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NPD Sales Results for November 2014 [Up3: NPD Data Error, AC:U #5]

T

The Abominable Snowman

Member
Biker19 said:
I agree. I rarely see games that are ported to other platforms, multiple iterations of the same game (like the Street Fighter series), or remakes outsell the original versions of games.

Resident Evil 4 is a good example: Sold a ton on Gamecube, but sold a lot less on PS2 when it got ported, despite the PS2 having a larger install base worldwide than Gamecube.

.
Click to expand...

While I generally agree, RE4 PS2 ended up passing the GC version by a considerable amount.

Code: 
2005	GC, PS2, Wii, PC	Resident Evil 4	1.7 million (GC)
                                                3.6 million (PS2)
                                                2.1 million (Wii)
 
A

anexanhume

Member
The Abominable Snowman said:
I agree with a lot of your points, but I don't think Nintendo is necessarily in trouble unless they fail to adjust. The market has outright rejected the Wii U and is starting to reject the 3DS, so 2015 will be pivotal to see if they are going to adjust or simply sell to their industry niche. They might be fine either way, but their niche has been steadily eroding since the SNES and is now at a low.

I think that the Wii market still exists, as naiive as that may sound. However, its full of people who are looking for cheap multimedia machines that do everything well. And no manufacturer, not even Google or Apple, has cracked that balance yet. I think it's too much for Nintendo to take on again, as they are absolute dinosaurs when it comes to services and multimedia. If they introduce a product like that it would probably take the most resources from them than any console they ever did to overhaul their design and R&D line of thought.

As far as PS4 v XOne, its clear IMO that the XOne is just now reaching a price point that's appropriate for its perception. The word that it's a 'little' weaker than the PS4 and may not get the foreign games has pretty much become standard knowledge. The Call of Duty/Sports/Shooter gamer typically does not care about stuff like that, but with both consoles being the same price they would go with the slightly better experience. Now, with the XOne cheaper, it may have been enough to sway those casual/fence sitters that the difference between the two systems is not as important as saving $50

Plus the market was hungry for next gen. What better way to enter next gen than at $329 with 4 games?
Click to expand...

IMO Nintendo will always have a market. The question is whether it's big enough to justify hardware. Console erosion is their own doing, but there's probably nothing they can do to return to handheld glory days.
 
J

jhmtehgamr20xx

Banned
Castef said:
A year ago it was hinted that producing a Xbox One was costing Microsoft about 470 USD, with 75 of them required by the bundled Kinect.

Now... the most expensive part of Xbox One is its GPU, valued at about 110$. Again, I'm talking about prices from one year ago.

Considering how fast technology develops and how fast prices of this kind of components fall in time I'd be REALLY surprised if a stand-alone Xbox One costs TO MICROSOFT more than 180/200 USD.
Click to expand...
That's too low. You're also forgetting about stocking and shipping costs, packaging costs, etc.
 
B

Beer Monkey

Member
elohel said:
*a complete 180 and a fire sale to change it yes

Only after a complete reverse on policy, removal of kinect and the price drop and game inclusion did it really take off which is great but should've been all that from the get go
If it's this doable imo or at least how it should be going forward
Click to expand...

Before November, the cheapest you could buy a Kinect-free SKU for was $399. On Black Friday (not even the whole month), if you waited in line you could buy a Kinect-free sku for was $329. Most people paid $349. Not everybody wants the pack-in games, and certainly not everybody values them at anywhere near the MSRP of said games. And what Microsoft pays to bundle those games in is way, way below MSRP, and even well less than wholesale.

So we're looking at the cost of the lowest price of entry to X1 ownership dropping from between 12% and 18% less than what it was last summer.

As far as the Kinect SKU? Price of entry dropped from $499 to $429 for the holidays. That's a 14% price drop, again, not counting the Ass Creed pack in.

In May 2002, Sony and Microsoft made a permanent price cut of 33% for their respective consoles.

That was no fire sale in 2002, and there's no fire sale now. It's the cost of doing business in the competitive landscape, and these discounts AREN'T EVEN THAT BIG.

I remember the Dreamcast fire sale (Black Friday 2001). Got an extra console for $50 and a bunch of extra games for $5-$10.

The terms fire sale and pyrrhic victory are being tossed around a lot in this thread; these terms do not mean what you think they mean.
 
Papacheeks

Papacheeks

Banned
Looking at the other thread about released games coming on XBone and PS4. 2015 looks to be more PS4 focused, in terms of games.

