North American gamers spend an average of $325 annually, Western Europeans spend $170 and prioritise deals and offer

Kacho said:
$325 is chump change unless you're a REE poster with a bunch of self-diagnosed illnesses. The average person spends more on Starbucks every year.
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Our next Starbucks is 60 km away. The last time I bought a SB Coffee was 10 years ago.

Germany isnt americanized enough it seems

Michael Jordan Lol GIF
 
Moses85 said:
Our next Starbucks is 60 km away. The last time I bought a SB Coffee was 10 years ago.

Germany isnt americanized enough it seems

Michael Jordan Lol GIF
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I have no idea about all that. The point is $325 isn't a lot of money annually, especially when people spend that much or more on things like coffee.
 
Setsuna Mudou said:
You didn't mention because you don't realize the same global market that allows American companies to sell their products and make a lot of profit is the same global market they will use to source their employees. You can't both mandate a 100% American workforce but somehow expect other countries to keep their market open for such company to sell their product to.

Besides, it's in the interest of each corporation to minimize costs. The only way they will not hire an extremely low wage worker, is if there are rules preventing them to. Nothing to do with illegals of any kind, which makes your argument absolutely null and void.

Apple can and will hire people in Vietnam to make the Iphones, unless they were forced by law to pay a minimum age that matches the American one. Have yet to hear why this solution wouldn't address your concern.
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I never said that. I was talking about in the US, hire citizens and H1Bs that are actually needed and have a worker permit program so there is no under the table cheap labor slavery in the US.

I wasn't referring to anything in any other countries. They have their own laws.
 
Setsuna Mudou said:
I can tell you quite a few shit ways in which people are screwed with Polish taxation. The fact you don't really have a progressive taxation means if you make over $30k or so per year, you're on the same tax bracket as someone making $1M a year. Most western European countries have a more gradual slope until you're at that extreme end of the tax bracket.

I make very good money and yes, it fucking sucks to see almost 50% of it disappear. I have no fucking clue how people cope with the price of services these days when they make "normal" wages and get taxed in the same bracket as me.

I don't think it's a good comparison to add costs of Nvidia GPUs because they are already overpriced from the start, but it's true that then currency conversions, even with a strong Euro tend to fuck the user more. You have to take into account that in Europe the advertised price is with VAT included, while in the US you pay sales tax separately. So if you would take away 23% of the cost, that would go a long way to make things more affordable.

Just don't be overly negative, yes the median take away salary is lower here than the US, but there are plenty of things that you take for granted that the normal US citizen can't even conceive. The fact you know that if you get sick or have an accident you can simply be treated for no cost, without worrying about insurance or what your insurance does or doesn't cover, that's a big plus too. You're not expected to tip every single service you get, I think that's he hidden VAT in the US :messenger_grinning_sweat:
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No point making arguments again that 10%er(or even better) salary wise can live enjoyably here, good for u, bro, enjoy, im glad u spending that wealth here in poland instead outside- thats good for the country i prefer that 100x over ppl emigrating and making other countries rich, majority of ppl are not in that situation tho =)
 
Gamer_By_Proxy said:
I never said that. I was talking about in the US, hire citizens and H1Bs that are actually needed and have a worker permit program so there is no under the table cheap labor slavery in the US.

I wasn't referring to anything in any other countries. They have their own laws.
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You didn't get my point at all because you're still so hyperfocused on supposed "cheap" labor in the US.

The cheap labor is not in the US, those companies can and do hire people at ridiculous low wages in other countries because they are not being penalized for doing so. Let me put it in a way you have to understand... wave a magic wand and tomorrow every single undocumented resident disappears from the US... unless you're on the business of picking strawberries or landscaping / cleaning bathrooms, your salary will see fuck all of an increase. Skilled labor is being done for pennies in different countries by the same companies that sell the products in the US. Your Iphone will still be made by nearly slave labor in Vietnam and India.

Wave the same magic want and all of a sudden salaries are similar worldwide, those same jobs will probably still be done in India and Vietnam, because they are more qualified and better prepared to do them.
 
ecosse_011172 said:
Any European who visits a large American city will have their mind blown by the scale of the poverty. It's pretty heartbreaking.
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Most of Europe has similar poverty rates to the US, but what does that have do with video games, which impoverished people are not concerned about regardless of what country they are in.
 
