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[Livin_Lovin]

Really, the only question for Wii is if original third party titles will sell consistently and well enough to spur larger budget titles on the system. (And for the love of god, nobody bring up the Ubisoft launch games)

And when I say "original" I mean new IPs.

 

[Culex]

Part of the problem with PS3 exclusives saving the system this year is that there are no AAA titles among them, DMC4 went cross platoform, and Lair tanked. Heavenly Sword was also a let down, mostly due to the length of the game. I can't see Warhawk, Ratchet or Uncharted becoming such huge successes that they turn the PS3 around.

Also, compared the Wii or Xbox360, there's nothing that really grabs you for the holiday season on the PS3. People can keep saying 'wait for next year' but by then, I think it'll be too little, too late.

Hardware and software sales have been abysmal, and the price cut only seems to have helped Sony for one month. If I were a sony exec and reading the latest figures, I'd be developing a lot of sweat on my brow.

 

[Aquanox]

Somebody should also weight in the fact that the best selling hardware in "Sony Family" is nearly in the end of its lifecycle unlike the ones it's being compared with.

 

[Mariah Carey]

If poor quality is the reason that 3rd party Wii games aren't selling, then why are Wii Play and Wii Sports so popular?

...because Wii Play and Wii Sports are pretty damn awesome?

 

[Tristam]

wii play > metroid prime 3 is dumb too

You're comparing a full month's worth of sales to four days.

 

[speculawyer]

I think Sony's best hope at this point is to reinforce Blu-Ray by getting non-PS3 Blu-Ray players out at less than $300, get the PS3 down to $399, and maybe, I don't know, advertise the damn console.

Uh . . . I think a less than $300 non-PS3 Blu-Ray player would be a bad idea . . . some of the PS3s sold are probably sold primarily to play Blu-Rays. :lol

I don't think advertising is much of an issue. People know it is out there.

 

[schuelma]

I think Madden Wii sales are something that people should be watching out for. It really shouldn't be that low, with Wii's userbase. It's not like Madden is some hardcore game that really clicks with WHOAMG NEXTGEN.

One would think/hope that Wii was attracting more former PS2 owners than that.

I agree, but I will say in Wii owners partial defense- EA put out a shitty game that gave owners no reason at all to buy 08 instead of sticking with 07.

 

[P90]

I think Madden Wii sales are something that people should be watching out for. It really shouldn't be that low, with Wii's userbase. It's not like Madden is some hardcore game that really clicks with WHOAMG NEXTGEN.

One would think/hope that Wii was attracting more former PS2 owners than that.

When Madden Wii looks similar to the PS2 version and definetly not like the 360s or PS3s... Unless the Wiimote implementation is stellar, you have the recipe for poor sales (relative) on the platform.

 

[Proelite]

How are the official sony forums taking this?

 

[neptunes]

Somebody should also weight in the fact that the best selling hardware in "Sony Family" is nearly in the end of its lifecycle unlike the ones it's being compared with.

what steps is sony taking to ensure that current ps2 owners won't buy a Wii or a 360 if they haven't already

 

[rs7k]

Can we try not to post dumb shit?

You're right, what a stupid argument. The Gamecube did better!

 

[traveler]

You're comparing a full month's worth of sales to four days.

True, but you're also comparing a game in its first week of sales to a game in its eight month of sales. :/

(Wii Play is best viewed as an accessory anyhow)

 

[Jiggy]

If poor quality is the reason that 3rd party Wii games aren't selling, then why are Wii Play and Wii Sports so popular?

Bundled with a controller for $10 more, and bundled with the system. There are loads of third-party games I'd buy for $10 or less.

 

[Vrolokus]

Either they're A) fanboys or B) logical thinkers who believe (like I do) that over pricing a machine with very little good software should lead to failure. Sony's made a ton of mistakes from pricing, to content, to exclusives, to arrogance, etc. infinity. Seeing them end up last shouldn't make people happy, but it shouldn't be unexpected either.

I agree with this. I own all three consoles, so the idea of any of them totally going down in flames = a lost investment for me (I went down with the Sega CD, Turbografx 16, Saturn and Dreamcast ships, so I know it's not a fun feeling). But more philosophically, the idea of an expensive console with a critical lack of great games selling on the basis of brand alone is deeply offensive to me. I want to believe gamers are smarter than that, and am somewhat relieved to see they are.

 

[Oblivion]

It can also be said that the best made games have the best marketing budgets. Spider-man 3 was a bad game but sold great, riding on the movie's success (even though it was also bad).

