FrenchMovieTheme
Member
i went to amazon to see if pisces was up for pre-order yet.... says its $43.99. wtf?
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Official Smashing Pumpkins thread
- Thread starter Diablos
- Start date
Deified Data
Banned
Machina is god-tier. Nostelgia be damned. My 3 favorites are Adore, Machina, and Oceania in no particular order.
Machina is pretty amazing, and honestly I don't think Ive ever really heard another album with even close to a similar feel and sound. The music evokes a certain "mythical" feeling.
Sacred and Profane and Wound are probably two of my favorites on the album, especially Wound, love the lyrics on that one.
Sacred and Profane and Wound are probably two of my favorites on the album, especially Wound, love the lyrics on that one.
MadOdorMachine
No additional functions
Amazon is selling Oceania for $4.99 if anyone's looking for a bargain.
Edit - It's hard to believe you can buy whole albums so cheaply now. I remember spending about that much on singles back in the 90's.
One thing BC is still really good at arranging songs.
Edit - It's hard to believe you can buy whole albums so cheaply now. I remember spending about that much on singles back in the 90's.
One thing BC is still really good at arranging songs.
MadOdorMachine
No additional functions
I'm officially hooked on this. After listening to it last week on iTunes I decided to buy the album especially since it was so cheap at Amazon. $4.99 is a hell of a deal on this. So here are my thoughts on it after listening to it for a bit.
This is in my opinion the best Smashing Pumpkins album since Mellon Collie. That's coming from someone who very much prefers the Pumpkins pre-Mellon Collie. I'm not going to dive off too deep in that other than to say that this is the best Billy's vocals have sounded in quite some time. From a production standpoint, it's also better than anything other Zwan and Adore since Pisces Iscariot. Everything is clear and level. Guitar overdubs galore, bass and drums have punch and vocals and keyboards all stand out thru the entire thing. Now on for the songs. I'll start with my favorites.
Panopticon - Holy shit, this is old school Pumpkins. They're back! That was the first reaction to me hearing this song. It has a great melody and a bass line and chorus that hooks you in and keeps you reeling, but won't let go. The song finishes off in a grand finale of Billy singing that reminds me a lot of "Muzzle." Everything in this song is great. I wish it would last longer.
The Chimera - If "Frail and Bedazzled" had a twin this would be it. It's so nice to hear happy, poppy, rockin Pumpkins again. This song is a time machine that takes me back to my high school years. When I turn on the song, I want to fire up joint the size of bus and dance for joy in public without a lick of care for what anyone thinks. It's littered with powerful riffs and classic Pumpkin overdubs that I really missed. If you liked the Pumpkins at all in the '90's you'll like this song.
Violet Rays - Is this the soundtrack to a movie? Am I in a dream? I don't know how to quite describe this song other to say it will put you in a trance. It's like driving down a tunnel. The 3/3 timing is odd and enchanting...The way the song itself is structured itself is a testament to Billy's song writing capabilities. He also performs surprisingly well vocally for such a slow ballad.
Pinwheels - This simple song starts slowly and builds up at just the right spots to keep you mesmerized. You'll probably find yourself asking to yourself, "WTF just happened. Did I just hooked on another song? Yes. Yes I did." The girl singing back-up vocals reminds me of something from Gish, but the music reminds of something that could have been on Mellon Collie. It's also new at the same time. You will say "Wow."
Basically, if you're a fan of the Pumpkins there's no reason this album shouldn't be in your collection. If you were a fan, but fell out, check it out anyway. For $4.99 you probably won't regret your purchase. If you found yourself questioning if the new lineup was as good as the original, I would have to say nothing will ever be that good, but this is still really good. I did find it funny they have a girl bass player and Asian guitar player again. Not sure if this was done on purpose or not but they had big shoes to fill and have done something really impressive for their debut. Anyway, I found myself liking the first song enough to continue listening. I fell in love with the second song "Panopticon" and kept going. By the time I got to "The Chimera" there were enough songs that interested me to want to keep going back. All in all, it's an album that almost every song has given me enjoyment and has come to grow on me. I think it was some trickery on Billy's part for designing the track listing in that order. Well played Billy, well played.
This is in my opinion the best Smashing Pumpkins album since Mellon Collie. That's coming from someone who very much prefers the Pumpkins pre-Mellon Collie. I'm not going to dive off too deep in that other than to say that this is the best Billy's vocals have sounded in quite some time. From a production standpoint, it's also better than anything other Zwan and Adore since Pisces Iscariot. Everything is clear and level. Guitar overdubs galore, bass and drums have punch and vocals and keyboards all stand out thru the entire thing. Now on for the songs. I'll start with my favorites.
Panopticon - Holy shit, this is old school Pumpkins. They're back! That was the first reaction to me hearing this song. It has a great melody and a bass line and chorus that hooks you in and keeps you reeling, but won't let go. The song finishes off in a grand finale of Billy singing that reminds me a lot of "Muzzle." Everything in this song is great. I wish it would last longer.
