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[vasuba]

I'm not sure hardcore become unimportant per se. If you had 3 similar systems in price and features and hardcore choose one, that system would have won big time. It gets more complicated once you build a console around appealing almost exclusively to hardcore and then expect to force that system down the mainstream throat. I think MS and Sony trie to leverage the hardcore a bit too hard. But hardcore importance did not magically disappear.

Oh i agree I place mysef firmlyin the hardcore category but its very obvious as the industry evolves he hardcores overall importance will continue to be a small part. Though in the future what hardcore is could be very different cause casual and non gamers could very well become hardcore in their own ways.

I do think its a little silly right now though the drama over how nintendo is gonna set some evil precedent to make weak systems. Nintendos already confirmed WiiHD as the future console. The real question we should be asking ourselves is where does Game controllers go from here.

The Wiimote is the real change in the industry not the "Underpowered" wii. The Wiimotes success leaves the future up in the air as to where do we go from there.

 

[quest]

Agreed, I really don't want to see the Wii take the lead this gen, and while not as bad, I just don't think MS are quite as adventurous and forward looking as Sony is.

Xenos says hi

The only reason the blue ray drive is in there is to help the movie division win a format war. If sony had no movie studio they would of launched with a dvd drive at 299/399 dollars and wiped the floor with everyone.

 

[Wollan]

If you want a realistic release list for the PS3 in 07 the PAL thread is your destination.

 

[fernoca]

You are forgetting one key fact: The xbox 360 had massive shortages at this point of its lifespan and the Wii continues to be sold out everywhere. PS3's are easily available, people just don't want to buy it.

I didn't forget that.
That's why I mentioned the price. Price is an important factor, and the fact that the PS3 is still selling over 100,000 units a month with no well known games and costing twice the price of a Wii and $100 more than a 360....it shows that even with all of this, people do have some interest in the PS3..but they are just waiting.

 

[PleoMax]

I didn't. The PS3 currently has more selling points than the N64 ever had.

I guess you are trying to justify to us why you're one of the 127 thousand people who bought a Ps3 last month.

Here's a tip, you don't need to. You are using arguements like, in 2 years the PS3 will really pick up...

Word? Is this what our expectations for the Ps3 have come about? Is it really that bad?
Cmon, did you ever thought that the Ps3 would be selling worse than the 360? In its 1st year? without the supply problems that the 360 had?

There's no way to spin this, Ps3 is doing way below what people expected. And don't give me the crap of when the Ps3 in 2 years is at $ price, cmon...do you think Developers care? Do you think the other consoles just stop selling, their success just stops in time and wait for the Ps3 to lower down the price to 300$ in 2 years?

Welcome to the real world buddy. Sega died, Nintendo lost the leadership....Pc gaming went to shit...Napoleon lost in battle, Rome fell...

Moral? Shit happens.

"Word"

 

[AdmiralViscen]

PS3 sales are absolutely unbelievable. I never, ever, ever, ever would have predicted that, as recently as yesterday, certainly not 6 or 12 months ago. Absolutely unbelievable.

 

[Bulla564]

And even with all that, it's selling about half as well as the N64 did? Wow, I'd hate to see what'd happen if Sony DIDN'T have those things!

It's the difference between launching with the biggest thing you have, and going downhill, and materializing the great value of your system as time goes on (you know, like the PS1/PS2).

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

Okay, for a turn, PS3 sales are terrible, but aren't Xbox360 sales too low too?

Actually, I was observing that also. Didn't the PS3 sell more than that last month?

 

[FrankT]

Actually, I was observing that also. Didn't the PS3 sell more than that last month?

:lol :lol

 

[PleoMax]

Er...no. Imo, I think Sony's line-up is even stronger than Microsoft's and that is saying alot considering how strong Microsofts line-up is. I just don't think it is strong enough to sell a $500/$600 console.



Ninja Gaiden Sigma
Heavenly Sword
Lair
8 Days
Gran Turismo 5
MGS4
Final Fantasy 13(?)
DMC4
Ratchet and Clank
Warhawk
Tekken 6
Resident Evil 5(I know it is not exclusive, but they have it)
Grand Theft Auto IV(same as above)
White Knight
Final Fantasy 7 Remake(??????????)

