Nintendo's Answer to PSP's multimedia ability...
- Thread starter lunlunqq
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The fact that there is no viabe portable option for video is the reason why it has yet to reach the mainstream.
Portable DVD Players - Are not something you are going to carry with at leisure.
Laptops - See portable DVD players. Laptops aren't inherently meant for portable video.
Portable/Handheld video players - Either their screens are too small, or their prices are too high.
You want something SMALL, and yet not so small that you can't enjoy what you are watching.
The PSP is in my opinion the closest thing to bringing portable video to the mainstream. It has a very affordable price, has multipe functions giving it more use, is handheld, and has a nice display.
Portable DVD Players - Are not something you are going to carry with at leisure.
Laptops - See portable DVD players. Laptops aren't inherently meant for portable video.
Portable/Handheld video players - Either their screens are too small, or their prices are too high.
You want something SMALL, and yet not so small that you can't enjoy what you are watching.
The PSP is in my opinion the closest thing to bringing portable video to the mainstream. It has a very affordable price, has multipe functions giving it more use, is handheld, and has a nice display.
V
Vennt
Unconfirmed Member
DavidDayton said:
That I will agree with, all of it too
Galian Beast said:
There are influences there. They may not be as strong as, say, internal departments in one company (like at MS), but they are there nonetheless. Sony used PS2 to drive DVD adoption, for example, and will do the same with Blu-ray. I can easily see why a publisher would be more concerned/suspicious of Sony's motives when they include "beyond games" functionality than they would of Nintendo.
Idiot Member
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I think they only have distribution rights to the animated series, and I think they have renewed their contract for a few more seasons.
They don't own the rights to pokemon, but if they have distribution rights for what ever media they want, then they COULD put pokemon anime on UMDs.
They don't own the rights to pokemon, but if they have distribution rights for what ever media they want, then they COULD put pokemon anime on UMDs.
You guys are completely missing the potential boat, at least for a US audience. Kids. Aside from the ds and GBA, cheap portable video/audio units for kids are selling fairly well as xmas gifts. The Juicebox and Video Now are over-priced technologically (40-80), but cheap in the overall scheme. A parent or kid in the US is looking at spending 40-100 for a device that requires separate batteries, and the like just to play videos on a screen smaller than the original gameboy. This device is as cheap as the cheapest Video Now unit, and doesn't require batteries or add ons. This neutralizes that market for Nintendo.
This is not and Ipod, and neither is the psp. The Ipod craps on both devices as far as a passive media device. But that market for a 300$ ipod is different than that of the Video Now or Juice Box.
This is not and Ipod, and neither is the psp. The Ipod craps on both devices as far as a passive media device. But that market for a 300$ ipod is different than that of the Video Now or Juice Box.
I'm personally very happy to see this validate the arguments I've batted back and forth with some of those previously against convergence in this thread.Galian Beast said:
See, I think that you're partially right... but I don't really see that portable video watching will be all that much of a regular draw for most adults. I can see it being used on occasion, but not on a regular basis... not enough to surplant standard television watching. People can listen to music while doing other things -- if you're going to watch something, you have to focus all your attention on it. How often does the average adult find themself in a position to sit still and watch something when they aren't near their real TV? Most folks work during the day, then come home. Music makes sense, movie watching doesn't.
If that's the case, I have a hard time seeing UMD's selling... encoding to a (ugh) Memory Stick seems much more plausible. You can copy video to the memory stick for the few times you need "video on the go"... I just don't see how UMD would be necessary for most people.
Now, I can see KIDS being a viable market for UMD films/shows/etc., though.
Idiot Member
Banned
gofreak said:
Sony is trying to converge their companies into a different form, and that is why you see their companies helping each other out more. If you are interested you should check out Transformation 60. Sony's business structure is going to be changing in the next few years to be more efficient and profitable.
But at the time Sony Computer Entertainment is clearly a video game company just as Nintendo is. Nintendo is also increasing their business practices and people know it.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
It did lack lighting, but did have a headphone jack. Of course since this unit has a jack of its own that doesn't matter. But why is it incompatible?mashoutposse said:
Have a lesser need and want to cut the price by half?JackFrost2012 said:
Here's a thought. A main advantage this new Nintendo device has over the ones already in existence for GBA is that it has extra hardware so it can decode better formats. Once these smaller companies start creating DS cards, could they create a boot device that would be an add-on to the add-on, using the Nintendo hardware for extra gruntwork but making it take advantage of the higher resolution, touch screen, possibly add other features for use with the SD card, such as the Famicom emulation and text reading?seismologist said:
Or would the DS technically further enough along so this extra hardware would be unnecessary and a software-only solution would suffice? Well, software-only and the plainer adapters that currently go in the GBA slot.
