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NPD Sales Results for November 2014 [Up3: NPD Data Error, AC:U #5]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
hydragonwarrior
Member
I'm expecting a similar boost in WIi U sales when Xenogears and Zelda hits. I'm starting to think Gamecube success will be very difficult to obtain this gen for Nintendo.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Seeing Sonic sales, I hope Sega realises that the reason is
(1) the bad quality of the games
(2) you could see that months in advance
Neither are Nintendo's platforms a bad choice for Sonic games, nor is Sonic unworthy of retail games, they just need to make games that aren't obviously garbage. And Sonic Boom basically screams "garbage" so much that I as a huge Sonic fan and owner of both Nintendo platforms have only bought the 3DS one on a B2G1 deal and have yet to buy the Wii U one (though I did play through it via a review copy).
(1) the bad quality of the games
(2) you could see that months in advance
Neither are Nintendo's platforms a bad choice for Sonic games, nor is Sonic unworthy of retail games, they just need to make games that aren't obviously garbage. And Sonic Boom basically screams "garbage" so much that I as a huge Sonic fan and owner of both Nintendo platforms have only bought the 3DS one on a B2G1 deal and have yet to buy the Wii U one (though I did play through it via a review copy).
Don't think that's kind of low?
Vestal
Junior Member
Page 46-47 is were the Pie-Bomb is dropped and the GAF goes ballistic.
Schnozberry
Member
It seems unlikely, but at least they aren't bleeding money anymore.
That may be too low but i Think 275 or so seems plausible. they probably lost money but not hundreds per console.
If people buy live and games over the next year they will make profit easy
Welfare
Member
People only got the PS4 close to 800k because of a tweet giving us the Xbox One's number, and having them both be at 1.2 million would contradict what the NPD statement told us.
That might have been the data cboat tried to give us, but he damn well knew the kind of reaction he would get out us.
Well the long silence of sony give me the feeling they aren't particular happy of the npd. It's never happened in the last months they stayed so quiet.
perfectchaos007
Member
Read it again
ah, it got me!
anexanhume
Member
First of all. Sony and Microsoft are fine. Sony was already doing great. Microsoft is doing much better. If there's any doom & gloom in this thread, it should be thrown Nintendo's way. They are on a trajectory below that of Gamecube, their worst performing console, and they've unleashed all their system seller franchises save Zelda. I would assume they're considering the options to follow up the 3DS pretty hard, though they're probably stuck with the Wii U for a bit more.
Sony is not in trouble. Not by any realistic metric. They had one of the best second Novembers of any console ever without adjusting their launch price. Moreover, it sounds like they shifted approximately 400K units of a non-bundled console at full price in November. That's pretty great. They are also narrowly missing out on being the best selling ever through the first 13 months of its life, and still selling at a profit. Given its price after inflation adjustment is better than number one, it's also boasting a higher attach rate, and it's generating a lot of new network subscriber revenue that didn't previously exist.
Yes, Microsoft beat them this month. But that doesn't matter in the near term. What matters are revenue and profit, and the division is great by both of those metrics for Sony. It helps to understand that not only has Microsoft drastically improved their value proposition, but the consumers in holiday months are different than those in the rest of the year. Holiday month consumers are often buying for someone else, and that person is usually younger. It's been well demonstrated that the younger generation skews towards Microsoft domestically, so it intuitively makes sense that parents and other relatives would be buying Xbox for their children. The second dynamic are bargain hunters. Microsoft gave them a huge reason to come out and buy now, and they are seeing that reward.
There's a good chance Microsoft also wins December. Their value proposition has only decreased by $20, ignoring the specials on top of that like gift cards. Sony seems to have brought their black friday bundle back, but to certain retailers and at a higher price. Those holiday consumers are still going to be buying.
