There is no point in arguing because I'm right. Or are you going to argue that Kakashi isn't weak, or that he does have ambitions as Hokage, or ever showed the desire to become one?
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Naruto Manga Thread (OT) - The End is here
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There is no point in arguing because I'm right. Or are you going to argue that Kakashi isn't weak, or that he does have ambitions as Hokage, or ever showed the desire to become one?
Icyflamez96
Member
Dont get ahead of yourself now.
Brawndo Addict
Banned
As long as Shikamaru is an adviser, it doesn't matter. He's to Tobirama as Naruto is to Hashirama.
Also we all know Naruto's romance endgame is harem. Naruto's game is too strong to be constrained to one person, he's going to play the field.
Seriously though, if the shipping stuff is going to continue to consume the thread (I don't think this excursion has reached that point yet), I say put money where your mouth is and make a three month avatar bet on whether your pairing will be established (or bet that the other pairing will not be). Change your avatar to fanart of the opposing couple if you lose. People don't talk as much about it when they already have something tangible to lose/gain.
Also we all know Naruto's romance endgame is harem. Naruto's game is too strong to be constrained to one person, he's going to play the field.
Seriously though, if the shipping stuff is going to continue to consume the thread (I don't think this excursion has reached that point yet), I say put money where your mouth is and make a three month avatar bet on whether your pairing will be established (or bet that the other pairing will not be). Change your avatar to fanart of the opposing couple if you lose. People don't talk as much about it when they already have something tangible to lose/gain.
How many times we tried in the past to divert discussion away from pairing wars in this thread? Quite a few times really. There was that one week break where people like myself attempted to discuss another topic but quite a many posters seem hung up on discussing their favorite pairings. It's gotten to the point where I rarely comment on the thread anymore. Every non-pairing discussion some how ends up being turned into pairing wars. The movie definitely isn't helping nowadays. I just want the manga to end without any mention of pairings. If Kishi has to mention it to appease readers, I hope he makes it as vague as possible over who the lucky girl is. Then again, that will probably lead to even more pairing wars shit.
zedreamcast
Member
Minato didnt show any desire to become hokage either, neither did Hashirama he thought Madara would be better. Garra never showed any interest in being kazekage either, tsunade didnt wanna be hokage either, Jiraya was offered the job and turned it down.
remember its someone whos acknowledged who becomes Hokage. Kakashi has been acknowledged for a long time.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I agree with frog as I've already mentioned that Naruto is the best candidate for Hokage especially considering the main mission statement for that position is to protect the village if shit goes down. No one can do that better than Naruto. With that said it all depends on the handling. I personally do not care what's shown in the manga or on screen, to me if it's canon it's canon. Of course I'd love to see Naruto as hokage on the page, that would be awesome and what I've been waiting for. But we'll see. We don't know what kishimoto intends to do after this movie.
And like I said my opinion can change wildly depending on how it's handled. If kakashi is just hokage and that's it, we're just supposed to accept it, I'd hate that. It has to be acknowledged that naruto isn't and why he isn't and when he will become it. Which I think it will be addressed. How can it not? Even Kakashi himself knows that Naruto has surpassed everybody and is basically the best living ninja on the planet not just in strength but just as a person. He has admitted it a few times. Would be weird to not address why he isn't hokage.
Also I don't think kakashi is weak. Weaker yes, but weak no
And like I said my opinion can change wildly depending on how it's handled. If kakashi is just hokage and that's it, we're just supposed to accept it, I'd hate that. It has to be acknowledged that naruto isn't and why he isn't and when he will become it. Which I think it will be addressed. How can it not? Even Kakashi himself knows that Naruto has surpassed everybody and is basically the best living ninja on the planet not just in strength but just as a person. He has admitted it a few times. Would be weird to not address why he isn't hokage.
Also I don't think kakashi is weak. Weaker yes, but weak no
it flips on a dime though, like right now everyone is discussing other stuff lol.
TheKaeptain
Banned
frog-fu is going to cry when Naruto declines leadership.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I think frog mentioned a couple pages back that it would be more acceptable if Naruto himself declines it for a good reason but as long as A) it was his choice and B) we still get to see him as hokage eventually.
Naruto doesn't really need the title of Hokage anymore. He's seen as a hero by the Konoha population due to beating Pain. And now with the war over, you can bet he's gonna be seen as a hero by everyone else. He got what he wanted and that was to be acknowledge. That was the reason (at first) to be Hokage. His reasons changed over time of course. I personally would like to see him have a Jiraiya-like role, just wondering around the Elemental countries, helping people, and keeping his promise to Nagato, Jiraiya, and his parents about achieving peace the true way. And then he can become Hokage.
Maddocks
Member
My words exactly, so hyped.