Of course, I'm sure that wouldn't exactly make further negotiations work out very well for them.Link316 said:
Idiot Member
Banned
-SRV- said:
You underestimate how mainstream video gaming has become.
Sure they will still use their laptops, but if they can get their videos on other portable machines that also have video games, they will buy them also. Adults buy more video games than you think. The reason why more adults don't buy gameboy systems is because the games are not there.
I am all for convergence, like I said before my surprise lies in the fact that Nintendo ONLY fans are so into it now.
DavidDayton, you do know that video games have been decreasing television watching right? I know that games surpassed hollywood, not sure if they've already surpassed television.
You would be surprised to see that adults have more spare time in their away from home lives... On the bus, stuck in traffic, on trips, on break, when work is slow and there is nothing to do...
I don't know what you believe most people do when they go to work, but it's not all going into the office building and sitting in front of a computer all day.
Galian Beast said:
How does gaming eating into television watching change the fact that folks who'd normally watch tv would seem more likely to do it with a standard tv, rather than in 5-10 minute bits and pieces?
Most people, in most jobs, aren't in a position to watch video clips throughout the day. Music, yes. Video, no.
Again, my point is that it seems unlikely that UMD discs will sell to adults to any large extent... video off the memory card seems more feasible as it would fit better with watching a wide variety of things at varied moments. Why would adults buy a collection of UMD discs instead of DVD? I see kids doing it, not adults.
the thing with portable devices is on average you usually only use them for short periods (about 30-45 minutes in my case), so for things like games where you can quickly save and get on with the rest of your day, or listening to music which doesn't require your undivided attention, portable devices work well.Galian Beast said:
whereas you can't walk down the street while you watch your favourite movie can you (where as you can when listening to music)? and like i said earlier i think most people only play portable games for relatively short periods of time which is perfect when you're travelling on public transport or sitting down somewhere waiting for the bus/train/someone.
so in essence what i'm trying to say is: watching a movie or tv show requires more time and attention than playing games or listening to music respectively, something that simply doesn't fit with the kind of usage portable devices get.
Galian Beast said:
4 Kids' Pokemon licensing deal expires in Dec 2006, plenty of time to put Pokemon videos on UMD
http://www.4kidsentertainment.com/docs/news/2001-1010b.pdf
Idiot Member
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Dayton my point was that gaming yields far more influence than you giving it credit for.
People will buy the PSP for games, and the other features it has will benefit from the userbase.
An hour long television show is really only like 40-45 minutes long. A half hour show is really only like 20 minutes long.
Even during a half an hour break, most people could enjoy it watching video, and then during slow periods in their work they could also enjoy VIDEO. Almost every job I've worked would there be time for this. Not to mention all the people who work during the 3rd shift.
People will buy the PSP for games, and the other features it has will benefit from the userbase.
An hour long television show is really only like 40-45 minutes long. A half hour show is really only like 20 minutes long.
Even during a half an hour break, most people could enjoy it watching video, and then during slow periods in their work they could also enjoy VIDEO. Almost every job I've worked would there be time for this. Not to mention all the people who work during the 3rd shift.
Idiot Member
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Scrow said:
Who says it has to be while you're walking down the street? There are more times during someones day when they are doing pretty much nothing, than just when they are walking down the street.
Watching a tv show or movie doesn't need to be completed in one sitting. Especially tv shows. And not all tv shows need a certain degree of attention.
Kutaragi's PR ambitions never really seem to come together. Maybe UMD2 will deliver what UMD is promised to.Galian Beast said:
We're not talking recordable UMD/3DM here though, SD & MS are already established recordable media and MPEG4/MP3 already established formats. The general timeline you've laid out doesn't really apply here.Galian Beast said:
Galian Beast said:
We are all using anecdotal evidence here, but I KNOW that my pulling out a PSP or DS in a meeting with physicians and clients would not be looked on favorably. Maybe your work has much downtime. Mine doesn't. In fact, I better get back to my work or I'll have to work late to make up for lost time.
