Official NFL off-season/Draft thread: party like its 1980! (niners #1 pick time!)

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dtrip said:
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Agent: Vikings trade Moss to Raiders

By SEAN JENSEN
Pioneer Press

The Vikings have agreed to trade Randy Moss to the Oakland Raiders for starting linebacker Napoleon Harris, the seventh overall pick in the upcoming draft and a 2005 late-round pick . Trades can be worked out although not announced until next month, and Moss' agent, Dante DiTrapano, told the Pioneer Press on Wednesday that the deal is done.

"Nothing is official until March 2," DiTrapano said. "But don’t be surprised if Randy Moss is wearing the Silver and Black this upcoming season."

Vikings vice president of football operations Rob Brzezinski would only say, "We've had some discussions with them (the Raiders), but there is nothing to announce."

Despite repeated denials, the Vikings have been shopping Moss for months, and they found a willing suitor in Al Davis, a maverick owner who embraces controversial players.

"In speaking with Moss, although he has a lot of ties to Minnesota and did not particularly want to be traded, he’s very excited with the possibility of playing for Al Davis and being a part of the Raider tradition," DiTrapano said. "The Raiders have vowed to use Randy’s talents the way they should be used, and that’s to throw the ball vertically down the field.

"Randy’s desire to win a Super Bowl is enhanced with a move to a team like the Raiders, because the Minnesota Vikings seem to be in a constant rebuilding mode."

The Vikings will wind up with the seventh overall pick for the third time in the last four years. In 2002, they drafted left tackle Bryant McKinnie, a starter. Two years ago, they had the seventh pick but a botched trade with Baltimore resulted in them picking two spots later. Still, they landed the player
they coveted, defensive tackle Kevin Williams, who has emerged into a Pro Bowl player.

The Vikings have the 18th pick in this year’s draft.

With the departure of Moss, the Vikings' top receiver is third-year receiver Nate Burleson. But the Vikings are expected to bolster that group via the draft or free agency. With a weak free agent class headlined by Pittsburgh's Plaxico Burress, the Vikings’ options could increase with potential salary cap casualties such as Isaac Bruce, Muhsin Muhammad and Derrick Mason.

The NFL Draft in April also offers two promising players, Michigan's Braylon Edwards and Southern Cal's Mike Williams.

Harris was selected by the Raiders with the 23rd pick in the 2002 NFL Draft, and he has recorded 249 tackles, 2.5 sacks, three forced fumbles, and five passes defended over the past three seasons. He is 6-foot-2, 255 pounds, and he can play inside and outside.

The Raiders will assume Moss’ $7.25 million base salary for next season while the Vikings realize a cap savings of nearly $2 million. Four seasons remain on Moss’ eight-year $75 million contract.

Sean Jensen covers the Vikings and the NFL. He can be reached at sjensen@pioneerpress.com.
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WOW this is fucking big. I'm not going to say Oakland gave up too much until I see who else they pick up in the off season. If they get scrubs then I would say they would have been better off trying to trade up or using the trades to get what they need. Moss is good, but not that good, considering all the good WRs that are rumored to be or actually are out there, ie. Muhommad and Coles.
 
Slo said:
May every touchdown he scores shut down a vital organ!
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Yes, for Red McCombs!

"OH, MY BLEEDIN' HEART!"


EDIT: BIG LOL for the Postons

No rookie representation (according to DM and FMT in a late #ga session) and their top two players are tagged again. SUCK IT DOWN.
 
The Raiders got ripped...?

If the Vikes get lucky with a great two picks from Oakland, it'll be an almost even trade, as it is, the Raiders got the better end of this deal by far. Moss single handedly changes the way the defense plays. Harris...? Yeah just get the scrub fullback to block him.
 
Well, the only way this is a good thing for the Vikes is if Randy wanted out, and would have been a malcontent all season. But that wasn't the case. :-\

One defensive starter isn't going to turn our horrendous defense around, we need much more help than that. For the last 10+ years that only thing that's let us win games is our explosive offense, and we just traded the explosive part away. :( Culpepper is a franchise QB, and we have good set of tailbacks, but we don't have a TE or a #1 receiver. Burleson is never going to be the guy. I can only hope that we hit the jackpot with that #7 pick.
 
