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Official "I need a new PC!!" 2009 Edition

Well, godhandiscen, brain_stew, hazaro, thanks for the input. Missed my deadline to buy anything today but I'll take what you guys had to say in account while I research this.

To be honest I really did consider just going for a GTX295 though. :lol
 

Khalid-S

Member
What do you guys think of this build? I don't want to spend more than 1400 dollars on this gaming PC.

picture19e1a1.png


Going to change Radeon HD 4850 X2 2GB with
Radeon HD 4870 X2 2GB

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-overclock,2112.html
 

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
Hazaro said:
It's always in my taskbar on start-up.

I've never run into any games that don't let me use AA or AF ingame.
I know it kinda works on UT3 (Or whatever some game was that didn't support it)

*I see you have UT3... Try enabling it on that.
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
Hazaro said:
*I see you have UT3... Try enabling it on that.
I fixed it. I had to run the program, create the profile while the game was running and alt tab multiple times until it got enabled. Now it works even after I restart. However, I don't have the icon in the taskbar.
 

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
godhandiscen said:
I fixed it. I had to run the program, create the profile while the game was running and alt tab multiple times until it got enabled. Now it works even after I restart. However, I don't have the icon in the taskbar.
Weird. Glad it's working.
 

SapientWolf

Trucker Sexologist
zoku88 said:
triple channel has very limited benefits in real world applications.
I don't think any of them are designed to take advantage of that insane memory bandwidth yet. Memory is the weakest link right now when it comes to computer performance, lagging far behind the advances made in processor speed and hard drive capacity. Processors are basically being starved because memory is too slow and can't 'feed the beast' fast enough.

The other problem is that gains in bandwidth are being paid with penalties in latency.
 

zoku88

Member
SapientWolf said:
I don't think any of them are designed to take advantage of that insane memory bandwidth yet. Memory is the weakest link right now when it comes to computer performance, lagging far behind the advances made in processor speed and hard drive capacity. Processors are basically being starved because memory is too slow and can't 'feed the beast' fast enough.

The other problem is that gains in bandwidth are being paid with penalties in latency.
Yea, latency is kinda meh with RAM :-/ It's why prcoessor cache is so useful >.>

Although, HDD, I argue, is the weakest link, though. At least for processes that actually hit the HDD.
 

FoxSpirit

Junior Member
brain_stew said:
Try upping your MCH and northbridge voltages by one notch. Set your RAM multiplier to its lowest setting at first (labeled either 1:1 or 2.0) with slack timings so that you can take that out of the equation. Only look into OCing your RAM once you've got a stable CPU overclock. Use OCCT CPU test, or Prime/Orthos small FFTs to test your CPU overclock.

Thanks, turns out slightly underclocking the RAm (776Mhz) and setting the ASUS Tweak RAM A.I. to light let me overclock flawlessly.

Really, I have everything set to auto except for the internal CPU frequency which now is 290MHz (FSB=1160). Seeing as the board itself reports as being able to FSB1600, I'd say I'm on the safe side there by far. :D

Also did some cable amangement, had some knot near the board and it turns out the northbridge gets really hot (at standard voltage). So I better took away any obsruction to airflow I found. Bothers me a bit, but hardly anything I can do. I'll simply trust Asus they knew what they did when they constructed that thing.

I tested the whole OC with Sandra's multicore efficiency test, didn't crash after 10 minutes, that should be enough. Okay, don't mind I never passed 40°C so I'm not worried this will be a problem even if I went at it for heavily prolonged periods.

So yeah, I'm now running well with my E4400@2.9GHz. Cheers :D
 
Congrat on your overclock fox! :)

edit: But you should see if its stable using Orthos. Use it overnight, and check in the morning if it didnt stop or crashed your system. If it stops you will hear you mobo beep periodically telling you that its not stable.
 

FoxSpirit

Junior Member
Hmmm, maybe I will at a later point, currently I see no reason to test it further than I did.

But on a sidenote, did I say the northbridge got hot? Oh wow, the 4850, now THAT is also one hot beast. Glad Gainward went with a dualslot exhaust cooler, this thing still radiates heat like there's no tomorrow :lol
 
FoxSpirit said:
Thanks, turns out slightly underclocking the RAm (776Mhz) and setting the ASUS Tweak RAM A.I. to light let me overclock flawlessly.

Really, I have everything set to auto except for the internal CPU frequency which now is 290MHz (FSB=1160). Seeing as the board itself reports as being able to FSB1600, I'd say I'm on the safe side there by far. :D

Also did some cable amangement, had some knot near the board and it turns out the northbridge gets really hot (at standard voltage). So I better took away any obsruction to airflow I found. Bothers me a bit, but hardly anything I can do. I'll simply trust Asus they knew what they did when they constructed that thing.