Now naruto can go to village to village and build good will while kakashi is back home running the actual village. Wonder when naruto will become actual hokage, will it be a super time skip in the last 6 pages of the manga that shows him with his kid and wife and title? or will it be the movie ending that does a time skip. At least once we have to see him with the actual title.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
Well his goal wasn't just to be acknowledged but also to become Hokage. We know that obviously he doesn't need it. He has surpassed it in every way. But the character wants it and he deserves it and we deserve to see it happen.
I agree about the jeraiya like role though. If Naruto says he isn't ready or experienced enough for Hokage yet and turns it down it would be great if Kakashi made him the new Sannin (along with Sasuke) and they will be the wandering protectors of the leaf village. That I actually would like. And then when it's time, Naruto tells kakashi to gtfo and takes the seat. But again, I'd want to see that not have it assumed. I want to see it on screen or on the page in some way.
I want to see Naruto's face on that goddamn cliffside.
zedreamcast
Member
I could see Naruto as head Jounin, lord knows hes strong enough.
The point was that Kakashi becoming Hokage when he doesn't desire it while it's been Naruto's lifelong dream isn't acceptable to me this late in the game where everything should be smooth sailing but isn't because that would be leaving money on the table, and let's not kid ourselves, that is the only real reason he won't be the Sixth Hokage.
The only way I can make peace with this shit is if the choice is left to Naruto and he declines for whatever reason. If it's glossed over in the movies like it's not important, that will be unforgivable.
btw, it was Minato's dream to become Hokage.
zedreamcast
Member
Nope it was Kushinas.
20? He should be 19 in the movie. He's 17 now.
zedreamcast
Member
Its 3 years later tho, and its winter, which means its more than likely to be after october.
Icyflamez96
Member
Kakashi probably will desire it after the war is over though. Kakashi isn't jacking Naruto's dream at all. He still has his whole life ahead of him.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I don't think it would be in character for Kakashi to take it without Naruto's blessing/permission. Once again I'm sure it will be addressed, I don't think Kishimoto is that much of an asshole lol. Naruto will request kakashi become hokage...for now, or turn it down for now for whatever reason.
AS LONG as we get more movies or more epilogue chapters or a new epilogue series, then I'm good. And it ends with naruto's face in the cliff.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
Yeah Naruto realised Sakura was in love with Sasuke a long time ago. Sakura and Naruto have a great friendship but I don;t see anything else there.
Instead of complaining about what other people are discussing why not start the discussion of something you want to talk about? Its not like we can't or don't talk about other things.
This is a community thread after all.
Icyflamez96
Member
Is it actually a concern that Naruto wouldn't approve of Kakashi being Hokage?
Mr_Antimatter
Member
The reason hes not hokage, to me, is two things:
1. He lacks any formal leadership experience. Hes a genin, after all. Promote him, give him a team, and let him prove himself.
2. They don't need him in an office doing paperwork and dealing with politics, they need him in the field doing what he does best: destroying enemies and creating new allies.
I'd say, give him 10-15 years or so of refinement and practical experience, then hand over the office.
1. He lacks any formal leadership experience. Hes a genin, after all. Promote him, give him a team, and let him prove himself.
2. They don't need him in an office doing paperwork and dealing with politics, they need him in the field doing what he does best: destroying enemies and creating new allies.
I'd say, give him 10-15 years or so of refinement and practical experience, then hand over the office.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
meh naruto will obviously approve, he loves kakashi and owes him a lot. But as long as we get to actually see him give the blessing and whatnot, that's the key, if it's just all assumed that would suck.
Read 498. Minato and Kushina both dreamed of becoming Hokage.
Kakashi, who has acknowledged Naruto surpassed the Hokage and is so very close to his dream, will desire the same position after Naruto has won the war, is that really what you believe?
Not at all, but he is owed the courtesy of first refusal.
How about next time you read my follow up post before responding.
Icyflamez96
Member
The blessing in what way? Seeing him give Kakashi permission to become hokage? I don't think Kakashi is exactly entitled to ask for his permission, but I could see him doing that anyway. I'm sure we'll at least see clearly that Naruto is happy and has no problems about the decision.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
Yes. If kakashi becomes hokage I want him to discuss it with naruto in SOME WAY whether it's to ask for his blessing or permission or just to discuss if naruto is ok with it or would rather have it instead.
I mean it makes sense for this to happen, Kakashi is the character who we keep seeing his inner monologue mentioning how much naruto has grown and how he has surpassed everyone and how he will be hokage and things like that. Basically as long as it's acknowledged and discussed. If the movie begins and kakashi is hokage and it's never mentioned why naruto isn't or what happened and they just act like it's totally normal, I'll flip an invisible table over
Icyflamez96
Member
Do you really think Kakashi wont want to take up the position after the war considering what's gone on? Naruto will most likely be content with the decision, so I don't think Kakashi has to worry about "getting in the way" of Naruto. Like I said, he has his whole life ahead of him, and also I don't think he is particularly is entitled to Naruto's blessings anyway although he will probably want to have some kind of discussion about it because that would just be in character for Kakashi.
