Tripolygon
Banned
Size of the box does not mean more powerful, it is all about cooling.
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Gamernyc78
Banned
This guy can't be serious quoting tht bozo whose been wrong as much as Mistermediax and called out.
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RDNA is NAVI! The argument was 9TFLOPS RDNA is around 12TFLOPS GCN. Which is accurate.Wait, rdna is considered navi? Like old navi out today?
But rdna2 is just navi with RT and vrs...like what PS5 Xsx is going to have.
So the whole argument about 12tflops rdna2 > 12tflops navi is pointless?
Was it DF that pushed such narrative? And then Xsx stealthy hype ran with that.
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Kampfradler
Member
Assuming Heisenberg is the most reliable insider;
Then he put a heart on this post from Osiris about the specs from Tommy:
This is getting to complicated for me ^^
I have heard from this one little voice in my headthat PS5 is about 9.5 and XsX is actually about 10 both measured in RDNA TFs.
Take with as much salt as needed because this dude is the only one saying this.
Then he put a heart on this post from Osiris about the specs from Tommy:
This is getting to complicated for me ^^
Rossco EZ
Member
he said ps5 is 12.8TF. does this correspond with Heisenberg and Osiris numbers? or can we at least get a 'guess' that it's in that ball park?12.8TF
Tripolygon
Banned
Nothing wrong in copying. Sony has excellent engineers and their board design has always been good. Microsoft cooling solution is vastly different from Sony when it comes to PS4/Pro and Xbox/X. That is the reason why XboxO is quieter. Better is relative these days, both have their advantages and disadvantages.
Gavin Stevens
Formerly 'o'dium'
Can somebody explain to me, as I'm having a a bit of a brain fart here, but if the ps5 is better in every way, how the SX can be higher in flops?
Granted flops isn't the full picture and I understand that, but how can this be possible...?
As for the SSD post above about sea of thieves, the way the game is created is totally different in terms of how assets are loaded into memory. It's a more traditional binary space type affair, which are historically more slow to load anyway. Spiderman is essentially the sort of game that will load everything as base low level lod first then get you ingame. Using trickery, it then calls in higher quality assets to populate the world. The whole thing is seamless, and you don't really notice when that fence 400 feet away pops into a different model a few seconds after loading. That's why a game like Spiderman will load so damn fast and well on an SSD. It's essentially the perfect type of game to show it off. If you can get a next generation COD game loading it's levels in that some of speed, I will be very impressed, as it's not made for this type of memory management. (HOWEVER, now that both consoles have SSD, all games will take advantage of it, so expect a lot of big changes here. But both consoles will be amazing with this).
Anwyay point is, for a game built like Sea Of Thieves, to get it loading that fast is fantastic. Remember - Even SNES and N64 games had loading times in places. Sometimes a black screen, sometimes an actual loading screen
Granted flops isn't the full picture and I understand that, but how can this be possible...?
As for the SSD post above about sea of thieves, the way the game is created is totally different in terms of how assets are loaded into memory. It's a more traditional binary space type affair, which are historically more slow to load anyway. Spiderman is essentially the sort of game that will load everything as base low level lod first then get you ingame. Using trickery, it then calls in higher quality assets to populate the world. The whole thing is seamless, and you don't really notice when that fence 400 feet away pops into a different model a few seconds after loading. That's why a game like Spiderman will load so damn fast and well on an SSD. It's essentially the perfect type of game to show it off. If you can get a next generation COD game loading it's levels in that some of speed, I will be very impressed, as it's not made for this type of memory management. (HOWEVER, now that both consoles have SSD, all games will take advantage of it, so expect a lot of big changes here. But both consoles will be amazing with this).
Anwyay point is, for a game built like Sea Of Thieves, to get it loading that fast is fantastic. Remember - Even SNES and N64 games had loading times in places. Sometimes a black screen, sometimes an actual loading screen
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pawel86ck
Banned
You are trying to discredit Dealer, but the thing is he indeed know people working at MS (if fact he host engineers who build XSX!). If he says guys at MS told him XSX loads sea of thieves at around 3-5s I believe him.
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DJ12
Member
Nice try, he said developers.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
yes both said ps5 tflops > xsex which we now know to be 12 tflops.
David Ricardo
Member
You have some things right and some others wrong.
Matt said he guessed nextbox would end stronger, but he never said PS5 was ahead. You are right in him dismissing the github leak.
Klee said PS5 was ahead but he wouldn't disagree with what Matt said. So we can conclude they are close. Also said the github leak didn't match his specs.
Reiner said PS5 was stronger, or so he heard from devs at E3'19.
Schreier said they were both very powerful and it would be very difficult to know which one is actually stronger. He also said both were stronger than RTX2080.
So yes, it appears they are both very powerful and close in performance to each other.
I wouldn't try to make sense of what Osiris, Heisenberg, and Tommy Fisher say because they seem pretty unreliable. That's my humble opinion.