Going forward, Microsoft will have a challenge in that they may have considerable difficulty generating sales if the temporary discount of $50 lapses and the price returns to $400. The "temporary" label may have just been to inspire a sense of urgency, and this was Microsoft's plan all along. It's not that $400 is inherently a bad value. Consumers are not dumb. They will see that the console they want used to be $50 cheaper, incentivizing them to just wait for that price to return, creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. Thus, I would be very surprised if they return to $400 after the holiday. Microsoft may also have a challenge in that the vast majority of consoles sold this holiday have been bundles. Granted, they've seemed to have flooded the channel with AC bundles, but a non-bundled console could further hurt their value proposition at $400 (or even $350).
Microsoft is also making a business decision that Sony really isn't in the position to do right now. They are likely taking a loss on the console to generate market share, with the hopes that attach rate and online service revenue recoup their losses. I also think there's a very legitimate fear that userbases can become so lob-sided that you reach a tipping point where most people who care about online gaming are going to Sony because their friends are already there. In contrast, Sony is trying to return to profitability, and their gaming division is actually one that has been helping them get there.
Going forward, Sony is in a strong enough position to wait and see until next year. Those consumers that buy consoles in January and February and into Spring are likely the consumers that are going to care about The Order, Bloodborne, Evolve, Witcher 3 and Batman. Nearly all 3rd party franchises, save a few noted IPs that have historically done well on Xbox platforms, have done better on PS4. Microsoft's lack of hardcore releases in this time-frame and the previous software landscape may shift things back in Sony's favor. Then they are at their leisure to save a probable price drop until next holiday, after they've already shifted 20 million consoles at their launch MSRP.
For Microsoft, 1.2M is an astounding number. It shows that consumers have not written off their platform and they can be competitive in market share in the US and UK, their previous strongholds. A combined 2.2M+ new gen consoles also shows that that market is very healthy, despite handheld gaming's woes contributing to a decline.
TL;DR: I'm amazed if you got this far. Sony is fine. Microsoft is now unquestionably fine. Nintenduhoh.
Sony is not in trouble. Not by any realistic metric. They had one of the best second Novembers of any console ever without adjusting their launch price. Moreover, it sounds like they shifted approximately 400K units of a non-bundled console at full price in November. That's pretty great. They are also narrowly missing out on being the best selling ever through the first 13 months of its life, and still selling at a profit. Given its price after inflation adjustment is better than number one, it's also boasting a higher attach rate, and it's generating a lot of new network subscriber revenue that didn't previously exist.
Yes, Microsoft beat them this month. But that doesn't matter in the near term. What matters are revenue and profit, and the division is great by both of those metrics for Sony. It helps to understand that not only has Microsoft drastically improved their value proposition, but the consumers in holiday months are different than those in the rest of the year. Holiday month consumers are often buying for someone else, and that person is usually younger. It's been well demonstrated that the younger generation skews towards Microsoft domestically, so it intuitively makes sense that parents and other relatives would be buying Xbox for their children. The second dynamic are bargain hunters. Microsoft gave them a huge reason to come out and buy now, and they are seeing that reward.
There's a good chance Microsoft also wins December. Their value proposition has only decreased by $20, ignoring the specials on top of that like gift cards. Sony seems to have brought their black friday bundle back, but to certain retailers and at a higher price. Those holiday consumers are still going to be buying.
Going forward, Microsoft will have a challenge in that they may have considerable difficulty generating sales if the temporary discount of $50 lapses and the price returns to $400. The "temporary" label may have just been to inspire a sense of urgency, and this was Microsoft's plan all along. It's not that $400 is inherently a bad value. Consumers are not dumb. They will see that the console they want used to be $50 cheaper, incentivizing them to just wait for that price to return, creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. Thus, I would be very surprised if they return to $400 after the holiday. Microsoft may also have a challenge in that the vast majority of consoles sold this holiday have been bundles. Granted, they've seemed to have flooded the channel with AC bundles, but a non-bundled console could further hurt their value proposition at $400 (or even $350).