I tested the whole OC with Sandra's multicore efficiency test, didn't crash after 10 minutes, that should be enough.
Okay, don't mind I never passed 40°C so I'm not worried this will be a problem even if I went at it for heavily prolonged periods.

So yeah, I'm now running well with my E4400@2.9GHz. Cheers :D

Hell no!

Download OCCT and run its CPU test for 4 hours. That's about the shortest period of stability testing you can get away with. You really shouldn't set your voltage to auto either as it could start putting some crazy volts through your chip. Try setting t to, say 1.35v, stability test, then notch it down to 1.3v if it passes and test again.
 

FoxSpirit

Junior Member
brain_stew said:
Hell no!

Download OCCT and run its CPU test for 4 hours. That's about the shortest period of stability testing you can get away with. You really shouldn't set your voltage to auto either as it could start putting some crazy volts through your chip. Try setting t to, say 1.35v, stability test, then notch it down to 1.3v if it passes and test again.

Is it really necessary to do that for 4 hours?
And why should auto be bad, that's the default setting of this mobo?
 

Esperado

Member
FoxSpirit said:
Thanks, turns out slightly underclocking the RAm (776Mhz) and setting the ASUS Tweak RAM A.I. to light let me overclock flawlessly.

Really, I have everything set to auto except for the internal CPU frequency which now is 290MHz (FSB=1160). Seeing as the board itself reports as being able to FSB1600, I'd say I'm on the safe side there by far. :D

Also did some cable amangement, had some knot near the board and it turns out the northbridge gets really hot (at standard voltage). So I better took away any obsruction to airflow I found. Bothers me a bit, but hardly anything I can do. I'll simply trust Asus they knew what they did when they constructed that thing.

I tested the whole OC with Sandra's multicore efficiency test, didn't crash after 10 minutes, that should be enough. Okay, don't mind I never passed 40°C so I'm not worried this will be a problem even if I went at it for heavily prolonged periods.

So yeah, I'm now running well with my E4400@2.9GHz. Cheers :D

Another way to get about 2.9 ghz would be (320 mhz * 9)=2880. Using that you can get a 4:5 ratio (or 2.5x depending on the motherboard) for 400 mhz (DDR2-800) memory frequency.
 
FoxSpirit said:
Is it really necessary to do that for 4 hours?
And why should auto be bad, that's the default setting of this mobo?

Yes, it really is, do you really want to run the risk of losing your work at any moment? You don't have to do anything just leave OCCT running overnight or in the background.

The auto setting is there for people sticking at stock clocks. If you OC, it can often be very liberal with the way it scales voltage with clock speed, which can end in you pumping far too much voltage through your chip which is bad for its lifespan. By setting it yourself you are removing all variables, you might as well do your OC right, and then leave rather than having to come back to it all the time.
 

FoxSpirit

Junior Member
No good, I did 250 for 800 and no POST. I'll keep it at that.
And why is 15 minutes no good when it reaches the max temperature? (when for five minutes the temp is going up and down slightly)?
Especially when it's pretty much known you can go much farher with the E4400 and this mobo goes much higher in specs?

Oh yeah, and who to trust, OOCT or Asus own inhouse temperature readout? There's quite the gap.
 
zoku88 said:
triple channel has very limited benefits in real world applications.

Point is....

If you're running an i7, it doesn't make sense to NOT use all of the benefits of the new platform.

And like you said in your other post, really the bottleneck of the newer systems is drive speed which the Raptor and SSD's are starting to take care of.

Fox: Go download Prime95 here and run it for 1hr-4hrs and see if it freezes your computer or gives a BSOD.
 

zoku88

Member
VictimOfGrief said:
Point is....

If you're running an i7, it doesn't make sense to NOT use all of the benefits of the new platform..
That's silly if it actually sacrifices performance, like, in the case of using 3GB instead of 4GB.
 

Esperado

Member

FoxSpirit

Junior Member
Umm, brain_stew, when I want to check my CPU temps, what is my best bet? Many programs, many different readout... RealTemp, CoreTemp, TaT, Asus Probe... it's very inconsistent, and I don't wanna find out once my CPU dies an early death -.-

edit: if I get this, this means the CPU's overheating self protection has kicked in(specified by intel as 61.5°C), right?? -.-

118q0ba.png
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
zoku88 said:
That's silly if it actually sacrifices performance, like, in the case of using 3GB instead of 4GB.
No game uses over 3GB right now. [H] even uses test systems in 2GB because their gameplay walkthroughs never go above 2GB.

Post 16.
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1382738
Gully State said:
What kind of % performance gains can you expect from an overclock for gaming in general?

