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[kame-sennin]

Re: The Conduit, does anyone know how many units Sega shipped? I'd like to know what Sega's expectations were with this game.

If aiming accuracy was the sole reason why people bought these games, we would have moved to some sort of light gun combo momvement setup a long time ago.

You know, I've always wanted this. I don't see why we can't have it on the Wii. Devs have no imagination, I guess

 

[theBishop]

They have a problem making a profit on anything other than mainline GTA. Look at their finances.

But we're talking about PSP specifically. What else on PSP have they sunk money in? I remember Midnight Club did quite well on PSP.

 

[professor_t]

So that's 2.07 million XBox 360 games sold in June, 2.31 million Wii games, and 1.11 million PS3 games.

Shit. PS3 software is performing terribly.

Especially considering the quality of its library and the fact that the people who spend $400-600 on a console should be the hardcore types who buy a ton of games.

 

[markatisu]

Re: The Conduit, does anyone know how many units Sega shipped? I'd like to know what Sega's expectations were with this game.

Even if they told us all of GAF would say it was PR nonsense, its too bad we do not know like we do in JP what shipments are.

 

[MWS Natural]

All pro was awful but every year i end up playing madden again and nothing ever really changes, awful awful ai, cheap gimmicky hail marys are easy, and it feels closer to NFL blitz than sim football. Don't know how EA can be so great at golf and hockey and be subpar at football and R0FLc0pter bad at basketball.

I couldn't disagree with you more. I hated the first year of Madden on 360 and it has been drastically improved since then. The graphics, controls and Defensive AI is much better. Gimmicky hail mary's ? Who are you playing against the CPU on rookie??

 

[AceBandage]

Given the Wii's staggering install base, and the fact that the game actually received a marketing push on TV, I can't imagine how it could have score any *less* than roughly 70k. I wasn't expected Halo numbers, but holy shit those sales are anemic.

Word of mouth killed the game fairly quickly, sadly. Even on the internet.

 

[Lostconfused]

Especially considering the quality of its library and the fact that the people who spend $400-600 on a console should be the hardcore types who buy a ton of games.

Well my anecdotal evidence is that i buy games on 360 instead of the ps3 because i can't connect the ps3 to my monitor. There is certainly some negative perception towards sony out there.

Edit: Well to pretend that i am not the most biased person out there. There is negative perception towards every console in way or another, except maybe the Wii.

 

[Rolf NB]

So that's 2.07 million XBox 360 games sold in June, 2.31 million Wii games, and 1.11 million PS3 games.

Shit. PS3 software is performing pretty much in line with its installed-base proportions. Two percentage points higher actually.

Fixed for accuracy.

Especially considering the quality of its library and the fact that the people who spend $400-600 on a console should be the hardcore types who buy a ton of games.

If PS3 owners bought software at the same rate as Wii owners, the number would have to be 20% lower at around 890k units for the month. But it isn't. For the reasons you posted, perhaps.

edit edit edit: PS3 software consumption rate per LTD unit is also 5% higher than on Xbox 360, going by these numbers.

 

[Opiate]

Edit: Stoney, I changed my mind. I think you're right that this is too off topic. I'm leaving the discussiuon.

Fixed for accuracy.

While true, there are some other factors to consider, BCN. The quality of the PS3 library is quite high for hardcore gamers. The system is very expensive. The system has a comparatively low install base.

All of these factors should be driving attach rate. It's a hardcore oriented system with a high price tag and a low adoption rate. Those are ideal circumstances for extremely good software attach rates.

I'd argue that the PS3 should be doing better than "in line with attach rate expectations," given the context.

 

[theBishop]

Especially considering the quality of its library and the fact that the people who spend $400-600 on a console should be the hardcore types who buy a ton of games.

That's a silly extrapolation from one-month sales. It's not like infinite games are available to buy. Just because a person pays $600 (seriously? in 2009?) for a PS3 doesn't mean they're going to buy trash like Damnation or Fuel to satisfy their insatiable hunger for games.

Or maybe they were going to buy 3 copies of inFamous.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

Fixed for accuracy.

It was accurate the first time. Your edit was just a coat of sugar.

 

[theBishop]

Well my anecdotal evidence is that i buy games on 360 instead of the ps3 because i can't connect the ps3 to my monitor. There is certainly some negative perception towards sony out there.

?

 

[sonicmj1]

I'm more shocked that there hasn't been more discussion about Wii Play missing the top 10 for the first time in two and a half years in a fairly weak month for game sales.

What's going on? Do people no longer need new controllers? Has the game reached saturation, despite the Wii still selling over 300K units a month?

 

[markatisu]

I'm more shocked that there hasn't been more discussion about Wii Play missing the top 10 for the first time in two and a half years in a fairly weak month for game sales.