Also Someone Yesterday answered my question if NPD for November takes into account the boost of sales from PSX hype.

Which it doesn't. So I think December will be interesting, and if Sony counters with another bundle or releases more of the GTA V bundle it will be a blood bath in December.

I think all the hype from PSX is going to give Sony a boost in sales for their regular sku's.
 
Discomurf

Discomurf

Member
Sure... even at a 10% increase over last November Wii U sales are discouraging, BUT I wouldn't call it 'Doom and Gloom' for Nintendo. Like I've said earlier, the ironic thing of them 'losing' the month is that they've most likely made the most amount of money out of anyone.
 
H

harSon

Banned
The most important thing Microsoft takes away from all of this is the fact that they've had more of a price issue than a perception issue with the Xbox One - which I'm sure is relieving news considering the latter is infinitely harder to correct.
 
Papacheeks

Papacheeks

Banned
AdanVC said:
Really surprised Sony didn't make any official statement on this month's numbers. I genuinely wonder why...
Click to expand...

Because they have WW in the bag. If they are battling US/UK, and XBox let's say takes US, I think SOny will take UK, EU, Germany and the rest of other territories.
 
Q

Quadraphonic

Member
Beer Monkey said:
Before November, the cheapest you could buy a Kinect-free SKU for was $399. On Black Friday (not even the whole month), if you waited in line you could buy a Kinect-free sku for was $329. Most people paid $349. Not everybody wants the pack-in games, and certainly not everybody values them at anywhere near the MSRP of said games. And what Microsoft pays to bundle those games in is way, way below MSRP, and even well less than wholesale.

So we're looking at the cost of the lowest price of entry to X1 ownership dropping from between 12% and 18% less than what it was last summer.

As far as the Kinect SKU? Price of entry dropped from $499 to $429 for the holidays. That's a 14% price drop, again, not counting the Ass Creed pack in.

In May 2002, Sony and Microsoft made a permanent price cut of 33% for their respective consoles.

That was no fire sale in 2002, and there's no fire sale now. It's the cost of doing business in the competitive landscape, and these discounts AREN'T EVEN THAT BIG.

I remember the Dreamcast fire sale (Black Friday 2001). Got an extra console for $50 and a bunch of extra games for $5-$10.

The terms fire sale and pyrrhic victory are being tossed around a lot in this thread; these terms do not mean what you think they mean.
Click to expand...

The May '02 drop was after the PS2 had been on the market for 26 months.

This XB1 drop came after 11.
 
N

nannasin

Neo Member
kinoki said:
I keep thinking how bad business XBO is. They're selling it at a huge loss. They aren't making money from this win. But! Right now it's not about being profitable. They just need to unload stock. What really must sting is having to split the money with Ubisoft.

If Sony and Microsoft both agreed to produce 1 million units per month for 12 months, which is logical since they both believed in their products and is how things are done, would mean that Microsoft has a huge warehouse full of Xboxes. They need to unload that. Their reasoning must be that they need to create a product that people want while still being able to produce more units.

Before November there was little reason to produce a single more unit of XBO. The stock they've already built would last them another year before it sold out. They were desperate and the money was already spent. They needed to make some of that back.

Are they happy it turned out that way? Probably not, but it was the best they could do with what they had. It was impossible to turn a profit out of the situation. If it hadn't succeeded they'd more or less had to leave the industry. This wasn't about profits; it was about maintaining status quo. And they sold a ton of units but the hard part is being able to turn one month into a habit.

Sony, on the other hand, turned a profit from this and are probably happy. They'd be happier if they had outsold Microsoft, of course or just straight out sold more units. They have little choice but to continue to make money.

So they both did what they could. Let's see what this leads to long-term.
Click to expand...

Where are people getting that MS is selling at a huge lost while Sony made a profit when Sony two biggest sellers were the bundles including 2 games (GTA/TLOU and the LBP3 bundles).

Also, how do people know how much MS it costs to sell the X1. I see a 471 dollar price thrown around and 71 dollar kinect cost thrown around but they kinda dont make much sense together along with the idea that PS4 is using the better GPU and better memory.

If kinect only costs 71 dollars to make why sell it for more than double what it costs to make when you are trying to get some market penetration after decoupling it from the X1. Why only charge an extra 100 dollars when it is in a package with the X1? Something doesnt add up.

Im sure both companies were selling at a lost but not a huge disparity. I would bet that kinect costs closer to 150 than 71 and by decoupling it from the X1, it significantly lowered the cost of making the X1 and thus allowing all those bundles to be made.
 
