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Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off | (Next-gen means current-gen)

ShapeGSX

Member
I don't understand the people that say comparing a open world vs closed circuit racer is not fair. If its not fair its not fair for Forza Horizon, because it need to render everything on screen where you can go. Closed circuit racers can cut corners like draw distance and assets in the distance, they can even fake everything behind the trees that it doesn't need to render. But even with all this Forza Horizon still looks better and does almost all the things better than any current gen racing game. Racing game is a racing game, no need to seperate them for graphics comparison. And for the people that say lets put the best looking pics in here and compare, i agree and disagree with that for one reason. There are games that look constantly good where there are games that look good in some conditions. It is good to give you a idea how the game looks in its best but what if the game looks like that only 5% of the time.

Here you go (all gameplay shots from PS4 pro)
29952075327_7ea24b7657_o.png

42408682492_02dbcb356f_o.png

44889152941_88e541acc2_o.png

42075065565_b21210cfa4_o.png

Those look really good. Did you turn the HUD off? In general, I think leaving the HUD on avoids confusion about what mode is being shown (gameplay vs replay vs photo vs paused).

Definitely seeing a bunch of aliasing at full resolution. I didn't realize that the PS4 would put copyright text on screenshots taken with the share button. That's lame. :-(

And I definitely agree, Horizon has always been at a disadvantage when it comes to graphics due to it being open world. The fact that Playground has been able to overcome this is phenomenal.
 
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Gingen

Banned
FH4 - 30fps - Arcade physics - One X (6TF) - 2018 game
30878752088_ba6ed46ddb_k.jpg


GTS - 60 fps - Sim physics - PS4 PRO (4.2 TF) - 2017 game
granturismosport_2018s0c22.png


:messenger_face_screaming:

PS
granturismosport_2018sfiby.png
 
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Gingen

Banned
And now someone try to replicate this car details on FH4... let's see if FH4 really looks better....... :messenger_smiling_horns:

2018092419004346evt.jpg

201809241900442mc1e.jpg

2018092418595116eor.jpg

20180924185944dai77.jpg
 
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FH4 - 30fps - Arcade physics - One X (6TF) - 2018 game
30878752088_ba6ed46ddb_k.jpg


GTS - 60 fps - Sim physics - PS4 PRO (4.2 TF) - 2017 game
granturismosport_2018s0c22.png


:messenger_face_screaming:
lol this post, still bringing up the physics nonsense, it's the same physics engine the handling is simply tuned differently. Also why are these screenshots 1920x1080? Furthermore you missed the point, you provide the GTS screenshots, not a comparison of both, we provide the comparison.
 

ShapeGSX

Member
FH4 - 30fps - Arcade physics - One X (6TF) - 2018 game
30878752088_ba6ed46ddb_k.jpg


GTS - 60 fps - Sim physics - PS4 PRO (4.2 TF) - 2017 game
granturismosport_2018s0c22.png


:messenger_face_screaming:


One inaccuracy: Both games have sim physics. Just because one simulation has increased grip vs the other doesn't make it any less of a simulation.

Ridge Racer and Daytona USA and even The Club have arcade physics. Forza Horizon is not in the same category as these games when it comes to physics simulation, period. Initiating or holding a drift actually takes skill in Horizon.


Also, the Xbox One X is rendering at full 3840x2160p (8,294,400 pixels) at 30Hz. Or 1920x1080p (2,073,600 pixels) at 60Hz.

The PS4 Pro is only rendering 3200x1800p checkerboard. It is only rendering half of the 5,760,000 pixels (2,880,000 pixels) at 60Hz. Hence why the images can look soft compared to a true 4k framebuffer. That's actually not too much of a resolution boost compared to 1080p.
 
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thelastword

Banned
FH4 - 30fps - Arcade physics - One X (6TF) - 2018 game
30878752088_ba6ed46ddb_k.jpg


GTS - 60 fps - Sim physics - PS4 PRO (4.2 TF) - 2017 game
granturismosport_2018s0c22.png


:messenger_face_screaming:

PS
granturismosport_2018sfiby.png

Hey!, What do you know, a proper non-disingenuous comparison between two different titles as I suggested. Both cars on screen, so the cars and lighting can be compared, DD and distant detail can be compared on-top of other bits like reflections, shadow quality et al....
 

