Nintendo DS wireless routing tidbits...(tunnel?)

neptunes

Member
http://www.livejournal.com/community/nintendo_ds/48965.html

More WiFi hacking news
after a good nights sleep of about 4-6 hours, i have gone back to work intercepting pictochat MAC packets.

things ive been able to figure out:
1) over 500 packets per second are sent, but only in chat room "A"
2) chat rooms "B" "C" and "D" apparently send random information on other wireless channels besides channel 1
3) the size of the transmission is based on how many "lines" you enter into pictochat. IE: the text lines... draw in the first, itl only send the first. much like how it displays on the top screen.
4) sending 1 "line" of information is sent as 13 MAC packets. the first is a NinDS header contaning mac addresses and a message address. second packet is completely empty, im guessing this is used if there are more users in the chat room. (i only have the 2 DSs to test with)
5) all text and drawings in pictochat are sent as raw uncompressed bitmaps. the bitmaps are sent as 4 bits per pixel (one nibble), with the bits equaling "0x1" for black and "0x0" for white.

i have saved the raw binary data for 3 individual messages. a) me drawing an *almost* straight line, b) me typing in "hello", c) an almost completely filled block of black (i didnt want to go over the line, so the bottom still has some white spots in it)


here is the binary data.. however, i have slightly modified each of the binaries for clearity. i have padded each MAC packet with 24 bytes of "EFEFEFEF" to help seperate out each packet in hex workshop on my display.

now its about time to write a simple binary parser in C/C++. however, today *IS* turkey day, so i'm not too sure when im gonna get around to doing this.
 
This is pretty cool news, even if it's just for Pictochat. Though, I honestly hope Nintendo gets something online themselves by the domestic PSP launch even just pictochat, though I highly highly doubt anything like that would happen.

What I'm curious about, is if these similar wi-fi signals are also sent out for multiplayer games. If so, that would show that Nintendo's own wireless protocol is not much different at all from the 802.11 standard. I doubt that's the case though, and this is just pictochat sending out info via the 802.11 wi-fi as opposed to the Nintendo protocol.
 
Can you explain in more detail? I can't get one thing online wirelessly and one online with wires using 2 different kinds of routers on one connection?
 
no, pictochat uses nintendo's own protocol.

I think both protocols use the same chipset, but use it in a different manner.
 
neptunes said:
no, pictochat uses nintendo's own protocol.

I think both protocols use the same chipset, but use it in a different manner.
Interesting, if this is actually the case. There are a ton of possibilities. I won't jump to any conclusions, as I'd rather hear what really sets the two protocols apart before I get excited about the DS' online system. But I have some ideas which would be pretty cool to see come true.
 
Well, if I understand this right, I'd have to get a second wifi card for my computer. Then I could tunnel from the DS to my PC to the Internet. 16 people per room isn't bad.
Of course, what could be done with a program is to use BCD as utility rooms. Write some words in room B and it would return a search with available rooms. Choose a number and chat room A is routed to that group instead. Does that make sense? If he can read the data, it shouldn't be hard to parse. That would leave C and D for other purposes. Maybe RSS or a second room, so you could link up to 2 at a time.
Edit:
Actually, I can see it used this way:
A: Main room, for ACTUAL people in the area. That way someone doesn't come near and ruin it all.
B: Net room
C: Config Room
D: Note Room (Any messages written are stored on the PC, with also an option to log all other channels as well)
 
It might just be me being stupid, but it sounds like he's trying to decipher how Picto-chat sends messages? Would it then be possible to make a "port" of pictochat to PC, capable of communicating with DS?
 
What has to be set to read DS messages? I swear, I have a PCI-based WNIC, and I absolutely cannot get NetStumbler to even show a blip from the DS while in PictoChat or versus mode in Super Mario 64 DS, no matter what I do in these two programs.
 
teamxlink said:
Over the last few days TheDaddy was successfull at tunneling pictochat.
Some of you might have heard about it before. Alot of work still needs to be done to get Metroid/marioDS working, and raise compatibility, but its looking promissing.

HOWEVER,
so far we only have it working on a very specific type of setup.
Thats why it is etremely important that no one buys *any* hardware yet; no routers, no PCI cards, nothing.

I'm stressing this once again because we want to avoid having people waisting their money on hardware witch wont work for ds tunneling in the end.

I'm sure TD will make an official announcement soon

great news.
 
yeah, i wish i could give you guys more info, but it's TD's show so youll have to wait untill he reckons the time is right.
 
Oni Link 666 said:
Could I just buy a cheap wireless router and connect it to one of the open slots on my regular router to use with the DS?

If you want to do that, you would buy something called a Access Point... for example, Fry's sells a refurbished Netgear 802.11g WAP (Wireless Access Point) for $20.

If you going to buy a wireless router, why not replace your current router with it? Seems kinda pointless otherwise (and might not work right unless there's a bridge mode or something...)
 
like i said in my original post, dont buy anything yet untill its established what setups will work (if youre intrested in tunneling anyway)
 
I love stuff like this. If this ends up working, it may well accelerate my DS purchase. I guess it would be our first real taste of online nintendo gaming. Pictochat could act as a "hub" of sorts for pre and post-game chatter? It could be tricky managing who you talk to and play against since it only seems to be designed to handle people in your immediate area, and not, potentially thousands of people over a wired network...but i guess the PC software could act as a bridge to connect you to the people you want to communicate/play with?

Sorry, just me thinking aloud. Awesome work guys, please do keep it up! :)
 
gofreak said:
I love stuff like this. If this ends up working, it may well accelerate my DS purchase. I guess it would be our first real taste of online nintendo gaming. Pictochat could act as a "hub" of sorts for pre and post-game chatter? It could be tricky managing who you talk to and play against since it only seems to be designed to handle people in your immediate area, and not, potentially thousands of people over a wired network...but i guess the PC software could act as a bridge to connect you to the people you want to communicate/play with?

Sorry, just me thinking aloud. Awesome work guys, please do keep it up! :)


i suspect it could be done using the existing arena structure, meaning that players could create their own private arena's for pictochat
 
soul2soul said:
Okay this is what I can say.

a.) metroid was used
b.) ~100ms ping
c.) smooth
d.) at moment, does not use kaiEngine - seperate app
e.) working on solution for *all* users - not just linux and mac - this will *work* too
*f.) dont buy anything yet

*Which means don't buy any wi-fi stuff for your pc yet, no access points etc...
:p
 
Hajaz said:
Wait... I thought Metroid used Nintendo's online? Interesting. I can't believe it honestly. :P I'm rather confused, but I'm sure they're going to explain it in the coming weeks? Nice news though.
 
Speaking of WiFi..

If one person had his DS and was using Pictochat, and 2 people decided to join him, one person 100 feet away, and the other 200 feet away [but withing 100 from person 2], would they all be able to play the game? Or do they all have to be within 100 feet from each other?
 
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