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NCAA 2014-15 Men's Basketball |OT| It's Cal's World, We're Just Living In It
- Thread starter Grover Cleveland
- Start date
Grover Cleveland
Member
ESPN's sources saying that John Calipari has reached out to the Pelicans about their head coaching vacancy.
#PrayForBBN in these trying times yall
#PrayForBBN in these trying times yall
Randolph Freelander
Member
He reached out to them?
Sorry, Fjordson. At least you still have Golden State.
Sorry, Fjordson. At least you still have Golden State.
Yeah, that really stuck out. He gone.
Grover Cleveland
Member
But the good news for UK, the same sources say that Cal would have to take a deep pay cut to take the Pelicans job.
New Orleans is only willing to pay 4-5 mil per year, he currently makes 8 mil
New Orleans is only willing to pay 4-5 mil per year, he currently makes 8 mil
bucknuticus
Member
B1G turning into murders row luckily we have all world player Russel returning next year...oh whats that? Ok, well luckily we have tons of depth and a veteran player team....oh thats not true either?
Fuck.
Fuck.
Randolph Freelander
Member
ESPN stirring the pot with their own narrative? Not unprecedented.
A coach not being forthright? Also not unprecedented.
A coach not being forthright? Also not unprecedented.
Exactly. Maybe Pelicans just said firmly "we won't pay up". Doesn't mean a pro offer sweet enough won't come this summer.
Worth noting that I don't begrudge Calipari on any of this. Just how the coach business works. Though a swift and decisive resolution would be nice. The lingering NBA thing probably hurts recruiting a bit.
sooperkool
Member
Cal isn't going anywhere until he blows a few more Final Fours and they turn the heat up.
sooperkool
Member
What makes you say that, you lose or they lose any faith in you and they run you out of town. They ran off Pitino, they ran off Tubby.
Randolph Freelander
Member
Pitino ran off himself. He was one year removed from a championship, and had just barely missed completing a repeat.
Pitino left for the Celtics after winning a title. He was a god in the 90's and could have stayed much longer. Tubby's situation is a bit more complicated and I do think he got some unwarranted pressure from fans, but after that '98 title (with Pitino's players) Tubby never went to another final four. And UK's status as a program simply wasn't the same without the cachet of Pitino, which hurt recruiting.
Combine those last few years of Tubby with the disaster of Billy Gillispie and you have a UK program that was a shadow of its former self in the 90's. For Calipari to take on all that and turn into UK into a "cool" program for 17-18 year old kids, to almost always have the basketball prgoram in the news and to have so many former players in the NBA is an impressive feat. And that's all stuff that matters big time when it comes to recruiting (and $$$ for the program). The on-court success speaks for itself. Only twice has he not been to at least the final four.
Dude is basically what Pitino was before the Celtics. Only thing that'll change that is a big NBA offer or retirement.
sooperkool
Member
I disagree, UK is the Crucible. If he starts losing or not living up "the UK standard" they will be putting for sale signs on his lawn too. They didn't bring him in to recruit so as Uk gets the recruits, they brought him in to win championships. Not to go to Final Fours, but we'll see. I don't think there's really any job out there in the NBA that would make hime leave right now.
chris121580
Member
I'm telling you mang, he could literally be as senile as Bobby Bowden was near the end at FSU and UK wouldn't run him off.
Also, angry / disappointed fans don't mean much. People know about that stuff in sports more these days because of social media and whatnot. They see a few dozen UK fans get angry on twitter and run with the "LOL UK fans so crazy!" narrative. Vast majority aren't like that and don't expect a title ever year. I mean before Calipari, UK had won 7 titles in 112 years, despite being the winningest program in college bball history. You gotta be realistic about how hard it is to win a title in college, especially with the randomness of today's NCAA tourney.
What really counts are things like money, attendance and reasonable on-court success, which is all as good as it's been in decades.
But all of this is sort of moot since I do think he'll be in the NBA eventually.
sooperkool
Member
As much as i'm not a fan of Cal, I don't think he's right for the NBA. He's a leader and recruiter but not a Coach. I see no success for him there but I do see him trying because what else is he going to do? Accept the fact that he hasn't won there?