Slo said:
Well, the only way this is a good thing for the Vikes is if Randy wanted out, and would have been a malcontent all season. But that wasn't the case. :-\

One defensive starter isn't going to turn our horrendous defense around, we need much more help than that. For the last 10+ years that only thing that's let us win games is our explosive offense, and we just traded the explosive part away. :( Culpepper is a franchise QB, and we have good set of tailbacks, but we don't have a TE or a #1 receiver. Burleson is never going to be the guy. I can only hope that we hit the jackpot with that #7 pick.
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I think Mike Williams will be the guy.
 
Bowser said:
I think Mike Williams will be the guy.
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That's who I wanted to Raiders to pick up, although there is still NO RB on that team. I laughed and cried when Moss' agent called the Raiders Super Bowl contenders. Even as a die-hard Raider fan, I know this isn't the case, haha.
 
WasabiKing said:
That's who I wanted to Raiders to pick up, although there is still NO RB on that team. I laughed and cried when Moss' agent called the Raiders Super Bowl contenders. Even as a die-hard Raider fan, I know this isn't the case, haha.
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u never ever know. the offense looks pretty set, gun slinging QB with 2 great WRs and a down the field type head coach. weirder things have happened.
 
Moss will fit in just fine in Oakland, all they need now is Ricky Williams and there all set to start filming. *shudders*
 
effzee said:
u never ever know. the offense looks pretty set, gun slinging QB with 2 great WRs and a down the field type head coach. weirder things have happened.
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This is true, but look at it this way:

1. Gunslinging = high risk and reward. Collins' TD/INT Ratio was under 1 when they signed him. Granted, he's better now than when he started, and he's never had a great OL to protect him. The Texans made him look god awful (happy now, MiG?), and the inconstency killed me. However, near the end, Porter and Collins were on the same wavelength, so I'm happy to see him back.

2. No defense = no win. That ass whipping against the Bucs said enough. Harris was one of the better LBs, but he was injury prone last year. Danny Clark's going to have step up, and I don't even know who the new MLB will be since they want to run 3-4 again. also, we don't know if Charles Woodson will still be a Raider, as he got franchise tagged... It would be HILARIOUS if we ended up with a pick higher than 7, but the odds of that is unlikely. Also, Philip Buchanon wants out... Maybe sending him back to Miami for a certain RB with problems with the hippy lettuce? Haha, Oakland, land of miscontent...

3. No Running game. Collins is not ready to throw 40+ attempts a game. His arm is going to fall off. Backup is a scrambler, and cannot throw deep. Screwed...

4. OL restructuring. After losing Lincoln Kennedy, we lost a great leader and a hell of a tackle. We'll see though, it's looking better.

The positives:

1. If we are going to run 3WR, a lot of teams are going to be in trouble. Moss is the #1, no doubt. But if you double him on a crossing route with the #2, Jerry Porter, lookout! Porter is a #1 to begin with, as the Broncos learned in game 2 of the series. You get him the ball, he'll catch it. The slot will be a battle between Ronald Curry and Doug Gabriel, the latter didn't materialize, but he never got the looks this year. But again, high rish and reward...

2. Using such a big pick on a RB class like this year is amazingly risky. So much potential for success OR failure. But to be honest, it probably will be better than what the Raiders have.

3. Champ Bailey to get owned again this year!
 
wow, what a horrible trade for the vikings. i still dont see why they were trying to move him instead of appreciate him like the eagles do with TO
 
i don't fucking understand why the vikes didn't get more for him. even though he's one shiesty mother fucker, there is little doubt moss is the best WR in the NFL.
i mean, everyone who bashes him(even me at times) would take him on his team in a freakin' heartbeat.

most people here forget the Raiders are my AFC team. It's always been Bears/Raiders/Colts for me. So I LOVE this move.
Really wish we had someone besides Collins though. He's simply not good enough.
But shit, with the WRs on the team, if we line up in 4 wr sets most of the time....good luck. Basically equal or slightly better than the colts passing offense, minus a Manning or James. So, basically half the Colts offense =p
But our defense is a bit better....though Woodson is overrated.