Idiot Member
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jarrod said:
i wouldn't simply put down what he says because other dreams didn't get out of the pipeline...
MS and SD have not been established as storage mediums for audio and video media though.
"walking down the street" was just one example i plucked out of my ass to demonstrate why tv shows and movies aren't suitable on the go. there are various other activities where somone can also use a portable device at the same time that i could've mentioned... that was just one example.Galian Beast said:
people don't want to watch movies in little pieces spread over the entire day. it's less of a problem with tv shows because we're used to ads anyway (and some are shot in a way that allows for ads), but it still wouldn't work because what you're suggesting is they can watch it over the entire day in little bits and pieces. Like i said earlier only the biggest tech geek would be interested in doing something like that. and even if the kind of person who does that isn't a tech geek they'd have to be damn passionate about the show/movie they're watching.Galian Beast said:
portable video is obviously something you're really interested in but i can tell you with only the slightest bit of doubt that you're in the minority when you factor in the rest of society outside of the types of people that even bother to discuss these sorts of thing on internet gaming message boards.
So, outside of Asia. Not to say that it isn't feasible for Pokemon on UMD, but I HIGHLY doubt that 4Kids would just up and do that without going up the Pokemon ladder for approval. Franchise players in sports are not traded without higher up approval. It is reasonable to assume it would be here.
soundwave05
Member
You have to wonder if Nintendo is willing to do this whether or not a mini-HDD-based GBA might not be out of the question?
They can probably make the GBA SP even smaller/slimmer now, so getting a HDD in there may not be impossible. Miyamoto mentioned in an interview a little while ago they could maybe make the GBA SP even smaller.
Use one of the DS screens instead, since those are higher-quality and would be quite nice for video playback IMO.
But the GBA SP's form factor is the key, its so pocket friendly.
That would put them in direct competition with Apple though, but Nintendo I believe is actually a bigger company than Apple is and their product would have the kicker of being able to play real games on top of movie and music playback (as of now, Apple only supports music and photo-viewing).
They can probably make the GBA SP even smaller/slimmer now, so getting a HDD in there may not be impossible. Miyamoto mentioned in an interview a little while ago they could maybe make the GBA SP even smaller.
Use one of the DS screens instead, since those are higher-quality and would be quite nice for video playback IMO.
But the GBA SP's form factor is the key, its so pocket friendly.
That would put them in direct competition with Apple though, but Nintendo I believe is actually a bigger company than Apple is and their product would have the kicker of being able to play real games on top of movie and music playback (as of now, Apple only supports music and photo-viewing).
-SRV- said:
learn what a licensing agent is, 4 Kids don't need approval because they've already gotten it when they signed this deal, they're the ones who hand out all the licensing now, you want to get a license to make Pokemon chewing gum or Pokemon cereal? you go through 4 Kids, not Nintendo
soundwave05
Member
As for the 4Kids thing, I still think they're heavily influenced by Nintendo. The big N would almost definitely have a clause stipulating that they would be able to veto any use of the Pokemon franchise which they did not approve of.
It'll be the same with Nintendo's movie division, for distribution outside of Japan they'll probably sign a deal with Dreamworks or Warner Bros. or even Disney (possibly), but they'll still have the right to stipulate how their product is released/marketed.
My personal feeling is UMD will never take off other than as a format for PSP video game software. I think because of the MP4 and MP3 capability of the PSP, most people would rather buy a movie on the DVD format (or a music album on CD) and simply rip them onto their Memory Stick if they want to watch/listen to them on the PSP.
It'll be the same with Nintendo's movie division, for distribution outside of Japan they'll probably sign a deal with Dreamworks or Warner Bros. or even Disney (possibly), but they'll still have the right to stipulate how their product is released/marketed.
My personal feeling is UMD will never take off other than as a format for PSP video game software. I think because of the MP4 and MP3 capability of the PSP, most people would rather buy a movie on the DVD format (or a music album on CD) and simply rip them onto their Memory Stick if they want to watch/listen to them on the PSP.
soundwave05
Member
4Kids does not have autonomous ability to do whatever they want with Pokemon. If they could just throw out the license to anyone, there are several scenarios (not just UMD) where Nintendo may find use of Pokemon characters inappropriate.
