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[darthbane2k]

You assume that the gameplay of Nintendo systems will suddenly appeal to people that didn't buy their system in the last two generations and that PS2esque graphics will be worth buying a Wii for just because of waggle. I think there is a huge untapped market for the Wii, but I don' think it includes the majority of current PS2 owners.

First of all Nintendo systems have nothing to do with gameplay. Games offer gameplay, a system is a vehicle to run a game.
And how about the volume, popularity and variety of third party TITLES. It was these elements which primarily made the PS2 a success and 3rd parties go where the sales go

Spoiler

unless their name is Square Enix

. The Wii has the sales, and so will have the titles and therefore the Shelf space.
The PS3 offers nothing that cannot be obtained more cheaply on other formats - See 360.

 

[dark10x]

Not surprising on PS3. However, one must recall that there were literally no software releases worth checking out in April. The PS3 has a limited amount of software and retails for $600. It's a wonder they're even selling THAT much...

 

[1-D_FTW]

When all these people buying PS2's decide to buy a next-gen console, they will more than likely buy a PS3 or an X360. There are still millions and millions of PS2 owners out there who still haven't bought one of the three new systems and I highly doubt they will buy a Wii just to play PS2 ports with waggle. The Wii may be great for getting some folks together with a case of Blue Moon and playing some Wii bowling, but I think the majority of gamers will either go with the PS3 or X360 when the prices come down.

You honestly think those are all hardcore gamers with PS2s?

My little 7 year old nephew just bought a PS2 because he was tired of being sadistically blackmailed everytime he wanted to use his sister's machine (and his Mom felt sorry for him... so she paid half).

So that house now has two PSTwos, but still not a single "hardcore" game.

I guarantee you their next-gen systems will have two things: 1.) A mainstream price 2.) The largest line-up.

 

[Jive Turkey]

God, I hope not.

You're expecting people buying a PS2 NOW will go out and buy a PS3 or 360 in a year...Really?

 

[DenogginizerOS]

You do know that the majority of PS2 owners couldnt really give a monkeys about the playstation brand, dont you?

They will buy the system has games that appeals to their tastes when it is at a price they can stomach.

The Wii will be getting the majority of the software by this time next year. Sales will continue to climb to heaven and it's game library will have something for everyone as all devs will be producing games for it. It will be the natural upgrade for most of the PS2 casuals.

Some of the PS2 casuals will go to Wii, but don't underestimate the appeal of Sony Computer Entertainment and the many developers they have to make games that appeal to the casuals. I think the Wii is expensive to a lot of casuals right now as well and they will save a little extra for an X360 or a PS3 so they can get a true next-gen system.

 

[Vagabundo]

Wii is a Fad and a Gimmick. Everyone will soon get bored with it and go home

Fixed.:lol

 

[Pureauthor]

Some of the PS2 casuals will go to Wii, but don't underestimate the appeal of Sony Computer Entertainment and the many developers they have to make games that appeal to the casuals. I think the Wii is expensive to a lot of casuals right now as well and they will save a little extra for an X360 or a PS3 so they can get a true next-gen system.

'Next-gen' is PS4 and X720 and WiiHD. We're talking current gen.

That aside - tell me what benefit the consumer will see in the 360 or the PS3 over the Wii? They don't care about graphics, to them, games are homogenous as long as they get their Madden and movie-licensed fix, and for those that do care about individual titles, the Wii is likely to garner more of it due to massive sales.

 

[DenogginizerOS]

You're suggesting people buying a PS2 NOW will go out and buy a PS3 or 360 in a year...Really?

No. I am talking about ALL PS2 owners. They are still the largest userbase out there and they haven't spoken yet. The ones buying PS2's today will buy a PS3 or an X360 in a few years, if not sooner. But people close to purchasing a new system right now will not be buying a Wii, in my opinion, because it is more of a lateral move than a forward one in many areas. I just don't see people who didn't buy Nintendo games in the last 2 generations suddenly changing tastes and buying waggled up versions of PS2 games and Mario Party 15.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

'Next-gen' is PS4 and X720 and WiiHD. We're talking current gen.