The Chimera - If "Frail and Bedazzled" had a twin this would be it. It's so nice to hear happy, poppy, rockin Pumpkins again. This song is a time machine that takes me back to my high school years. When I turn on the song, I want to fire up joint the size of bus and dance for joy in public without a lick of care for what anyone thinks. It's littered with powerful riffs and classic Pumpkin overdubs that I really missed. If you liked the Pumpkins at all in the '90's you'll like this song.
Violet Rays - Is this the soundtrack to a movie? Am I in a dream? I don't know how to quite describe this song other to say it will put you in a trance. It's like driving down a tunnel. The 3/3 timing is odd and enchanting...The way the song itself is structured itself is a testament to Billy's song writing capabilities. He also performs surprisingly well vocally for such a slow ballad.
Pinwheels - This simple song starts slowly and builds up at just the right spots to keep you mesmerized. You'll probably find yourself asking to yourself, "WTF just happened. Did I just hooked on another song? Yes. Yes I did." The girl singing back-up vocals reminds me of something from Gish, but the music reminds of something that could have been on Mellon Collie. It's also new at the same time. You will say "Wow."
Basically, if you're a fan of the Pumpkins there's no reason this album shouldn't be in your collection. If you were a fan, but fell out, check it out anyway. For $4.99 you probably won't regret your purchase. If you found yourself questioning if the new lineup was as good as the original, I would have to say nothing will ever be that good, but this is still really good. I did find it funny they have a girl bass player and Asian guitar player again. Not sure if this was done on purpose or not but they had big shoes to fill and have done something really impressive for their debut. Anyway, I found myself liking the first song enough to continue listening. I fell in love with the second song "Panopticon" and kept going. By the time I got to "The Chimera" there were enough songs that interested me to want to keep going back. All in all, it's an album that almost every song has given me enjoyment and has come to grow on me. I think it was some trickery on Billy's part for designing the track listing in that order. Well played Billy, well played.
Deified Data
Banned
Oceania is supposed to relate the "Fool's Journey" from the tarot. Whether Billy sticks true to that concept or not I don't know.
I like Oceania -- I really do -- and to each their own, but man, saying this tops Mellon Collie (B-sides or no) or Adore to me is quite something.
That said, few things will ever top MCIS in my book, partly because of the time and memories associate with that period, and partly because of the sheer range and depth of those tracks.
That said, few things will ever top MCIS in my book, partly because of the time and memories associate with that period, and partly because of the sheer range and depth of those tracks.
I think the previous Teargarden stuff works more like a collection of demos that led to Oceania at this point, and I don't think Billy would disagree.
I think the concept of releasing all the songs on their own is completely dead, and the remaining songs will be released in further albums (2 more), aka a thematic string running through them all.
edit: Oceania is definitely nowhere near those 2 albums. MCIS is a monster of an album, and I feel quite confident in saying there has not been anything else like it since it came out in 1995. Despite feeling Siamese is the better album, I think MCIS probably is Billy's masterwork, if that makes sense. As for Adore, the quality of the songs and lyrics are magnitudes above Oceania. Stuff like Blank Page can't be touched...
I think the concept of releasing all the songs on their own is completely dead, and the remaining songs will be released in further albums (2 more), aka a thematic string running through them all.
edit: Oceania is definitely nowhere near those 2 albums. MCIS is a monster of an album, and I feel quite confident in saying there has not been anything else like it since it came out in 1995. Despite feeling Siamese is the better album, I think MCIS probably is Billy's masterwork, if that makes sense. As for Adore, the quality of the songs and lyrics are magnitudes above Oceania. Stuff like Blank Page can't be touched...
Oceania is alright. Much more excited for the reissues at this point then any other new SP material though.
Hearing Machina 2 in good quality will be fantastic, and it might have the then final Metro show on DVD. Also interested in the Adore B-Sides and what they could do with Mellon Collie, after the Aeroplane Flies High chronicled a lot of the stuff from around that era
Hearing Machina 2 in good quality will be fantastic, and it might have the then final Metro show on DVD. Also interested in the Adore B-Sides and what they could do with Mellon Collie, after the Aeroplane Flies High chronicled a lot of the stuff from around that era
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
i'm actually excited for everything pumpkins. as much as i'm looking forward to the re-issues i am very hopeful for the direction of the band. i don't think oceania can stand up to adore, let alone MCIS/SD but it's a really good foundation and there is a lot of potential there
MadOdorMachine
No additional functions
Don't know if this was directed at me or not, but I was talking strictly about production of the record itself. Billy's vocals sounded terrible on a lot of songs and should have been re-recorded. Also, MCIS isn't EQ'd properly at all. It's really muddy and the clarity is missing that was present in the three albums preceding it. That's what I meant. Obviously MCIS had a lot of great songs but this one actually sounds like he was at least trying to sing better a little bit and the clarity and levels are better than they have been in awhile.
It's a trap.
PumpkinPie
Banned
Pisces Iscariot RI comes with a FUCKING CASSETTE!