Still, I think the Vikes coulda got a lot more out of this. Two draft picks and young, young LB? Ugh.


Sportsnation:

1) Should the Vikings have traded Randy Moss?


53.3% Yes

46.7% No


2) What are the Raiders getting?


78.8% One of the best WRs in the NFL

21.2% The biggest headache in the NFL


3) Who is getting the better end of the deal?


68.7% Raiders - Randy Moss

31.3% Vikings - Napoleon Harris, No. 7 pick overall, late-round pick


4) Would you be happy if your favorite team had added Moss for a similar price?


68.0% Yes

32.0% No


5) Will the Oakland Raiders make the playoffs this season?


60.8% No

39.2% Yes


6) Which team will win a Super Bowl first?


50.1% Vikings

49.9% Raiders


7) Moss missed five games last season, but caught 111 passes for 1,632 yards and 17 TDs in 2003. Which of the following is closest to what he'll do for the Raiders?


47.3% 90-plus catches, 1,200-plus yards, 10-plus TDs

34.3% 100-plus catches, 1,500-plus yards, 15-plus TDs

14.8% 75-plus catches, 1,000-plus yards, 7-plus TDs

3.6% Less than 75 catches, 1000 yards and 7 TDs


8) If you were potential new owner Reggie Fowler, would you still be interested in buying the Vikings without Moss on the team?


66.5% Yes

33.5% No


9) Who is the best wide receiver in the NFL?


41.4% Randy Moss

35.4% Terrell Owens

20.1% Marvin Harrison

3.1% Torry Holt


10) Who benefited the most from the other?


45.9% Daunte Culpepper benefited more from Randy Moss

42.3% They benefited equally from each other

11.9% Randy Moss benefited more from Daunte Culpepper
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After the way TO came back in the superbowl there is no doubt in my mind that he is the best reciever in the nfl. He does it all and is willing to go all out for his team, unlike Moss.
 
TheDuce22 said:
After the way TO came back in the superbowl there is no doubt in my mind that he is the best reciever in the nfl. He does it all and is willing to go all out for his team, unlike Moss.
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TO's superbowl effort was beyond courageous. But he's still not as GOOD as Moss. More heart? of course. Better? Nope.
 
i have to admit both teams win in this trade as it stands now.

the raiders get:
* Possibly the most deadly WR tandem in the AFC aside from the colts (although i wouldn't call the colts a tandem, i'd call them a mob)
* Instant credibility deep
* Automatically improved running game

the vikings get:
* Good draft pick
* Cancer off the team
* They were legit w/o moss last year


good trade for both!
 
Eminem said:
TO's superbowl effort was beyond courageous. But he's still not as GOOD as Moss. More heart? of course. Better? Nope.
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That depends on how you define "good". Of course, there's no one better in the NFL at running the short fade in the red zone and catching the ball over the DB's head, but I wouldn't say that Moss runs "better" crossing routes than TO (they're both about the same in what is IMO the most important route in the NFL). Plus, TO is definitely a better downfield blocker and general player when the play is not designed to go to him. That's Moss's biggest problem - if you don't get him involved in the play he will half-ass it. That's a pretty big negative. It's also why the Raiders will be such a great fit for him - Al Davis has always loved a vertical passing game, where guys like Randy Moss can excel and be given constant opportunities to make plays.
 
TO's superbowl effort was beyond courageous. But he's still not as GOOD as Moss. More heart? of course. Better? Nope.
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Moss a deep threat but TO is a threat any time he touches the ball. Nobody can tell me that Moss does more for his team than TO does.
 