That aside - tell me what benefit the consumer will see in the 360 or the PS3 over the Wii? They don't care about graphics, to them, games are homogenous as long as they get their Madden and movie-licensed fix, and for those that do care about individual titles, the Wii is likely to garner more of it due to massive sales.

And individual titles are going decide this fight. It's all a matter of which ones come out before which other ones, because those big titles are what grow the userbase and foster development support.

 

[Pureauthor]

The ones buying PS2's today will buy a PS3 or an X360 in a few years, if not sooner.

The ones buying PS2's today are bargain hunters that will go for the cheapest system with the most games a few years from now, probably on the cusp of next-gen. Given pricing, they're far more likely to go with the Wii.

 

[tanasten]

Fixed.:lol

Oh no sir. I'm just saying that it's a long race, and that the system has to prove itself to be a worth. I think it is (the only system I own along with the DS) but Wii Sports isn't going to hang off forever the system, and with games like Super Paper Mario and Wii Play... the system isn't going to hold off.

Wii needs games to prove that it worth it. And I'm a Nfan, a Wiilover and whatever else you want to add to my tag.

We must look into perspective, not just the present numbers. Nintendo knows it (for their good) so I hope they prove the systems value within the next 5 years at least. (I trust on them)

 

[Night_Trekker]

Some of the PS2 casuals will go to Wii, but don't underestimate the appeal of Sony Computer Entertainment and the many developers they have to make games that appeal to the casuals. I think the Wii is expensive to a lot of casuals right now as well and they will save a little extra for an X360 or a PS3 so they can get a true next-gen system.

You know what "casuals" like about the Wii? 1) It's cheap and 2) when you play it, you can swing the remote around as if you were actually involved in the on-screen activity. It's less complicated and more intuitive. In a few years, playing the PS3 or the 360 games will still mean pressing buttons, an abstraction that a lot of "Wii casuals" never would have gotten past in order to get into gaming in the first place.

And the casual gamers don't even have a concept of "next gen" and don't argue about it with their friends. They just want to play fun games, and the Wii is delivering a more exciting experience (for them) for less cash.

That doesn't mean some of these people won't get into gaming and move to other, more traditional systems. But the majority probably won't.

 

[NinSoX]

I just don't see people who didn't buy Nintendo games in the last 2 generations suddenly changing tastes and buying waggled up versions of PS2 games and Mario Party 15.

hauhauhau

 

[DenogginizerOS]

'Next-gen' is PS4 and X720 and WiiHD. We're talking current gen.

That aside - tell me what benefit the consumer will see in the 360 or the PS3 over the Wii? They don't care about graphics, to them, games are homogenous as long as they get their Madden and movie-licensed fix, and for those that do care about individual titles, the Wii is likely to garner more of it due to massive sales.

Semantics. I still think of this current-gen as next-gen because it is still relatively young and so many gamers haven't even given serious consideration to buying one of the current three sustems.

But, to answer your question, I don't see a shift in the developers that made all the great games for PS2 and PS1 going anywhere. What I see is the fruits of their labor at the Sony Gamer's Day and I see a tremendous amount of appeal there. I see Halo 3 bringing the entire Xbox owning population to the store and pretty darn close to buying an X360. And so the benefit to consumers is that they will get exciting new games that look and hopefully play better than the offerings from the developers they supported in previous generations. I do think the Wii, as Nintendo stated themselves, is carving out an entirely new population of gamers that haven't touched a console ever. And I applaud them for that. But I just don't see the types of games that so many have been supporting this last two generations suddenly showing up and looking better on a Wii.