Dealer is a proven fraud when it comes to information hes been incorrect more times than he has had hot dinners.
longdi
Banned
Maybe Xsx clocks their gpu higher to gain the tflops marketing advantage, and also the cpu as alluded by insiders heisenberg.
Seems like Sony runs a tighter design ship. In terms of internal specs to get that optimal gaming output developers need. Very thoughtful.
While MS takes the best out there today, and plosh it up with more cooling and exterior designs, with thoughtful hype videos.
Seems like Sony runs a tighter design ship. In terms of internal specs to get that optimal gaming output developers need. Very thoughtful.
While MS takes the best out there today, and plosh it up with more cooling and exterior designs, with thoughtful hype videos.
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Captain Hero
The Spoiler Soldier
Respect to all insiders we thank you really for your effort but either you say what you have in a solid state or just wait with us the official reveal , too many insiders but no one is confirming what he has ! .. I believe the two console from Sony & MS have no big differences and they will be almost the same the real deal is GAMES and how the Devs take advantage of the powerful consoles ,,
Tripolygon
Banned
Why would they knowingly divulge information to him when they know that he can't keep a secret to save his life?
Rossco EZ
Member
interesting, i am eager for the playstation event
vpance
Member
Pretty much. With Pro and X both companies just had different aims with their timing and profitablity.
Wouldn't be surprised if PS5 at similar power comes in smaller than XSX. The huge box with a large quiet fan doesn't particularly strike me as innovative or cost efficient. It's a safe design though, like the launch X1 was.
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MilkyJoe
Member
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Tripolygon
Banned
Not power. Your box is going to be as big as the cooling solution you use allows. Hence PS4 more powerful yet smaller than Xbox One and Xbox One X is more powerful yet smaller than PS4 Pro. This is not that hard to understand. You can put a 2080Ti and a beefy CPU in a mini PC case as long as you have a competent cooling solution.
Isn't the "patented VRS" bulletpoint just their implementation of VRS at the API level of DirectX, which of course they would have patended? I would expect Sony to have their own implemetnation of how their API communicates with the hardware.
Mark cerny himself has stated PS5 has hardware RT
Tripolygon
Banned
We really didn't. Folks were living in make believe land where PS5 wasn't already announced to have hardware accelerated RT.
longdi
Banned
There was suspicion whether it was hardware RT like rtx or forced hardware RT like something else using the navi cu.
Do you trust pr talks? Like what did he really mean? Or is their cutesy diagram clear enough?
Because there was a github leak that shows ps5 sdk did not have rdna2 RT
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pawel86ck
Banned
I dont care if he is biased or not. Dealer hosts very important people from MS, people who build XSX and that's the most important fact for me.
At 5m46s mark he talks about sea of thieves load times on XSX and compared them to his 970 evo pro 3.5GB/s SDD.
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ANIMAL1975
Member
That post from negociator was the question Tommy was replying to. If you don't remember the conversation that was going on back then, (i think you do) i can remind you: Ms had confirmed having the 2nd tier VRS implementation, and people start speculation about Sonys because of the patented remark. So Tommy was basically confirming that Sonys VRS will be the 2nd tier and up to date implementation _ which has nothing to do with whatever patented customizations both may have (like in... they have to work with different proprietary APIs no!?).
About your last remark, what happened this forum that is such a shame!? Aren't you allowed to come in here and argue with Tommy, and discuss/dispute his claims, like you are doing? Or is it simply the fact that he is allowed to share them, that got you so aggravated? _ Well you got mod of war explanation, i quoted below for you you're welcome
Thank you very much for the time you took to make this post, trying to bring some peace to this thirsty souls, we don't deserve itWe will never detail the vetting process. Ever. That is all done privately between only 2 parties. Not even all the mods know each individual's vetting process for each person. Only directly between two people (the mod and the person). This is to protect the sources, and not burn anyone ever.
HeisenbergFX4 has a very solid source, but like I said, that does not mean it can't change with tweaks and revisions to kit. Even the source admits this. Very solid source.
@Tommy Fisher I asked to scale it back a bit. I personally am letting him be. I didn't do his vetting process, so I do not know the details, I was just told by another that "his information cannot be fully verified, but there may be something there" in so many words. He will either hang himself, or get paraded in the streets. Same goes for @OsirisBlack.
@SCFC_ just responded and supposedly wants to go through it. Please stand by...
Things are coming, and it is very exciting. There is no "doom and gloom" from either camp. Both are going to be GREAT. So ignore the clickbait "warfare" articles from select sites, if you know what I mean.
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Wow, MS must be really incompetent then if they copied the ps4 pro, made it 40% more powerful, put it in a smaller box and still couldn't get it to sound like a jet engine. They'll need to try harder for the series x. Maybe they made it that shape so they could actually put a little jet engine in there so they don't fail this time.
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MilkyJoe
Member
A bigger box allows a more efficient cooling solution, the more efficient the cooling system the higher the clocks.