Sorry I realize this is a vague question.
Which processor are you going to overclock?

Check this graph for example:
1225698242I6VvskAKIu_3_1.gif
 
Foxspirit, try to bring those temps down!! Too hot.

Do you have an after market cooler? What kind of thermal paste did you use? Is it properly seated?

Also, using Orthos is for stability. Your CPU can be in the 50's Celcius on load, but if the PC isnt stable it will fail orthos or give you a BSOD. Reason you want to keep your CPU temps low is to keep it alive much longer. It is good to make sure you use an after market cooler, and use a good brand of thermal paste for overclocking.

Goodluck!
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
Gully State said:
I'm planning on overclocking the E8400
I was able to find these benchmarks. Your CPU already runs at 3.0GHz, so you will need to raise it beyond 3.6GHz to experience any difference.
 
Zyzyxxz said:
PC gaming seems to hit a graphics dead end now.

With the fact that CPU's are insanely fast and we can run Crysis well on many cards.

I don't really see PC gaming going too far ahead since these days it seems many PC games are just ports from the consoles.

did you not see that thread that listed all the PC games for 2009?? seriously, get informed on this. you will thank yourself and wet your pants at the amount of great stuff coming out this year. PC tech is always changing, always ahead.
 

vpance

Member
Tell me if this is normal. I've set the vcore to 1.275 in the bios, but when I check it in cpuz or any other program it shows like 1.22. Then when it's under load it drops to 1.2. It seems so far off. Mobo is an EP45-UD3R with a Q9400.

Set at 1.275v I can get 3.5ghz stable I think. Well for 10 minutes so far.
 

Yazus

Member
Guys, make my PC ready for next-gen.

I would like to change 2GB ram into 4GB, and change the old 8400GS to at least a 9500GT.
Is there any video card with the same power as a 9500/9800, but that cost less and have nearly the same high compatibility?

Also, I wanted to overclock my E4500 Dual Core 2 but I found out that my PC, being a pre-made, couldn't be overclocked.

Dammit....
 

Yazus

Member
Bumblebeetuna said:
Looking to buy a new monitor for use with the 360, PS3 and PC. Would either of these be good? I'm clueless about the quality of monitors.


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16824009157

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16824236051


I have an Acer x193w, 19" 1440x900 Widescreen 2ms refresh rate, and it's great. I played a lot of PC, 360 and films on it and I have to say its great really.

If you don't want to go for a 19", go for 21.6", and really go for Acer, AFAK their monitors are great.

Edit, in the one you listed, If you want to play in HD, my bet is
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824009157
 

Ysiadmihi

Banned
Does anyone who plays Company of Heroes have problems scrolling with Vista or Windows 7? My framerate is fine, but when I scroll or am placing a building my controls become very laggy. At first I thought DX10 was the problem, but it does it under DX9 too. I really want to play the game under DX10 but it's almost impossible on Vista :(
 

dionysus

Yaldog
evil solrac v3.0 said:
did you not see that thread that listed all the PC games for 2009?? seriously, get informed on this. you will thank yourself and wet your pants at the amount of great stuff coming out this year. PC tech is always changing, always ahead.

PC is unsearchable, so is 2009. Could you point me in the right direction for that thread?

edit. Found it at:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=347320&page=6&highlight=2009

Not as good as the 2008 thread that had pictures and descriptions of every game in the OP. If one doesn't exist by Feb. 11th, when I get back home, I will put one together.
 

markot

Banned
How upgradeable will the i7 motherboards be?

Im thinking that I may as well upgrade with the i7 920, but I want it to last awhile and be upgradeable...
 
Labombadog said:
Foxspirit, try to bring those temps down!! Too hot.

Do you have an after market cooler? What kind of thermal paste did you use? Is it properly seated?

Also, using Orthos is for stability. Your CPU can be in the 50's Celcius on load, but if the PC isnt stable it will fail orthos or give you a BSOD. Reason you want to keep your CPU temps low is to keep it alive much longer. It is good to make sure you use an after market cooler, and use a good brand of thermal paste for overclocking.

Goodluck!

Orthos isn't the best stability test, really. OCCT and Intel Burn Test will tax it much more. I'd imagine the reason for those high temps is down to the auto voltage setting. Crank that down manually and you should be alright.

Since its a 65nm Core 2, you want to use RealTemp for temps.


vpance said:
Tell me if this is normal. I've set the vcore to 1.275 in the bios, but when I check it in cpuz or any other program it shows like 1.22. Then when it's under load it drops to 1.2. It seems so far off. Mobo is an EP45-UD3R with a Q9400.

Set at 1.275v I can get 3.5ghz stable I think. Well for 10 minutes so far.