What's going on? Do people no longer need new controllers? Has the game reached saturation, despite the Wii still selling over 300K units a month?

Could people have actually bought it for the game? I think GAF would explode if that was true

 

[LosDaddie]

Why did that surprise you, TW on Wii has been the best selling version for the last 3 years and this year it came with added hardware and extensive promotion.

You misunderstood me.

I'm not surprised the TW10 Wii sold the most, but rather that neither the X360 (especially) or PS3 version charted in the Top 10. I figured at least X360 version would chart.

 

[theBishop]

I'm more shocked that there hasn't been more discussion about Wii Play missing the top 10 for the first time in two and a half years in a fairly weak month for game sales.

What's going on? Do people no longer need new controllers? Has the game reached saturation, despite the Wii still selling over 300K units a month?

It makes sense that Wii Play purchases would correlate linearly with Wii hardware sales.

 

[pr0cs]

?

If your monitor supports HDCP

 

[Revelations]

So that's 2.07 million XBox 360 games sold in June, 2.31 million Wii games, and 1.11 million PS3 games.

Shit. PS3 software is performing terribly.

2.51 million 360 software sold.

 

[markatisu]

It makes sense that Wii Play purchases would correlate linearly with Wii hardware sales.

M+ units themselves sold 169k and Wii Play probably made up the other half

I think Wii Play will drop even more next month when WSR sales are shown

 

[LosDaddie]

It was accurate the first time. Your edit was just a coat of sugar.

Agreed. Sounded like PR spin to me

 

[kame-sennin]

Even if they told us all of GAF would say it was PR nonsense, its too bad we do not know like we do in JP what shipments are.

I really don't care what Gaf thinks. But knowing how well it sold versus how it shipped will tell us if this game will be a total bomb, or if it has a chance of doing NMH numbers.

 

[Freeza Under The Shower]

Good to see the fun free-roamer (prototype) best its not-so-fun competitors.

 

[ThatObviousUser]

I'm on the handheld band-wagon. And one of the significant up-and-coming platforms isn't being tracked on the NPD Video Games service.

...Android?

 

[EatChildren]

Even if they told us all of GAF would say it was PR nonsense, its too bad we do not know like we do in JP what shipments are.

If SEGA can say that MadWorld performed disappointingly, then say they are happy with The Conduit's first week sales while still running ads, then I'm inclined to believe them regardless of what cynic-GAF says.

 

[Rolf NB]

It was accurate the first time. Your edit was just a coat of sugar.

I disagree. It lacked meaning. It was just fuzzy wooly adjective.

 

[Jokeropia]

Yet I have a dozen friends who played Metroid Prime 3 and/or Medal of Honor Heroes 2 and every fucking one of them still happily buys and plays 360/PS3 shooters. I respect your personal opinion but I don't think most gamers feel that way.

Why should I care what most gamers may think? I was just explaining why getting FPSs on 360 is not an alternative for me.

You are completely fucking delusional.

Tsk.

The legion of sub 10k sellers is really going to substantially change those software numbers? I'm sure that's where publishers are making their bread and butter.

The cutoff was 20k, and yes, they could easily put Wii on top of 360 for total software sales as that wouldn't even require any substantial changes to begin with.

This would put to rest any impact those less than 20k sales were pulling.

If he had mentioned units rather than value, yes.

 

[markatisu]

2.51 million 360 software sold.

8.6 attachment rate does not equal 2.51m

http://www.pcworld.com/article/168607/microsofts_aaron_greenberg_on_june_npd_xbox_360_numbers.html

 

[bhhawks78]

Were there really people arguing that the Wii Mote isn't superior? I've only picked up a Wii Mote a dozen times or so, and I could tell almost instantly that it was a superior control option for shooters, both first and third. I don't mean I personally prefer it, because I don't, I mean it from an objective standpoint: with which controller could I am more rapidly and more precisely? Again, the answer seemed to be pretty clearly the Wii Remote, to me.

If someone has legitimately experienced the opposite, I'd like to hear it. I think the ample amount of auto aim on most PS3/360 shooters speaks to the controller's weaknesses.

Is there usually auto aim in Wii Games? There isn't in most PC shooters.

Edit: Just to make it clear, I think it's perfectly fine to prefer the PS3/360 controller to the Wii Mote. Preference is different than technical ability. For example, many people prefer dual analog shooters to KB/M shooters simply because they are accustomed to dual analogs and are comfortable with it, and thus don't mind the loss of precision. That is completely fine and both understandable and justifiable. But those are more subjective preferences, and are not indicative of more objective measures like precision and speed.

The problem is that in the conduit the wiimote approximates a broken shaky lightgun, not precision. So you have all the negatives of the controller without the potential positives.

