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[Audioboxer]

Maybe one day England's hard-on for the Torries will come to an end. We'll need to wait and see just how much damage they can do before some of their loyal fans even consider changing allegiances. Probably not for a while though whilst the Labour party is a joke, and probably never for some of the older generations (until they finally kick the bucket on mass).

Overall though this is yet another reason I'll go all in on supporting Scottish independence again. Even if just to get away from the Tories. I mean you know Labour are fucked when the Tories actually get a couple of seats in Scotland in the location elections. Ex-Labour voters who hate the SNP/Scottish Independence actually going over to the Tories. What a time to be alive. We need that swing to be the other way, Tory voters going to Labour. Although primarily that being the case in England, Scotland seems to want fuck all to do with either the Tories or Labour right now. At least the majority of Scots that is.

Good on us, but shame we are still shackled to London and the lunacy and oppression of the Tory government.

edit: Also I know my saltiness can be tasted through your monitors, I'm just seriously worried about the NHS in general, as a patient and also career wise as within the next few years I'll probably be working within it. Or hoping to... (Psychology student).

 

[It's Reyn Time!]

"shifting blame" - lol. People in glass houses etc. How about you answer my question about why the other parties didn't appeal to those Conservative voters last election. In case you might have missed it, theres a whole leadership election going on in the main opposition party from MPs who think that their leader doesn't appeal to the main electorate.

Blaming the voters who used their democratic right to vote only goes so far. Yes the Government should be accountable, but an effective opposition is the only way that can happen. That's that same tune you hear me talking about. Get used to it.

I'm criticising you for brainlessly defending Tory policy by coming to every thread in which they propose something either immoral, inhuman or breathtakingly stupid with 'well the opposition didn't manage to stop them!'. Why are you now asking me why people voted Tory?

Fine, people voted Tory for a number of reasons. Some based on the promise of a referendum, which worked out well for everyone involved. Some voted based on what their parents voted. Others voted based on what Rupert Murdoch told them, although to be fair he did have a very convincing photograph of a man eating a sandwich to back him up. A significant number of people, perhaps more significant than all of those other groups combined, voted Tory because it was their genuinely held belief that either it was the better choice or because they believed they would be better off under a Tory government, and both of those groups are certainly right if you live in certain areas of the U.K.

However, I'm not talking about Tory voters at large, I'm talking very specifically about the Tory voters who transparently come into discussions about Tory policy, being enacted by a Tory majority government, and try to blame the opposition for not stopping them.

 

[Air Zombie Meat]

Tories and their supporters have been blaming the opposition for the past decade. Why would they stop now.

 

[Royal_Phalanx]

Maybe one day England's hard-on for the Torries will come to an end. We'll need to wait and see just how much damage they can do before some of their loyal fans even consider changing allegiances. Probably not for a while though whilst the Labour party is a joke, and probably never for some of the older generations (until they finally kick the bucket on mass).

Overall though this is yet another reason I'll go all in on supporting Scottish independence again. Even if just to get away from the Tories. I mean you know Labour are fucked when the Tories actually get a couple of seats in Scotland in the location elections. Ex-Labour voters who hate the SNP/Scottish Independence actually going over to the Tories. What a time to be alive. We need that swing to be the other way, Tory voters going to Labour. Although primarily that being the case in England, Scotland seems to want fuck all to do with either the Tories or Labour right now. At least the majority of Scots that is.

Good on us, but shame we are still shackled to London and the lunacy and oppression of the Tory government.

edit: Also I know my saltiness can be tasted through your monitors, I'm just seriously worried about the NHS in general, as a patient and also career wise as within the next few years I'll probably be working within it. Or hoping to... (Psychology student).

The NHS's counselling services are utter shit. I've had to use them so I know.

 

[Audioboxer]

The NHS's counselling services are utter shit. I've had to use them so I know.

Yeah the mental health sector in general in the UK has been scorched the past 5 years. Cuts absolutely everywhere.

