Support NeoGAF

[Doytch]

Get in there, AA. We can find a spot for Dom Brown. Or just flip him to a fourth team.

 

[The Frankman]

Fantastic read about Carlos Beltran's career as a Met

Beltran Gallery

Also, one of the greatest catches I have ever seen.

 

[see5harp]

I guess they really don't think Howard, Utley or Rollins can hit in the clutch. On paper it would seem like Howard is having another solid season with homers and rbi's. How are they not producing runs with their insane payroll? Are Cain and Timmy really that good against the Phils?

 

[Windu]

I guess they really don't think Howard, Utley or Rollins can hit in the clutch. On paper it would seem like Howard is having another solid season with homers and rbi's. How are they not producing runs with their insane payroll? Are Cain and Timmy really that good against the Phils?

Howard is actually having his worst offensive season of his career. Can't wait till that contract kicks in!

 

[XiaNaphryz]

Hmmm...from an old BP article:

Since Sabean took over after the 1996 season, he has traded away 41 young pitchers with fewer than 200 innings pitched in the Major Leagues:

41 pitchers traded away since 1996
58.9 career WARP

Six homegrown pitchers that were kept and played on Giants’ 2010 postseason roster
53.7 career WARP

I'd guess 25% of that 58.9 WARP was probably from Liriano alone.

 

[AbortedWalrusFetus]

Howard is actually having his worst offensive season of his career. Can't wait till that contract kicks in!

At least he's still getting RBIs. He's the only person on the team doing that, it seems.

 

[Windu]

At least he's still getting RBIs. He's the only person on the team doing that, it seems.

he is batting cleanup, of course he is getting RBIs. not to mention that batting with men in scoring position is probably the easiest situation to hit in.

 

[AbortedWalrusFetus]

he is batting cleanup, of course he is getting RBIs.

Yeah... more RBIs than the rest of the NL. Obviously he's going to get them since he bats cleanup, but he's particularly proficient at getting them this year compared to other NL teams and players. ANd the phillies haven't had many men in scoring position given their troubles this year. For most of the year Howard had no one in front of him, and no one behind him. Things got better when Utley came back, but on the tail end they are still bad.

 

[Doytch]

Yeah... more RBIs than the rest of the NL. Obviously he's going to get them since he bats cleanup, but he's particularly proficient at getting them this year compared to other NL teams and players. ANd the phillies haven't had many men in scoring position given their troubles this year. For most of the year Howard had no one in front of him, and no one behind him. Things got better when Utley came back, but on the tail end they are still bad.

oh my god the pain it hurts make it stop

 

[AbortedWalrusFetus]

oh my god the pain it hurts make it stop

I'm not really defending his poor hitting this season, but there are reasons he's been worse than usual. My point was to say that among the phillies, the only person that you can say of the middle of the order that has been clutch, if you can even call it that, is Howard.

 

[bluemax]

oh my god the pain it hurts make it stop

I don't even know where to begin his comment hurts my brain and soul so much.

 

[Doytch]

ya i really dont give a shit to bother formulating a response.

question: anyone have the os x version of ootp 12? reviews on app store says it crashes at july 9, wondering if it's still buggy...

 

[Windu]

well Fangraphs does have a statistic that tries to evaluate players on how they perform during the most imporant situations in the game. Howard is at .78 this season, which i guess is decent. He still sucks though.

http://www.fangraphs.com/library/index.php/misc/clutch/
http://www.fangraphs.com/winss.aspx...ual=0&type=3&season=2011&month=0&season1=2011

edit: also, list of 1B having better offensive years:

Miguel Cabrera
Adrian Gonzalez
Prince Fielder
Joey Votto
Paul Konerko
Michael Morse
Michael Cuddyer
Albert Pujols
Todd Helton
Freddie Freeman
Casey Kotchman
Gaby Sanchez
Mark Teixeira
Daniel Murphy
Adam Lind

I've heard that from Phillies fans. Just from last postseason (I don't follow the Phillies) I get the impression that he swings and misses often but his hr and rbi total still seem impressive from a Giant fan's perspective.

Well for one, RBIs are a team dependent and lineup positioning dependent stat. Not a good way to evaualte a player. And HRs are not every thing. Dan Ugga has 18 HRs and was hitting under .200 for most of the year. I prefer to look at stats like wOBA or wRC+ for total offensive production which are similar to OPS but are weighted and league and park adjusted. Both can be found on Fangraphs.com

 

[see5harp]

Howard is actually having his worst offensive season of his career. Can't wait till that contract kicks in!

I've heard that from Phillies fans. Just from last postseason (I don't follow the Phillies) I get the impression that he swings and misses often but his hr and rbi total still seem impressive from a Giant fan's perspective.

 

[darkside31337]

I've heard that from Phillies fans. Just from last postseason (I don't follow the Phillies) I get the impression that he swings and misses often but his hr and rbi total still seem impressive from a Giant fan's perspective.