TheRealTalker
Banned
that sucks man I wish you and his/her family the best
My condolences. That really is terrible. I wish you and all those affected the best.
Icyflamez96
Member
Sorry to hear that dude :/
Mr_Antimatter
Member
My condolences, it's a rough thing to go though.
SonofdonCD
Member
Kakashi is only weak by comparison to Naruto and Sasuke. He was a Jounin at age 13, and has learned many, many justu by this point. He is also a master tactician. His taijustu game is mad strong. Yes, he is weakened by not having his sharingan anymore, but he is not weak.
Like it was mentioned above me, not having ambitions to be hokage doesn't disqualify you from being a candidate, or from being a good one if you do become one.
Ultimately, Kakashi has the skills to do the job better than Naruto, RIGHT NOW. Yes, Naruto is stronger, but he is the main character, so of course he is. But that by itself isn't enough to make you Hokage. It is also a job, which is running the village, including essentially a military. While I would put Naruto on my squad in a heartbeat, I would not let him stay behind and run everything. He doesn't have the disposition nor the knowledge. The main thing that Kakashi has that Naruto lacks is wisdom. He is not even 20 years old currently in the manga. He has plenty of time to be Hokage. Naruto will get there eventually, so I'd say for now that he should go out and about in the world and try to unite all of the lands. Be more like Jiraiya. Considering what he has done, there is no leader who wouldn't listen to him. He doesn't need the Hokage title for that. And truth be told, the Hokage seat would be wasted on him right now. He is in his prime years, and at the height of power. He should be out there fighting and protecting people. You really aren't supposed to do that as Hokage. You are supposed to delegate that out to your subordinates. Hokages only really fight when there is a direct threat to the village INSIDE the village.
Leaders should have some life experience. Experience takes time. Decades even. Without experience (and the knowledge and wisdom that you gain with it), how can you trust that the leader will be able to make good decisions? Would you really want to have an 18 year old president running your country? Unless there literally is no one else qualified (which it seemed to be the case with Gaara) I hope that you wouldn't.
Come on, dude. I can understand not liking it, but there is hardly anything else that hasn't been resolved at this point. It's hard to expect people to not discuss this now, when the potential for resolution on this topic is less than a week away!
Naruto just saved the world not long after saving his village. He is owed much more than Hokage.
I'm sure Naruto will approve, but if they don't at least offer it to him, much like how Jiraiya was offered the position before suggesting Tsunade in his stead, then fans have every right to be pissed at Kishimoto for pulling this shit at the last minute.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I think Sai (the poster not the character lol) mentioned it before as well, but the main mission statement of the hokage position is to be the protector of the village. The person best suited to do that is the person that should have it. That's why Naruto is the best choice. I think Naruto should just turn it down and say I'm young I want to have fun and blast some fools and then I'll take it, kakashi keep that seat warm your sharinganless hobo.
With that said, I will continue to fight those who say kakashi is weak. He is still one of the best ninja alive. Yes he lost the thing that put him over the top but with some work there's no reason he couldn't be above sannin level.
With that said, I will continue to fight those who say kakashi is weak. He is still one of the best ninja alive. Yes he lost the thing that put him over the top but with some work there's no reason he couldn't be above sannin level.
condolences brah! That's rough.
Thanks. He's the reason I've been following the manga for such a long time. He introduced me to the anime when it first began airing on Toonami all those years ago. When I came in, the show was already at the start of the Chunin exams. He went on to join the marines and couldn't keep up with the manga because of it. We had plans to meet up next week to read the final chapters together with a few of our friends who also followed the manga.
Icyflamez96
Member
Yes, he is owed much more than Hokage. It's just the smarter choice to have Kakashi at Hokage right now, and have Naruto out doing whatever he'll be doing, because whatever he's doing will probably be much more efficient than what he would do if he was just sitting at the village all day.
zedreamcast
Member
Sorry dude I hope that youre doing ok
Naruto needs to head out to other villages be biju diplomat show that the biju ain't monsters are good creatures and he can use the rikudou powers to help the injured and whatever. He can also get with every chick he wants in any village on the way.
Let tsunade retire and let kakashi deal with war aftermath, also if Mei is a kage level shinobi there should be no question that no sharingan kakashi is at that level.
Head jounin is obviously gonna be Yamato.
Sorry about your loss Namikaze.
Let tsunade retire and let kakashi deal with war aftermath, also if Mei is a kage level shinobi there should be no question that no sharingan kakashi is at that level.
