If there's any resemblance to a "bubble" in the recent tabletop gaming boom, this is it. The hype for these sorts of things is unreal. I really don't get how people keep doing this to themselves.
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New Board Gaming |OT2| On Tables, Off Topic
- Thread starter Karkador
- Start date
If there's any resemblance to a "bubble" in the recent tabletop gaming boom, this is it. The hype for these sorts of things is unreal. I really don't get how people keep doing this to themselves.
BattleMonkey
Member
And how many of these big kickstarters end up on deep discount few months after release?
Really few kickstarters have been worth it even for the "exclusives". The few I've backed, looking at the exclusive rewards, don't think any really have any major impact and could have been left out, and would have saved a ton of money.
Really few kickstarters have been worth it even for the "exclusives". The few I've backed, looking at the exclusive rewards, don't think any really have any major impact and could have been left out, and would have saved a ton of money.
Myth's exclusives (character class, metal tokens, quests, etc) aren't amazing (though the storybook is nice) but the real big deal is getting extra minis with the base game. That ups the value.
Right now, if I went to MiniatureMarket and tried to buy everything I got in my pledge, it be $500+. I only pledged for $100. I try to look at it as online future shopping where you get SUPER discounts.
BattleMonkey
Member
At a super gamble. And Myth was fairly mediocre game that launched with alot of problems. The company is also already screwing up again another kickstarter with their Recon KS and all it's problems so far.
You get alot of minis sometimes in the mini sets, but do you really need all that extra stuff? I got a ton of minis with Sedition Wars... yea that went well..... Lets not forget Robotech... maybe in 4 years after the KS we will finally get all our stuff, too bad that doesn't fix the crappy game we got already.
I always scratched my head at that...I never had issue with Myth, even pre-updated cards. Actually playing a 5 person Storyline right now and we all like it and anxious to start a new story after next play session. I didn't back Recon so I don't know how they are messing that up but things are going fine with Journeyman.
Might not need all the stuff (like metal coins) but everyone liked that they could pick their gender of their character and fighting tons of creatures outside of grubbers and insects.
if you end up doing this on Friday or Saturday I'm down. Too busy today/tomorrow though.
antiquegamer
Member
I love Robinson Crusoe even if we often died on that cursed island. The Darwin expansion is also pretty fun but it set up as campaign than single scenario. I can't wait for what they have in store for the next expansion. (supposedly to be Cthulhu theme, I know we already have plenty of Lovecraft but adventure on R'lyeh island to fight off Cthulhu sound like fun).
Femmeworth
Banned
Just that particular game. It helped that it had three cool lady characters, and the SO and I consider the rogue androgynous.Were you drawn to D&D, or just that particular game?
There's two points of view on board game Kickstarters. North America view, and outside of North America view. (Although Canada is in a weird situation right now due to weak CAD causing Kickstarter prices to get out of hand. Are retail prices still mostly reasonable?)
For example there's really no discounts on board games in Finland. In fact, availability is generally poor except for the most popular stuff and the popular games are sold at slightly over RRP (or at RRP if you are lucky). Basically if the Kickstarter creator has put some effort into EU shipping pricing, most of the time it's a lot cheaper to back through Kickstarter than waiting for retail. That's why I don't care about exclusives at all, shipping fee is the killer feature (other than, well, the game being interesting/good).
Now there's a million exceptions to this like Brazil, non-EU friendly shipping etc. but typically it holds pretty well. For example Gloomhaven KS ended today. For me it was either $74 (~67 euros) or $89 (~80 euros) with shipping. The RRP is estimated at $100 to $120 so if the game ever becomes available here (which I doubt), it's going to cost around 110 to 130 euros. Substantial saving for me but for North American backer it's quite probable that they can pick it up at CSI for slightly less than the KS price.
A lot of Kickstarters don't put that much effort into figuring out shipping though. Not a day goes by that I don't see a Kickstarter with $35 for the game, $50 extra to ship to EU.