They're also often very well-advertised, which I think people frequently forget.
(I remember getting sick of those Red Steel commercials very quickly, but I also remember how well Red Steel sold..)

Yes, exactly. Marketing also plays a very significant role. As a result, games like Red Steel will sell well. Of course, when you have good marketing but make a shitty product, you may get sales but word of mouth will make it difficult for people to be fooled next time around. Which is why quality is also important.

 

[traveler]

Bundled with a controller for $10 more, and bundled with the system. There are loads of third-party games I'd buy for $10 or less.

Why did Mario Party 8 sell then? Or Pokemon Battle Revolution?

Are brand names and games with accessories the only games that will sell on the system?

 

[beef3483]

If poor quality is the reason that 3rd party Wii games aren't selling, then why are Wii Play and Wii Sports so popular?

While it has only been partially proven that quality third party games (RE4, Trauma Center) sell on Wii, reversing the argument only makes third party Nintendo sales look better, while also completely invalidating the Madden Wii sales argument.

 

[titiklabingapat]

Didn't the Wii version scored the worse, even lower than the PS2's?

 

[Dartastic]

If poor quality is the reason that 3rd party Wii games aren't selling, then why are Wii Play and Wii Sports so popular?

Keep in mind that Wii Play is essentially a 10 dollar game. If you need another Wiimote, why not buy Wii Play? It's pretty much a no brainer; even the guys at mass market stores like Wal-Mart and Best Buy know this, and they tell their customers as well. When I went into Best Buy when Wii Play first came out, they made sure to tell me that if I was buying another Wiimote that I should just get Wii Play. When you think of the audience that is buying the Wii, those Best Buy and Wal-Mart recommendations go a long way.

 

[speculawyer]

My comment wasn't directed only at madden..

But it was EA's best selling Wii game!

In fact is was the only 3rd party Wii game to make the Top 20! . . . Aw never mind. I give up too. :lol

 

[dk_]

PS3 MADDEN NFL 08 336.2K

336.2K poor people.

 

[traveler]

336.2K poor people.

?

Is the PS3 version gimped or something?

 

[devilscallmedad]

Keep in mind that Wii Play is essentially a 10 dollar game. If you need another Wiimote, why not buy Wii Play? It's pretty much a no brainer; even the guys at mass market stores like Wal-Mart and Best Buy know this, and they tell their customers as well. When I went into Best Buy when Wii Play first came out, they made sure to tell me that if I was buying another Wiimote that I should just get Wii Play. When you think of the audience that is buying the Wii, those Best Buy and Wal-Mart recommendations go a long way.

Doesn't explain Mario party though, another shitty mini game collection and sells like crazy.

?

Is the PS3 version gimped or something?

30FPS?

 

[Dartastic]

Why did Mario Party 8 sell then? Or Pokemon Battle Revolution?

Did Pokemon have staying power? Why does Mario Party 8 have half the sales of Wii Play this month?

 

[Tristam]

True, but you're also comparing a game in its first week of sales to a game in its eight month of sales. :/

(Wii Play is best viewed as an accessory anyhow)

And people love extra controllers.

I'm not exactly sure what constitutes high sales in NA -- is 218,100 units in 4 days unimpressive or something?

 

[P90]

Why did Mario Party 8 sell then? Or Pokemon Battle Revolution?

Are brand names (snip)

Aren't brand names like GT, MGS, and FF going to "save" the PS3? Brand names are blue chips.

 

[Mar]

Some of you guys sound like you are happy that the PS3 is selling poorly... Maybe I'm just drunk

I've been hoping for this ever since Sony went into Nintendo mode. IE: Arrogant arseholes. I am very happy to see it sell poorly and their claims to explode in their own faces. I was also pleasantly rewarded back in the day when Nintendo were like this too, and I wished for the same outcome.

 

[Evlar]

Why did Mario Party 8 sell then? Or Pokemon Battle Revolution?

Are brand names and games with accessories the only games that will sell on the system?

I don't know. Do you?

 

[chespace]

The Wii is a beast!

WTF, indeed.

 

[vitaflo]

Also, compared the Wii or Xbox360, there's nothing that really grabs you for the holiday season on the PS3. People can keep saying 'wait for next year' but by then, I think it'll be too little, too late.

It's already too little too late. Sony had to show up this xmas and they didn't (or rather, the 3rd parties they depend on didn't). The 360 has an insane lineup this holiday and even Nintendo is putting out 3 of its major franchises this fall (something they never do). Sony not only needed to match this, but exceed it, given how far behind they are now, and they've fallen flat on their face. They're basically finished. Hopefully they learn not to take advantage of their userbase next gen.