Head jounin is obviously gonna be Yamato.
Sorry about your loss Namikaze.
Mr_Antimatter
Member
But being a war hero doesn't mean he'll be a great politician/general. He's still too green.
Kakashi's service record is much more extensive, his leadership experience much more extensive, and he's already been offered the hat once before and nearly got the office if Tsunade hadn't woke up. Heck, they trusted him enough to promote him to general in the war and put thousands under his command.
It seems like a fairly obvious choice. Kakashi would basically just be keeping the seat warm with trusted leadership until Naruto can be refined enough to take over, a process that reasonably will take years.
He needs to spend some time as a field commander as a chunin/jopunin and time as an ambassador of sorts talk no jutsuing away a lot of the worlds problems. Let him do his thing, while Kakashi takes care of all the boring backround politics.
He's undeniably powerful, and full of charisma, but they need him out there more then they need him in the village.
Kakashi would get waxed by a number of shinobi in Konoha alone atm. His entire fighting style was based on his Sharingan, which he no longer posses. Maybe in time he'll reach new heights, but as it stands, aside from his mind, he's weak by Kage standards.
I never said that it should, but given the circumstances, it simply wouldn't be fair to Naruto to be passed over for Kakashi.
Kakashi has no leadership experience outside of leading a team. He doesn't know to run a village any more than Tsunade did when she took on the job. Hell, Hiruzen was appointed Hokage in the midst of a war and I doubt he had any knowledge or know-how to run a village. Hokage have advisers for a reason.
More to the point, as has been observed a number of times over the course of the war, Naruto is a natural leader. People believe in him and he makes them want to follow him. In his conversations with Obito it became clear Naruto understands what it means to be Hokage, i.e. what it means to be a leader. He walks ahead of everyone and they follow his back.
Don't misunderstand me when I disagree with you, you do raise valid points, and I agree with a lot of them, but I can't accept Tsunade has to retire and let Kakashi become Hokage before Naruto. I don't like it. I can make my peace with it, but I absolutely hate the very idea of it. I would much rather have Tsunade stay on until Naruto is in his thirties than have Kakashi become Hokage now and let Naruto become Hokage in his twenties. I utterly despise the idea of anyone but Naruto becoming Sixth Hokage.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I'm more interested to see if Naruto is just left a genin or gets auto-promoted to whatever the highest position is other than hokage lol. This latest chapter basically showed why there can never be another chunin style exam with people like naruto and sasuke. They will literally level the village and destroy themselves.
My bet is that Tsunade WANTS to step down from being hokage after all that has happened and wants to focus her efforts on healing and whatnot.
My bet is that Tsunade WANTS to step down from being hokage after all that has happened and wants to focus her efforts on healing and whatnot.
Icyflamez96
Member
This is spot on.
I need to see him in another chunin exams.
There needs to be a mini arc.
Needs.
To.
Be
Kakashi has no leadership experience? he was just a general leading thousands of shinobi in the allied shinobi forces.
Kakashi has all the prerequisites for being hokage, you might say he had no ambition for being hokage but Obito's words changed him and that was enough for him to take the role.
Kakashi has all the prerequisites for being hokage, you might say he had no ambition for being hokage but Obito's words changed him and that was enough for him to take the role.
yeah!
PeakPointMatrix
Member
Great post. I agree.
I'm almost 95% certain the final page will be a decade into the future where we get a glimpse of Naruto as Hokage. Combined with Shikamaru as his advisor, they'd be unstoppable.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I'd kill to see it just for laughs. Naruto would just create a clone then go take a nap and wake up a jonin. I've mentioned it before but I also want to see naruto as a sensei with his own class and sakura and sasuke having a class as well. So much potential lulz to explore.
Icyflamez96
Member
LOL perf
When have we ever seen Kakashi conduct politics? People speak well of him, and that's about it. After the war, who in their right minds will oppose Naruto, and if they do, given the fact Naruto has redeemed and made allies out of the worst kind of sinners in the world, what makes you think he can't manoeuvre through politics? If Hashirama could do it, then there is no reason Naruto can't. Also, I'd like to see anyone lie to him when he can sense their intentions if they're evil. Of course he'd also have advisers to help him learn on the job, much like I imagine Hiruzen and Tsunade (and Kakashi).
Naruto has led more people in the war than Kakashi has considering he was leading the entire army at various points. Also, at the risk of repeating myself from earlier posts, Naruto is evidently a natural leader that people believe in, and he's learned from Itachi that he can't do everything by himself so I doubt he would try.
I don't disagree Naruto needs to hold a rank that reflects his value, but like I said in an early post, more so than Naruto waiting a few year to become Hokage, my issue lies mainly with Kakashi becoming Hokage in the meantime.
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