FrenchMovieTheme said:
i have to admit both teams win in this trade as it stands now.

the raiders get:
* Possibly the most deadly WR tandem in the AFC aside from the colts (although i wouldn't call the colts a tandem, i'd call them a mob)
* Instant credibility deep
* Automatically improved running game

the vikings get:
* Good draft pick
* Cancer off the team
* They were legit w/o moss last year


good trade for both!
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So is Napolean Harris a bum, or what? He sounds like a bust.
 
marshall faulk redid his contract (2/$6M)
Pace may be signing soon
Rams looking to sign fred miller (RT cut by tenn)
Pisa tinoisamoa moved to SS.

Looking pretty good so far. If we can sign a big name FA MLB, and draft a good WLB, and get a FS somewhere, we're gonna be dangerous next year. The offense is set, if we get fred miller, then we can draft and sign defense the rest of the way.
 
I wouldn't give up Tiki for Moss, maybe Osi Umenyiora (AKA Michael Strahan Jr.).

Damn we should have done that! C'mon other Wellington!
 
People comparing TO to Moss need to chill out. Moss is faster and will get a jump ball better. He's got the better hands and runs the better routes (yes, the only reason he doesn't get even more yardage is b/c he attracts half the secondary). He's also just as explosive after the catch as TO. People sometimes forget Moss can run with the ball quite well. It's just that he doesn't normally have to. The only thing TO is better at is blocking. If given the choice, I'd take Moss 10 times out of 10. TO is awesome, but Moss is clearly awesomer.

Anyway, the Vikes got shat on with this trade. Good grab for the Raiders. But as mentioned, that's a nowhere team. Moss isn't exactly going to a contender now. :( Personally, I'd have killed for the Falcons to have grabbed Moss. If I was them, I'd give up Brookings and Price for Moss alone. Moss and Vick would just trample the NFC next season. And a deep threat like Moss would do even more for their running game. Imagine the lanes it would open up for Vick. Oh well, this trade came out of the blue IMO, and looks like Raiders got a real scoop.

Oh yeah, in other news, Jay Fiedler is GONE!!!! Woooo! Let the celebration begin. :D Now, if we can just do something about Feeley next, it'll all be taken care of. PEACE.
 
Pimpwerx said:
Oh yeah, in other news, Jay Fiedler is GONE!!!! Woooo! Let the celebration begin. :D Now, if we can just do something about Feeley next, it'll all be taken care of. PEACE.
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:lol!!! The 'phins should jump on Jeff Garcia. Between Chris Chambers, Marty Booker, and Randy McMichael, that passing game could be fuckin' serious. Minor/Gordon are alright at RB, but they could definitely upgrade with a good draft choice. This crop of rookies is looking really good. I like the entire AFC East, let alone the 'phins. I hope they can turn it around. I feel they have the talent but were still abysmal last season.

I just got off the phone with Tom Coughlin. We talked about a wide variety of things relating to the Giants. First, he said that the organization is still trying to figure out what they want to do with wide receiver Ike Hilliard and strong safety Shaun Williams. Problem with Williams is that Gibril Wilson, a rookie last year, filled in so well that he will be considered for the starting job. Williams is a better tackler, but Wilson seems to have better on-field instincts, tied for the team lead in interceptions and even missed most of the last half of the season. Which speaks volumes. Hilliard is now a free agent, and the Giants organization is trying to go after a big name receiver, so cutting his salary out seems possible! Also mentioned that Barrett Green, Michael Strahan, Gibril Wilson, and Shaun O'Hara are recovering well from their injuries. He said to me that they are still happy with the trade for Eli, even if they don't get a first round draft pick, and that they are looking to stick Luke Petitgout at LT and David Diehl at RT. You heard it here first ladies!
 
soulja224466 said:
marshall faulk redid his contract (2/$6M)
Pace may be signing soon
Rams looking to sign fred miller (RT cut by tenn)
Pisa tinoisamoa moved to SS.