Except his numbers aren't good.

You don't even have to get advanced, his .796 OPS speaks for itself.

That extension alone gives me hope that the Mets will be able to compete for the division in the not too distant future.

 

[Windu]

That extension alone gives me hope that the Mets will be able to compete for the division in the not too distant future.

perhaps, but i have a feeling that in a few years it will be the nationals and braves competing for the East. Then again, the mets do have a competent GM now, so you never know. The East will be the class of the NL for years to come though.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

I'm not really defending his poor hitting this season, but there are reasons he's been worse than usual. My point was to say that among the phillies, the only person that you can say of the middle of the order that has been clutch, if you can even call it that, is Howard.

lol. Put Miguel Olivo in that spot and he probably has as many RBI. It's a worthless stat to use to defend a player having a poor season.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Howard just swings and misses too much, that's the bottom line.

 

[Windu]

Howard just swings and misses too much, that's the bottom line.

 

[see5harp]

That gif is so damn funny. To be fair to Howard, sometimes he doesn't even swing.

 

[Windu]

i hear beltran is really good at that as well.

 

[The Frankman]

i hear beltran is really good at that as well.

If you're going to kill Beltran for the AB in 2006 at least it was a knee-buckling curve. Howard got an extremely flat cut fastball that screamed "JACK ME OUT OF THE PARK" and stared at it like it was an alien being.

 

[Dragon]

Howard just swings and misses too much, that's the bottom line.

Howard is getting outslugged by Shane Victorino. Bottom line if you're going to be below average at first base you better hit for some power.

If you're going to kill Beltran for the AB in 2006 at least it was a knee-buckling curve. Howard got an extremely flat cut fastball that screamed "JACK ME OUT OF THE PARK" and stared at it like it was an alien being.

To be fair Beltran is a superior player to Howard as well. But really that's looking for the silver lining in a rotten apple.

 

[The Frankman]

Not to mention he hits in a ridiculously friendly hitters' park.

Thing with Howard is I thought he was going to beat Wilson because the thing that kills Howard Wilson doesn't throw: curveballs. I had a feeling Howard would make good contact if he got anything resembling a fastball, so Wilson had to take a chance with a slider (remember, he had hung alot of them down the stretch). He got a back door cut fastball that hardly cut and I don't know what Howard was looking for. AT ALL.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

Remember when people were talking up a Howard for Pujols trade?

 

[darkside31337]

i hear beltran is really good at that as well.

Uncalled for.

Carlos Beltran has career .366/.485/.817 line during the postseason. Not his fault his old team never got there.

 

[CajoleJuice]

edit: also, list of 1B having better offensive years:

Miguel Cabrera
Adrian Gonzalez
Prince Fielder
Joey Votto
Paul Konerko
Michael Morse
Michael Cuddyer
Albert Pujols
Todd Helton
Freddie Freeman
Casey Kotchman
Gaby Sanchez
Mark Teixeira
Daniel Murphy
Adam Lind

:jakncoke

 

[see5harp]

i hear beltran is really good at that as well.

I think even if he doesn't deliver at all, he at least gets a few
Quality pitches for other guys in the lineup. At least hes a
Threat. We got Aubrey Huff in there batting cleanup trying sacrifice bunts.

 

[Macattk15]

Uncalled for.

Carlos Beltran has career .366/.485/.817 line during the postseason. Not his fault his old team never got there.

 

[Joey Fox]

With Rick Ankiel leading off tonight for the Washington Nationals, I think we can say they've hit rock bottom. Especially with Chien-Ming Wang taking the mound tonight, who's not really ready to be taking a major league mound at this point.

 

[Dmncnby2k9]

With Rick Ankiel leading off tonight for the Washington Nationals, I think we can say they've hit rock bottom. Especially with Chien-Ming Wang taking the mound tonight, who's not really ready to be taking a major league mound at this point.

Saw his numbers in AAA, he got rocked down there.

 

[Malo]

Sherman is speculating that the yankees could be the potential third team in the astros-phillies talks for Hunter Pence. With Dom Brown going to the yankees and Delin Betances going to the astros, do it cash!

 

[see5harp]

Is Pence better than Werth of past years?

 

[Doytch]

Is Pence better than Werth of past years?

Pence has three years seasons than Werth's best, and is four years younger.

 

[Windu]

What if the Braves are the 3rd team in the Phillies-Astros talks and get Domonic Brown (hat tip: @dupu)? Does @meechone go on suicide watch?

this would be amazing, but is .01% likely to happen.

edit: McLouth put on the DL

#Braves' Mclouth on DL w/ lower abdominal strain, Constanza up from Triple-A leading off tonight

#Braves lineup; 1. Constanza cf, 2. Prado 3b, 3. Freeman 1b, 4. Uggla 2b, 5. Hinske lf, 6. Ross c, 7. Heyward rf, 8. Gonzalez ss, 9. Beachy

 

[eznark]

Felipe Lopez is hitting 5th tonight.