I laughed.

Alot

For various reasons

 

[Shake Appeal]

hope springs eternal

 

[Shogmaster]

pwnage with pics from predator 2

Damn....

 

[ZeoVGM]

Er...no. Imo, I think Sony's line-up is even stronger than Microsoft's and that is saying alot considering how strong Microsofts line-up is. I just don't think it is strong enough to sell a $500/$600 console.



Ninja Gaiden Sigma
Heavenly Sword
Lair
8 Days
Gran Turismo 5
MGS4
Final Fantasy 13(?)
DMC4
Ratchet and Clank
Warhawk
Tekken 6
Resident Evil 5(I know it is not exclusive, but they have it)
Grand Theft Auto IV(same as above)
White Knight
Final Fantasy 7 Remake(??????????)

Um..

He said "for the rest of the year".

And you listed a game that doesn't exist.

Nice.

 

[vanguardian1]

MGS4
Final Fantasy 13(?)
Resident Evil 5(I know it is not exclusive, but they have it)
Final Fantasy 7 Remake(??????????)

I doubt MGS4 will hit North America in 2007, no way Final Fantasy 13 will hit North America in 2007, RE5 has no chance of releasing this year anywhere from what we've heard, and THERE IS NO FINAL FANTASY VII REMAKE. At least not yet, all of their divisions are busy with other projects, last we checked.

 

[outunderthestars]

I didn't forget that.
That's why I mentioned the price. Price is an important factor, and the fact that the PS3 is still selling over 100,000 units a month with no well known games and costing twice the price of a Wii and $100 more than a 360....it shows that even with all of this, people do have some interest in the PS3..but they are just waiting.

Don't get me wrong, the moment the ps3 hits $300 it is mine.

I just think that a system that has 130,000 in sales a couple of months after launch is in need of some changes. I wonder how many of those sales are for the blu-ray dvd player aspect alone....

 

[vasuba]

It's the difference between launching with the biggest thing you have, and going downhill, and materializing the great value of your system as time goes on (you know, like the PS1/PS2).

In reality the PS2 wasnt the greatest of the 3 systems last gen based on standards people hype the PS3 for. It was the weakest of the 3 consoles.

PS1/PS2 Success means little for the PS3. Nintendo Dominated in the NES,SNES generations and was the unknockable king of the industry. History shows how that went.

 

[Oblivion]

It's the difference between launching with the biggest thing you have, and going downhill, and materializing the great value of your system as time goes on (you know, like the PS1/PS2).

Just so you know, PS1/PS2 NEVER started off this terrible. There is no way to spin this, dude.

 

[Wiitard]

Oh i agree I place mysef firmlyin the hardcore category but its very obvious as the industry evolves he hardcores overall importance will continue to be a small part. Though in the future what hardcore is could be very different cause casual and non gamers could very well become hardcore in their own ways.

I do think its a little silly right now though the drama over how nintendo is gonna set some evil precedent to make weak systems. Nintendos already confirmed WiiHD as the future console. The real question we should be asking ourselves is where does Game controllers go from here.

The Wiimote is the real change in the industry not the "Underpowered" wii. The Wiimotes success leaves the future up in the air as to where do we go from there.

Honestly, I think both Sony and Microsoft would be in much better place if they just spend the little extra money on things like having a camera and a microphone with every single system. They obviously thought that a it was way more important then that to have slightly faster processors or couple a dozen extra megs of ram. Now, that was, in retrospect, very very stupid.

As for HD, you know, I look at the games coming out for 360 this year and THAT is what makes me worry about future of gaming - major efforts, very polished, taking as little risk as humanly possible. I think the medium if far too young to be working on definitive versions of the genres instead of trying new stuff. HD means a flop costs 20 mil. I really don't like that. To me, HD is not worth the price it demands in terms of creative risks not taken.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Er...no. Imo, I think Sony's line-up is even stronger than Microsoft's and that is saying alot considering how strong Microsofts line-up is. I just don't think it is strong enough to sell a $500/$600 console.



