Stuart360
Member
Wait isnt that the wrong way around?, or is the lighting tech really THAT demnding lol.
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Bernd Lauert
Banned
I assume outdoors we're gonna have super fake RT (low detail, few meshes) while indoors it's gonna be much closer to real RT.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
The more advanced tech is only useful on indoor environments.. so it would be pointless to enable it. If you didn't use the more advanced lighting indoor, presumably you'd get much better FPS, but then the game isn't going to look super impressive as indoor environments are really made to shine more by lighting than anything else.
Light bounces and dynamic lights make more of a difference.
They outright stated that tech doesn't work on complex meshes.. only simple ones like walls and furniture and shiat.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Not as big of a difference but i guess its realtime.
Lumens has a pretty big hit on framerate literally cutting it in half in some of the UE4 demos so devs might end up sticking with baked GI.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
We’ll their highest settings outright isn’t recommended for anything but indoor areas. Is this taking that into account? I would think it would..
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ArcaneNLSC
Member
Again, this is not a dumping ground for general posts. 1 month reply ban.
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ZywyPL
Banned
Single light source (the Sun) on relatively flat area vs multiple lights + multiple light bounces of the walls (plus still that incoming Sun light from the windows), so yeah, definitely more demanding. Same with walking down the street with all the street lights and building around. That 1080p scares me, watching native 4K PC footage is what I'd call next-gen, the upscaled footage not so much, everything is washed out, missing a ton of details, which is the opposite of what the tech was made for.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
So after around 4 hours of messing about, i wasnt able to get this demo to work. I cannot run it off of the HDD. It crashes with some Direct3d error. I cant move it to SSD because the main 100 GB install has to be done on the SSD and i dont have 200 GB of empty space. This is what I get for buying a prebuilt PC.
But does anyone here have a 4 tflops GPU? I am curious to know what resolution it runs at if the 2080 is running this at 1440p 30 fps. My friend has a RX570 which is 5 tflops but its a polaris GPU which IIRC didnt have any primitive shader support like the vega cards. So we need either a 5500m or a 5600 downclocked to run at 4 Tflops.
Beyond 3d shows 6GB of VRAM plus 3-4 GB of System RAM required to run it at native 4k. That should come down a little for 1080p but by how much is the question because at 10GB they are already beyond the XSS specs.
Another thing I realized is that the 10 GB of RAM is below the 13.5 GB of RAM available in next gen consoles. Assuming the PS5 is around there somewhere. That means this demo with absolutely no ingame logic, no destruction, no NPCs, no foliage or any kind of interactivity is already taking up 80% of the ram available. I suspect RAM is going to force them to downgrade the visuals a bit even if the GPUs can handle it.
But does anyone here have a 4 tflops GPU? I am curious to know what resolution it runs at if the 2080 is running this at 1440p 30 fps. My friend has a RX570 which is 5 tflops but its a polaris GPU which IIRC didnt have any primitive shader support like the vega cards. So we need either a 5500m or a 5600 downclocked to run at 4 Tflops.
Beyond 3d shows 6GB of VRAM plus 3-4 GB of System RAM required to run it at native 4k. That should come down a little for 1080p but by how much is the question because at 10GB they are already beyond the XSS specs.
Another thing I realized is that the 10 GB of RAM is below the 13.5 GB of RAM available in next gen consoles. Assuming the PS5 is around there somewhere. That means this demo with absolutely no ingame logic, no destruction, no NPCs, no foliage or any kind of interactivity is already taking up 80% of the ram available. I suspect RAM is going to force them to downgrade the visuals a bit even if the GPUs can handle it.
Wow. One of the few thats actually having a rational discussion about the PC specs of the demo results thats been flying around.
So my question is this: would the SSD, I/O take some of the weight off the ram usage?
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
And here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
Dolomite
Member
I stand on the opinion that most of what was showed during last yrs UE5 demo was delicately scripted under conditions so optimal that we won't be playing anything like that in the near future.And here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
SportsFan581
Member
And here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
I wouldn't give up all hope yet. I'd expect the PS4 version to look worse than it normally would, I'd take that as the dev increasing the scope beyond what is typical for PS4 and thus the visuals take a hit on that platform.
I am with you as well.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
But I am not talking about last years UE5. I am talking about yesterdays UE5 demo which you can run on a 6 tflops 2060 at 1080p 30 fps. If you have a PC you can download the demo and literally play around in it right now.
It looks like this. On a 1080p stream.
The Horizon footage so far looks like a game designed on a 1.84 tflops GPU. Scaled to run at native 4k 30 fps on a console with 5x more tflops. There is no two ways about it.
Lets just hope this is just a bad joke and the final game will look more like the trailer last year.
Can you be even more idiotically hyperbolic? I just want to know how far you can come.And here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Which part is hyperbolic. I will list them all again so its easier for you to pick them out.
- And here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
- This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
- Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer.
- But good god. I never expected it to look this bad.
- Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
Are you saying its NOT downgraded? Do you think UE5 demo looks better? Do you disagree that cross gen does not suck? Have you seen Halo infinite? Do you disagree that the draw distance is bad? You think LODs look good?
Is it hyperbolic that I am hoping that this is PS4 footage? Actually, I think its pretty idiotic to assume against visual evidence that this isnt the final product, but call me a hopeless romantic.
Zoro7
Banned
All you do is complain. Like 90% of your posts are complaints. Why don’t you wait to se the gameplay before getting your knickers in a twist?And here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
wellgamer789
Neo Member
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
If the game looks like that but has flying, foliage catching fire tech and destructible trees like in Zelda BoTW and Far Cry 2 then i will swallow the downgrade.
Setsuna Mudou
Member
I fully agree and sincerely hope that's a mix of shitty quality youtube streaming + ps4 version. It looks like ass. Not Halo infinite ass, but ass nevertheless.
Let's see.
100% fuck crossgen.
Sinthor
Gold Member
I'm just going to say...I don't know we have enough to compare to say it's downgraded. This looks pretty good to me. I'd say in at least some cases yes the UE5 demo looks better but this game isn't UE5 and from previous gens we already know we won't see up to the UE demo levels of content in games. At least not until LATE in the generations.And here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
I dunno...I reserve judgement.
Sinthor
Gold Member
Well, you can GUARANTEE that the youtube screen isn't going to look as good as the actual content.
TheRedRiders
Member
I would avoid comparisons to the UE5 demo for several reasons.And here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
We all knew HFW was not a "true" next generation game and would be likely held back by cross generation support.
What Epic are doing with Unreal Engine is amazing but there are some good criticism which we can make against it, one being the severe lack foliage and it's rendering, the demos for some reason have stuck to dry dessert lands, sure they look amazing in terms of geometric detail but they are starting to look "bland". Another is the performance, I said this a while back on this thread that the Unreal Demo was throwing around insane number of polygons, such a number would never be featured in proper games due to bottlenecks in filesize. In fact, I'll put my money on that we'll see or get a glimpse of a triple A game which looks better and more diverse than UE5 whilst also having moderate performance (1440p to 4K).
Let's not forget also that several of Playstation's first party studios don't even use Unreal Engine, from games like God of War, Uncharted, Last of Us and Ghost of Tsushima and I don't think that's going to change anytime soon, the ICE team propriety engines are on another level all together.
But back to my main point, sure we can criticise what we're seeing right now from the HFW stream but lets at least reserve judgement until we see the gameplay demo but let's also not compare everything to the UE5 demos, because sometimes those comparisons are not valid, especially when comparing them to games which have a totally different art style, animation and offer cross-gen support.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
yeah, I am willing to wait a few hours. Yesterday in the UE5 demo thread, I was just telling the PC and PS5 fans to hold off on warring until we get the demo in our hands before calling victory on the 64GB of RAM requirements. I am going to take my own advice here and just wait for the final results.
But i gotta say the initial shock of those screens was too much. They shouldve never revealed footage like this. I dont know whose idea was this but first impression is very important.
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Stooky
Member
a dev would design using Bg objects to occlude like hills valleys etc to reach max fidelity. Designing high detail wide open plains with far draw distances is something a dev wouldn't generally wouldnt do. In the real world taking up 10gb ram just for background would is rare.
TheRedRiders
Member
Wasn't the 64 GB RAM requirement because of HDD?
I'm sure it would be significantly less RAM requirement when an SSD is used or have I missed something.
Setsuna Mudou
Member
Correct, however it should look 10 times better than it does. If they had any sense they would hide the shitty last gen version under the rug and only show the PS5 one. And if this is the PS5 version, then fuck them for making it crossgen.
I'll wait to see the gameplay, but I'm hoping it's just them trolling at this point.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
People are running the compiled demo at 4k using around ~10GB of total RAM between VRAM and system RAM.
The 64GB thing was for loading a lot up in the editor itself.
But I think that was SlimySnake's point.. to wait for better info before jumping to conclusions.
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dcmk7
Banned
I think I must be the only one in this thread pretty confident atm.
Reveal trailer looked good, and was running on a PS5, no reason why would be downgraded from those visuals.
Have there been any recent examples of a PS studio game being downgraded? Only example I can think of is Spiderman and puddle-gate, which turned out to be fake news (IIRC).
Reveal trailer looked good, and was running on a PS5, no reason why would be downgraded from those visuals.
Have there been any recent examples of a PS studio game being downgraded? Only example I can think of is Spiderman and puddle-gate, which turned out to be fake news (IIRC).
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
I think it's going to look amazing.. i mean the first game did..
But that demo last year to me wasn't gameplay.. I find the claim it was just really odd.... and even if it was in engine, some could have been pre-rendered.. as at least one other game at the show (Kena) admitted some of their trailer was.
I expect the game to look amazing, and the cinematic presentation parts of the game that use hero assets to look damn close to what we saw last year. But I also think it's possible they won't be exact replicas.