Microsoft is also making a business decision that Sony really isn't in the position to do right now. They are likely taking a loss on the console to generate market share, with the hopes that attach rate and online service revenue recoup their losses. I also think there's a very legitimate fear that userbases can become so lob-sided that you reach a tipping point where most people who care about online gaming are going to Sony because their friends are already there. In contrast, Sony is trying to return to profitability, and their gaming division is actually one that has been helping them get there.
Going forward, Sony is in a strong enough position to wait and see until next year. Those consumers that buy consoles in January and February and into Spring are likely the consumers that are going to care about The Order, Bloodborne, Evolve, Witcher 3 and Batman. Nearly all 3rd party franchises, save a few noted IPs that have historically done well on Xbox platforms, have done better on PS4. Microsoft's lack of hardcore releases in this time-frame and the previous software landscape may shift things back in Sony's favor. Then they are at their leisure to save a probable price drop until next holiday, after they've already shifted 20 million consoles at their launch MSRP.
For Microsoft, 1.2M is an astounding number. It shows that consumers have not written off their platform and they can be competitive in market share in the US and UK, their previous strongholds. A combined 2.2M+ new gen consoles also shows that that market is very healthy, despite handheld gaming's woes contributing to a decline.
TL;DR: I'm amazed if you got this far. Sony is fine. Microsoft is now unquestionably fine. Nintenduhoh.
Banjo-Kazooie
Member
For as long as you all keep giving him attention
John Harker
Definitely doesn't make things up as he goes along.
I think it is near if not the actual Highest selling bundle ever
Thats not justice, thtat's vengeance.
CadetMahoney
Member
My face is still like this:
http://33.media.tumblr.com/5c170128edc2e5b71b60f4c5cd9c650a/tumblr_nd94uiH6dK1qhjbxeo2_500.gif
How is it even possible? Do ppl just care about which one is cheaper? It doesn't make sense to me.
*a complete 180 and a fire sale to change it yes
Only after a complete reverse on policy, removal of kinect and the price drop and game inclusion did it really take off which is great but should've been all that from the get go
If it's this doable imo or at least how it should be going forward
Wii u was cheaper. All three consoles provide great games and services. But yes cheaper during holidays is huge
anexanhume
Member
Yup. Punishing a developer for their publisher forcing them to push something out the door. Let's not buy Pillars of Eternity because KOTOR 2 was an unfinished, buggy mess!
The ''first subtitle'' game always sold more until now, right (like, Red>Blue, Gold>Silver, Ruby>Saphire, Diamond>Pearl etc)? This is really surprising.
From a poster in this thread
Keep in mind the PS4 still sold 70% of the Xbox One total. At 399 with pack in for almost the entire month.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I see Nintendo as being screwed. I was REALLY and I do mean REALLY hoping that they would drop the price of the system, but I just cannot bring myself to pay $300 for a console that is considerably weaker than other consoles.
I'd like to play games like Windwaker HD (the only must have title for me honestly), Super Smash Brothers, Mario Kart, and Hyrule Warriors, but not at that price.
I'd like to play games like Windwaker HD (the only must have title for me honestly), Super Smash Brothers, Mario Kart, and Hyrule Warriors, but not at that price.
A Human Becoming
More than a Member
Anyone post 360, PS3, Wii, Vita numbers?
xemumanic
Member
Not next year, but probably in 2016, we could see that from BOTH Sony and MS. The sort of hardware they went with makes it possible IMO. Not that they will, but they could. There's no reason for this gen to last as long as they're talking. And done right, should be 100% BW compatible.
When 95% of the big games come both, yeah, the cheaper one can definitely make a difference. Less money but for less Ps basically.
Bingo. i don't know why you are surprised.
They are pretty much the same, so why not buy the cheaper one? (Just please note that no average consumer cares about resolution/frame rate etc).