You idiots have nothing to complain about.

 

[ToxicAdam]

Orlando Cabrera hitting 5th for the Indians tonight.

I win.

 

[Sharp]

With Rick Ankiel leading off tonight for the Washington Nationals, I think we can say they've hit rock bottom. Especially with Chien-Ming Wang taking the mound tonight, who's not really ready to be taking a major league mound at this point.

Haha, you think this is rock bottom? You ain't seen nothing yet.

 

[Joey Fox]

Haha, you think this is rock bottom? You ain't seen nothing yet.

That's a decent question. Obviously, it will get a lot worse this week. It's not like I think they'll start playing .500 ball again after tonight.

As far as leadoff hitter goes, I think this is rock bottom. Ankiel has a low average, OBP, isn't fast, I don't remember many doubles; I can't think of a worse leadoff candidate now that Stairs is gone. The hope is still there that after this weekend the Nationals will have someone else in that spot for the long term.

 

[Sanjuro]

Ubaldo talk on the radio all day. Do not want.

 

[JABEE]

Ryan Howard gets a lot of unjust criticism from other fans. Tell me a player on any of your teams who ha won NL MVP, rookie of the year, hit 45+ HR and 135+ RBIs in four straight seasons, fastest to 200 HR, Fastest to 250 HR, WS Champion, NLCS MVP 09, the Non-Steroid NL single season HR record and behind only Roger Maris and Babe Ruth in the MLB single season HR record. When Carlos Beltran does even half of that you can talk shit to Howard.

 

[Windu]

lol philly fans. so cute

 

[clemenx]

Ryan Howard gets a lot of unjust criticism from other fans. Tell me a player on any of your teams who ha won NL MVP, rookie of the year, hit 45+ HR and 135+ RBIs in four straight seasons, fastest to 200 HR, Fastest to 250 HR, WS Champion, NLCS MVP 09, the Non-Steroid NL single season HR record and behind only Roger Maris and Babe Ruth in the MLB single season HR record. When Carlos Beltran does even half of that you can talk shit to Howard.

I lol'd

 

[JABEE]

lol philly fans. so cute

It's true though.

 

[jakncoke]

Orlando Cabrera hitting 5th for the Indians tonight.

I win.

The other 6 players beside McCutchen/Walker. I win.

 

[Windu]

It's true though.

and its also true that those accomplishments don't change the fact that Howard is a overrated piece of shit who has a outrageous contract.

edit: Also, Carlos Beltran is ten times the player that Ryan Howard is.

 

[darkside31337]

Ryan Howard gets a lot of unjust criticism from other fans. Tell me a player on any of your teams who ha won NL MVP, rookie of the year, hit 45+ HR and 135+ RBIs in four straight seasons, fastest to 200 HR, Fastest to 250 HR, WS Champion, NLCS MVP 09, the Non-Steroid NL single season HR record and behind only Roger Maris and Babe Ruth in the MLB single season HR record. When Carlos Beltran does even half of that you can talk shit to Howard.

Seriously? Ryan Howard didn't win the WS, the Phillies did.

Postseason
Howard - .278/.382/.517
Beltran - .366/.485/.817

Only reason Beltran doesn't have a NLCS MVP is because his teams (both the Astros and the Mets) lost their series. He never lost his team a series, or even a game in the playoffs. I seriously hate all Mets fans that blame him for the series against the Cards, absolutely loathe them.

I can't believe you have the audacity to compare Howard to Beltran.

 

[CajoleJuice]

Both Beltran and Pujols deserved the 2006 NL MVP over Howard.

 

[Windu]

Both Beltran and Pujols deserved the 2006 NL MVP over Howard.

Howard wasn't even the MVP on his own team that year, Utley was.

edit:

While there has been speculation the Braves and Phillies have been in a bidding war for Astros’ outfielder Hunter Pence, a Major League source said Friday that the Braves have not considered Pence to be a priority.

The Braves did inquire about Pence and also to see if the White Sox were interested in trading Carlos Quentin. But it seems they are more likely to acquire Rays’ outfielder B.J. Upton or Padres’ outfielder Ryan Ludwick before Sunday’s 4 p.m. ET deadline arrives.

Upton could serve as the club’s leadoff hitter and starting centerfielder. But even with Schafer and McLouth sidelined, they may still target Ludwick, who would primarily play the corner outfield positions. But he is athletic enough to play center field if necessary. – Mark Bowman

http://mlb.mlblogs.com/2011/07/29/injury-plagued-braves-do-not-consider-pence-a-priority/

 

[LJ11]

Hmmm...from an old BP article:


I'd guess 25% of that 58.9 WARP was probably from Liriano alone.

You've corkscrewed yourself into the ground this week, well done.