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NBA Offseason |OT| "It's a complete shit move, but we're stuck with it now"
- Thread starter Jarate
- Start date
Ninja Scooter
Member
as little as possible if they are trying to free up salary.
friskykillface
Banned
fuck Hortford
Quite possibly. Or someone from the Hawks camp is feeding Woj for PR before the breakup. They didn't want to sign Al to a max deal, then they signed Dwight, now they want him? The plan was to replace Millsap with Howard? I don't get it.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Al wants to be a 4 rather than a 5. Signing Dwight might have been a move to make that happen.
My guess is they will do that if Horford bolts, but if they can keep Horford, they have Dwight and Al locked in for at least the next 3 years, rather than having to revisit free agency again with Milsap when he's 32. Milsap's a free agent after next year.
Oh well. We offered him max. Now he's just pussy footing trying to squeeze as much as he can out of ATL so he can stay home. I'm not sure how Milsap is feeling right now since they obviously want Horford.
He can play 4, but also read signing Dwight pissed him off.
https://twitter.com/ZachKleinWSB/status/749251285803626497
If he wanted to stay all along, nothing you can really do. Drama should be over soon enough.
panthapanda
Member
Considering the options right now, Millsap has every reason to opt out and chase the money. He'll be even more expensive than Horford in the long run.
Honestly I think the Hawks continuing to chase Horford is a message to other players that if you come here, they'll TRY to take care of you. If the price is right.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Exactly. Even if, for the sake of argument, you think Horford and Milsap are the same player in terms of value and ability, you have the chance to lock one of the two up for 5 years while the other can opt out after 1 season and put you right back in a bidding war all over again next season....you keep the guy you can control.
Why wouldn't they trade Milsap first? Now they have no leverage. It appears to me they signed D12 then didn't like the plan.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Because they don't have to agree to anything yet. They can agree to a Milsap trade on the hush (maybe they already have) contingent on Al resigning with them. The leverage they have is that Milsap is really fucking good and lots of teams would want him.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Soon to say "GOT A MEETING WITH KEVIN DURANT 2016"
darkwing-buck
Member
Is their anyway Lakers can get rid of nick young?
darkside31337
Tomodachi wa Mahou
Soon to say "GOT A MEETING WITH KEVIN DURANT 2016"
would still be better than hanging dan marino's jersey from the rafters
friskykillface
Banned
Ah okay, makes sense.
They'll likely still make the playoffs with Carlisle coaching
Ninja Scooter
Member
They can just cut his ass. Which they should do. And bring back Sasha to replace him.
The Dallas thing is bizarre. I mean, it makes sense why big time free agents would pass on the Lakers and Knicks because of how bad they are, but the Mavs have been a consistent playoff team, have a top 3 head coach, have deep pockets, state of the art facilities, play in a big market in a state with no tax....does everyone in the league just loath Mark Cuban or something?
Hell no. We're missing it this season. Several teams beneath us got better and we got significantly worse. This is after just barely making the playoffs.
MetalFearSolid
Banned
Come on Masai do some magic. Raptors can't possibly just retain DeRozan and call it an off-season.
There still is zero logic to signing D12 to pair with Milsap and letting Horford meet with other teams when the plan was to retain him the whole time. You would have already had a Milsap deal in place. They are backtracking.
Dallas has consistently been a good enough destination to be a threat for leverage but not the best option. Dwight to Houston and Deron Williams to Brooklyn are the only two free agents that passed on Dallas where I think they fucked up. Dwight's role would have been far better utilized in Dallas since Dallas' offense was never predicated on a driving guard that needs the middle to be free. Deron Williams clearly did not enjoy his time in Brooklyn. Sure, if it was all just about the money then BK was the right choice. But it sounds like he did not like the spotlight or team structure there.
Everybody else? They had better options and those better options were willing to pay whatever Dallas had to offer.
darkwing-buck
Member
Yeah it's a bit odd, the mavs overachieve every year and I feel like Carlisle gets the most out of what he has.