You're crazy if you think that Nintendo wouldn't still have certain amount of control to veto/stop certain Pokemon merchandising which they find is a conflict of interest -- ie: I bet as a toy maker you wouldn't be able to make "virtual pet Pikachu" toys even if you went through the proper channels, because Nintendo already makes a product like that themselves -- hence its a conflict of interest.
You're crazy if you think that Nintendo wouldn't still have certain amount of control to veto/stop certain Pokemon merchandising which they find is a conflict of interest -- ie: I bet as a toy maker you wouldn't be able to make "virtual pet Pikachu" toys even if you went through the proper channels, because Nintendo already makes a product like that themselves -- hence its a conflict of interest.
soundwave05
Member
Anyways, getting back to topic, how much do the HDD in the i-Pod mini cost?
Nintendo should look at implimenting one of those into a new version of the GBA SP IMO.
That could be an even bigger seller than the DS. The size just makes all the difference in the world.
Something that could play MP3s, MP4 video, and GBA games just slightly bigger than the current GBA SP would be a killer product IMO. They should really phase out the screen on the GBA SP with the better backlit DS screens regardless though.
Nintendo should look at implimenting one of those into a new version of the GBA SP IMO.
That could be an even bigger seller than the DS. The size just makes all the difference in the world.
Something that could play MP3s, MP4 video, and GBA games just slightly bigger than the current GBA SP would be a killer product IMO. They should really phase out the screen on the GBA SP with the better backlit DS screens regardless though.
Every widely accepted technological advancement had to go through a few rounds of refinement before it achieved the right balance of potence, accessibility and convenience to capture the attention of mass audiences. Once this happens, it's amazing to watch how quickly people are willing to alter existing patterns of behavior. You talk about what people's TV/movie/video-watching habits are like currently, yet these habits didn't even exist 50-60 yrs ago. Cellphones are reshaping habits as we speak.Scrow said:
Portable video is currently getting a lot more attention than it previously did from a number of CE companies in a number of sectors because mass storage and portable screen tech is becoming increasingly cheaper and of higher quality as connectivity options are becoming more ubiquitous and higher bandwidth. Meanwhile the combination of downloadable/streaming video from the Internet, Tivo/DVRs and "on-demand" video offered by cable services is reducing the need to watch most video content "by appointment".
Within the (presumedly successful) lifetimes of the DS and PSP I can see portable video potentially crossing the threshold into much wider acceptance thanks to the increasing effect these technological factors will have on the habits of consumer populations.
seismologist
Banned
soundwave05 said:
Nintendo should license the GBA technology to Apple to make this product. It would probably never happen though.
soundwave05
Member
Yeah Nintendo could just license the GBA chipset to Apple, since they're likely to phase the GBA SP out anyway, but then again they really don't need Apple to put a mini-HDD in a GBA.
Apple is still slow to get to video playback (although there should be an i-Pod video model by next year).
Apple is still slow to get to video playback (although there should be an i-Pod video model by next year).
seismologist
Banned
The problem is even though Sony is pushing it, I dont see too much overlap in the two markets. Apple will probably release a ultra slick iPOD video player pretty soon and people will buy one regardless of whether it can play videogames.