Ninja Gaiden Sigma
Heavenly Sword
Lair
8 Days
Gran Turismo 5
MGS4
Final Fantasy 13(?)
DMC4
Ratchet and Clank
Warhawk
Tekken 6
Resident Evil 5(I know it is not exclusive, but they have it)
Grand Theft Auto IV(same as above)
White Knight
Final Fantasy 7 Remake(??????????)

RE5, MGS4, and FF13 aren't coming out this year.

And how could you say any of the games left will be more important than Halo 3? Also, GTAIV will have a much more positive impact on the 360 than the PS3 due to the system price.

Sony might have a huge variety of games coming out this year, but MS has the system sellers. And like I keep on saying, we cannot underestimate the impact that having the three biggest franchises in the US - GTA, Halo, and Madden - on the same shelf this holiday season will have for MS.

This month is very interesting for Sony. It really confirms the idea that the PS3 will go through the same drought the 360 went through last spring, but due to the price it'll be bigger.

Not too long ago there was much discussion that the price was irrelevent because the immense power of the Playstation brand would compell people to buy the PS3. Is it safe to say that those statements were false? The PS3's failure this month has little to do with the system in general or the software - both of which are in good shape imo. It's the damn price. $600 is not a mainstream price for a videogame system

 

[HyperionX]

Just so you know, PS1/PS2 NEVER started off this terrible. There is no way to spin this, dude.

Actually PS1 did start off terrible. Sales are worse that PS3 right now at this time in it's life.

 

[Chris_C]

I'm not trying to. What I meant was, third parties will still make all types of games for whichever consoles win. The worst thing I see happening is if you're a fan of Sony's internal studios, and they stop making games. But that won't happen.

I know, I was just kidding

Anyway, what I meant (and this is of course entirely subjective) is that I agree with Altogether Andrews in that I'd like to see company's continue to push the technological aspect of gaming just as much as experimental ideas. I think Sony's been able to find something close to a balance, with a powerful machine that offers traditional gaming, but at the same time they're pushing more experimental concepts like FlOw, Home, LBP, etc. As I said though, this is entirely just my opinion.

The upside to all this is that Sony (just as Nintendo of the past) needs a little humility. Strange as it seems, MS seems to have the most traditional gaming console this generation.

 

[Bulla564]

Here's a tip, you don't need to. You are using arguements like, in 2 years the PS3 will really pick up...

I could care less about explaining these numbers, and I don't have to wait 2 years to enjoy my PS3 (which I have been doing extensively since launch). If anything, my argument is that my favorite Playstation franchises will not disappear because of a slow start, and 2007/2008/2009 etc will be filled with them. I'm sorry for those convinced that Sony is dropping out of the console market.

 

[nitewulf]

where are dante and gofreak? how come they aren't taking part in this lively thread, are they not a part of this "community"?

 

[vasuba]

Actually PS1 did start off terrible. Sales are worse that PS3 right now at this in it's life.

Big part of that though could be contributed to some new kid on the block trying to take on the King of the Industry Nintendo.

Sony is the king right now so its a far different situation where the kings console isnt doing the kingly role

 

[Bildi]

Oh dear, the lists have started.

 

[plagiarize]

I didn't forget that.
That's why I mentioned the price. Price is an important factor, and the fact that the PS3 is still selling over 100,000 units a month with no well known games and costing twice the price of a Wii and $100 more than a 360....it shows that even with all of this, people do have some interest in the PS3..but they are just waiting.

except february isn't the weakest month of the year. check some past sales figures. in pretty much *every* case feb sales > march sales > april sales with april sales being between 1/2 and 2/3rds of what february was.

basically, it's going to take a miracle to keep the ps3's sales in six figures in april.

 

[CrunchyB]

What does the PS3 have? it is coming in with future-proof features, strong 3rd party support, and not just "Mario64". If you need a refresher course on the myriad of Playstation franchises, look at the PS2 line-up.