 

[PkunkFury]

Why is this forum mystified that Wii Play keeps selling? Have you ever been to a retail store?? Mom grabs a Wii and a controller, she asks sales monkey what games to get. Sales monkey says, "Well, i dunno, but for 10 dollars extra you get a bunch of games with this controller". Mom puts the controller back and buys Wii play! Is it that hard to follow? Wii play will continue to sell throughout the Wii's lifetime. Because it's a freaking controller.

 

[Jiggy]

Why did Mario Party 8 sell then? Or Pokemon Battle Revolution?

Are brand names and games with accessories the only games that will sell on the system?

Can't speak for Mario Party 8, never played the series.


Pokemon Battle Revolution is probably because most of us who bought it made a horrible, horrible mistake, assuming it would be like Stadium or Stadium 2. Or in my case, assuming the trainer creation wouldn't have the fewest features for create-a-character this side of Carnival Games. In hindsight, I should have just bought a fifth copy of Diamond/Pearl. Would have entertained me at least three times as much, and three times as long.

 

[traveler]

I don't know. Do you?

No idea. :lol

I should probably back out of this debate. I didn't even make the "third party games don't sell on Wii" claim; I just got shanghaied into the argument when I said that I thought it was ridiculous that people thought quality was the man deciding factor in sales. That's the only point I was trying to make and I think I made it.

 

[ferrex]

When I hear the "Third party games don't sell on Wii" talking point it's usually closely coupled with assumptions about Wii's audience. Usually they say either third parties don't sell because Wii is dominated by Nintendo fanboys or by casuals that only want to play Wii Sports. Right? Meanwhile all the REAL gamers are off playing on their 360 so OF COURSE they wouldn't buy Wii software. And then the lack of third party sales is used to support this.

But if the games are actually shit, and the reason REAL gamers aren't buying them is because they are shit, then what does that tell us about how REAL gamers would react to good third party games on the Wii? Nothing at all. It's a vacuous argument.

Most third party games on the Wii- like Boogie, or Madden Wii 08, or Carnival Games, or that whole pile of post-launch Ubisoft tripe- don't sell because they aren't worth buying. Attributing their bad sales to the console audience rather than their lack of quality is misleading.

Which is why those of us genuinely interested in industry trends (and not simply engaging in inane, worthless console zealotry) are curious to see how a genuinely well executed, quality game like MP3 fares on the Wii. Note: we haven't seen this yet, because MP3's numbers are from a scant few days of sales.

Sometimes I wonder about posters here. How many of you are actually interested in the whims of the industry, developers, and consumers, versus how many have simply hitched their personal self worth wagon to a particular platform?

 

[Ether_Snake]

The more obvious solution would be for third parties to steer clear from creating shitty software for the Wii.

Why do we keep hearing this? Do you really think that when EA made Boogie they said "yeah let's make another shitty game for the Wii!"? There's no "Push this button to make an awesome game!".

If it was that easy there would be no such thing as Pixar or iPods!. When a company is raking in huge profits it's difficult to but it and try to take some of its market share by simply "deciding" to make quality games. Look at how many shitty games are released on the PS2/PS3/360!

Sure, third parties will TRY to make a lot more games for the Wii, but it won't be long before they face the same problem they always faced on ALL Nintendo platforms.

 

[Oblivion]

Re: Madden Wii sales.

Well, I think it's also fair to mention that EA advertised the 360 version like crazy. Course..I guess that wouldn't explain why PS3 sales were pretty good. But yeah..just throwing that out there.

 

[traveler]

Which is why those of us genuinely interested in industry trends (and not simply engaging in inane, worthless console zealotry) are curious to see how a genuinely well executed, quality game like MP3 fares on the Wii. Note: we haven't seen this yet, because MP3's numbers are from a scant few days of sales.

Sometimes I wonder about posters here. How many of you are actually interested in the whims of the industry, developers, and consumers, versus how many have simply hitched their personal self worth wagon to a particular platform?

You actually wonder about that? I think you're giving some of us too much credit.

 

[Dartastic]

It's already too little too late. Sony had to show up this xmas and they didn't (or rather, the 3rd parties they depend on didn't). The 360 has an insane lineup this holiday and even Nintendo is putting out 3 of its major franchises this fall (something they never do). Sony not only needed to match this, but exceed it, given how far behind they are now, and they've fallen flat on their face. They're basically finished. Hopefully they learn not to take advantage of their userbase next gen.