Sad really considering the stigmas around mental health as it is, and even going back a few years services were still struggling as it was then. Let alone now.

 

[Hasney]

I'm not making excuses for the state of the mental health care in the UK since I have 2 friends who were nurses in the field and had to quit due to patient number stress, but is there a country that gets it right? I really want to read a positive mental health story for once.

 

[Beefy]

NHS is basically a carcass at the edge of a road. That is slowly rotting away and being picked of by flys.

 

[Beefy]

I'm not making excuses for the state of the mental health care in the UK since I have 2 friends who were nurses in the field and had to quit due to patient number stress, but is there a country that gets it right? I really want to read a positive mental health story for once.

Steps to Wellbeing are brilliant. That's that only positive I have had with my mental health issues.

 

[platocplx]

They literally threw that bus they had advertising brexit right through the NHS. Yikes.

 

[Jackpot]

The NHS's counselling services are utter shit. I've had to use them so I know.

Never used them but I was offered 2 counselling sessions per year due to lack of resources.

 

[Calm waterfall]

You did that to yourselves by electing the Torries, well England did. I am saddened to see NHS getting chopped off little by little. Isn´t that foolish? Would the Torries win the next election if they cut off too much of the NHS? I think the Labor party is still in disarray, but is there any alternative beside the Leb Dem?

 

[psynergylover]

Congrats on that second place olympic finish though

Lol!

 

[Chmpocalypse]

Leavers - helping the UK #getbrekt since 2016.

Sorry to all the informed people who voted Remain. You shouldn't be made to suffer for this idiocy. : (

 

[Audioboxer]

I'm not making excuses for the state of the mental health care in the UK since I have 2 friends who were nurses in the field and had to quit due to patient number stress, but is there a country that gets it right? I really want to read a positive mental health story for once.

Well the actual individuals, or at a least a lot of them, in the NHS do amazing work (nurses/psychologists/psychiatrists/etc). It's not so much I, or others for the most part are saying the quality of care received is shocking. What is is the workload staff are put under and the conveyor belt attitude where patients get such skimpy amounts of appointments before basically having to be politely told feck off so some unrealistic target somewhere can be met.

Also group therapy and group events in general were slashed badly.

 

[gutter_trash]

Labour...why can't you select electable leaders anymore?

Ideological purity will doom you to eternal opposition

 

[stuminus3]

We get healthcare for free in the UK, the service isn't too bad either (though not perfect, and inefficient).

Your healthcare is not "free". Your taxes pay for it. They are literally taking the money you handed over to pay for healthcare and putting it in their pockets.

 

[Archer]

oh yes

 

[Audioboxer]

Meanwhile in Scotland

Our NHS is our most cherished institution and for as long as the SNP is in government we will work to protect and improve it.

There is no doubt that in doing so we will face big challenges over the next few years. People are living longer and our NHS is treating more patients than ever before.

That’s why we’ve committed to an ambitious plan to improve our health service and increase health resource investment by at least £500 million more than inflation over the next five years. That’s almost £2 billion of increased investment.

In the election we received a clear mandate to implement this vision for our NHS. And, despite the tumultuous events of the last two months, we’re already delivering on the promises we made.

We’ve created new GP and paramedic training places, we’ve expanded IVF access and Scotland continues to have the best hospital A&E waiting time performance in the UK.

We have achieved much in the three months since the election but as Health Secretary I will never stop working to make Scotland healthier still.

Here is some of what has been achieved in our health service since the election.

1. Scotland’s A&E performance has been the best in the UK for 15 months. Our core accident and emergency performance has remained better than elsewhere in the UK for the last 15 months of published data, from March 2015 to May 2016.

2. We have created 100 new GP training posts. A proportion of the new training places will also come with an incentive to take up posts in hard to fill locations, such as remote and rural areas.

3. One thousand new paramedics will be trained over the next five years. The new paramedics will be equipped with the skills to support people in the community.