Brian Fellows
Pete Carroll Owns Me
Such a strange class.
bucknuticus
Member
Luckily you dont have to coach in the NBA
Grover Cleveland
Member
Cal: Title secondary to getting 8 players drafted this year
Shady outchea recruiting.
Let's keep it a buck, the upper level high school talents, the "one and dones" don't have winning an NCAA Championship as their primary objective in life, or really even in their time in college.
They want to see which coach will put them in the best position to succeed and which program will put them in the most visible spotlight as they broadcast themselves to their potential employers in the NBA. Cal's just advertising himself and UK as the best coach and the best place for those things to happen.
I doubt the really old geezers in BBN want to hear that though.
Shady outchea recruiting.
Let's keep it a buck, the upper level high school talents, the "one and dones" don't have winning an NCAA Championship as their primary objective in life, or really even in their time in college.
They want to see which coach will put them in the best position to succeed and which program will put them in the most visible spotlight as they broadcast themselves to their potential employers in the NBA. Cal's just advertising himself and UK as the best coach and the best place for those things to happen.
I doubt the really old geezers in BBN want to hear that though.
Randolph Freelander
Member
^ I saw an article on that earlier. Dude said in 2010 that the draft was the biggest day in the history of Kentucky basketball. It was a clown statement then, and the same is true now. Don't get me wrong, it's awesome that so many kids are getting drafted and having their futures potentially set for life (as long as they spend and invest responsibly), but come on. Herm, remind this guy exactly why the game is being played.
Yep. Of course I've already seen the old fashioned fringe freak out on twitter and forums like idiots. How they don't see what he's doing is hilarious. As if he truly doesn't want to win.
After rumours of Calipari being interested in an NBA job (the same day he has a big recruit on campus) he quickly signs a new contract and talks publicly about how he's more concerned with kids getting drafted than his own success. Boy, what a shocker.
And he's keeping UK in the news whenever he can. I just watched ESPN dedicate a whole segment to UK basketball on Pardon the Interruption earlier and it's the middle of May. It's just all part of the recruiting game at the end of the day and that feeds right into winning. Something that's really tough to do these days at a high level without top freshmen.
Grover Cleveland
Member
Good ol Friday news dump
UNC receives official Notice of Allegations from the NCAA regarding academic scandal
"The University of North Carolina has received its Notice of Allegations from the NCAA, but will not release the details of the report until a later date, according to sources familiar with the investigation.
The NCAA does not publicly announce delivery of a Notice of Allegations and member institutions are not required to release the full report. UNC is expected to announce the receipt of its NOA on Friday afternoon. "
UNC receives official Notice of Allegations from the NCAA regarding academic scandal
"The University of North Carolina has received its Notice of Allegations from the NCAA, but will not release the details of the report until a later date, according to sources familiar with the investigation.
The NCAA does not publicly announce delivery of a Notice of Allegations and member institutions are not required to release the full report. UNC is expected to announce the receipt of its NOA on Friday afternoon. "
Although, if we are being real here, the fact that this comes out on the Friday before a 3 day weekend shows you where the NCAA is thinking in all this.
No fear, UNC friends, banners safe, no post season ban, and just some scholy losses, probably more on women's basketball and soccer.
BigWeather
Member
There was never any doubt.
Are ya'll kidding or serious? You think you're going to "skate" on LOIC? That has never come without major penalties. Remember, when this shit all started UNC thought it was going to end with a 2 game suspension for Austin, and 1 game for Little. Yet here we are, 5 years later.
Grover Cleveland
Member
Fred Hoiberg's going to the Bulls.
First Donovan, now Hoiberg, couple of big losses for the college game
First Donovan, now Hoiberg, couple of big losses for the college game
Randolph Freelander
Member
Well, Donovan had actually done something in college.
The Bulls sure love Iowa State, though.
The Bulls sure love Iowa State, though.