I mean people think the fish swimming in the water was some advanced AI fish routine... it very likely could have just been a scripted scene.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
That could be it. I only have 16GB of RAM and wasnt able to get this thing to even run on my HDD. Crashed every time on boot.
Notice how the difference between recommended and minimum specs is 32GB vs 64GB and a higher spec'd graphics card. No mention of the SSD or HDD and people were able to run the game on the HDD and fly around the map at pretty fast speeds. The switch to the dark world is roughly 15 seconds longer on HDD.
dcmk7
Banned
That would be quite misleading though, for such a highly anticipated game, very risky.
They must be aware of the flak they would receive when the true quality emerges, if that were the case.
Have they done anything like that in the past?
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THEAP99
Banned
Yeah, doesn't look like the reveal last year eitherAnd here comes the downgrade we all feared. It looks atrocious compared to the UE5 demo.
This is why cross gen sucks and will always suck.
Hoping against hope that this is PS4 footage and the PS5 footage will look like the trailer. But good god. I never expected it to look this bad. Look at those assets. The draw distance. The awful LODs. Kill me.
My goal today is to make sure i dont get banned today.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
PuddleGate wasn't fake news. They used screenspace reflections for the puddles for the demo knowing they couldnt have puddles like that in an open world game. The final game used a different form of reflection that was cost effective like it needed to be. John from DF explained it better but basically the gist of it was that they could never have those reflections in an open world game with millions of puddles unless you had artists lining up all those reflections manually or using RT. It's not a performance thing, just a man power cut. Miles and Spiderman Remastered restored those puddles. reflections thanks to RT.
TLOU2 got a big downgrade on enemy character models. And some small downgrades to the motion matching system and slight downgrades to their Global Illumination system. I am hoping the PS5 version puts those back in. That game was also running on a PS4 Pro so no idea why those things had to be downgraded.
Uncharted 4 trailer was said to be running on a PS4 at 1080p 60 fps in realtime by Cornie Yuu which was never proven to be false but the final game did get a downgrade. Though not a major graphical downgrade, the fact that it wasnt 60 fps was kinda lame. They shoudve never claimed it was realtime. She left ND soon after that so maybe it was all her. All ND claimed was that was captured on PS4.
Days Gone got a lighting downgrade. The final version had a different setting for that area (now in a snowy mountainy region) in that sawmill area, but i played the game for 50 hours and never saw day lighting look that good.
Games that improved after their first reveal were Horizon, GoW, Ghost Of Tshushima and the new Ratchet and Clank.
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Setsuna Mudou
Member
i'm frankly shocked, I want to stay optimistic, but it's not easy. I can easily imagine a bigger scale of the world, plus more diversity in enemies, etc to bring image quality down considerable if they're trying to run it on a 8 year old jaguar based console...
Basically a no buy and hopefully it sends a message if enough people vote with their wallets. Let's see in a few hours.
THEAP99
Banned
When will this sink in? Another 1 month reply ban. This is the tech thread, not a 'move other discussions here' thread.
Yeah, I'm at least hoping for a lot of gameplay improvements. Improved human enemy and melee combat is a must. I was also hoping for flying mounts and other crazy big fights against bigger robots but I don't think that's gonna happen unfortunately. We'll see though. Will they charge $70 for a cross gen game?
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1080p with twice the amount of npc's, car's, 200m extra draw distance, more complex AI is more next-gen then 4k.
I get it, we all have opinions...but
SlimySnake
Okamiden
to say it looks worse than Halo Infinite initial reveal is a hell of a take, lol.And I know these 2 games will get compared to hell n back since both are cross gen. I am confident HFW will look better than that first Infinite reveal.
Sony put the better stream first in the blog (Twitch)....and then proceeded to embed the worse looking one, (Youtube) lol. Make sure the stream is set to 1080p. Sadly we have to wait for a 4K upload later.
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Thedtrain
Member
I get it, we all have opinions...but
And I know these 2 games will get compared to hell n back since both are cross gen. I am confident HFW will look better than that first Infinite reveal.
Sony put the better stream first in the blog (Twitch)....and then proceeded to embed the worse looking one, (Youtube) lol. Make sure the stream is set to 1080p. Sadly we have to wait for a 4K upload later.
This looks like a ps4 engine. Hell, Death Stranding looked much better.
How sure are we this is ps5 footage?
Stooky
Member
Calm down. the wait screen on the state of play youtube chanel even with it being compressed looks better than anything you posted.
If it is PS4 footage....my point still stands....
Zadom
Member
I like to think of him as “hard to please”. We may need him to balance out my ignorant optimism.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I never said that. That was Okamiden.I get it, we all have opinions...but
I would never say that. I am not risking my account over this cross gen game lol.
Now if you PM me on the other hand....
Some of us are used to it, being in alot of speculation threads with him. lol
You just get used to knowing at any moment this side comes out.
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