DeadlyVirus
Member
PS3 and 350 still sell a lot in 2-tier countries, so I guess not
DeadlyVirus
Member
Because the X1 was overpriced
Welfare
Member
Parents are very price-sensitive. All the 12 year olds just want a box to play the lastest Cawwa Doody on, and the Xbox does that as cheaply as possible.
Alpha comes before Omega. The trend still stands.
So what you're saying is Sony should just not release any exclusives until the Holidays. Might as well delay The Order & Bloodborne for 6 months.
Solid reasoning there, champ.
Deputy Moonman
Member
I worry about the new 3ds. The original has been fantastic, but the new one is basically the old one with improved 3d effect and improved specs To the general public, I don't know how this will be viewed. It can be argued that part of the Wii U's problem is confusion by the similar naming convention as the Wii. Will the 3ds have the same problem?
Insane Metal
Member
Holy hell more than 300k difference. The age of Sony was too fast. Now it's time for Microsoft.
anexanhume
Member
DPE did nearly even on the older consoles, so clearly that wasn't a large issue for buyers given the current gen consoles heavily outsell other cross-gen titles these days.
It's essentially a Lite/XL type revision to most buyers and they exacerbated the "upgrade" problem they already had with the Wii U. Titles that only work on the new 3DS are just going to piss consumers off.
White is the exception in North America, probably because the kids here like Zekrom more than Reshiram.
DataStream
Member
I imagine we will see MS make the price cut permanent, but with a few digital pack-ins of launch titles as opposed to brand new titles. They will likely gauge the market from that point and swap for touchstone new release bundles as needed.
NickFire
Member
I agree that the cost-conscience parents and shoppers in general don't care much for resolution, but plenty of average consumers still do.
I agree. I rarely see games that are ported to other platforms, multiple iterations of the same game (like the Street Fighter series), or remakes outsell the original versions of games.
Resident Evil 4 is a good example: Sold a ton on Gamecube, but sold a lot less on PS2 when it got ported, despite the PS2 having a larger install base worldwide than Gamecube.
And in MCC's case, it doesn't help that the collection was mostly broken to everyone before all of the patches came.
GarciaHotspur
Member
Lol don't worry for Sony.
Quite unsurprising, given how much effort Microsoft put up this month. I believe this is a very good thing overall... A defeat of Microsoft (or a 7-10k difference #CBOAT) would have been disastrous for the Xbox brand in the US (and hence worldwide really). Maybe it will push Sony to offer a better value, or even reduce the price a bit sooner that they expected. But for that, I think Microsoft need to keep the pressure on, and it won't be easy...
This November, Microsoft had everything on their side, but I am not sure they will be able to keep this advantage in the coming month :
- the amazing price offer (I believe people could get it for 329$ with three extra games...) is simply unsustainable in the long run, and the price drop effect on sales will inevitably lower even if they keep that price down.
- a good amount of extra exclusives compared to Sony. I think it's fair to say that Microsoft simply had more bullets in terms of good AAA exclusives, but this tendency will change fast if we look at both planning for next year.
- a good image, they got rid of most of the initial (terri)bad PR, and Sony was a bit hurt by that #PS4HasNoGames narrative. If it's unlikely Microsoft will get back to its initial and terribly bad PR, Sony will most likely (and really already has) get rid of that impression real fast. PSX and the Q1-Q2 2015 planning will make sure of that.
It will equally interesting to see how Sony react (as you may have guessed from my post, I don't think they need to more than what they currently does, but I would sure love to see them do it anyway), and how Microsoft will try to keep on its momentum (given their Q1-Q2 planning, I imagine they will try to keep on pushing good bundles and pricing)
This November, Microsoft had everything on their side, but I am not sure they will be able to keep this advantage in the coming month :
- the amazing price offer (I believe people could get it for 329$ with three extra games...) is simply unsustainable in the long run, and the price drop effect on sales will inevitably lower even if they keep that price down.