Grover Cleveland
Member
Adam Gold ‏@AGoldFan 11m11 minutes ago
Hearing that the NOA will spare men's basketball of penalties. Charges aimed at football based on impermissible benefits. #NOA #UNC
Hearing that the NOA will spare men's basketball of penalties. Charges aimed at football based on impermissible benefits. #NOA #UNC
Adam Gold ‏@AGoldFan 11m11 minutes ago
Hearing that the NOA will spare men's basketball of penalties. Charges aimed at football based on impermissible benefits. #NOA #UNC
The funny thing is even that's a mischaracterization. Both men's bball and football are supposedly not named in the NOA per UNC sources.
http://chapelboro.com/featured/arts-angle-why-the-wait/
Grover Cleveland
Member
In any event, I bet PackPride's going to be mad as hell at the end of this
InsideCarolina ‏@InsideCarolina 5m5 minutes ago
BREAKING: Notice of Allegations released, #UNC charged with lack of institutional control re: academic depts.
http://carolinacommitment.unc.edu/updates/unc-chapel-hill-releases-ncaa-notice-of-allegations/
Lots of references to Boxill and women's bball
BREAKING: Notice of Allegations released, #UNC charged with lack of institutional control re: academic depts.
http://carolinacommitment.unc.edu/updates/unc-chapel-hill-releases-ncaa-notice-of-allegations/
Lots of references to Boxill and women's bball
Elfforkusu
Member
Yeah, not surprising at all.
I do wonder what it would've taken to get the b-ball program sanctioned...
I do wonder what it would've taken to get the b-ball program sanctioned...
Grover Cleveland
Member
Roy Williams killing a kid?
Players getting free lines of hookers and blow in the locker room?
Marcus Paige betting on games?
InsideCarolina ‏@InsideCarolina 31m31 minutes ago
SOURCES: #UNC finalizing new contract for Roy Williams. Story - http://insideca.ro/NUNn8
SOURCES: #UNC finalizing new contract for Roy Williams. Story - http://insideca.ro/NUNn8
Again, are you guys joking or actually delusional? What do you think is going to happen here? UNC has been charged with LOIC and 4 other Level 1 violations, it's already too late to cheat the process, they are already knee deep in shit. Violations of that nature have never come without post-season bans, loss of scholarships, fines, probation, etc.... Hell, they classified the paper classes as an "impermissible benefit" which is about the best anyone on PackPride could have hoped for lol.
You really think football and basketball are going to be cleared because UNC buried the evidence directly linking them? From the LOIC allegation,
And it's not like we don't already know the names of players who've received the "impermissible benefit",
The NCAA (nor the media) isn't that fucking stupid. No one is going to conclude that the corrupt women's basketball program sucked revenue and Olympic sports into their web of lies and deceit. They were never gonna beat UConn anyway!
You really think football and basketball are going to be cleared because UNC buried the evidence directly linking them? From the LOIC allegation,
And it's not like we don't already know the names of players who've received the "impermissible benefit",
The NCAA (nor the media) isn't that fucking stupid. No one is going to conclude that the corrupt women's basketball program sucked revenue and Olympic sports into their web of lies and deceit. They were never gonna beat UConn anyway!
LOIC was charged on the academic side of the house, which the NCAA has never done before...the whole NOA smacks of "we don't really have shit, so we're going to throw these charges and see what happens." If there are any postseason bans or banners taken down by COI, UNC will sue the shit out of them:
LEVEL I CHARGES
Lack of institutional control (levied against three university employees....also cited College of Arts & Sciences for lack of oversight)
Academic fraud. (NOT LEVIED)
Failure to cooperate in an NCAA enforcement investigation. (levied against two university employees)
Individual unethical or dishonest conduct. (levied against three university employees)
Head coach responsibility violation by a head coach resulting from an underlying Level I violation by an individual within the sport program. (NOT LEVIED)
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-bas...tions-ncaa-looks-favorable-coach-roy-williams
Basically, the NCAA is going with "we're not saying the classes themselves were fraudulent or an impermissible benefit, it's the help athletes got in enrolling in the classes that is the problem." If there are serious sanctions based on that, well, UNC and Skadden Arps will see the NCAA in court.