T

The Abominable Snowman

Member
Discomurf said:
Sure... even at a 10% increase over last November Wii U sales are discouraging, BUT I wouldn't call it 'Doom and Gloom' for Nintendo. Like I've said earlier, the ironic thing of them 'losing' the month is that they've most likely made the most amount of money out of anyone.
Click to expand...

Yeah they made good money but at what price? I think having a good foothold in the console industry is far more important right now for them than making a slim amount of money.
 
NickFire

NickFire

Member
harSon said:
The most important thing Microsoft takes away from all of this is the fact that they've had more of a price issue than a perception issue with the Xbox One - which I'm sure is relieving news considering the latter is infinitely harder to correct.
Click to expand...

I don't think MS will ever believe your opinion is fact after the backlash it received in 2013, especially when Apple products considerably sell well despite their prices. And for the benefit of all gamers, I hope they, Sony, and all publishers never forget the lessons MS learned when they alienated the gaming audience at the time of reveal and E# 2013.

Don't get me wrong though - Price is extremely important.
 
S

Sean

Banned
JohnnyFootball said:
I see Nintendo as being screwed. I was REALLY and I do mean REALLY hoping that they would drop the price of the system, but I just cannot bring myself to pay $300 for a console that is considerably weaker than other consoles.

I'd like to play games like Windwaker HD (the only must have title for me honestly), Super Smash Brothers, Mario Kart, and Hyrule Warriors, but not at that price.
Click to expand...

Yeah when the Wii U can only manage to sell a terrible 240k units during November alongside one of Nintendo's biggest franchises (Smash), it's completely screwed.

I'm guessing Nintendo will just give Wii U the PS Vita treatment, keep it around but not devote much resources towards making it a success. No price drops or anything, no more effort trying to sell it. They know it's a lost cause. Even if Wii U sales were to double it wouldn't really change anything.
 
B

Beer Monkey

Member
Quadraphonic said:
The May '02 drop was after the PS2 had been on the market for 26 months.

This XB1 drop came after 11.
Click to expand...

The OG Xbox 33% price drop came after six months. And these drops are very small compared to those 2002 drops.

The biggest change that MS has made isn't these holiday discounts. It's removing the Kinect, and that isn't costing them anything, it's just a configuration change. These discounts are small, they just look big because people remember the price of the original configuration with different hardware.

This is far from a fire sale, and the use of the term in this thread is ridiculous.
 
M

mreddie

Member
Sony's NEW response:

tumblr_msxl2biGNm1rel180o1_500.gif
 
S

Steverulez

Member
PhoReal said:
hohohohoho
Click to expand...

Spoiler for the end of SO

The ending clearly sets up a sequel - the planes flying out of the park with the Overdrive loads or whatever. Insomniac are a big name developer, made a great game and if MS wanted to continue to work with them and build the franchise up they would have already greenlit by now I think. They could always cancel it later ;)
 
E

EatMyFace

Banned
Ash Sparrow said:
I Don't think its hard to figure out. Most people know you'd be okay going with either console, so the one that is lower cost is going to get the most sells.
Click to expand...
It's not that simple. It's all about timing. Upcoming holidays + AAA titles + free games & bundles = Success

XBO was $399 in September yet the PS4 sold more Destiny bundles at $450.
 
JohnnyFootball

JohnnyFootball

GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Relix said:
Someone tell Sony that's what happens when you have a shitty exclusive Holiday lineup, where third parties can be found on a cheaper console.
Click to expand...

Yes, let's tell Sony to rush their games and release them when they're not ready.

I played a ton of games on my PS4 these last few months.

I have no idea what you guys are smoking.
 
R

Relix

he's Virgin Tight™
TomShoe said:
So what you're saying is Sony should just not release any exclusives until the Holidays. Might as well delay The Order & Bloodborne for 6 months.

Solid reasoning there, champ.
Click to expand...

If they had foresight and good management The Order could have made it for Holidays. Of course in all probability we would have gotten a bugged piece of shit like Halo MCC or AC Unity so there's that. You need exclusives throughout the year, but have something appealing for your console for the Holidays. Little Big Planet? Yes I know it sold 8 million (the series itself) but its not a must have nor a masses mover. I am quite happy they 'lost" November and probably will lose December, and hopefully this is a wake up call. In my eyes there were settling in a position like they were for PS2 and thankfully that won't happen with these results. In a way, I want panic mode Sony so I can get better games eventually.