You know you are sounding A LOT like the N64 defense force ca. 1996 do you? I should know since I still have the honorary badge

What I'm saying is that the N64 had all the third parties and franchises such as Final Fantasy and Metal Gear going for it initially and look where those ended up. It was also "future proof" (64 bit baby) and unlike the PS3 had far and away the best piece of software on the market + an attractive prive point. And we all know how that ended up.

Obviously, the situation isn't the same with the PS3, but the parallels are disturbing to say the least. Everything's not lost for the PS3, but things had better improve by the end of the year...

 

[xaosslug]

where are dante and gofreak? how come they aren't taking part in this lively thread, are they not a part of this "community"?

dude, stop.

 

[Oblivion]

Actually PS1 did start off terrible. Sales are worse that PS3 right now at this in it's life.

Are you sure? I thought it was picking up steam pretty quickly.

 

[Jammy]

Actually PS1 did start off terrible. Sales are worse that PS3 right now at this in it's life.

That wouldn't surprise me. The PlayStation brand was nothing at the time. What made the difference last time was complete ****-ups by Nintendo combined with tons of games being released on the PS.

Now, nobody is shooting themselves in the foot and PS3 isn't getting tons and tons of support.

 

[WickedLaharl]

Er...no. Imo, I think Sony's line-up is even stronger than Microsoft's and that is saying alot considering how strong Microsofts line-up is. I just don't think it is strong enough to sell a $500/$600 console.



Ninja Gaiden Sigma
Heavenly Sword
Lair
8 Days
Gran Turismo 5
MGS4
Final Fantasy 13(?)
DMC4
Ratchet and Clank
Warhawk
Tekken 6
Resident Evil 5(I know it is not exclusive, but they have it)
Grand Theft Auto IV(same as above)
White Knight
Final Fantasy 7 Remake(??????????)

Hahaha you even listed FF7 remake as a possibility. Priceless.

Spoiler

though i do think that sony should get on their hands and knees and beg for one

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

for the rest of the year

you really don't think those are all coming out 2007 i hope.

No, of course not. I probably went a little too far.


Ninja Gaiden Sigma
Heavenly Sword
Lair
DMC4
Ratchet and Clank
Warhawk
Tekken 6
Grand Theft Auto IV(not exclusive, but it's there)
Oblivion(same as above)



Still a very solid line-up imo. All I was trying to say was I don't think the X360 2007 line-up surpasses the PS3's at this point. I must admit though, I don't know what can stand up to Halo 3 though.

 

[Bulla564]

PS1/PS2 Success means little for the PS3.

True. PS1/PS2 Sony franchises that are going to PS3 mean A LOT for me as a gamer. That's why I have a PS3.

 

[xaosslug]

Are you sure? I thought it was picking up steam pretty quickly.

i have no idea, personally. But, I keep hearing that 'PSX didn't REALLY pick up steam until FFVII hit' so when was that?

 

[Rody]

US$ 599.

 

[plagiarize]

Just so you know, PS1/PS2 NEVER started off this terrible. There is no way to spin this, dude.

eh, the ps one started out slower, but it was a new brand then.

still the original xbox managed more in it's first february.

 

[neptunes]

whoa whoa, don't want to enter the list wars. but isn't MGS4 comming out this year?

or are people think it'll slip into early next year? (which is a possibility)

 

[nitewulf]

dmc4 can stand up to halo 3, for me anyway. i love halo's graphics and music though.

 

[jj984jj]

Er...no. Imo, I think Sony's line-up is even stronger than Microsoft's and that is saying alot considering how strong Microsofts line-up is. I just don't think it is strong enough to sell a $500/$600 console.



Ninja Gaiden Sigma
Heavenly Sword
Lair
MGS4
DMC4
Ratchet and Clank
Warhawk
Grand Theft Auto IV(same as above)

Not exactly a big list for 2007.