 

[theBishop]

If your monitor supports HDCP

Don't they all at this point? I bought my monitor 3 years ago and it works great.

 

[Lostconfused]

?

My monitor doesn't have a DVI port for some insane reason. Well it had an HDMI port but it took all of 3 days for it to break on me and the warranty didn't cover it. Either way this all ends with me not wanting to spend money on a new monitor or an HDTV.

 

[Opiate]

Good to see the fun free-roamer (prototype) best its not-so-fun competitors.

As subtle as a brick to the head.

 

[sonicmj1]

It makes sense that Wii Play purchases would correlate linearly with Wii hardware sales.

I guess that's true. It has been outsold by Wii Fit and Mario Kart lately anyways, so it's sensible that those would still be in the top 10 when Wii Fit leaves.

It just seems like some symbolic turning point or something, considering how long that title was selling well.

 

[FrankT]

Why should I care what most gamers may think? I was just explaining why getting FPSs on 360 is not an alternative for me.
Tsk.
The cutoff was 20k, and yes, they could easily put Wii on top of 360 for total software sales as that wouldn't even require any substantial changes to begin with.
If he had mentioned units rather than value, yes.

In terms of dollars sold it's pretty clear.

8.6 attachment rate does not equal 2.51m

http://www.pcworld.com/article/168607/microsofts_aaron_greenberg_on_june_npd_xbox_360_numbers.html

Is that not a running LTD attach rate. Not sure it works like that. Its either A that leak was wrong or B the attach is a bit higher for the month.

 

[Revelations]

Given the Wii's staggering install base, and the fact that the game actually received a marketing push on TV, I can't imagine how it could have score any *less* than roughly 70k. I wasn't expected Halo numbers, but holy shit those sales are anemic.

I hate to be the one that tells you this. But the wii's userbase is 85% mom & pop wii sportsters, fitness junkies, wii players and 15% Nintendo [ONLY] fans.

 

[theBishop]

Good to see the fun free-roamer (prototype) best its not-so-fun competitors.

thanks for the clarification.

 

[Rolf NB]

2.51 million 360 software sold.

240.6*8.6=2069.16

Beaten, of course.

 

[Evlar]

Fixed for accuracy.

If PS3 owners bought software at the same rate as Wii owners, the number would have to be 20% lower at around 890k units for the month. But it isn't. For the reasons you posted, perhaps.

While true, this is just emphasizing Sony's install base problem. I don't see that it makes anyone at Sony or third party publishers happy to know that they can expect about 50% of the sales they will see on the 360.

I don't know at what point the platform starts losing its viability as a money-maker for ports and multi-plats. It's at 54% total software sales per month compared against 360right now. I would guess it can go lower, but how much?

 

[Stoney Mason]

I was simply hoping to learn if there really were people claiming dual analogs were superior, as Beermonkey seemed to imply. I thought it was generally accepted that the Wii Mote could allow for more precision and speed, and that was certainly my (brief) experience. If there are people who genuinely believe that Dual Analogs are technically superior (as in, not just a preference), then I wanted to hear their reasoning.

Like most people I bought into the original talk that Wii was going to revolutionize fps controls. When I actually play them on the Wii I find I don't actually like them as much as I thought I would. That's not saying there isn't more fidelity in the aiming part. A couple of things come to mind.

1.) Most fps gamers are use to pad controls at this point. There is a learning curve to using the wii with first person controls. I would argue that learning curve is higher than it is for games like Wii Sports and such which seemed fairly natural.
2.) My hands get tired eventually holding up the pointer and moving it around. I'm not saying that's the case with everybody but it happens to me. I find I need to take a break much more frequently with Wii games in general because of this.
3.) There are issues with me moving outside of the tracking area with some of the Wii fps style games. Once you move out of the tracking area you lose control.
4.) The Wii online setup is god awful.

So while I can completely understand why some people might prefer the Wii, I can also completely understand why when given the option a person might prefer to game on his HD console for fps games despite the increased aiming fidelity a wii-mote can provide. That's why the argument of superior control is flawed. It's not really fair to analyze these things in a vacuum. When a person says they prefer the gamepad to a Wii-mote they are probably internalizing a bunch of different factors into that answer beyond just aiming accuracy.

 

[sonicmj1]

8.6 attachment rate does not equal 2.51m

http://www.pcworld.com/article/168607/microsofts_aaron_greenberg_on_june_npd_xbox_360_numbers.html

What do lifetime attachment rates and software sold in a month have to do with each other?