PSYGN

Member
Looking at these pictures as someone who doesn't play racing games, they are getting close but not quite there yet. Gran Turismo has a lot of soft glow/bloom in the headlights and shines which looks off.
 
Hey!, What do you know, a proper non-disingenuous comparison between two different titles as I suggested. Both cars on screen, so the cars and lighting can be compared, DD and distant detail can be compared on-top of other bits like reflections, shadow quality et al....
Oh give me a break lol, he cherry picked not only the Forza screenshot in completely different lighting direction/conditions but he also setup the whole situation. We all know that Gran Turismo Sport has better car details when closely examined because guess what, Forza has 600 more cars than it. He also chose a cockpit view because it obscures more than 65% of the environment.

Do you guys think we're completely oblivious? Do you think we can't see exactly what's going on here? Also again, why are these screenshots 1920x1080?
 

Bogroll

Likes moldy games
FH4 - 30fps - Arcade physics - One X (6TF) - 2018 game
30878752088_ba6ed46ddb_k.jpg


GTS - 60 fps - Sim physics - PS4 PRO (4.2 TF) - 2017 game
granturismosport_2018s0c22.png


:messenger_face_screaming:

PS
granturismosport_2018sfiby.png
What you bringing Tera flops into it for, i could post the same FH4 pic in 1080p on a 1.31 TF console and it still looks better than that GTS pic you provided.
 
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LostDonkey

Member
Oh give me a break lol, he cherry picked not only the Forza screenshot in completely different lighting direction/conditions but he also setup the whole situation. We all know that Gran Turismo Sport has better car details when closely examined because guess what, Forza has 600 more cars than it. He also chose a cockpit view because it obscures more than 65% of the environment.

Do you guys think we're completely oblivious? Do you think we can't see exactly what's going on here? Also again, why are these screenshots 1920x1080?


Took the words right out of my mouth.

One is in clear broad daylight the other is in shade provided by the trees lining the road.

Like another poster said the idea isnt that you provide both shots. Pick a great shot of a game and let the participants see if they can beat it. All this purposely obtuse comparisons is pointless.
 

BigLee74

Member
You've already been offered the rules, Driver86. Post the picture you want of your beloved game that can do no wrong, and let people from the other camp counter it with their own selection. Your cherry-picked nonsense is just trolling of the highest order.

Whilst at it, special mention to you and TLW for spectacularly ruining what has always been my fave thread anywhere.
 
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Gingen

Banned
One inaccuracy: Both games have sim physics. Just because one simulation has increased grip vs the other doesn't make it any less of a simulation.

Ridge Racer and Daytona USA and even The Club have arcade physics. Forza Horizon is not in the same category as these games when it comes to physics simulation, period. Initiating or holding a drift actually takes skill in Horizon.


Also, the Xbox One X is rendering at full 3840x2160p (8,294,400 pixels) at 30Hz. Or 1920x1080p (2,073,600 pixels) at 60Hz.

The PS4 Pro is only rendering 3200x1800p checkerboard. It is only rendering half of the 5,760,000 pixels (2,880,000 pixels) at 60Hz. Hence why the images can look soft compared to a true 4k framebuffer. That's actually not too much of a resolution boost compared to 1080p.

FH4 sim .....

4ce.gif
 
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Turk1993

GAFs #1 source for car graphic comparisons
Fun facts Forza Horizon physics are heavier on the CPU then GTS and Forza 7. It simulates ice, snow, mud, tarmac, gravel, sand, water, hydroplaning and temperature based grip level. It still has nothing to do with the graphics where its still superior to any racer right now. the more he post the dumber he sounds.
 

Gingen

Banned
You've already been offered the rules, Driver86. Post the picture you want of your beloved game that can do no wrong, and let people from the other camp counter it with their own selection. Your cherry-picked nonsense is just trolling of the highest order.