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cormack12 said:
Source: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/newzo...yNjA5MDYkbzEkZzAkdDE3NTUyNjA5MDYkajYwJGwwJGgw

North American players spend an average of $325 on gaming annually, accounting for 28% of global market spending, a new report has found.

The report found that the global market size is $189 billion (up 3.4% year-on-year), with North America accounting for 28% ($52.7 billion) of that total, and Europe making up 18% ($33.1 billion).

While North America and Europe house only 20% of players (3.54 billion), the regions, together, account for 46% of global spending.

Elsewhere, the report found that North America leads in annual spend per player, with gamers spending an average of $325 each year.

European players spend almost three times less, with an average of $125. Cumulatively, Western gamers ($170) spend more than three times what Eastern gamers ($51.60) do on average.

The motivations behind player spending in these regions also differ. 34% of North American players spend money to unlock exclusive content, while 29% do so on personalisation/character customization.

In Europe, 28% of players prioritise deals and offers, with 21% valuing ad-free experiences. The report suggests that "discounted bundles and subscription models can increase conversion in this region."

The report also found that there's diversity in player spending patterns between regions. In North America, 27% of players invest in content packs, power-ups, and in-game currencies, 24% buy subscriptions, and 23% purchase battle passes.

European gamers, on the other hand, spend the most on in-game currencies and content packs (21% each), 20% on subscriptions, and 18% on gear and time-saving features.

The research also reveals that Microtransactions drive 49% of PC and 52% of console revenue in North America, with shooters the favored genre. In Europe, they drive 42% of PC and 51% of console revenue, with sport the top genre. Mobile, however, is "near 100% in-game revenue."

Newzoo-x-Tebex---NA-leads-average-spend-per-payer.png
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The term europoor AND amerifat definitely originated from reality
 
Topher said:
Most of Europe has similar poverty rates to the US, but what does that have do with video games, which impoverished people are not concerned about regardless of what country they are in.
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Poverty rates don't tell the story as they're not comparable.

This started from people talking about how poor Europe is in comparison.
 
PeteBull said:
No point making arguments again that 10%er(or even better) salary wise can live enjoyably here, good for u, bro, enjoy, im glad u spending that wealth here in poland instead outside- thats good for the country i prefer that 100x over ppl emigrating and making other countries rich, majority of ppl are not in that situation tho =)
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I'm not making any argument against, actually I'm saying that taxes should be much much lower for people making less money than me. I just think your outlook seemed a bit overly negative, there are plenty of ways to find well paying jobs here. I'm talking corporate jobs on full time contract or B2B (where you pay way less taxes).
I have project managers and finance consultants working here in Poland and they are making over 150k Eur per year. I know for a fact that's the case, I'm paying their salary :messenger_tears_of_joy:

I do agree that it's nowhere the same level of opportunities for people staying in smaller towns or more rural areas, but that's the same everywhere. Check the avg salary in Washington or California vs somewhere like Alabama or Mississippi.
 
Topher said:
Most of Europe has similar poverty rates to the US, but what does that have do with video games, which impoverished people are not concerned about regardless of what country they are in.
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That poster you quoted woke up today and chose to argue, just fyi before you get drug into it too deep :)
 
ecosse_011172 said:
Poverty rates don't tell the story as they're not comparable.

This started from people talking about how poor Europe is in comparison.
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"Poor" in the context of how much folks spend on video games is a much different conversation than that of poverty. One really has nothing to do with the other. If folks are making a claim that people spending less money on video games makes them "poor" then think there is some perspective being lost there.
 
Bojji said:
This is driving that GPD growth, Europe is mostly producing "real" stuff in the meantime. And guess where most of that GPD growth money is?
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Europe also fucked up with their green deal shit. Iam not against it but if we would have used our resources the right way we would still be on par with the us.
 
Setsuna Mudou said:
You didn't get my point at all because you're still so hyperfocused on supposed "cheap" labor in the US.

The cheap labor is not in the US, those companies can and do hire people at ridiculous low wages in other countries because they are not being penalized for doing so. Let me put it in a way you have to understand... wave a magic wand and tomorrow every single undocumented resident disappears from the US... unless you're on the business of picking strawberries or landscaping / cleaning bathrooms, your salary will see fuck all of an increase. Skilled labor is being done for pennies in different countries by the same companies that sell the products in the US. Your Iphone will still be made by nearly slave labor in Vietnam and India.