 

[Jive Turkey]

No. I am talking about ALL PS2 owners. They are still the largest userbase out there and they haven't spoken yet. The ones buying PS2's today will buy a PS3 or an X360 in a few years, if not sooner. But people close to purchasing a new system right now will not be buying a Wii, in my opinion, because it is more of a lateral move than a forward one in many areas. I just don't see people who didn't buy Nintendo games in the last 2 generations suddenly changing tastes and buying waggled up versions of PS2 games and Mario Party 15.

Wish in one hand and shit in the other...

I agree guys like jordan083840573 won't suddenly like Mario games but I don't see your average Joe Sixpack or his yungins running out to buy a +400 console anytime soon.

 

[Jokeropia]

Hahaha, it seems I was spot-on with at least one prediction:

Increased supply will make many people begrudgingly realize that Wii is here to stay. I predict several meltdowns.

Such a great time to be a Nintendo fan. Wii and DS are doing exceptionally and Pokemon is just unreal.

Awesome. :lol

I'm curious, how much more did Pokemon Diamond/Pearl sold in Japan in the same interval/time compared to the US?

Around 2.1 million.

SHALL WE TALK ABOUT PROFITS?

Microsoft just put out Vista which will be bought by BILLIONS and Office 2007 which is a standard piece of software for almost every office in the world.
Sony is one of the largest electronics manufacturers in the world, their products fly off the shelf and they will be the company who most benefits from Blu-Ray's success.
Nintendo is making a small amount of money in the games market.

What the hell does this have to do with videogames? And actually, Nintendo are posting significantly higher profits than the entirety of Sony right now.

 

[psycho_snake]

The wii is selling so well because its something very different to whats out there. Its library is decent, but its the way that you play the games on wii that are attracting customers. The wii can afford to have a weak-ish games library.

The PS3 isnt doing so well because it doesnt have a strong games library and because its so expensive, but i think that Ps3's fortune could change dramatically over the year. The games coming out this fall look very promising, so that will get some people to splash the money. What sony should do is lower the price because the PS3 will sell very well. Good games will heavily increase PS3 sales, so long as sony can lower the price of the system.

 

[Vagabundo]

Oh no sir. I'm just saying that it's a long race, and that the system has to prove itself to be a worth. I think it is (the only system I own along with the DS) but Wii Sports isn't going to hang off forever the system, and with games like Super Paper Mario and Wii Play... the system isn't going to hold off.

Wii needs games to prove that it worth it. And I'm a Nfan, a Wiilover and whatever else you want to add to my tag.

We must look into perspective, not just the present numbers. Nintendo knows it (for their good) so I hope they prove the systems value within the next 5 years at least. (I trust on them)

No, you are right. This will be a long gen, but it will be decided by this time next year. Either we will have a clear winnar by that stage or a 30/30/30 split (or close enough not to matter).

So far the Wii is trending to be the winner, of course the end of this year is crucial and I am interested in the numbers and how it will all fall out.

 

[urk]

Come on, Sony, drop that price!

 

[DenogginizerOS]

Wish in one hand and shit in the other...

I agree guys like jordan083840573 won't suddenly like Mario games but I don't see your average Joe Sixpack or his yungins running out to buy a +400 console anytime soon.

Price is the key. But as the sales suggest, Wii is hot, but PS2 is still burning as well. Given the time it has been on the market, 184K is pretty damn impressive. And in its current status, the selection of PS2 games absolutley dwarves the Wii selection.

 

[Mar]

360 outselling the PS3 2:1, nice! I hope this will speed up the process of a price drop.

At last. Something worth taking notice of in this thread.

I must say though. This thread has been awesome. The meltdowns have been legendary.

 

[Pureauthor]

But, to answer your question, I don't see a shift in the developers that made all the great games for PS2 and PS1 going anywhere. What I see is the fruits of their labor at the Sony Gamer's Day and I see a tremendous amount of appeal there.

