely unacceptable.
ultrazilla
Gold Member
Embrace that digital future young whipper snappers!
If I can't buy a game on disc/cartridge ie: touch it, I won't be owning it.
Good luck but in a way, you asked for it when you went all digital.
If I can't buy a game on disc/cartridge ie: touch it, I won't be owning it.
Good luck but in a way, you asked for it when you went all digital.
Precisely why I stick to physical if at all possible. I dont know if Tokyo Jungle was a physical release but 99 cents for a digital version was okay with me.
I hardly ever buy digital games on Sony but I do every now and then on Wii U and 3DS..just not anything that has a physical release.
I hardly ever buy digital games on Sony but I do every now and then on Wii U and 3DS..just not anything that has a physical release.
I had my old PSN account banned after asking for a refund when my son bought somethjng while the tv was off and he was just pushing buttons on the dual shock controller. If I knew that a $10 refund would get my account banned I would have just let it slide. Live and learn.
Edit: and you won't get anywhere with support. They just repeat the same script over and over even if you escalate up to a a manager.
Edit: and you won't get anywhere with support. They just repeat the same script over and over even if you escalate up to a a manager.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I don't think that's fair to him or any of us who buy digital games. We aren't "asking for it." There should be some expectation that Sony won't screw us over.
D
Deleted member 126221
Unconfirmed Member
Holy shit. Just as I was getting comfortable buying many digital games on PSN...
Digital purchases have their advantages, but leaving it up to a company to have the last say on products you paid for is frightening, especially at long term...
Digital purchases have their advantages, but leaving it up to a company to have the last say on products you paid for is frightening, especially at long term...
Nah. You're just asking for trouble using a credit card or PayPal when gift cards, both digital and physical, are easily avalible.
That said Sony's policy on charge backs is atrocious. But its not different than any other service.
What we really need is a better charge back policy and two step authentication to make accounts more secure. And thats not just Sony.
Fuck that, I want your boss on the phone.
Be polite, be reasonable and keep it simple. If things don't go the way you want (with silly reasons) time to start a complaint and let them know. Get names of all involved who were giving you trouble and being obstacles to sorting your problem out, reports to better business. The whole shebang.
Ah paypal. Ffs.
call recorder
Be polite, be reasonable and keep it simple. If things don't go the way you want (with silly reasons) time to start a complaint and let them know. Get names of all involved who were giving you trouble and being obstacles to sorting your problem out, reports to better business. The whole shebang.
Ah paypal. Ffs.
call recorder
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I'm not sure if this is what you mean, but I for one would be happy to tick an option to punch in some kind of email or text code before all my purchases to avoid this nonsense.
Mithos
Member
Ranging from not useful to worthless?
Enable password at checkout from PlayStation Store ?
hymanator
Member
I was a victim of the Sony banhammer before. A Sony rep said my psn id was against their terms of service, and is what led to my ban. They acknowledged that I invested over a thousand dollars into my account, so they allowed me to change my psn id so I could keep my purchases. The problem with having your name changed though, is you lose all of your leaderboard stats in all of your games, trophies, and cloud saves etc. It was even more heartbreaking because I had over 18 levels in the LittleBigPlanet series that would all get deleted as well, one of my levels were "Team Picked" on top of that.
I was on the phone with a Sony representative the entire time, and he was trying to help me pick a new screen name, which is a HUGE pain in the ass, since every good name has been taken, and picking a name over the phone made me feel like I had to rush. I kept trying to pick a different screen name, including several that included my last name (which were also already taken) when the rep stopped me. "Hold on a second" he said. "I just checked your credit card you have on file and realized your last name is the same that your profile uses, I'll go ahead and reverse the ban we had in place, we apologize for the inconvenience." I was extremely happy to hear the good news, but it has definitely made me nervous about the "all digital" future we are living in. The fact that you can have a lifetime of purchases, game saves, achievements, stats and everything else vanish with a push of a button scares the hell out of me.
I was on the phone with a Sony representative the entire time, and he was trying to help me pick a new screen name, which is a HUGE pain in the ass, since every good name has been taken, and picking a name over the phone made me feel like I had to rush. I kept trying to pick a different screen name, including several that included my last name (which were also already taken) when the rep stopped me. "Hold on a second" he said. "I just checked your credit card you have on file and realized your last name is the same that your profile uses, I'll go ahead and reverse the ban we had in place, we apologize for the inconvenience." I was extremely happy to hear the good news, but it has definitely made me nervous about the "all digital" future we are living in. The fact that you can have a lifetime of purchases, game saves, achievements, stats and everything else vanish with a push of a button scares the hell out of me.
I don't think anybody wants a digital only console market. Digital just doesn't mesh with the walled garden approach, at least for consumers. It's the perfect storm of anti-consumer practices.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Horrible situation, but my main takeaway form this is even more reason to never, ever, use PayPal again. Have hated them since back in 2002 when they tried to claim I owed them money after I sold digital goods to a scammer who did a chargeback after receiving everything.