JohnnyFootball said:
Yes, let's tell Sony to rush their games and release them when they're not ready.

I played a ton of games on my PS4 these last few months.

I have no idea what you guys are smoking.
Click to expand...


Me too. Diablo 3, Last of Us, Destiny, GTAV, DA:I. Still, all of those I could play in another console.
 
I

ironcreed

Banned
Discomurf said:
Sure... even at a 10% increase over last November Wii U sales are discouraging, BUT I wouldn't call it 'Doom and Gloom' for Nintendo. Like I've said earlier, the ironic thing of them 'losing' the month is that they've most likely made the most amount of money out of anyone.
Click to expand...

It blows me away how underrated the Wii U is. But at least they are finally turning a profit.
 
A

anexanhume

Member
Cidd said:
They got spanked, hard that's why.

they only got themselves to blame.
Click to expand...

They've only made announcements when they won. This goes back to at least the PS3 days. It doesn't matter how much they lost by- they don't do PR when they lose. There's no one to "blame". They had a great month too.
 
E

EatMyFace

Banned
gamechanger87 said:
Allegedly MS green light SSOD 2. I think it did well digitally. For a new IP I think it did well. Wouldn't be suprised to see MS offer it as a game with gold this spring. They want people to try it out and get ready for 2.
Click to expand...
Did it? No Top 10 in its debut month.(or the following)
Is it even close to 1 million?
 
H

harSon

Banned
NickFire said:
I don't think MS will ever believe your opinion is fact after the backlash it received in 2013, especially when Apple products considerably sell well despite their prices. And for the benefit of all gamers, I hope they, Sony, and all publishers never forget the lessons MS learned when they alienated the gaming audience at the time of reveal and E# 2013.

Don't get me wrong though - Price is extremely important.
Click to expand...

I never said otherwise. Simply that these results are definitely a promising sign, considering it suggests that the plethora of missteps they endured prior to and directly after the release of the XB1 may not have had lasting implications that would shield the platform from future success. Basically, unlike Nintendo, making the right moves has resulted in promising success.
 
G

Guerrilla

Member
Beer Monkey said:
Before November, the cheapest you could buy a Kinect-free SKU for was $399. On Black Friday (not even the whole month), if you waited in line you could buy a Kinect-free sku for was $329. Most people paid $349. Not everybody wants the pack-in games, and certainly not everybody values them at anywhere near the MSRP of said games. And what Microsoft pays to bundle those games in is way, way below MSRP, and even well less than wholesale.

So we're looking at the cost of the lowest price of entry to X1 ownership dropping from between 12% and 18% less than what it was last summer.

As far as the Kinect SKU? Price of entry dropped from $499 to $429 for the holidays. That's a 14% price drop, again, not counting the Ass Creed pack in.

In May 2002, Sony and Microsoft made a permanent price cut of 33% for their respective consoles.

That was no fire sale in 2002, and there's no fire sale now. It's the cost of doing business in the competitive landscape, and these discounts AREN'T EVEN THAT BIG.

I remember the Dreamcast fire sale (Black Friday 2001). Got an extra console for $50 and a bunch of extra games for $5-$10.

The terms fire sale and pyrrhic victory are being tossed around a lot in this thread; these terms do not mean what you think they mean.
Click to expand...

Everyone needs to read this. Historically most consoles dropped the price earlier/and steeper than the x1, yet it's the x1 that is doing a "fire sale", if that's a fire sale, what was the ps3 situation? Did sony flush the console down the toilet? Or what hyperbolic term could we use here?
 
J

John Harker

Definitely doesn't make things up as he goes along.
mreddie said:
So I'm guessing Activision is making bank regardless of their products and I'm guessing Skylanders outsold Infinity on Black Friday.
Click to expand...

Its interesting, Acti notes Skylanders is #1 with game sales + toys. I wonder if that means Skylanders toys have outsold Disney's, because at first glance I actually think the game infinity 2.0 is ahead of Skylanders.
 
breakfuss

breakfuss

Member
CadetMahoney said:
My face is still like this:
http://33.media.tumblr.com/5c170128edc2e5b71b60f4c5cd9c650a/tumblr_nd94uiH6dK1qhjbxeo2_500.gif

How is it even possible? Do ppl just care about which one is cheaper? It doesn't make sense to me.
Click to expand...

But has power (especially when the differences are negligible) ever really mattered to the average consumer? Didn't PS2 crush Xbox and Gamecube? PS1 outsold everything under the sun. And the 360 for a time performed better than PS3. Why should it be any different now?
 