4. We’ve expanded access to IVF so that it is now the most generous in the UK. Families who have children in the home but where one parent has no biological children will now be eligible.

5. We have brought forward plans for a £5 million expansion of the Golden Jubilee Hospital. This will mark the first stage in our plan to invest £200 million in a network of elective treatment centres to meet the needs of an ageing population.

http://www.snp.org/delivering_a_healthier_scotland

Although I'm sure rough times will carry on for the NHS up here.

Also in regards to the 350m Brexit lie, how about we just go with if we had scrapped Trident we'd actually have around 205 billion to reshuffle around services. /ranthatoff

 

[openrob]

I'm shocked so many people still don't see the old tactic of underfunding, stressing to breaking point and finally privatising because "it doesn't work".

THANK YOU!

 

[Royal_Phalanx]

Maybe one day England's hard-on for the Torries will come to an end. We'll need to wait and see just how much damage they can do before some of their loyal fans even consider changing allegiances. Probably not for a while though whilst the Labour party is a joke, and probably never for some of the older generations (until they finally kick the bucket on mass).

Overall though this is yet another reason I'll go all in on supporting Scottish independence again. Even if just to get away from the Tories. I mean you know Labour are fucked when the Tories actually get a couple of seats in Scotland in the location elections. Ex-Labour voters who hate the SNP/Scottish Independence actually going over to the Tories. What a time to be alive. We need that swing to be the other way, Tory voters going to Labour. Although primarily that being the case in England, Scotland seems to want fuck all to do with either the Tories or Labour right now. At least the majority of Scots that is.

Good on us, but shame we are still shackled to London and the lunacy and oppression of the Tory government.

edit: Also I know my saltiness can be tasted through your monitors, I'm just seriously worried about the NHS in general, as a patient and also career wise as within the next few years I'll probably be working within it. Or hoping to... (Psychology student).

As someone trapped in England, albeit in one of the bastions of informed political decisions, London, I hope you get your independence, and join the EU. Safe to say I don't give a fuck about the Union anymore.

 

[Audioboxer]

As someone trapped in England, albeit in one of the bastions of informed political decisions, London, I hope you get your independence, and join the EU. Safe to say I don't give a fuck about the Union anymore.

Well I did say after Brexit as much as I have a bone to pick with London, a big one, it's the establishment there, not the people. You guys were actually sane about Brexit, and allies in the cause (regardless of whether you are Tory, Labour, Lib Dem or something else!). Therefore if you can find a way to cut a circle around London and float up here that is cool!

And yeah I know the rest of England harped on about how frustrated they all were with London, but you know what, so are we up here and we still didn't think using the EU to go nuclear and stick it to the government was a good idea. Sometimes political differences need to be set aside if a common goal in a vote is of benefit to members of different parties. Probably also because lol NHS 350m and trusting Boris Johnson and Co was something we'll never fall for again in the North. The North knows and the North never forgets.

Labour please sort yourself out for the rest of the UK. I think at this point even Tory voters want a party who can actually face off against theirs. Competition is good.

 

[Jezbollah]

I'm criticising you for brainlessly defending Tory policy by coming to every thread in which they propose something either immoral, inhuman or breathtakingly stupid with 'well the opposition didn't manage to stop them!'. Why are you now asking me why people voted Tory?

Show me where I have specifically "brainlessly" defended Tory policy in this thread. And in others.

In fact you'll find it's quite the opposite, I have often lamented the state of the Labour party for letting the Conservatives think they can go ahead and do stuff like this.

That is the core of my frustration. That tune that you're tired of hearing.

 

[nekkid]

Well I did say after Brexit as much as I have a bone to pick with London, a big one, it's the establishment there, not the people. You guys were actually sane about Brexit, and allies in the cause (regardless of whether you are Tory, Labour, Lib Dem or something else!). Therefore if you can find a way to cut a circle around London and float up here that is cool!