Um? The majority of titles that are going to have any significant impact on sales and were at Gamer's Day were all 1st party stuff. And that's not going to affect 3rd party support overmuch, because all three console makers have strong IPs in terms of sales.

I see Halo 3 bringing the entire Xbox owning population to the store and pretty darn close to buying an X360.

Halo 2 didn't sell to half of the XBox's population, and suddenly the sequel is going to bring over the entire XBox population? What?

And so the benefit to consumers is that they will get exciting new games that look and hopefully play better than the offerings from the developers they supported in previous generations.

'Looking better' and 'playing better' are nonissues to the standard casual gamer. I told you already - to them, games are homogenous goods. Price will more than likely be the deciding factor.

 

[greendublin]

PS3 below 100k, 360 drops for 4 months in a row even with a new SKU ... this whole shebang hurts my head... from now one NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO LAUNCH A SYSTEM ABOVE 300 BONES. QFT this post Microsoft and Sony.

 

[psycho_snake]

No. I am talking about ALL PS2 owners. They are still the largest userbase out there and they haven't spoken yet. The ones buying PS2's today will buy a PS3 or an X360 in a few years, if not sooner. But people close to purchasing a new system right now will not be buying a Wii, in my opinion, because it is more of a lateral move than a forward one in many areas. I just don't see people who didn't buy Nintendo games in the last 2 generations suddenly changing tastes and buying waggled up versions of PS2 games and Mario Party 15.

Thats not true at all. Back in the GC days, most of my friends wouldnt consider buying it, but now I know plenty of people who would consider buying a wii rather than a PS3, even if they ownded PS2's last gen.

Having said that, I dont think that this would have been the case if it wasnt for Ps3's ridiculous price. As I said right from the beginning, sony controlled their own success and they shot themselves in the foot when they announced the price. The wii was going to be a difficult system to compete with because its different, but sony have gifted nintendo because of their terrible pricing.

 

[Jive Turkey]

At last. Something worth taking notice of in this thread.

Seriously...Is she 18 yet? I want to stop feeling dirty.

 

[Patrick Bateman]

:lol :lol

 

[F#A#Oo]

:lol

 

[KeithFranklin]

Nintendo has made LOTS of new franchises. Just because they don't abandon Mario does not mean that they're whoring him out. Nintendogs is doing better than any recent Mario game released, and they haven't announced a single sequel to it.

I would say that it isnt a franchise yet then.

 

[psycho_snake]

Come on, Sony, drop that price!

Its really the key to sony's success. The sony gamers day made a lot of people change their mind about PS3. Sony did a brilliant job because they've given themselves such a good impression without their key titles such as FF, MGS and GT. Regardless of what people think about the system, they are always going to be reluctant to buy it at the price its selling at.

 

[Grecco]

Its really the key to sony's success. The sony gamers day made a lot of people change their mind about PS3. .

It boggles my mind how people say this.... Reminds me of how people said Home and LBP announcements would help sales in March....

 

[DenogginizerOS]

Um? The majority of titles that are going to have any significant impact on sales and were at Gamer's Day were all 1st party stuff. And that's not going to affect 3rd party support overmuch, because all three console makers have strong IPs in terms of sales.



Halo 2 didn't sell to half of the XBox's population, and suddenly the sequel is going to bring over the entire XBox population? What?



'Looking better' and 'playing better' are nonissues to the standard casual gamer. I told you already - to them, games are homogenous goods. Price will more than likely be the deciding factor.

3rd party support right now for the Wii is just now adjusting to the appeal. The number of projects for X360 and PS3 (and NOT Wii) are already much further along. I don't think anyone outside of Nintendo gave the Wii a chance and I think the development of games for the system right now in the 3rd party realm is pretty much still in its infancy.

I said it is going to bring them to the store and close to buying one, not actually buying one. The quality of Halo 3 and the price of X360 will determine what percentage of people will actually buy an X360. That, and the promise of GTAIV less than a month after Halo 3.