Shin Johnpv
Member
Personally I don't think UMD is going to take off, I can't imagine people are going to rebuy all their dvd movies again (after just recently rebuying all their movies in the last 7 years from the switch from VHS to DVD) just to watch them on the go PSP + Buying entire movie collection again is much more expensive then buying a portable dvd player which Ive seen as low as the 150 - 200 dollar range which many of them have larger screens than the PSP
I think the main reason DVD has caught on so fast, besides it offering better quality sound and images at the same price, is that you almost couldnt escape having a dvd player
when I bought a computer in 98 from gateway it had a dvd player standard on it, the PS2 and Xbox had dvd players in them
I mean shit every where you looked there were DVD players in abundance I think that is one of the things that really helped DVDs become a standard and your not going to see that for UMD
they arent going to make UMD players for the PC that come with every PC, they aren't going to make UMD home players (why would they theyre less than DVDs and sony isnt going to compete with their own Blu Ray players), the PS3 isnt going to be using UMDs
and unless UMD versions of movies are 5 - 10 bucks I dont see people buying them in mass, I mean honestly whose going to go out and buy say the new Harry Potter movie with no extras on UMD for 20 bucks after they just got the infinetly superior DVD version for 20 bucks
personally i think playing media files from a memory stick is where it's at, it means I can watch anything I allready have with a little bit of effort
I just don't see UMD becoming any kind of standard for video or audio files
I think the main reason DVD has caught on so fast, besides it offering better quality sound and images at the same price, is that you almost couldnt escape having a dvd player
when I bought a computer in 98 from gateway it had a dvd player standard on it, the PS2 and Xbox had dvd players in them
I mean shit every where you looked there were DVD players in abundance I think that is one of the things that really helped DVDs become a standard and your not going to see that for UMD
they arent going to make UMD players for the PC that come with every PC, they aren't going to make UMD home players (why would they theyre less than DVDs and sony isnt going to compete with their own Blu Ray players), the PS3 isnt going to be using UMDs
and unless UMD versions of movies are 5 - 10 bucks I dont see people buying them in mass, I mean honestly whose going to go out and buy say the new Harry Potter movie with no extras on UMD for 20 bucks after they just got the infinetly superior DVD version for 20 bucks
personally i think playing media files from a memory stick is where it's at, it means I can watch anything I allready have with a little bit of effort
I just don't see UMD becoming any kind of standard for video or audio files
What happened to Nintendo's "It's all about teh games!! Mixing multimedia with games is bad for the industry !!!11" mantra? I think Nintendo realizes when consumers see one gaming handheld that plays video and mp3, touch screen and two screens isn't much of a pro.
THAT-IS-THE-DUMBEST-SHIT-EVER
I've heard it so many times that it's beginning to annoy me.
SONY DOES NOT EXPECT PEOPLE TO REPLACE THEIR DVD COLLECTIONS WITH UMD's!!
No company is that f*cking stupid. It's a failed process before it even begins.
Shin Johnpv said:
THAT-IS-THE-DUMBEST-SHIT-EVER
I've heard it so many times that it's beginning to annoy me.
SONY DOES NOT EXPECT PEOPLE TO REPLACE THEIR DVD COLLECTIONS WITH UMD's!!
No company is that f*cking stupid. It's a failed process before it even begins.
radioheadrule83
Banned
A new HDD gameboy device would be rediculously good. This is on par with my wish for my Gamecube games getting new life with next gen gameboy.
Brofist
Member
seismologist said:
There are already some pretty slick video players on the market, one made by Sony themselves. So obviously they realize there is some dfference in the market between people buying a dedicated movie player, and a PSP. Just the same as how Sony kept releasing stand alone DVD players after the PS2 release.
Spiritreaver
Member
Agreed, with a little added DS support (bigger screen size, touch screen buttons/searching) this would be even better and still usable with both systems.GSG Flash said:
I'm quite excited by this news, simply because it uses SD. I already own SD cards and have many devices that use it. Plus the prices for larger SD cards have fallen considerably since I first got one (1GB is like $70, hell you can get 2GB for sometimes cheaper than a 1GB memory stick from what I've noticed). Sure, this isn't going to look superb, like the PSP, on the GBA or DS screen, but I'm willing to take that for a cheaper medium with a wider range of uses. Perhaps if I had a bunch of Sony products that required Memory Stick I'd be more excited about that... but I don't. My PDA, Digicam, etc only use SD and I'm quite glad for that.
This is quite a good step forward for Nintendo. It's not a new idea at all, and many third party devices have already done similar, but for Nintendo's sake. I like this. Now if they get a greater grip around online play and Wi-Fi for the DS, along with PDA features.. well I'll be quite joyful.
Insertia said:
It does, however, beg the question: Why push the format for movie distribution at all? If faced with the choice of buying a movie or TV show on DVD or UMD, I'm sure as shit not going to go for UMD. The PSP doesn't even have a TV out, let alone the reduced resolution would look like garbage on a "normal" set.
Shin Johnpv
Member
Insertia said:
xsarien said:
the above reply says it all
xsarien said:
Why push the format? First of all I suspect UMD is for gaming first, not movies.
If you're going to buy DVD format rather then UMD, fine. Who isn't? What reasonable person is going to purchase a obscure propriety format over the standard? No one.
Bundling UMD video with DVD's, Playstation/PSP games, sony music cd's, or PSP itself and hiking the price up $10 or so is an excellent way to get the UMD format out there.
The intention is to get it to coexist rather then directly compete with DVD (because it cant).