E

EatMyFace

Banned
AdanVC said:
Really surprised Sony didn't make any official statement on this month's numbers. I genuinely wonder why...
Click to expand...
They don't always make statements. They NEVER give numbers.
So having a losing month isn't something they're going to want to make a statement on.

There's not much they can say in a PR statement that would make much sense anyway. I hate PR spin anyway so I'm glad they didn't throw a statement together just to save face.
 
M

Mooreberg

is sharpening a shovel and digging a ditch
Has this been the lowest year of software sales for SCEA and Microsoft Game Studios since... ever? Drive Club, Forza, and Sunset Overdrive did not hit the top ten. MCC came in at #9, and is still having networking issues. TLOUR and inFamous did good earlier in the year, but not on par with the original TLOU or anything.

Third parties could have driven a truck through that opening, but the big sales successes have been the usual suspects. Now everbody will be clawing at each other next year. Weird stuff. You would not think they had longer to prepare for these systems than ever before.
 
M

Mar Nosso

Banned
Relix said:
If they had foresight and good management The Order could have made it for Holidays. of course in all probability we would have gotten a bugged piece of shit like Halo MCC or AC Unity so there's that. You need exclusives throughout the year, but have something appealing to your console for the Holidays. Little Big Planet? Yes I know it sold 8 million (the series itself) but its not a must have nor a masses mover. I am quite happy they 'lost" November and probably will lose December and see if this is a wake up call. In my eyes there were settling in a position like they were for PS2 and thankfully that won't happen with these results. In a way, I want panic mode Sony to get better games eventually.




Me too. Diablo 3, Last of Us, Destiny, GTAV, DA:I. Still, all of those I could play in another console.
Click to expand...

Sony is an in-house software builder power, but they need time to get the ball rolling. The same thing happened last gen with the PS3. It took them a god-awful amount of time to start a steady stream of good and exclusive games, but when they did, it was unstoppable. And in the end allowed them to sell more PS3s worldwide than the Xbox 360. It trickles at first, then it pours.

I'm expecting the same thing this generation. inFamous: Second Son was a good start, DriveClub had plenty of hiccups but is now getting praise, LBP3 rounds out the stable for variety in genres. Next year there is already a lot planned to come out, steadily over the course of the year. With Microsoft still getting sorted for in-house productions and Sony now in the lead out of the gate, things will get very interesting next year.
 
C

Cidd

Member
anexanhume said:
They've only made announcements when they won. This goes back to at least the PS3 days. It doesn't matter how much they lost by- they don't do PR when they lose. There's no one to "blame". They had a great month too.
Click to expand...

They only Sold like 840k on the busiest shopping season of the year. they sold like 600k in September with the Destiny bundle. compared to what MS sold, I would call it a fail because they failed to respond to what MS was doing.
 
K

KillerMan91

Member
Mooreberg said:
Has this been the lowest year of software sales for SCEA and Microsoft Game Studios since... ever? Drive Club, Forza, and Sunset Overdrive did not hit the top ten. MCC came in at #9, and is still having networking issues. TLOUR and inFamous did good earlier in the year, but not on par with the original TLOU or anything.

Third parties could have driven a truck through that opening, but the big sales successes have been the usual suspects. Now everbody will be clawing at each other next year. Weird stuff. You would not think they had longer to prepare for these systems than ever before.
Click to expand...

2012 was extremely shitty for SCE. Playstation All-Stars was their biggest game of the year...
 
B

BriGuy

Member
harSon said:
The most important thing Microsoft takes away from all of this is the fact that they've had more of a price issue than a perception issue with the Xbox One - which I'm sure is relieving news considering the latter is infinitely harder to correct.
Click to expand...
It also means they're free to try their DRM shenanigans again, provided the price is right. I'm not even being snarky here. If they release their next machine at like $250 or less and enable sell back of digital games, they could have a real winner on their hands.
 
Welfare

Welfare

Member
1st Course said:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=950818

PR say Advanced Warfare is best selling SKU this year so far on PS4, PS3 , XB1 and X360.

Going by the infos we have:

No PS4 game sold more than 1.17m this year.

No XB1 game sold more than 1.26m this year.

No 360 game sold more than 1.31m this year.

No PS3 game more than 765k this year.

Is it me or these numbers looks kinda low?
Click to expand...

Did Titanfall drop off a cliff or something? What is that at?
 
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