Looking better is ABSOLUTELY an issue for a percentage of casuals. Watching people try out Motorstorm in Best Buy, I have overheard people praising the looks and more times than not wandering over to the PS3 section to check out what else the system has to offer. The price is the big deterrent. But I do think looking better and playing better is one siginificant factor in determining if the casual will fork over the money for an entertainment device.

 

[Mojovonio]

next gen is a horrid failure.

 

[Mar]

Seriously...Is she 18 yet? I want to stop feeling dirty.

Who cares. I live in Australia. Legal age of consent is 16.

dance.gif

 

[psycho_snake]

It boggles my mind how people say this.... Reminds me of how people said Home and LBP announcements would help sales in March....

Im not saying that the sony gamers day is going to completely turn things round for Sony, but it certainly has given PS3 a better impression. Just go into sony gamers day thread to see how happily people have reacted. However I know that its not going to make much difference to sales. The games like uncharted and R&C will make some people want a PS3, but they are not going to go and buy one because of the price.

 

[darthbane2k]

No. I am talking about ALL PS2 owners. They are still the largest userbase out there and they haven't spoken yet. The ones buying PS2's today will buy a PS3 or an X360 in a few years, if not sooner. But people close to purchasing a new system right now will not be buying a Wii, in my opinion, because it is more of a lateral move than a forward one in many areas. I just don't see people who didn't buy Nintendo games in the last 2 generations suddenly changing tastes and buying waggled up versions of PS2 games and Mario Party 15.

Just like all the SNES owners bought N64 and Gamecube exclusively..
Just like all the Genesis owners kept the Saturn and Dreamcast afloat...

 

[Pureauthor]

3rd party support right now for the Wii is just now adjusting to the appeal. The number of projects for X360 and PS3 (and NOT Wii) are already much further along. I don't think anyone outside of Nintendo gave the Wii a chance and I think the development of games for the system right now in the 3rd party realm is pretty much still in its infancy.

Exactly. And it's selling like it is with practically 0 worthwhile 3rd party support! :lol Imagine what happens when the support does come!

I said it is going to bring them to the store and close to buying one, not actually buying one. The quality of Halo 3 and the price of X360 will determine what percentage of people will actually buy an X360. That, and the promise of GTAIV less than a month after Halo 3.

You misunderstood my point. Less than half of XBox owners purchased Halo 2 = less than half of XBox owners would be interested enough to go to the store for the sake of Halo 3.

Looking better is ABSOLUTELY an issue for a percentage of casuals. Watching people try out Motorstorm in Best Buy, I have overheard people praising the looks and more times than not wandering over to the PS3 section to check out what else the system has to offer. The price is the big deterrent. But I do think looking better and playing better is one siginificant factor in determining if the casual will fork over the money for an entertainment device.

Then explain to me why the best-selling game of the last generation (by a good green country mile) was on a portable SNES.

 

[Grecco]

Im not saying that the sony gamers day is going to completely turn things round for Sony, but it certainly has given PS3 a better impression. Just go into sony gamers day thread to see how happily people have reacted. However I know that its not going to make much difference to sales. The games like uncharted and R&C will make some people want a PS3, but they are not going to go and buy one because of the price.

Exactly... In The Real World, a show that spent days under embargo, will make little or no difference in sales and less changing the weak consumer confidence on PS3

Uncharted Will make People want a PS3? How different are these games from Motorstorm, Virtua Fighter 5, and Gundam Musuo?

 

[OmniGamer]

April 2007


PlayStation Portable 183k
PlayStation 3 82k

Only read the first page, but Good Lord! Well, I contributed 1 sale to each of those meager totals in April. But I don't care, after yesterday's embargo lift, i'm gonna have a great time this fall with both! But come the eff on Sony, drop the price significantly!!! You're sitting on great(and very well built) hardware, and great games are coming...don't keep shooting yourselves in the foot with SIX HUNDRED AND NINTY NINE YOO ESS DOLLARS!