 

[PleoMax]

I could care less about explaining these numbers, and I don't have to wait 2 years to enjoy my PS3 (which I have been doing extensively since launch). If anything, my argument is that my favorite Playstation franchises will not disappear because of a slow start, and 2007/2008/2009 etc will be filled with them. I'm sorry for those convinced that Sony is dropping out of the console market.

They won't dissappear. They will just start appearing more...on other consoles. Konami was pressuring Kojima to make a 360 version of MGs4....and that was BEFORE the shitty sales. That's one example.

Unless you were talking about 1st party, wich in any case...is dead obvious.

 

[nitewulf]

i have no idea, personally. But, I keep hearing that 'PSX didn't REALLY pick up steam until FFVII hit' so when was that?

true enough...but the overall market was also much smaller at that point. you cant compare both situations. not to mention sony was the newcomer, against nintendo and sega, industry stalwarts. quite the opposite situation.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

And how could you say any of the games left will be more important than Halo 3? Also, GTAIV will have a much more positive impact on the 360 than the PS3 due to the system price.

I never said or indicated(at least I hope I didn't) that any of those games would be more important than Halo 3. I know none of those games will be as big as Halo and that includes MGS4. I said IMO, quality-wise, I think Sony has a stronger line-up. I am probably in the minority though.

 

[NinSoX]

US$ 599.

Yea no shit. It's VIDEOGAMES Sony, no one but hardcore fans takes it seriously enough to pay so much. And hardcores are in the minority.

 

[plagiarize]

whoa whoa, don't want to enter the list wars. but isn't MGS4 comming out this year?

or are people think it'll slip into early next year? (which is a possibility)

i think the safe bet right now is that it might see release in japan this year, but probably not america.

be nice to be wrong on that though, i do own all three systems and i don't want to see any of them fail.

Spoiler

still, i do have a stronger reason to root for blu-ray movies now in the format wars

 

[Oblivion]

I know, I was just kidding

Anyway, what I meant (and this is of course entirely subjective) is that I agree with Altogether Andrews in that I'd like to see company's continue to push the technological aspect of gaming just as much as experimental ideas. I think Sony's been able to find something close to a balance, with a powerful machine that offers traditional gaming, but at the same time they're pushing more experimental concepts like FlOw, Home, LBP, etc. As I said though, this is entirely just my opinion.

The upside to all this is that Sony (just as Nintendo of the past) needs a little humility. Strange as it seems, MS seems to have the most traditional gaming console this generation.

Ah, okay, I getcha now.

 

[SoVos20]

PS3 is hardly a failure. It is doing better than Xbox360 did at this time. It is a huge success if anything, given the price.

 

[Zaptruder]

Xbox and GC weren't too far from each other, you know.

Unless you mean it'll be like Xbox, with a rather robust software library.

Well, the Xbox comparison is a fairer one; it has the backing of a multinational corporation (not that nintendo isn't one... ), it'll have better online than the other 2 consoles (assuming Sony continue to aggressively develop the PSN), it'll garner its fair share of support and great games. And it's released the latest.

This is probably as bad as its going to get for the PS3... but the bad news is that it's damn bad. When the good stuff starts getting released (the good stuff already in production), along with growing BD market and the HOME stuff (if it takes off), the PS3 will be able to claw back some marketshare... but before that happens, it'll lose a fat wad of it as we wait.

Problem is then, will developers abandon the PS3 during that period of time to throw in with the Wii pile? My dearest hope is no... but I'm a gamer, and they're companies.

 

[vasuba]

PS3 is hardly a failure. It is doing better than Xbox360 did at this time. It is a huge success if anything, given the price.

Seriously its a massive failure when your the king of the industry at the time and your doing this bad.

 

[schuelma]

PS3 is hardly a failure. It is doing better than Xbox360 did at this time. It is a huge success if anything, given the price.

Heeeere we go :lol :lol

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

Hahaha you even listed FF7 remake as a possibility. Priceless.

Spoiler

though i do think that sony should get on their hands and knees and beg for one

Heh, well actually I heard a few fairly strong rumors from several sources that FF7 Remake is coming, but I have my doubts unfortunately. That is why I put so many question marks when I listed it. Please be real FF7: Remake