 

[Revelations]

8.6 attachment rate does not equal 2.51m

http://www.pcworld.com/article/168607/microsofts_aaron_greenberg_on_june_npd_xbox_360_numbers.html

360 PROTOTYPE 419,863
360 UFC 2009 UNDISPUTED 338,278
360 FIGHT NIGHT ROUND 4 260,817
360 RED FACTION: GUERRILLA 199,380
360 GHOSTBUSTERS: THE VIDEO GAME 192,298
360 TIGER WOODS PGA TOUR 10 133,321
360 CALL OF DUTY: WORLD AT WAR 88,589
360 CALL OF DUTY 4: MODERN WARFARE GOTY ED 71,175
360 HALO 3 62,546
360 NBA 2K9 61,400
360 MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL 2K9 58,916
360 TRANSFORMERS: REVENGE OF THE FALLEN 58,829
360 GUITAR HERO: SMASH HITS 43,139
360 OVERLORD 2 38,772
360 FALLOUT 3 OPERATION ANCHORAGE AND THE PITT EXPANSION PACK 38,559
360 LEFT 4 DEAD GOTY ED 35,141
360 FABLE II 31,796
360 X-MEN ORIGINS: WOLVERINE UNCAGED ED 30,878
360 ELDER SCROLLS IV: OBLIVION GOTY ED 29,201
360 GRAND THEFT AUTO IV 29,176
360 BLAZBLUE: CALAMITY TRIGGER 28,905
360 FALLOUT 3 28,404
360 HALO WARS 26,346
360 RESIDENT EVIL 5 25,796
360 FIFA SOCCER 09 25,431
360 STAR WARS: THE FORCE UNLEASHED 24,191
360 CALL OF JUAREZ: BOUND IN BLOOD 23,684
360 SACRED 2: FALLEN ANGEL 22,163
360 GEARS OF WAR 2 21,516
360 LEFT 4 DEAD 21,316
360 PRINCE OF PERSIA 20,756
360 GUITAR HERO METALLICA 20,076

2.51 milli...if I calculated right.

 

[markatisu]

I hate to be the one that tells you this. But the wii's userbase is 85% mom & pop wii sportsters, fitness junkies, wii players and 15% Nintendo [ONLY] fans.

I can't tell if this is a joke post or not, wtf is a wii player :lol

Also shouldn't it be like 95% Nintendo ONLY if 3rd party bitching is taken into account

 

[FrankT]

What do lifetime attachment rates and software sold in a month have to do with each other?

Exactly those figures should be different.

 

[Opiate]

The problem is that in the conduit the wiimote approximates a broken shaky lightgun, not precision. So you have all the negatives of the controller without the potential positives.

That's fine, I don't care about the Conduit. I was talking about the controller more generally and not that game specifically: obviously any individual game can implement any controller poorly.

I'd like to end it at that, however, as I believe Stoney is correct that this is too off topic.

 

[w3stfa11]

I hate to be the one that tells you this. But the wii's userbase is 85% mom & pop wii sportsters, fitness junkies, wii players and 15% Nintendo [ONLY] fans.

Yep and this is self-evident when you walk into a Target or Best Buy and see shelves of non-core and shovelware games.

 

[Accident]

So that's 2.07 million XBox 360 games sold in June, 2.31 million Wii games, and 1.11 million PS3 games.

Shit. PS3 software is performing terribly.

The attach rate are LTD

Software LTD:
Xbox 360 133,135,619
Wii 131,614,598
PlayStation 3 53,815,852

 

[Revelations]

I can't tell if this is a joke post or not, wtf is a wii player :lol

Also shouldn't it be like 95% Nintendo ONLY if 3rd party bitching is taken into account

People who bought a wii and ONLY plays wii play. Theres more than likely over 15 million of them in US alone. [of course im exaggerating that number but given the software sales may not be that far off]

 

[Omar Ismail]

240.6*8.6=2069.16

That's not how you use attach rates.
Attach rates are for ALL consoles sold, not just the specific month.

So there have been 15Million * 8.6 games sold for 360 since day one.
In june it was 2.51M software units.

Cap eesh?

 

[theBishop]

I guess that's true. It has been outsold by Wii Fit and Mario Kart lately anyways, so it's sensible that those would still be in the top 10 when Wii Fit leaves.

It just seems like some symbolic turning point or something, considering how long that title was selling well.

It's probably still selling well, just not in the top 10.

A quick check shows Wii Play at roughly 50% attach to Wii hardware every month this year. Assuming that holds for June, it would be somewhere in the area of 180k, just shy of the Top 10.

 

[FrankT]

The attach rate are LTD

Software LTD:
Xbox 360 133,135,619
Wii 131,614,598
PlayStation 3 53,815,852

Bingo. Winna.

2.51 milli...if I calculated right.

And that doesn't even account for the under 20k crowd.

 

[Pseudo_Sam]

The wii's userbase is 85% mom & pop wii sportsters, fitness junkies, wii players and 15% Nintendo [ONLY] fans.

:lol