Its called Vdroop, and yes, its normal, happens on every motherboard. Its a safety feature so that voltage spikes under load don't damage your CPU.


Yazus said:
Guys, make my PC ready for next-gen.

I would like to change 2GB ram into 4GB, and change the old 8400GS to at least a 9500GT.
Is there any video card with the same power as a 9500/9800, but that cost less and have nearly the same high compatibility?

Also, I wanted to overclock my E4500 Dual Core 2 but I found out that my PC, being a pre-made, couldn't be overclocked.

Dammit....

Look a few posts back, a 4830 for $80. Ridiculous value right there, it'll outperform even a 9800GT, and be at least 4x as fast as the (crappy) 9500GT you were considering. Have you got two spare slots for RAM? Any branded DDR2 800 should be good, get 2x2GB if you haven't the free slots, I'd recommend the G Skill stuff on Newegg.

Could you post the model number of your motherboard, or model of the pre built PC. It might be worth throwing in a cheap E7300 or something in their if it can take a 45nm Core 2 since you can't OC.
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
markot said:
How upgradeable will the i7 motherboards be?

Im thinking that I may as well upgrade with the i7 920, but I want it to last awhile and be upgradeable...
At this point they are the most upgradeable platform you can get.
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
markot said:
Hm, also, any ideas when Intel will release more versions and we will see more compatible MBs?
Well, at this point we are talking about the x58 chip. We won't see a better chip until next year or december of this year at the earliest. Intel will release the Core i5 this year, but those will be more affordable than the Core i7 and also slower. On 2010 we will see the successor to Nehalem Westmere which has 6 or more cores and it will be faster per clock.
More info here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nehalem_(microarchitecture)

IMO the motherboards will not get better until next year when the next chip is released, they will only get cheaper.
 
godhandiscen said:
Well, at this point we are talking about the x58 chip. We won't see a better chip until next year or december of this year at the earliest. Intel will release the Core i5 this year, but those will be more affordable than the Core i7 and also slower. On 2010 we will see the successor to Nehalem Westmere which has 6 or more cores and it will be faster per clock.
More info here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nehalem_(microarchitecture)

IMO the motherboards will not get better until next year when the next chip is released, they will only get cheaper.

I think that's when I'll be making the jump, should be affordable motherboards by then, power draw should come down with the shrink and DDR3 won't be as pricey either. Well, either that or I'll jump to Core i5 and OC if the 6 core versions lands on that socket.
 

godhandiscen

There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
brain_stew said:
I think that's when I'll be making the jump, should be affordable motherboards by then, power draw should come down with the shrink and DDR3 won't be as pricey either. Well, either that or I'll jump to Core i5 and OC if the 6 core versions lands on that socket.
I think your first plan is the best. Core i5 doesn't have triple channel, and your current specs can carry you all this year. Core i5 is a different socket btw. Core i7 uses the same socket as Westmere.
 

Yazus

Member
brain_stew said:
Look a few posts back, a 4830 for $80. Ridiculous value right there, it'll outperform even a 9800GT, and be at least 4x as fast as the (crappy) 9500GT you were considering. Have you got two spare slots for RAM? Any branded DDR2 800 should be good, get 2x2GB if you haven't the free slots, I'd recommend the G Skill stuff on Newegg.

Could you post the model number of your motherboard, or model of the pre built PC. It might be worth throwing in a cheap E7300 or something in their if it can take a 45nm Core 2 since you can't OC.

My PC is a Fujitsu Siemens ScaleoP

My Motherboard is Intel G31
I dont know anything about OCing, or even changing processor, I only changed the ram in my old PC. :lol

Also, I'm buying the 4830, thanks.
 
godhandiscen said:
I think your first plan is the best. Core i5 doesn't have triple channel, and your current specs can carry you all this year. Core i5 is a different socket btw. Core i7 uses the same socket as Westmere.

Oh, yeah I'm aware of all that, still I'm a sucker for a bargain and if there's a chance of cheap 6-core witha load of OCing then I'm up for the challenge. :D

Really interested to see when the "P55" or whatever its going to be called will hit, the price of the motherboard is the thing that really turns me away from i7 atm. Still, like you say, my current rig is enough to tide me over till Westmere, so I might as well just do one big upgrade then.
 

bee

Member
vpance said:
Tell me if this is normal. I've set the vcore to 1.275 in the bios, but when I check it in cpuz or any other program it shows like 1.22. Then when it's under load it drops to 1.2. It seems so far off. Mobo is an EP45-UD3R with a Q9400.

Set at 1.275v I can get 3.5ghz stable I think. Well for 10 minutes so far.

look for "load line calibration" in the bios and enable it
 
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