I agree with everything you said, except the bolded bits. While it's obvious that the PS3 isn't going to be a smash success, saying they're basically finished is a bit harsh. Now, if the sales ratio remain the same throughout the holiday season... Saying Sony's finished would be a safe thing to say. Hell, it wouldn't even have to be through the holiday season. If the numbers are the same through October (which PS3's numbers will be, due to Halo) then you can say it's finished. Just wait a few months.

 

[Ether_Snake]

One would think/hope that Wii was attracting more former PS2 owners than that.

Most are either sitting on their asses playing PS2/PSP games (like me) or buying 360s.

 

[Culex]

I agree with everything you said, except the bolded bits. While it's obvious that the PS3 isn't going to be a smash success, saying they're basically finished is a bit harsh. Now, if the sales ratio remain the same throughout the holiday season... Saying Sony's finished would be a safe thing to say. Hell, it wouldn't even have to be through the holiday season. If the numbers are the same through October (which PS3's numbers will be, due to Halo) then you can say it's finished. Just wait a few months.

I think if PS3's numbers for the September NPD are below 130k, we can say that they are finished.

 

[Deadly Monk]

Madden on 360...sold more than Madden on PS2....

My god, times have changed

 

[Grecco]

Look at how many shitty games are released on the PS2/PS3/360!

.

And for the most part they sell like shit on those consoles too. Its a rare moment when shit like Tenchu or Two Worlds sells.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Most are either sitting on their asses playing PS2/PSP games (like me) or buying 360s.

But they're also buying Wii's if and when they find them, even if they only have three games for it and haven't turned it on for a while. It's true. The Wii is so attractively priced and so different that most gamers can't help but snatch one up when they see it. I couldn't.

 

[Cheeto]

Sure, third parties will TRY to make a lot more games for the Wii, but it won't be long before they face the same problem they always faced on ALL Nintendo platforms.

Yeah, because the GB, GBA, NES, DS and SNES all had a terrible time selling third party games.

 

[Grecco]

I agree with everything you said, except the bolded bits. While it's obvious that the PS3 isn't going to be a smash success, saying they're basically finished is a bit harsh. Now, if the sales ratio remain the same throughout the holiday season... Saying Sony's finished would be a safe thing to say. Hell, it wouldn't even have to be through the holiday season. If the numbers are the same through October (which PS3's numbers will be, due to Halo) then you can say it's finished. Just wait a few months.

Finished in the sense that theres no way Sony wins this gen. Not finished in the sense that Sony will pack it up and go home

 

[GameGamer]

360 MADDEN NFL 08 896.6K
PS2 MADDEN NFL 08 643.6K


Just


WOW!!!!!!!!!

 

[Ether_Snake]

Even if they are "huge" successes (Uncharted having the best shot) they'll dropping in months that have room cleaning, floor shattering games like Halo, GHIII, Rock Band, and Mass Effect. They need room to breathe that they just won't get. The multiplatform hits this fall, as Madden has shown, will not be moving PS3s to any significant degree and the fact that there are SO MANY of them this fall (Assassins, COD4, Rock Band, GHIII) is going to make it so hard for those PS3 games to stand out. GT5P will probably have the best shot because regardless of content, it's going to look to your average consumer like a really awesome budget priced game. But will that move consoles? Probably not enough.

But really, those who say Uncharted might have a shot at being a "great game": :lol

It won't sell. This is like trying to sell Tomb Raiden, but replace the big-titted Lara by a dude in a dirty shirt, on an expensive console that has no games.

Not gonna happen. And the chances that the reviews give this game such an awesome score that it would overwrite the above is almost nill

Sony CANNOT, in any way, reverse its position outside Japan. It is NOT possible. Stop dreaming.

 

[Dartastic]

Finished in the sense that theres no way Sony wins this gen. Not finished in the sense that Sony will pack it up and go home

Durrrrrr. It's really a race for second place. If the trend continues for another couple months, it's safe to say that Wii's got this in the BAG. Even still, it's pretty safe to say with Halo coming out that 360 has second place firmly in its grasp.

 

[knitoe]

Re: Madden Wii sales.

Well, I think it's also fair to mention that EA advertised the 360 version like crazy. Course..I guess that wouldn't explain why PS3 sales were pretty good. But yeah..just throwing that out there.

Think, most people that own a Wii also have a X360 and/or PS3. So, if they are going to get Madden, they wouldn't buy the Wii version compare to other two. Thus, the extremely low numbers for Madden Wii.

 

[schuelma]

Sony CANNOT, in any way, reverse its position outside Japan. It is NOT possible. Stop dreaming.

I'm still waiting to hear how it can do so inside Japan.