 

[Night_Trekker]

But I do think looking better and playing better is one siginificant factor in determining if the casual will fork over the money for an entertainment device.

No, those are two significant factors. One doesn't necessarily follow the other. Why are you going out of your way to lump the two together after someone has already explained this to you?

 

[loosus]

Wii is doing great, but I do agree that Nintendo seems to be meandering into their old shitty habits again: putting their characters into all their games, despite the fact that GameCube clearly showed that people don't want that. In the span of less than a year, all this crap is coming out:
1.) Super Mario Galaxy
2.) Super Smash Bros. Brawl
3.) Mario Strikers Charged
4.) Mario Party

That's just freaking Mario games. In less than one year. And not counting Wario Ware and any other Mario games that we don't know about yet.

 

[darthbane2k]

Its really the key to sony's success. The sony gamers day made a lot of people change their mind about PS3. Sony did a brilliant job because they've given themselves such a good impression without their key titles such as FF, MGS and GT. Regardless of what people think about the system, they are always going to be reluctant to buy it at the price its selling at.

Oh please!
The majority of the market, yes that majority that made up the most of the 100mil PS2 sales, will not have even noticed that the Gamers Day happened at all.

Furthermore... just you wait until next week....

 

[DenogginizerOS]

Just like all the SNES owners bought N64 and Gamecube exclusively..
Just like all the Genesis owners kept the Saturn and Dreamcast afloat...

Using your logic, what does the Wii offer that makes it similar to the PS1 and PS2? In other words, if the Wii is going to be the top selling system and win over the competition's userbase, what features of the system will sustain it for 5-7 years?

 

[Jive Turkey]

I would say that it isnt a franchise yet then.

That would have been a fantastic response...10 pages ago.

 

[Grecco]

Wii is doing great, but I do agree that Nintendo seems to be meandering into their old shitty habits again: putting their characters into all their games, despite the fact that GameCube clearly showed that people don't want that. In the span of less than a year, all this crap is coming out:
1.) Super Mario Galaxy
2.) Super Smash Bros. Brawl
3.) Mario Strikers Charged
4.) Mario Party

That's just freaking Mario games. In less than one year. And not counting Wario Ware and any other Mario games that we don't know about yet.

Your point, one that we have heard adnaseum would go better if you didnt pile super Smash Brothers with it. Super Smash is hardly considered "freaking mario games"

 

[DenogginizerOS]

No, those are two significant factors. One doesn't necessarily follow the other. Why are you going out of your way to lump the two together after someone has already explained this to you?

I'm not. I consider them two factors. Poor word choice on my part.

 

[Pureauthor]

Using your logic, what does the Wii offer that makes it similar to the PS1 and PS2? In other words, if the Wii is going to be the top selling system and win over the competition's userbase, what features of the system will sustain it for 5-7 years?

The law of self-reinforcement - the same law every single console generation has followed to a T.

The strongest selling system gets the most support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which...

 

[DenogginizerOS]

Then explain to me why the best-selling game of the last generation (by a good green country mile) was on a portable SNES.

Price, portability, and the lack of a competitor in its market that could offer a worthy alternative.

 

[darthbane2k]

The law of self-reinforcement - the same law every single console generation has followed to a T.

The strongest selling system gets the most support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which causes the system to get more support, which draws more consumers in and boosts sales, which...

Thanks for that. I really could not be bothered explaining it all again to deaf ears.

 

[loosus]

Your point, one that we have heard adnaseum would go better if you didnt pile super Smash Brothers with it. Super Smash is hardly considered "freaking mario games"

Uh yeah. It has Mario featured fairly prominently. Anyway, you're splitting hairs.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Uh yeah. It has Mario featured fairly prominently. Anyway, you're splitting hairs.

The same way it can be considered a "freakin' Zelda game" and a "freakin' Pokemon game"?