Looking pretty good so far. If we can sign a big name FA MLB, and draft a good WLB, and get a FS somewhere, we're gonna be dangerous next year. The offense is set, if we get fred miller, then we can draft and sign defense the rest of the way.
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as long as Mrs. Doubtfire is coaching that team, you're never gonna be "dangerous".
 
i heard about that trade piston. i have to ask what the F because those two receivers are basically identical. the only difference being that moss returns punts, but other than that both are average to (possibly) slightly above average at best. the deal doesn't make a lot of sense for the jets because they're going to have to eat that ridiculous contract that coles has, but oh well!

Daniel Snyder: I didn't get rich by writing checks friends!
 
FrenchMovieTheme said:
i heard about that trade piston. i have to ask what the F because those two receivers are basically identical. the only difference being that moss returns punts, but other than that both are average to (possibly) slightly above average at best. the deal doesn't make a lot of sense for the jets because they're going to have to eat that ridiculous contract that coles has, but oh well!

Daniel Snyder: I didn't get rich by writing checks friends!
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im assuming Moss will come cheaper cause the Redskins want to help clear some capspace.
 
it might work for the skins cause moss is a FA no after this coming season?


anyway the eagles might be eyeing givens....i hope they pursue MM first.
 
effzee said:
it might work for the skins cause moss is a FA no after this coming season?


anyway the eagles might be eyeing givens....i hope they pursue MM first.
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well the talk was that the deal would only be done if the Redskins could agree to an extension with Moss, but it'll probably be for something cheaper than what Coles was making. I wonder if this means we'd keep Gardner, though. I still hope we take a reciever (Williams or Edwards) with our draft pick though.
 
well now that i think about it coles IS better off on the jets. mccaerins has already proven himself to be a legit #1 receiver on that squad, so coles would be a nice addition. it's not like coles hasn't produced at all, it's just he hasn't made much of an impact (i.e. teams dont fear him nor do they gameplan for him)
 
The mention of the Bears picking up Warner even as a backup makes me sick. We have better pick up either Mushin or even better, Plaxico.
 
yodathesoda said:
The mention of the Bears picking up Warner even as a backup makes me sick. We have better pick up either Mushin or even better, Plaxico.
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last i hear llovie wasn't too fond of warner. hope that stays true. get a decent backup, yeah. but not warner.
if grossman goes out again, i think he may be one of those guys that is injured all the time and we need a new plan all over(FUCK)

But i refuse to believe that.
 
Eminem said:
last i hear llovie wasn't too fond of warner. hope that stays true. get a decent backup, yeah. but not warner.
if grossman goes out again, i think he may be one of those guys that is injured all the time and we need a new plan all over(FUCK)

But i refuse to believe that.
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Agreed, although I do believe Hutchinson has a small small chance of becoming a decent replacement. Whats the deal with us supposedly taking a RB with the 4th pick? I thought Lovie was big on T Jones? I'd much rather have some more WR help or an O lineman,
 
Ninja Scooter said:
as long as Mrs. Doubtfire is coaching that team, you're never gonna be "dangerous".
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What makes you think that? What other offense put up 500 points three years in a row, and a 450 point season in 2003. If the defense improves to even average, the rams will be dangerous again.
 
soulja224466 said:
What makes you think that? What other offense put up 500 points three years in a row, and a 450 point season in 2003. If the defense improves to even average, the rams will be dangerous again.
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Because you have the worst coach this side of Bill Callahan who makes the most genius calls come playoff time. As long as you have Mike MArtz as your head coach, you are going NOWHERE.

EDIT: Any team with the $1-#6 pick want to give it up for an All-Pro CB? THanks a lot, Postons, you fucks!
 
Eminem said:
definitely. we need WRs bad. I'm through with Mr. Michigan David "I talk shit but I can't catch" Terrell
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Well, be happy now:

INDIANAPOLIS -- For wide receiver Muhsin Muhammad, released Friday afternoon by the Carolina Panthers, the stay in the NFL unemployment line was a brief one.

Less than 12 hours after the Panthers terminated Muhammad's contract, rather than pay him a $10 million roster bonus, the veteran wide receiver and the Chicago Bears reached an agreement in principle on a multi-year deal, ESPN.com has learned. There remains some work to be done on contract language and distribution of funds, sources said, but the two sides are in accord on all key parameters of the deal.