@WojVerticalNBA said:
https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/749355739853062148
https://twitter.com/WojVerticalNBA/status/749356089423060992
very nice. just need a backup pg and center now.
darkside31337
Tomodachi wa Mahou
Honestly its got to be Cuban. Guys saw what they did to their team -after- they won a title in 11. Letting Chandler walk to save the money to do... nothing with it was the dumbest shit ever.
Ninja Scooter
Member
I think the plan was to try and keep Horford, and if they couldn't, keeping Milsap. The Dwight signing works with either of these scenarios. They don't really lose any leverage by holding on to Milsap (for now) because teams will jump over each other to get him the moment he's made available.
I doubt that is why. Letting Tyson Chandler walk wasn't stupid at all. He never lived up to the contract he got in NY. Mark Cuban has a record of over 15 years that shows that he is willing to pay to keep a contending team together. Deciding that Tyson Chandler was not worth that contract doesn't change that.
darkside31337
Tomodachi wa Mahou
Knicks were pretty decent when Chandler was there. They even won 54 games in a season. The Knicks. And he was dead wrong about not keeping Chandler. They blew up a team that actually won a title to chase after bigger names.
He can run the offense but he can't shoot which is a no-no in D'Antoni system.
MetalFearSolid
Banned
Mavs gonna sign ZaZa Pachilia to a $70 million contract. Book it.
And what followed after? Chandler was hurt and underperformed/didn't play much the rest of those years. They offered him a max 1 year deal that was higher than the Knicks' contract per year. Chandler wanted years. That championship team wasn't going to last. Every single player was trending downward after that season.
darkwing-buck
Member
haha he got more votes then deandre jordan in last years all star, it was beautiful
Maybe if he didn't shit the bed hard in the second half of the season.
Interesting plan B when Milsap would be on the team knowing he was on the block if you can't move him.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Why wouldn't' they be able to move him? That would be the easiest part of all of this.
Why isn't Horford a Hawk then? He's somehow mulling over more years and more money? It does look like he's staying a Hawk based on Wojo..
Negotiation for a better trade
Ninja Scooter
Member
Because he's going to take a meeting and see what all his options are. Same reason KD is taking all these meetings and will probably end up just resigning with OKC for a year. I didn't say it was a sure thing, I said it's very possible their plan was to pair Dwight with either Paul or Al, depending on what Al did in free agency.
Celtics should just trade for Milsap. It would be a humorous end to all of this.
I love Millsap more than Horford, but if we have the opportunity to lock up Horford for five years instead of losing Millsap after next season to free agency, then I'll take Horford in that situation.
Mixed feelings on the Bazemore contract. He still has room to grow, but that's a lot of money for him.
And I'm not a Howard fan due to all of his antics off the court, but I don't deny that he will help us badly with boards and having an actual center that can allow Horford to FINALLY play at the 4 where he belongs.
Mixed feelings on the Bazemore contract. He still has room to grow, but that's a lot of money for him.
And I'm not a Howard fan due to all of his antics off the court, but I don't deny that he will help us badly with boards and having an actual center that can allow Horford to FINALLY play at the 4 where he belongs.
catpurrcat
Member
Yup even as a percentage of cap space, some of these feel disproportionate. Over 20-25% of cap space over 3-5 years to a non starting player? This will jam up the trade market too, as salaries between 2016 and 2017 contracts will be so out of line with anyone signed 2015 and earlier. Worst of all, none of these teams are getting better, winning now. Tier 1 is STILL the Cavs, Warriors, Spurs, and Thunder (assuming KD returns).
Well one thing remains true. Even at max Celtics can't get a free agent.
Face it Tiger..
Banned
yep.
catpurrcat
Member
I see why he is waiting it out (presumably thats why we havent heard a peep). Theres not much talent difference between the role player guys signing July 1-July 4, and the guys that will still be available next week, though teams are paying double this week.
(Obvious exceptions on stars or improving stars like derozan, Batum, etc).
I mean, check out the very reasonable Marvin Williams deal from today. Hopefully thats a sign of things to come. $8-12 million a year (ie 10-15% of the cap) will get you a very reasonable role player, if you can wait out the bubble market.
Vault Dweller 111
Member
So will my Jazz finally make the playoffs? This epic rebuild ending with us topping out as the 4 seed is bad enough. At least let me watch some damn postseason games.