And yeah I know the rest of England harped on about how frustrated they all were with London, but you know what, so are we up here and we still didn't think using the EU to go nuclear and stick it to the government was a good idea. Sometimes political differences need to be set aside if a common goal in a vote is of benefit to members of different parties. Probably also because lol NHS 350m and trusting Boris Johnson and Co was something we'll never fall for again in the North. The North knows and the North never forgets.

Labour please sort yourself out for the rest of the UK. I think at this point even Tory voters want a party who can actually face off against theirs. Competition is good.

I think a big part of why Scotland voted the way it did was because the SNP, who are head and shoulders above any other party in Scotland in terms of popularity, were pretty unanimous in their support for staying in the EU. Not necessarily because a higher percentage of the Scottish electorate could work out the benefits for themselves, but they were being told the right messages by their chosen party, rather than having the campaigners bickering amongst themselves.

Cool name, btw. SC fan?

 

[Audioboxer]

I think a big part of why Scotland voted the way it did was because the SNP, who are head and shoulders above any other party in Scotland in terms of popularity, were pretty unanimous in their support for staying in the EU. Not necessarily because a higher percentage of the Scottish electorate could work out the benefits for themselves, but they were being told the right messages by their chosen party, rather than having the campaigners bickering amongst themselves.

Cool name, btw. SC fan?

Probably true for many people to be fair, but I think even if that is the case, thank fuck it is the case.

Hah, yeah. My online name which I've had for 10+ years now came from SC. Even although that particular EP wasn't what I was listening to a ton I still liked the name. Still give them the occasional spin these days but Andrew's other projects Jacks Mannequin and Andrew McMahon Into the Wilderness are better. He's a pretty talented guy even if you don't particularly like the poppy rock stuff. Met him once when I seen SC live and he was sound as!

 

[nekkid]

Probably true for many people to be fair, but I think even if that is the case, thank fuck it is the case.

Hah, yeah. My online name which I've had for 10+ years now came from SC. Even although that particular EP wasn't what I was listening to a ton I still liked the name. Still give them the occasional spin these days but Andrew's other projects Jacks Mannequin and Andrew McMahon Into the Wilderness are better. He's a pretty talented guy even if you don't particularly like the poppy rock stuff. Met him once when I seen SC live and he was sound as!

Yeah, cool guy. Met him at a show in Islington. AB isn't the best, but Leaving Through The Window and especially North are great albums. I enjoyed JM, too, although that was a bit short-lived.

 

[Hasney]

Well the actual individuals, or at a least a lot of them, in the NHS do amazing work (nurses/psychologists/psychiatrists/etc). It's not so much I, or others for the most part are saying the quality of care received is shocking. What is is the workload staff are put under and the conveyor belt attitude where patients get such skimpy amounts of appointments before basically having to be politely told feck off so some unrealistic target somewhere can be met.

Also group therapy and group events in general were slashed badly.

Oh no, totally. It;s the staff and ward numbers that are the fucked up part in this country. That and actually getting benefits for those that cannot work for their issues. I was just wondering if there was a country that gets it totally right. Just wanted to look at them positively.

 

[Sumio Mondo]

Tories being Tories, unfortunately.

We'll probably just roll over and accept it too.

Not only that but the Londoners will vote them back in again. Oh goody.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Leavers - helping the UK #getbrekt since 2016.

Sorry to all the informed people who voted Remain. You shouldn't be made to suffer for this idiocy. : (

Is #getbrekt the greatest hashtag ever?

 

[kharma45]

Meanwhile in Scotland





http://www.snp.org/delivering_a_healthier_scotland

Although I'm sure rough times will carry on for the NHS up here.

Also in regards to the 350m Brexit lie, how about we just go with if we had scrapped Trident we'd actually have around 205 billion to reshuffle around services. /ranthatoff

That Trident figure is over 30 years, and from an anti nuclear group. Reuters analysis puts it at £167bn.

You're comparing two figures, both wrong, over very different time periods.