The idea of campaign play and permanence does have appeal, but some game designs look like they want to drop a videogame's worth of stuff on your table, as if more = better.
I do want to have a GOOD campaign game some day, but one of the appeals of tabletop is that the 1-3 hour game, from start to finish, is pretty much unique to this medium. You can get the short deathmatch and the long saved game on video, but that start-to-finish evening strategy game is pretty much only on the table...so for that, I don't really think "saving" is essential.
Splendor is fantastic. Its simple to play but very deep. Its not a engine building game though. its all about optimization. Its also alot less random then some feel. But you need quiet a few games before you will begin to understand the deeper levels of strategy in splendor.
Brilliant game, especially with two.
hunchback
Member
Has anyone here played Bolt Action? http://www.boltaction.com/index.html
I have never seen a WWII miniature game and very curious how much fun it is.
I finally got my LOTR cards sleeved. Tonight I'm going to attempt the first quest/mission. I really like the artwork on all of the cards.
I have never seen a WWII miniature game and very curious how much fun it is.
I finally got my LOTR cards sleeved. Tonight I'm going to attempt the first quest/mission. I really like the artwork on all of the cards.
BattleMonkey
Member
That just puts an extra gamble burden on non american buyers. The shipping stuff entices them yes, but even for us Americans there is a huge gamble factor in any kickstarter usually, plenty of the kickstarters have produced major duds or been disasters. So all overseas backers are taking extra risk
disillusion386
Member
Okay good to know. I do like games with simple mechanics so I might go for it.
Splendor's a favourite at work because of its subtle play, feints & blocking. Real tight games, lots of thinking, lots of attempts to block & stop strong plays from other players. Love it.
I've been pretty fortunate with my Kickstarter backing in that I really only thing I have one complete dud, which was Zpocalypse (I haven't touched it since all the errata, and frankly we didn't even get through one game of the original muddied rules).
The rest - Level 99 Games' assorted stuff, Agents of Smersh, Legacy: Gears of Time, Gunship, Defenders of the Realm, Chicken Caesar, JammerUp - were all well received in my group, and even some of the 'leaner' or more party/casual-friendly games I backed like Cartoona and We Didn't Playtest This: Legacies have reviewed well amongst my playgroups. Some other stuff that went through Kickstarter that I've since picked up at retail was also pretty well received.
Mind you, most of the stuff I backed was in 2012, before shipping costs ballooned (and, now, the CAD tanked), so I legitimately have no idea how many bad releases have come out over the past three years. I do certainly think there's definitely an issue with people impulsively backing Kickstarter titles without really considering the quality of the product (of the games I bought, Chicken Caesar was the only one I really bought without giving it a thorough look, just because I was so enthralled with the theme I felt like they deserved my dollarbucks). I'm definitely forced to be far more discerning now with the sheer volume of 'looks nice but how does it play' stuff, especially after I bought into that Zpocalypse hype train...
antiquegamer
Member
That's the thing about CMON if you don't back their KS then you miss out on 1/3 of the games. For Blood Rage, you have Wild Boar clan exclusive to KS plus several other minis. This is what I find most annoying about their stuffs and the way they do KS.
Gaming Truth
Member
There's a new Kickstarter up for a deluxe edition of Innovation. That's neat and all, but, I thought I already bought one a few years ago.
I appreciate their redesign and the fact that it has two previously unreleased expansions, but what in the world is the deal with this? Is this a Sony/Marvel thing where Asmadi was desperate for money, sold the international rights of Innovation to Iello, and then try their best to pretend it didn't happen?
Edit: Didn't write that I was also curious if they differ. Iello's version has wording changes to clarify issues with the original version. I can't remember if it also has balance fixes. The Deluxe edition definitely says it has balance fixes. If Iello slightly altered Innovation and Echoes, did they do it with designer blessing/input? Are the balance changes in the Deluxe version the same as the ones in the Iello version?