Wave the same magic want and all of a sudden salaries are similar worldwide, those same jobs will probably still be done in India and Vietnam, because they are more qualified and better prepared to do them.
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it's not that they are not penalized to do this, it's that it doesn't make any sense. You can't pay an American wage to someone living in a country where the average salary is 1/10th or even less. It would cause massive distortions and problems in that market.

"because they are more qualified and better prepared to do them."
LOL
 
Topher said:
Most of Europe has similar poverty rates to the US, but what does that have do with video games, which impoverished people are not concerned about regardless of what country they are in.
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Poverty rate is actually a lot higher in the US, but I agree that it doesn't matter much for video games spending.

lhxILCMSqWBhswBe.png


www.statista.com

Poverty rates in OECD countries 2022| Statista

Costa Rica had the highest poverty rate of OECD member countries.
www.statista.com www.statista.com
 
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diffusionx said:
it's not that they are not penalized to do this, it's that it doesn't make any sense. You can't pay an American wage to someone living in a country where the average salary is 1/10th or even less. It would cause massive distortions and problems in that market.

"because they are more qualified and better prepared to do them."
LOL
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Pick one, you want to stop companies from using near slave labor and treat the worforce with the respect they deserve while potentially incentivizing companies to hire people in your market, or, you want them to keep paying 1/10 of what they should and come here complaining how companies don't hire locally? You can't have both.

And yes, more qualified and better prepared because they have skilled labor, especially when it comes to specialized industry, because they have been doing it for decades now. They have lines of production, excellent sourcing of components (good location and low costs), skilled labor trained extensively to do this sort of work.

It is what it is, you might not like it, but it's the real world.
 
Setsuna Mudou said:
Pick one, you want to stop companies from using near slave labor and treat the worforce with the respect they deserve while potentially incentivizing companies to hire people in your market, or, you want them to keep paying 1/10 of what they should and come here complaining how companies don't hire locally? You can't have both.
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First of all, "respect" doesn't automatically mean "US wages." The wages for these jobs are quite good by local standards. The growth of the Chinese middle class that is becoming this massive powerhouse was largely built on these sorts of jobs and wages.

Anyway... what you are saying is not just ridiculous but totally unenforceable. The US federal government has no way to force a company to pay someone in Vietnam the US minimum wage. Nor would it. As long as capital and trade are free or free-ish then naturally this sort of arbitrage will arise. You can't stop it and worse, it is by design. The whole globalist trade regime is built around encouraging this sort of labor arbitrage. Obviously I am against this regime.
 
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man, always some europoors insecure about their disposable income

compared to much of the world, US and EU citizens are both extremely wealthy (have some perspective, people)
but adjusted for PPP, US has higher median household income than EU--meaning US households have more disposable income
average US household also has a larger house, more cars, etc. if you care about that sort of thing.
US boys just have more money, not a big deal.
 
Kacho said:
I have no idea about all that. The point is $325 isn't a lot of money annually, especially when people spend that much or more on things like coffee.
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No it's not much.
I had a discussion a few months ago during dinner as a friend's girlfriend insisted that gaming is expensive and i proved her wrong and in the end she spent more by going to bars and restaurants 2-3 times a week as that's her thing, than her boyfriend who buys a new console ever 7 years and pays 80€ per year for ps+ and buys a game every couple of months.
She seemed annoyed...
This happens every time i make this discussion and they usually switch the argument to "but i am doing something social" which i then reply with the argument that my discussions with her boyfriend during Diablo are more meaningful than whatever she says with her friends while drinking in a club half drunk.

Anyway, European here and i spent at least five times that without even playing that much.
 
diffusionx said:
First of all, "respect" doesn't automatically mean "US wages." The wages for these jobs are quite good by local standards. The growth of the Chinese middle class that is becoming this massive powerhouse was largely built on these sorts of jobs and wages.

Anyway... what you are saying is not just ridiculous but totally unenforceable. The US federal government has no way to force a company to pay someone in Vietnam the US minimum wage. Nor would it. As long as capital and trade are free or free-ish then naturally this sort of arbitrage will arise. You can't stop it and worse, it is by design. The whole globalist trade regime is built around encouraging this sort of labor arbitrage. Obviously I am against this regime.
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Not ridiculous at all, and enforceable through audits. Laws would have to be passed to make it mandatory to disclose employee costs abroad, including any gray area of subcontracting through local partners.