 

[Succinct Verbosity]

Not only that but the Londoners will vote them back in again. Oh goody.

I don't get this comment. London itself is pretty much labour territory.

 

[Sumio Mondo]

Yes, it has to do with revealing the actual intentions of the UK government in that they never actually cared about NHS, even while they were championing supporting NHS even further during the whole Brexit bullshit

This was happening way before Brexit ever came around, this has been the Tories masterplan for a long, long time now. Privatisation was always on the cards the moment they took office and Hunt was in the door.

 

[Dougald]

I don't get this comment. London itself is pretty much labour territory.

Yep, it's pretty much one of the only areas in South England that doesn't almost always vote Conservative

Complain about the home counties if you want to complain about this. My constituency has never elected a non-conservative MP

 

[Deleted member 325805]

Same here but the sad truth is the NHS has been awful (at least in my area) for a very long time now.

I have no other choice, I have chronic back pain and I couldn't afford to have MRIs, specialists, physiotherapy etc without them. They're slow, and often incompetent but they're better than nothing.

 

[Audioboxer]

That Trident figure is over 30 years, and from an anti nuclear group. Reuters analysis puts it at £167bn.

You're comparing two figures, both wrong, over very different time periods.

I know, but money is money. Scotland's contribution was something like £18 billion and that is a lot for a nation our size with our population.

 

[Sulik2]

The UK needs to riot. Want lasting governmental change? Riots have always worked pretty well historically. And they need to do it in evey major city before their governemernt does too much of their wellfare systems to repair.

 

[outunderthestars]

Hold the "self harmers" accountable for their actions.

Alcohol:
Cigarettes:
Drugs:

Any related illness/injury should be exempt from NHS funding. Let them foot the bill.

Then watch the NHS flourish, beds will be empty, A&E wait times will be minutes not hours.

If only the government had the balls. I wish.

Why stop there? Expand that to people who eat poorly and/or don't exercise?

 

[Audioboxer]

The UK needs to riot. Want lasting governmental change? Riots have always worked pretty well historically. And they need to do it in evey major city before their governemernt does too much of their wellfare systems to repair.

That will come some day. As much as everything is burning down around us you know what us polite, reserved, tea siping and queue loving Brits are like. We'll riot after we are already dead. And then apologise for it.

 

[IdreamofHIME]

The UK needs to riot. Want lasting governmental change? Riots have always worked pretty well historically. And they need to do it in evey major city before their governemernt does too much of their wellfare systems to repair.

Yeah, all those Riots in the 80s sure got a Labour government elected....in 1997.

 

[kharma45]

I know, but money is money. Scotland's contribution was something like £18 billion and that is a lot for a nation our size with our population.

And Scotland still ran a deficit of £14.8bn for 2015/2016 even with that.

 

[Audioboxer]

And Scotland still ran a deficit of £14.8bn for 2015/2016 even with that.

Again the point isn't to go defending trident costs given other costs (at least not for me), it's to point out I believe it is wasted money as I don't think it's needed. Due to that belief I hold nothing is going to make me say "ah yeah, x costs more, or the country spent this anyway" ¯\_(&#12484_/¯

At this point yourself or others would be better criticizing me for being against Nuclear weapons. The cost is just the kicker to me as it epitomizes why Trident is a waste of money. I mean I'm hardly being more deceiving in my remarks than the ludicrous NHS 350m banner. Trident will cost what if does, even if it takes x years.

 

[Linkstrikesback]

Hold the "self harmers" accountable for their actions.

Alcohol:
Cigarettes:
Drugs:

Any related illness/injury should be exempt from NHS funding. Let them foot the bill.

Then watch the NHS flourish, beds will be empty, A&E wait times will be minutes not hours.

If only the government had the balls. I wish.

Fucking stupid idea.

Person smoked once while a child, cancer 30 years later? Lol too bad pay up bucko.

 

[War Peaceman]

Fucking stupid idea.