- a good amount of extra exclusives compared to Sony. I think it's fair to say that Microsoft simply had more bullets in terms of good AAA exclusives, but this tendency will change fast if we look at both planning for next year.
- a good image, they got rid of most of the initial (terri)bad PR, and Sony was a bit hurt by that #PS4HasNoGames narrative. If it's unlikely Microsoft will get back to its initial and terribly bad PR, Sony will most likely (and really already has) get rid of that impression real fast. PSX and the Q1-Q2 2015 planning will make sure of that.
It will equally interesting to see how Sony react (as you may have guessed from my post, I don't think they need to more than what they currently does, but I would sure love to see them do it anyway), and how Microsoft will try to keep on its momentum (given their Q1-Q2 planning, I imagine they will try to keep on pushing good bundles and pricing)
Give War A Chance
Member
Not just, but it's the LARGEST factor amongst the average consumer, considering the library of games at the end of the generation is like 60%+ the same games...
The Abominable Snowman
Member
I agree with a lot of your points, but I don't think Nintendo is necessarily in trouble unless they fail to adjust. The market has outright rejected the Wii U and is starting to reject the 3DS, so 2015 will be pivotal to see if they are going to adjust or simply sell to their industry niche. They might be fine either way, but their niche has been steadily eroding since the SNES and is now at a low.
I think that the Wii market still exists, as naiive as that may sound. However, its full of people who are looking for cheap multimedia machines that do everything well. And no manufacturer, not even Google or Apple, has cracked that balance yet. I think it's too much for Nintendo to take on again, as they are absolute dinosaurs when it comes to services and multimedia. If they introduce a product like that it would probably take the most resources from them than any console they ever did to overhaul their design and R&D line of thought.
As far as PS4 v XOne, its clear IMO that the XOne is just now reaching a price point that's appropriate for its perception. The word that it's a 'little' weaker than the PS4 and may not get the foreign games has pretty much become standard knowledge. The Call of Duty/Sports/Shooter gamer typically does not care about stuff like that, but with both consoles being the same price they would go with the slightly better experience. Now, with the XOne cheaper, it may have been enough to sway those casual/fence sitters that the difference between the two systems is not as important as saving $50
Plus the market was hungry for next gen. What better way to enter next gen than at $329 with 4 games?
SatelliteOfLove
Member
That's not my point, though.
So MS did manage I buy back some market share? So it seems they can remain competitive in US but they're going to have to find a way of keeping the console cheaper than PS4. Great result for them as that was their goal. It cost them margin but honestly if they didn't show they could compete this holiday I think the market would have decided it was game over.
On the other hand very good PS4 numbers at a much higher price shows demand remains strong for PS4. A strong second place and overall great LTD sales so they remain veryuch in the game.
Going forward it's probably a question of how much each wants to win US and how much it matters to them. Worldwide leader remains a lock for Sony IMO so it'll be interesting to see how the approach this. MS has no choice I belive; they have to throw everything at US for foreseeable future.
Poor Wii U though. That's the real focal point for me. It's looking like a two horse race in US at this point.
On the other hand very good PS4 numbers at a much higher price shows demand remains strong for PS4. A strong second place and overall great LTD sales so they remain veryuch in the game.
Going forward it's probably a question of how much each wants to win US and how much it matters to them. Worldwide leader remains a lock for Sony IMO so it'll be interesting to see how the approach this. MS has no choice I belive; they have to throw everything at US for foreseeable future.
Poor Wii U though. That's the real focal point for me. It's looking like a two horse race in US at this point.
Aren't they being advertised as Omega Ruby & Alpha Saphire though (thus ORAS)? I think we have a unprecedent event here.
Edit:
Well... =(
Ash Sparrow
Banned
I Don't think its hard to figure out. Most people know you'd be okay going with either console, so the one that is lower cost is going to get the most sells.
2015 is looking amazing for Nintendo fans. Too bad sales don't seem to reflect this.
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