Whilst at it, special mention to you and TLW for spectacularly ruining what has always been my fave thread anywhere.

that's exactly what I did, I took the FH4 image from the screenshots posted by your friend here

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/next...t-gen-means-current-gen.823807/post-253458061

if you want to accuse someone of cherry picking, just above your friend Hage Dayo is a perfect example.... hey but he is a GT hater so here he is considered a great user .... LOL
 

ShapeGSX

Member
FH4 sim .....

Forza Horizon has been said to have "arcade physics" in a misguided attempt to show that it doesn't need as much computation as standard Forza Motorsport or Gran Turismo. And apparently this is why Forza Horizon's graphics are so good. (No, this doesn't make any sense, but it is the argument of GTS stalwarts.)

That is incorrect. Forza Horizon simulates physics at 360Hz, just like Forza Motorsport does, and with the same physics engine. (Citation - http://nxgamer.com/previews/forza-6-attention-2-d ) Although, obviously new surfaces and temperatures have been added to the simulation.

Therefore, regardless of how the physics engine is tuned for the desired game play, Forza Horizon's physics engine is still just as computationally complex as Forza Motorsport.

So let's put this one to bed. There's no reason to continue with the physics engine having any bearing on graphics nonsense, period. Knock it off.
 
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Gingen

Banned
I'm curious as to why you're ignoring quotes directly from the developers which ascertain that FH is running the same physics as FM.

Supercars that can be safely driven through forests at 300 km/h ..... but it's a sim because the developer says so ... you can't be serious
 

BigLee74

Member
that's exactly what I did, I took the FH4 image from the screenshots posted by your friend here

https://www.neogaf.com/threads/next...t-gen-means-current-gen.823807/post-253458061

if you want to accuse someone of cherry picking, just above your friend Hage Dayo is a perfect example.... hey but he is a GT hater so here he is considered a great user .... LOL

No, you're still cherry picking. You have selected a shot made prior to the rules being established, designed to suit your transparent agenda.

Take the best shot you can, let it be countered.

Scared?
 

Gingen

Banned
No, you're still cherry picking. You have selected a shot made prior to the rules being established, designed to suit your transparent agenda.

Take the best shot you can, let it be countered.

Scared?

What are you talking about? I'm still waiting for the Audi TTS comparisons shots... why no one posts them?

Scare?
 
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phil_t98

#SonyToo
Oh give me a break lol, he cherry picked not only the Forza screenshot in completely different lighting direction/conditions but he also setup the whole situation. We all know that Gran Turismo Sport has better car details when closely examined because guess what, Forza has 600 more cars than it. He also chose a cockpit view because it obscures more than 65% of the environment.

Do you guys think we're completely oblivious? Do you think we can't see exactly what's going on here? Also again, why are these screenshots 1920x1080?

agreed more cherry picking from the cherry pickers
 
What are you talking about? I'm still waiting for the Audi TTS comparisons shots... why no one posts them?

Scare?
Why would anyone respond to them? They're out of game. They're photomode manipulated rendering and as we've said no one doubts Gran Turismo Sport has more detailed cars, we'll admit it. It's not hard to focus your detail efforts when you're engineering 600 less vehicles.
 

Gingen

Banned
Why would anyone respond to them? They're out of game. They're photomode manipulated rendering and as we've said no one doubts Gran Turismo Sport has more detailed cars, we'll admit it. It's not hard to focus your detail efforts when you're engineering 600 less vehicles.

GTS has ~ 250 cars... FH4 ~ 450.....

"600 less vehicles".... lol.... stop lying
 

Turk1993

GAFs #1 source for car graphic comparisons
Again, fooling yourself with the scape photo's. Post some real in game car model photos of that TTS instead of posting just one from the interior and all the others from scape mode. The interior is mostly 2d during gameplay and everything els is lower quality.
43981605245_aea00ae649_o.png

44173844964_90cc3a8962_o.png

44173856334_582bdb03d7_o.png

Now look at FH4 in game model
43082252730_640a314ae1_o.png

43082265180_d146590945_o.png

43981677205_3ebf5492bb_o.png


Oh and, if you call my shots cherrypicked post some real gameplay photos from the outside view of this car where you can see the interior clearly. you can do it on any track with any lighting as long as the interior and the seats are visible, im waiting :).
 