Person smoked once while a child, cancer 30 years later? Lol too bad pay up bucko.

Also, how do you prove it? Monumentally stupid and immoral.

 

[MCN]

Fucking stupid idea.

Person smoked once while a child, cancer 30 years later? Lol too bad pay up bucko.

Healthcare is a basic human right, and should be available free at the point of delivery to everyone regardless of any other factors.

So is water, so don't get me fucking started on fucking water bills.

 

[Acorn]

I propose we tax cunts 90%, remove all privileges of being a citizen and mandate they have their weetabix pissed in every morning. If only the govt had the balls...

 

[It's Reyn Time!]

Show me where I have specifically "brainlessly" defended Tory policy in this thread. And in others.

In fact you'll find it's quite the opposite, I have often lamented the state of the Labour party for letting the Conservatives think they can go ahead and do stuff like this.

That is the core of my frustration. That tune that you're tired of hearing.

'Show me where I've deflected attention to the opposition to defend Tory policy! All I've done is regularly blame the opposition for decisions made by the Tories!'.

Listen to yourself.

 

[WhateverItTakes]

'Show me where I've deflected attention to the opposition to defend Tory policy! All I've done is regularly blame the opposition for decisions made by the Tories!'.

Listen to yourself.

I get what he's saying. While the blame lies squarely on the Tories shoulders, because they're actually the ones, y'know, doing this shit, there's still simultaneously the fact that if someone else won the election the Tories wouldn't be an to do this shit. And I guess if you see the Conservative Party as the enemy that were always gonna do these things, then you'd be more annoyed at the people you support not stopping them. Like, we all know Dr. Eggman is gonna do evil schemes, so we'll blame Sonic if he actually gets away with it.

I'm not sure if Political clout would change much though. If the Tories held Parliament by an inch or mile they'd be defunding the NHS as a step to privatise it no matter what, it's been one of their long term goals right? It's just incredibly frustrating that Labour can't seem to get its shit together to stop it and there aren't any other parties right now with enough seats to really pose a challenge.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

At this point yourself or others would be better criticizing me for being against Nuclear weapons. The cost is just the kicker to me as it epitomizes why Trident is a waste of money. I mean I'm hardly being more deceiving in my remarks than the ludicrous NHS 350m banner. Trident will cost what if does, even if it takes x years.

Right, but "I'm hardly being more deceiving than an outright lie" is not really the best statement to be making about yourself. Why not just make accurate statements? The system will have a lifetime cost of £167bn over 32 years (2028 to 2060), or £5.2bn a year. Supposing that all nations contribute equally, Scotland specifically would save £412m a year. That's already a considerable amount of money that will be pretty persuasive to a lot of people, and it has the added benefit of being true, so why not use it instead of furiously spinning?

I too think the Trident programme is stupid. I'd rather not disarm fully, for a number of reasons which would probably derail this thread, but we could use the B61-12 and have it delivered by F-35s from the Norfolk base, allowing us to completely remove nuclear weapons from Scotland at the same time, which seems a fair compromise, and for just under a quarter of the cost of the Trident (because we already have the delivery system more or less and are just purchasing the payload). That would still ends up saving Scotland ~£300m a year, remove all nuclear weapons from Scotland, and still represent a reasonably good compromise for the Union whereby we keep some form of nuclear deterrent but apportion it to the nation that wants it most.

 

[Audioboxer]

Right, but "I'm hardly being more deceiving than an outright lie" is not really the best statement to be making about yourself. Why not just make accurate statements? The system will have a lifetime cost of £167bn over 32 years (2028 to 2060), or £5.2bn a year. Supposing that all nations contribute equally, Scotland specifically would save £412m a year. That's already a considerable amount of money that will be pretty persuasive to a lot of people, and it has the added benefit of being true, so why not use it instead of furiously spinning?