Do you really think MS are going to move away form the One X tech, with the specialty cooling system, to just an empty case and a fan perched on top? Phil Spencer has said that the design of the case was down to a mandate of performance over aesthetics? I predict the X will be the most powerful, the PS5 will be in the "good enough" range.
Insane Metal
Member
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Rossco EZ
Member
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Gavin Stevens
Formerly 'o'dium'
Reminds me of the little foam pads 360 never added that would have stopped disk scratching when moving the unit. Daft.
DemonCleaner
Member
there is still the possibility they can disable half a dual CU / WGP. we just don't know atm. coming from past archs where amd always had to disable in a symmetrical manner it seems more likely to me. but then again nvidia is disabling on a per SM basis since forever... but you might have to have tile-based rendering for that.
Gamernyc78
Banned
Thy were incompetent enough to have the biggest console fail in history via rrod then come with another console less powerful with a big ass power brick but you know thts just history
but it's gd thy watched what their competitors were doing and adjusted, thy all learn from eachother. Jet engine idea sounds gd if it'll help the console
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Pyramid Song
Member
Maybe one heard the TFs expressed on GNC and the other on RDNA. Is that possible ?
Gamernyc78
Banned
OH not this bs again? Boy you ppl like to switch shit based on narratives. Is this Dim?
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
i see you are still peddling this theory of bigger = better after Lacix proved you wrong just last night.
just like with the reveal PS4 and XBOX ONE. You can see based on size which one is more powerful.
I guess its a shame this forum turned into breeding ground for "insiders" and vetting process is obviously failling for whatever the reason. I dont think entire internet gets as much new insiders daily as this place gets, but as long as people click I guess its ok.That post from negociator was the question Tommy was replying to. If you don't remember the conversation that was going on back then, (i think you do) i can remind you: Ms had confirmed having the 2nd tier VRS implementation, and people start speculation about Sonys because of the patented remark. So Tommy was basically confirming that Sonys VRS will be the 2nd tier and up to date implementation _ which has nothing to do with whatever patented customizations both may have (like in... they have to work with different proprietary APUs)!
About your last remark, what happened this forum that is such a shame!? Aren't you allowed to come in here and argue with Tommy, and discuss/dispute his claims, like you are doing? Or is it simply the fact that he is allowed to share them, that got you so aggravated? _ Well you got mod of war explanation, i quoted below for you you're welcome
Thank you very much for the time you took to make this post, trying to bring some peace to this thirsty souls, we don't deserve it
What do I have to say more about Tommy? That there is no 32kb cache in Navi as he said? That Remedy is publicly traded and cannot "secretly" be part of Sony in any way, shape or a form? Seems like such an easy way to tell he is bsing, but I guess the best we can ask for him is to tone it down a bit since he cant get verified...
Gamernyc78
Banned
Why If even corporate big wigs from Microsoft have been called out on their lies and pr bullshit so many times. So now we Gona believe every authority corporate figure? We are gamers who've been around to know to never take shit for face value if not you'd still be believing in milo, that staged kinect demo where the Asian guy was way off, you'd believe kinect couldn't be removed from Xbox one bcus of os, etc.. All shit pushed by the corporate bigs and so much more.
Anyway let me get back on topic.
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martino
Member
and most probable scenario is none of them heard something from people having last dev kit for the two....even more when we come back in time
i find it odd that it's not hard for people to doubt timeline of the possible info in the github leak but not how misaligned and out of date third hand messy context info from insider can be.
MilkyJoe
Member
MDSLKTR
Member
Bro, breath.Thy were incompetent enough to have the biggest console fail in history via rrod then come with another console less powerful with a big ass power brick but you know thts just history
Jet engine idea sounds gd if it'll help the console
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
So Heisengborgs says:
XSX: 10tflops
PS5: 9tflops
Tommy Hilfiger:
XSX: 12.2tflops
PS5: 13tflops
?
XSX: 10tflops
PS5: 9tflops
Tommy Hilfiger:
XSX: 12.2tflops
PS5: 13tflops
?
Gamernyc78
Banned
I just finished working out lol how'd you know? I'm definitely taking deep breathes but thank you
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Osiris also confirmed again a few days ago:
Xsx 11.6
PS5 12.4
cant wait to see which insider (out of the million of them) is right and which ones (the rest) are wrong.
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HeisenbergFX4
Member
Thats not what I said.
I said most of what I was hearing was in line with the 12 tf number.
But one person that I trust keeps saying he is quite certain that 12 tf number is what MS has calculated to measure against current consoles when in fact that number is single digits of Navi.
If I was a betting person I would bet the 12 but I only bet when I am totally certain.
Bonus thoughts regardless I do not believe the PS5 will hit 13 no matter how its measured.
Afternoon thoughts.
Even though I said I wasnt saying much until reveals I want to make sure what I did say was repeated accurately.
44alltheway
Member
Do you know when the reveal of either console will be? Im not asking for you to say the date, just if you yourself know the date
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