Also, per THE NCAA'S OWN BYLAWS:
Guess what...allegation 1 pertains to Bylaw 16.
You're right that some of this is unprecedented, but that's because no school has ever cheated like this before. Remember what we're talking about here, an entire academic department propped up as a degree mill to maintain the academic eligibility of student-athletes. There are some similar cases though, like this,
--
Yeah, but this was an impermissible benefit that directly maintained a student's eligibility. I can't predict what the NCAA is going to do here, but they could easily argue that a benefit which ensured a student-athlete kept receiving scholarship money was in fact, monetary.
As for going to court, all I can say is lol good luck. UNC accepted two level 1 violations for failure to cooperate because they were scared of what Crowder or Nyang'oro might tell an investigator. If they sue the NCAA though, now we're talking about subpoena power which UNC can't do anything to avoid. Are you sure that's what they want?
Whatever man, we'll see. Won't find out anything for another 9 months, so no point wasting breath. I'll leave with a couple of points I've gleaned from reading all the coverage:
*Charging UNC for the lack of cooperation by Crowder and Nyang'oro seems absurd given that, you know, UNC paid millions for the WR which NCAA used for a lot of their investigation and has detailed testimony from those two. Seems like they were added for nothing but heft, so they could tout "5 charges" instead of 3.
*Nothing in this NOA is new. It's the same stuff outlined in prior investigations. The NCAA launched this re-investigation last June because, in their words, people that were previously uncooperative might be willing to talk. Well, the NOA shows that none of them talked. Not Crowder, not Nyang'oro, not Willingham, not McCants ... no one. So it's a rehash of the same issues.
Obviously, there are no guarantees when it comes to the COI, given they seem to ignore precedent at every possible turn. BUT, the NOA provides the framework for the COI to rule, and UNC has already said it is going to challenge several aspects of it in their response and during the COI hearing. And going by the letter of NCAA law, this NOA doesn't really provide much of a basis to punish men's bball or football. "Excessive academic support" is usually not indicative of an impermissible benefit. And the WR already stated you can't just remove those classes and re-calc GPAs to ascertain eligibility, because who's to say they couldn't have taken another easy class in a different department?
But again, the COI is a wild card. We'll see in 9 months.
*Charging UNC for the lack of cooperation by Crowder and Nyang'oro seems absurd given that, you know, UNC paid millions for the WR which NCAA used for a lot of their investigation and has detailed testimony from those two. Seems like they were added for nothing but heft, so they could tout "5 charges" instead of 3.
*Nothing in this NOA is new. It's the same stuff outlined in prior investigations. The NCAA launched this re-investigation last June because, in their words, people that were previously uncooperative might be willing to talk. Well, the NOA shows that none of them talked. Not Crowder, not Nyang'oro, not Willingham, not McCants ... no one. So it's a rehash of the same issues.
Obviously, there are no guarantees when it comes to the COI, given they seem to ignore precedent at every possible turn. BUT, the NOA provides the framework for the COI to rule, and UNC has already said it is going to challenge several aspects of it in their response and during the COI hearing. And going by the letter of NCAA law, this NOA doesn't really provide much of a basis to punish men's bball or football. "Excessive academic support" is usually not indicative of an impermissible benefit. And the WR already stated you can't just remove those classes and re-calc GPAs to ascertain eligibility, because who's to say they couldn't have taken another easy class in a different department?
But again, the COI is a wild card. We'll see in 9 months.
Do I think they are going to nail specific players on a particular team during a particular season? No, so your banners are probably safe. But I do think the programs noted in the LOIC allegation as receiving the most benefit (football and men/women's basketball) are going to suffer severe sanctions. There's also going to be an assumption of further guilt due to the "failure to cooperate" charges. You can parse the NOA however you want, but it's a clear acknowledgement of deliberate cheating on behalf of athletics, which has never gone unpunished.
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