I too think the Trident programme is stupid. I'd rather not disarm fully, for a number of reasons which would probably derail this thread, but we could use the B61-12 and have it delivered by F-35s from the Norfolk base, allowing us to completely remove nuclear weapons from Scotland at the same time, which seems a fair compromise, and for just under a quarter of the cost of the Trident (because we already have the delivery system more or less and are just purchasing the payload). That would still ends up saving Scotland ~£300m a year, remove all nuclear weapons from Scotland, and still represent a reasonably good compromise for the Union whereby we keep some form of nuclear deterrent but apportion it to the nation that wants it most.

Furiously spinning? lol

I started off by saying we'd have 205 billion to reshuffle (minus the dismantlement costs I guess, but they are only in the millions, maybe a couple of hundred million tops), and I was talking about the UK, not Scotland alone, and even if it is over x years I am right. Then I mentioned the 17 billion figure for Scotland, as obviously we contribute a portion, not the whole amount.

I got my figures from here

2. Trident is financially unjustifiable

The Tory Chairman of the Commons Foreign Affairs Committee, Crispin Blunt, has calculated that the total cost of the next generation of Trident at £179 billion over its lifetime. CND have estimated that the cost may even be as high as £205 billion.

http://www.snp.org/trident_what_you_need_to_know

Lastly I don't really care if my venom towards it upsets anyone. I think it is an absolute joke we think we need a nuclear deterrent and will furiously masturbate (more so Torries will, and Mrs Iron Lady let me hit the button!) to keep it up and running whilst fucking up services that people actually have a need for. I'm not very arrogant and close minded about many other things in life but a WMD is one thing I won't bend the knee to masturbate in line with other citizens of this country thinking "but our deterrent! Russia! scary Muslims! North Korea!". We done fine without one in the past, before begging for it and then riding the American-War gravy train.

Other countries in Europe are absolutely fine without Nuclear weapons, and any time we prance about stating we approve of Nuclear disarmament for other Nations we look like hypocritical cunts.

I guess we should aspire to spend as much money as our American brothers in Arms on "defence"

Yes defence matters, but when our Government is actually cutting budgets for soldiers and traditional arms whilst spending more to keep Trident up and running, lol @ anyone trying to plead the importance of our country needing to "defend against/kill the enemies!". Bunch of hypocrites you are when you fight to keep Trident because "muh deterrent" but literally say nothing or don't give two shits about cuts to the army and soldiers.

 

[AHA-Lambda]

"Lets fund our NHS instead"

Tell me lies tell me sweet little lies

This is why anyone who voted Leave for NHS reasons is an idiot, cos it was an obvious lie from the off.

I'm shocked so many people still don't see the old tactic of underfunding, stressing to breaking point and finally privatising because "it doesn't work".

Exactly.

We get healthcare for free in the UK, the service isn't too bad either (though not perfect, and inefficient).

But the counter to this is that the UK has an eye watering about of external debt. The country likes to pretend it's a bit richer than it really is. Could end up biting us badly.

Except it's not. Tell a lie often enough and people will believe it. Our financials really aren't that bad, and yet the Tories have convinced everyone that we're inches away from being Greece.
And yet our strong economy was also the basis for voting Leave >_>

I genuinely do not understand why anyone would vote Tory/Leave, especially in middle England right now when they complain so much about "being left behind by globalisation". So why continue to vote for the guys that have been in power then?
I sincerely feel you have to be ignorant and misinformed, the question is merely whether that is a willful ignorance or not.

 

[Bleepey]

If you believe the Leave's NHS thing you should be mocked and laughed at:

The founder of one of the main groups campaigning to pull Britain out of the European Union has called for the NHS to be sold off to the private sector.

Campaigners from the Leave.EU group have claimed in public that if Britain pulled out of Europe, the money that currently goes to Brussels could “be spent on our priorities such as the NHS”.

But during a visit to the United States, Arron Banks, the co-founder of the group who has given millions of pounds to bankroll the campaign, admitted he was in favour of privatising the NHS entirely.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...hief-arron-banks-nhs-privatised-a7022306.html