Because some details remain, specifics of the contract were not yet available. But it is assumed that Muhammad will receive in the area of $10 million in total guarantees and will earn an average of between $5 million-$6 million in the first three seasons.

The agreement came in the early hours of Saturday morning, around 3 a.m, after a long night of negotiations between agent Joel Segal and Bears officials. The Bears were one of the first teams to contact Segal when his client's availability became official on Friday. Several other franchises checked in with Segal as well but Chicago, which has made the upgrade of its wide receiver corps and offseason priority, moved very aggressively to close a deal.

There has been plenty of speculation here, where teams have gathered for the annual combine workouts, that the Bears would address their wide receiver need in the draft, perhaps by choosing University of Michigan star Braylon Edwards with the fourth pick in the first round. How the acquisition of Muhammad affects the Bears' draft plans remains to be seen.

Adding the nine-year veteran Muhammad provides young quarterback Rex Grossman, who will go to training camp as the starter, a proven and dependable target.

Chicago wide receivers combined for just 111 catches, 1,561 yards and three touchdowns in 2004. The leading wideout, David Terrell, posted 42 receptions for 699 yards and one touchdown. The consensus, even before the Muhammad deal, was that Terrell, a first-round choice in the 2001 draft, would be cut in the offseason.

A former Michigan State standout, Muhammad, 31, is coming off the finest all-around season of his career. He registered 93 catches for 1,405 yards and 16 touchdowns, and was on the NFC Pro Bowl squad. Most impressive about Muhammad's 2004 performance was that it came without fellow receiver Steve Smith on the field.

Smith suffered a season-ending broken leg in the first game of the year, taking away the Panthers' premier deep-ball threat. But despite facing weekly double-team coverage in Smith's absence, Muhammad flourished and he led the NFL in receiving yards.

For his career, Muhammad has 578 receptions for 7,751 yards and 44 touchdowns. He has five seasons of 60-plus catches and three years with 1,000 or more receiving yards. Muhammad, who will turn 32 in May, appeared in 125 games, and started in 113 of them.

Carolina on Friday made the difficult decision to terminate Muhammad's contract because it simply was prohibitive for the Panthers. With the $10 million roster bonus, a base salary of $650,000 and some prorated charges, Muhammad carried a salary cap charge of $12.5 million for 2005.
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According to ESPN and Newsday, the Giants and Rams have put out feelers for a possible trade of Orlando Pace.

INDIANAPOLIS - The Giants have a need to upgrade at left tackle. The Rams are tired of slapping a franchise tag on left tackle Orlando Pace. Could both teams help one another out? It's possible.

The teams have held preliminary discussions about a swap for Pace, one of the league's premier left tackles since being drafted with the first overall pick in 1997. Although a deal does not appear imminent, the fact that both teams are talking about Pace is intriguing.

Giants general manager Ernie Accorsi declined comment. Rams coach Mike Martz was unavailable for comment.

Giants coach Tom Coughlin said Thursday he planned to go into the season with Luke Petitgout as his left tackle and keep David Diehl at right tackle. But there has been some talk of moving Diehl to guard, where he played as a rookie in 2003, and move Petitgout to right tackle.

If the Rams were to trade for Petitgout, it would signal the Giants were reasonably comfortable with keeping Diehl at right tackle. There is also the possibility of signing a free-agent tackle, although there are slim pickings on the open market.

Another potential player to use as trade bait is cornerback Will Allen, who is going into the final year of his contract and is set to make $2.275 million.
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It would be an interesting move for both teams. Though at the moment Pace isn't signed and doesn't have an agent.

The Giants are also interested in bringing in Jay Fiedler as backup and mentor to Eli Manning. It seems like every team in the league wants Fiedler as their backup but he actually played for Coughlin in Jacksonville so that might improve the Giants chances... though I'm not sure that'd be a good thing.
 
Just remembered that the Panthers are going to face the Bears @ Chicago this coming season. It's gonna be weird seeing Muhammad not wearing the traditional black-and-blue road uniform :(
 
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