In any case, none of that will happen, nothing will happen other than the people with almost all the money will continue to get even more money, everyone else will continue to get poorer and poorer and blaming the people in even worse situation than themselves for the fact they are poor.

While we have motherfuckers on the way to become trillionaires in a few years, we all gotta be super angry about some peasant picking strawberries because he's undocumented and wants to feed his family. Like that's gonna solve anything...
 
Zathalus said:
That seems a bit low, for both Europe and NA. It's that's the average it just goes to show most gamers likely dont invest in the hobby nearly as much as some of us.
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Explains why game sales are low. Just looking at the euro number that's 3 full price games a year at best. I spent more than that on Xbox summer sale alone and I'm a game pass subscriber. And then there is my ally X that I bought back in February and my steam game. The kicker?…… I barely have time to play anything.
 
RickMasters said:
Explains why game sales are low. Just looking at the euro number that's 3 full price games a year at best. I spent more than that on Xbox summer sale alone and I'm a game pass subscriber. And then there is my ally X that I bought back in February and my steam game. The kicker?…… I barely have time to play anything.
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Isnt this report including mobile gaming? I know there is big money ln there but modt players dont buy anything on the apple or store.

This isnt the full picture of average premium sales at all.
 
Madserb2023 said:
The USA is generally richer than Europe. Not all areas of course. Also, games cost more here too, also food, energy etc. Combine that with more tax and you have to budget more. It's really all there is to it.
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Food is cheaper in Europe in general. At least so far I have been in Portugal, Spain, Croatia, Italy and South of France; and outside super touristy areas food is quite a bit cheaper. Oh and it's generally better in quality.
 
ecosse_011172 said:
Any European who visits a large American city will have their mind blown by the scale of the poverty. It's pretty heartbreaking.
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I have seen plenty of poverty in Spain and Portugal recently. Is it as bad as say Detroit, no, but there is poverty and homelessness. It is better in general though due to better general healthcare.
 
Punished Miku said:
$170 per year lol. I wouldn't even call yourself a gamer with rookie numbers like that. You're not even Gamepass scum with embarrassing spend like that.
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Surprising indeed.
I am Game Pass (Ultimate) scum and still buy games on sale every once in a while, so I am easily above that number. Wouldn't have thought that I count as a "big" spender.
 
ecosse_011172 said:
So you're happy to have less and less money (and rights) as Elon Musk and his ilk get more and more?
The current levels of inequality are unknown in modern history.
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Current levels (in US at least) are basically similar to Gilded Age of late 1800s which led to huge demonstrations, unrest, and major gov intervention eventually as well as anti-trust break up of multiple large firms.
 
ecosse_011172 said:
Norway and Switzerland have entered the chat:

scrooge mcduck pool GIF
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sure but in general purchase power is gonna be lower. Also fun fact i live in switzerland, i spend less on games now because i play mostly indies because AAA devs charge me up to 97$. I won't be spending 97$ to buy any game.
 
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StereoVsn said:
Current levels (in US at least) are basically similar to Gilded Age of late 1800s which led to huge demonstrations, unrest, and major gov intervention eventually as well as anti-trust break up of multiple large firms.
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Gilded Age 2.0

37d2fc5db6a3be478225d4a9104e790685d85f36.png


This time I doubt people will go on the streets, they have far more "serious problems" (woke stuff, Trump stuff, Race problems etc.) on their minds.
Not to mention I doubt people supporting both parties will be able to unite, all this is very convenient for the Elites...
 
I've subscribed and downloaded the full report. If someone wants it, dm me.
Well, I found pretty amazing that the entire report only focused on those two markes, leaving some other important players aside. Some markets have extremely higher growth capacity than US and EU, and the report also noted that the growth capacity of Euro countries is almost 3 times than NA ones. That data alone is more important than what players spend more. If you're an consolidated player on the market, you would invest more on the markets that have potential to grow even more, not on the stagnant ones.
 
Bojji said:
Gilded Age 2.0

37d2fc5db6a3be478225d4a9104e790685d85f36.png


This time I doubt people will go on the streets, they have far more "serious problems" (woke stuff, Trump stuff, Race problems etc.) on their minds.
Not to mention I doubt people supporting both parties will be able to unite, all this is very convenient for the Elites...
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Yeah, it might be even worse to an extent vs 1.0. Throw AI into the mix and the current attempt to genetic engineering and other ways to prolong life (for very very high price) and we got full on dystopian Cyberpunk future we have read and played games about.
 
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