Again, fooling yourself with the scape photo's. Post some real in game car model photos of that TTS instead of posting just one from the interior and all the others from scape mode. The interior is mostly 2d during gameplay and everything els is lower quality.
43981605245_aea00ae649_o.png

44173844964_90cc3a8962_o.png

44173856334_582bdb03d7_o.png

Now look at FH4 in game model
43082252730_640a314ae1_o.png

43082265180_d146590945_o.png

43981677205_3ebf5492bb_o.png


Oh and, if you call my shots cherrypicked post some real gameplay photos from the outside view of this car where you can see the interior clearly. you can do it on any track with any lighting as long as the interior and the seats are visible, im waiting :).
There's no comparison, GTS is blurry due to the rendering method and resolution. There's aliasing EVERYWHERE, the grass in general is a flat texture which looks like it was pulled from Halo: Combat Evolved. The tree quality is inconsistent beyond belief, in some areas they're the fake 2D ones which swivel and appear 3D and in others they're just straight up flat 2D textures, not even crosshatched to appear as if there's depth. The backdrop geometry is about as complex as Halo as well with somewhat detailed looking textures so the background terrain appears rugged, I mean it's nothing special. The only thing that looks decidedly good are the road textures.

JJimwy0.jpg



I mean look at this, look at the trees, look at the aliasing and jagged lines on everything the car included, look at how ill-defined things are in the distance.

29952075327_7ea24b7657_o.png
 
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Turk1993

GAFs #1 source for car graphic comparisons
There's no comparison, GTS is blurry due to the rendering method and resolution. There's aliasing EVERYWHERE, the grass in general is a flat texture which looks like it was pulled from Halo: Combat Evolved. The tree quality is inconsistent beyond belief, in some areas they're the fake 2D ones which swivel and appear 3D and in others they're just straight up flat 2D textures, not even crosshatched to appear as if there's depth. The backdrop geometry is about as complex as Halo as well with somewhat detailed looking textures so the background terrain appears rugged, I mean it's nothing special. The only thing that looks decidedly good are the road textures.

JJimwy0.jpg



I mean look at this, look at the trees, look at the aliasing and jagged lines on everything the car included, look at how ill-defined things are in the distance.

29952075327_7ea24b7657_o.png
I was only comparing the car model here but yeah the environment has nothing against FH4.
 
I don't understand the people that say comparing a open world vs closed circuit racer is not fair. If its not fair its not fair for Forza Horizon, because it need to render everything on screen where you can go. Closed circuit racers can cut corners like draw distance and assets in the distance, they can even fake everything behind the trees that it doesn't need to render. But even with all this Forza Horizon still looks better and does almost all the things better than any current gen racing game. Racing game is a racing game, no need to seperate them for graphics comparison. And for the people that say lets put the best looking pics in here and compare, i agree and disagree with that for one reason. There are games that look constantly good where there are games that look good in some conditions. It is good to give you a idea how the game looks in its best but what if the game looks like that only 5% of the time.

Here you go (all gameplay shots from PS4 pro)
29952075327_7ea24b7657_o.png

42408682492_02dbcb356f_o.png

44889152941_88e541acc2_o.png

42075065565_b21210cfa4_o.png

That's more like it! Good honest shots from the game that people can compare without bias. I did my best to get similar shots from Forza 7 on my PC but some of the tracks in the shots aren't in both. It's a bit easier for me since I can just smash Printscreen and I'm all done. I'm run everything at max on a 40" monitor. All the following shots are direct from gameplay with the HUD turned off completely. I left the braking line and motion blur on for the first shot by mistake. I have no dog in this fight, I enjoy both franchises and think both have their strengths and weaknesses. I decided not to post and FH3 or FH4 shots as a comparison to GTS this time as people seem to be calling foul at the moment. I'll save those for another post.