This is all really frustrating. Hence the post
I appreciate their redesign and the fact that it has two previously unreleased expansions, but what in the world is the deal with this? Is this a Sony/Marvel thing where Asmadi was desperate for money, sold the international rights of Innovation to Iello, and then try their best to pretend it didn't happen?
Edit: Didn't write that I was also curious if they differ. Iello's version has wording changes to clarify issues with the original version. I can't remember if it also has balance fixes. The Deluxe edition definitely says it has balance fixes. If Iello slightly altered Innovation and Echoes, did they do it with designer blessing/input? Are the balance changes in the Deluxe version the same as the ones in the Iello version?
This is all really frustrating. Hence the post
Showed a playthrough video to my SO yesterday, she was smiling almost all the way through. After it was over she looked up at me and said "this is awesome, why are we not getting this?"
Awesome!
Gaming Truth
Member
Aw, but the Iello version is more aesthetically pleasing. You're not on of these people with pitchforks in hand, are you? 😱
Asmadi is trying to cook up a Cambridge Black Box situation
I wouldn't write up a diatribe about it but the original art and layout just works better for me. Plus, we got expansions yo. (Yes I realize the first one eventually came out from iello).
Femmeworth
Banned
Among the Stars vs 7 Wonders, which is better for two players?
Why would this be a black box situation? Asmadi has been on point with their KS campaigns.
disillusion386
Member
While I enjoy two-player 7 Wonders, it requires a dummy player and doesn't capture the feel of the regular game.
I hear Among the Stars is fantastic.
EDIT: also, this is apparently coming out at Essen: https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/173346/7-wonders-duel
Among the Stars does a dummy player for 2 players as well as 7 Wonders. Doesn't necessarily answer your question so it is a question of if you like spatially making a ship or just "collecting resources."
I actually feel like the 2 player dummy in 7 Wonders adds a lot of tactical considerations to the game when opposing the person you're playing against, using it as a tool and resource to gain leverage over them.
disillusion386
Member
Oh man, for some reason I was thinking of Star Realms. Yeah, I don't know anything about Among the Stars.
I agree with you actually, and I too enjoy the extra control you get from the dummy player, but anecdotally, I know a lot of people just prefer the regular game.
Joke about the new look vs old. Asmadi is good people.
Femmeworth
Banned
Ended up getting Among the Stars, Lost Cities, and Flash Point: Fire Rescue through the Target deal. With tax and Lost Cities only being ~$20, I didn't really take full advantage of the deal. Though expanding my collection by three games for ~$60 isn't so bad.
I actually prefer the Iello version 😳
Back to the mines, you godless heathen.
Femmeworth
Banned
I came across the term "ameritrash" for the first time. That was interesting.
Decided not to get Rum and Bones. I simply don't like cmon's business model. And the game seems to simple for a 100$ investment.
Especially as you only get two teams in the retail version.
Ended up pulling the trigger on two games I have been looking at for a year now: Biblios and Battlecon: Devastation of Indines.
Especially as you only get two teams in the retail version.
Ended up pulling the trigger on two games I have been looking at for a year now: Biblios and Battlecon: Devastation of Indines.
Played a learning game of Churchill last night, 3 players, all of us new to it. Definitely a learning curve, and typical GMT/war-game-like rules (see section 4.4, which says see section 1.2 etc). One key element, placing counter-insurgents & political markers is explained in depth but never tells you why you'd want to do it, until you come across a mention of them earning you VP.
The whole game's a representation of the deals & maneuvering between the three Allies towards the end of WW2, so it represents this with the big 'twist' in final scoring - the high scorer can't be too faraway in points for the lowest scorer, or they'll lose, letting the second place player win. This makes the game really weird where you have to help your opponents to keep them scoring, but not so much that they overtake you.
In our 3 turn tutorial game, I was the Brits (obviously) & raced ahead, but the Yanks caught up a little, with the USSR falling way behind. We defeated the Germans in the second turn, but couldn't defeat the Japanese without the USSR help... so the final turn was us helping /him/ because he couldn't do it on his own... But at the same time, I had a ridiculous amount of influence around the world that the USA couldn't catch up with...