2cmRRsw.jpg

PAaPBm3.jpg

I'd give Forza the win on textures, Dubai is a good example as is Prague. Environment texture clarity is very high especially track surfaces and highlighted areas. Car paint color is an issue that Forza has always had, it's very washed out in the sun compared to GT which always looks more like actual paint than in Forza. Forza has a tendency to get really dark on the side facing away from the sun in any scenario despite the fact things behind the car should be illuminating it from bounce lighting. Forza Horizon 3 and 4 don't have this issue. There was a video I watched once explaining the process both use, very similar but in different orders. In some light the Forza 7 paint does look better but it's pretty rare. These shots show another Forza issue, someone forgot to color the third brake light red in FM7. There are way more cars, but there is a price to pay for farming out modeling.

4i8fwmd.jpg

xp19ahC.jpg

This shows more of the same really. Very high detail on the track and items in direct view. The far background looks off because there is a heat ripple effect going on this track which looks great in motion but messes up the shot a bit. This is probably a top-three track as far as visuals go in Forza 7. The car suffers a bit again, despite being parked next to a light grey wall with the sun beating on it, there is no bounce lighting up the rear of the car. This A45 is actually a metallic black color. The trees on the left in the first shot are all cardboard but the texture is lit in a way that it ends up being very hard to tell. On this stretch you're usually clipping along. In the second shot You can look down into the part of the city you raced though earlier, there are helicopters, planes landing, that oil tanker actually moves through the bay and it's good that your eyes are pulled over there because the hill to the left has an N64 ground texture on it.

4JkL1AD.jpg

Interior shots at night are very different between the two. The headlights in FM7 cast shadows off other cars as well as trackside objects. The interior textures are very good. Strangely, the AC dials don't light up in FM7, but the steering wheel buttons don't light up in GTS. The night lighting gets extremely dark in FM7 with no other cars around especially in tracks out in the middle of nowhere. I don't particularly care for the hand placement in either game, it's like a really nervous driver's ed student driving like a complete hard-on.

23N8yGg.jpg

The last shot was annoying. In FM7 the driver can't freelook, just swing left and right about 45 degrees. I could have gone into Forzavista to get a shot, but that's not gameplay. I think the textures and materials are more detailed in FM7, and the awful bloom in GTS off shiny metals really is overdone otherwise the lighting is much better. Both look really good but once again in Forza, anything not lit up by the sun may as well be painted black
 

Bliman

Banned
Why would anyone respond to them? They're out of game. They're photomode manipulated rendering and as we've said no one doubts Gran Turismo Sport has more detailed cars, we'll admit it. It's not hard to focus your detail efforts when you're engineering 600 less vehicles.
I don't agree with that you have to model much less cars.
Yes that is true.
And yes you can do much more detail per car that way.
But to me it is still a seperation you make.
This thread is about the graphics and nothing else but the graphics.
They are mostly different games.
So GTS cannot be discarded because it has less cars.
The same that the GTS boys cannot say, oh but we have a simulator (which is a big stretch).
The goal is simple.
The graphics.
Just show gameplay pictures or if you want photomode pictures (the last one doesn't represent the game, so therefore I don't like it. And you have to state that they are enhanced that way).
For the rest you must know nothing about the game.
 

JLMC469

Banned
Just my opinion:

GTS: the games lighting engine and materials are best in class. You can take some truly jaw dropping pictures.

Forza Horizon 4: I thought Driveclub was the best looking racing game I had played until the FH4 demo on the X...WOW.
 

Stuart360

Member
I love the lengths some people go to prove their plastic box is better, fucking Google Earth lol. The fact is that if every game came with a virtual camera that you could pause the game with and move around the game world, there isnt a game in exiistence that wouldn't have some of these poor looking areas off in the distance, or behind a tree line or something. Thats why the games should be judged on what they look like while actually playing, you know the thing that is important. Only one winner when judging from the one critea that actually matters.
 
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