In the end, I lost because I was too far ahead, but not enough ahead to be absolutely convincing. It's a really funky end-game, but a riveting experience. Definitely got rules wrong, definitely a little confusing that first round, but one I need to play again soon.
The whole game's a representation of the deals & maneuvering between the three Allies towards the end of WW2, so it represents this with the big 'twist' in final scoring - the high scorer can't be too faraway in points for the lowest scorer, or they'll lose, letting the second place player win. This makes the game really weird where you have to help your opponents to keep them scoring, but not so much that they overtake you.
In our 3 turn tutorial game, I was the Brits (obviously) & raced ahead, but the Yanks caught up a little, with the USSR falling way behind. We defeated the Germans in the second turn, but couldn't defeat the Japanese without the USSR help... so the final turn was us helping /him/ because he couldn't do it on his own... But at the same time, I had a ridiculous amount of influence around the world that the USA couldn't catch up with...
In the end, I lost because I was too far ahead, but not enough ahead to be absolutely convincing. It's a really funky end-game, but a riveting experience. Definitely got rules wrong, definitely a little confusing that first round, but one I need to play again soon.
Reminds me of an old board game I used to play back in college. It revolved around democracy in ancient Greece IIRC, and you had to work together with others to attain the goals you received at the beginning of the game. The game described a big lead as smoething that the other senators would interpret as a sign of corruption and would make you lose the game.
In what context?
Gaf loves Ameritrash games.
Republic of Rome? Still very popular & yeah, definitely shares some similarities.
I said the same thing
If you enjoy the likes of Twilight Struggle with a dash of negotiation, this is well worth a look at. Definitely a GMT game though
One Foul Note
Member
That sounds real interesting. Is it possible for the American player to over-assist you and thus push you into the danger zone? Interesting dynamic for a game where the 2nd player might be more interested in helping the first place person then themselves.
Absolutely possible. It's a really interesting game.
Honestly Gaf seems very diverse in taste. At least thats how I feel.
It gets super tense in the 10th conference as everyone is trying to get everything set up to win the game. In our last game, everyone was completely silent except for the conference negotiation card plays because it was such a fine line between all players.
Some rules that I think get forgotten often, based on my several plays so far:
Clandestine support markers give you one point, but once a political control marker goes down into a country, it gives 3 points to that player. You also can't remove opponent's political control markers from a country unless you have your own clandestine support down. And don't forget to pay attention to the global issue restrictions on political marker placement!
Empty colonies with no markers in Asia give the UK 2 points each.
Global issue markers never return to the starting neutral spot once they've been moved.
If the conditional issues (USSR Declares War on Japan and Normandy Invasion) end in the center of the table, then they take effect. Otherwise, they are canceled (unlike all the other issues). Additionally, if on the turn those issues take effect but the front they affect isn't able to make it to the next space, then they get put back on the issues track and have to be selected and completed again on a future conference.
If the USSR wins the A-Bomb issue, they get a free advance on the A-Bomb track, but you still roll to see if the US/UK marker advances. Basically, there's always an A-Bomb roll for the US/UK when the A-Bomb issue is won by someone.
If the Strategic Materials issue ends the conference in the middle of the table, everyone gets their Strategic Materials resource that turn.
Kamikaze spaces in the Pacific eliminate naval markers in those front boxes when the front moves into them. Also, if an Imperial Japanese Navy cube gets placed during the military phase (and remember, only one IJN cube can ever be placed per turn), then it eliminates a naval marker in that front box during the Front Advancement phase, meaning the front cannot advance that turn. Really brutal, as it basically means you lose a turn.
XiaNaphryz
LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
Twilight Struggle beta about to hit Steam, beta keys supposedly will be sent out over the next few days if you were part of the Kickstarter tiers that gave access.
Femmeworth
Banned
Saw it used on /r/boardgames and then heard it used in rahdo's introduction video. I'm starting to pick up on some of the board gaming jargon/slang.In what context?