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
i guess billy is broke because the PI special edition is fucking $45. gish/SD were only $25 when they came out! sucks that this scumbag knows i'll pay it for a classic remaster. i am afraid of what the MCIS/TAFH remasters will cost
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
god dammit dennis flemion of the frogs died 
http://exclaim.ca/News/dennis_flemion_of_frogs_dies_at_57
bullshit
http://exclaim.ca/News/dennis_flemion_of_frogs_dies_at_57
bullshit
Bumblebeetuna
Member
Loving Oceania.
I ordered it from Amazon for $42, but I got the free shipping so it won't arrive till next week.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B006XIFHLA/?tag=neogaf0e-20
So, the new James Iha is pretty awesome, and a lot better than Oceania I might add. I implore any SP fan to give it a listen. It's much better than his debut, too. It's very mellow but has a lot of moments that remind me of vintage SP. Gets better every time I listen.
Frankly at this rate James is now a better songwriter than Billy. Compare the trash on Oceania to this, and, yeah... night and day. Between himself, Billy, and Jimmy, he's got the best album/body of work out in the past couple years.
Currently you can only import the album but it's due out in the US soon. Not exactly sure when.
So, the new James Iha is pretty awesome, and a lot better than Oceania I might add. I implore any SP fan to give it a listen. It's much better than his debut, too. It's very mellow but has a lot of moments that remind me of vintage SP. Gets better every time I listen.
Frankly at this rate James is now a better songwriter than Billy. Compare the trash on Oceania to this, and, yeah... night and day. Between himself, Billy, and Jimmy, he's got the best album/body of work out in the past couple years.
Currently you can only import the album but it's due out in the US soon. Not exactly sure when.
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
your hate for billy is strong! you are wrong about oceania but you are right about james' solo album. its prettttay prettay good.
p.s. any impressions of the pisces remaster? amazon has the digital version for like $13
Ichabod
Banned
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
if your expectations are that oceania is as good as MCIS then you will be massively disappointed in the album
James Iha performed Mayonaise in Korea.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wf5-s2-HEgc
No, it's not a cover. After all, he is credited for writing it along with Billy.
FMT: I haven't checked out the Pisces reissue. The $45 pricetag really turned me off. I'll probably get around to just downloading the digital version at some point; the DVD included with the physical release doesn't look to be all that spectacular, and I don't really give a damn about the cassette tape.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wf5-s2-HEgc
No, it's not a cover. After all, he is credited for writing it along with Billy.
FMT: I haven't checked out the Pisces reissue. The $45 pricetag really turned me off. I'll probably get around to just downloading the digital version at some point; the DVD included with the physical release doesn't look to be all that spectacular, and I don't really give a damn about the cassette tape.
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
He changed the vocal mix for plume. Sounds shitty. Come on billy don't start George lucasing these works!
Er, yeah. I listened to some samples on Amazon, lossy as they may be, and the vocal mixes across the board seem a bit spotty. Obscured, for example. It sounds a bit cleaner I suppose, but it's different. I'm afraid to hear the whole song, because the original mix is absolutely flawless. I hope Billy didn't, as you said, "George Lucas" one of his best songs ever...
Speaking of Plume, kinda silly the Gish reissue had it too since we knew it would get a new mix for PI. Would have rather had something cool like Pale Scales. Remember the Greatest Hits DVD Gish menu? Yeah, that song. In full.
I'm almost wanting to get the $45 physical release just because it would be cool to own all of the reissues, but it's just not worth it. Especially if Amazon has everything (plus the digital booklet) except for the DVD for less than $15 and lossless.
btw, for those of you who use Apple Lossless -- please tell me it's painless to convert to FLAC?
$15 or $45... bleh. Why couldn't it just be the same price as the Gish and SD reissues? If anything, they should have cost more if you think about it... not that I care they were cheap.
There are a few grievances with the PI reissue people are noticing. Most notably is a couple of digital artifacts/glitches not present on the original release, along with Plume (I think?) using a completely different vocal take than what is on the original album. Unacceptable, considering the asking price.
Fleet_of_Foot
Member
Oh God. James Iha is terrible and watching him perform Mayonaise is terrible. Seriously, this performance is awful. It's almost like he's doing it poorly on purpose, maybe as a screw you to Billy?
I understand his album isn't out in America yet and importing is the only way right now, but linking to his album with a $35 price tag makes me roll my eyes really hard.
I understand his album isn't out in America yet and importing is the only way right now, but linking to his album with a $35 price tag makes me roll my eyes really hard.
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
yeah he just doesn't have the voice to go with this song. i don't think it's terrible but it doesn't sound too hot.
the new album ain't too shabby though
maquiladora
Member
It really is an album that grows enormously on repeat listens, maybe because of the sheer number of hooks and melodies the album is full with, once you become familiar with them it's like seeing a stereo-gram picture for the first time "Holy shit this is good".
Best since Adore for me. Adore has a special place in my heart.
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
take my money now billy
BigJonsson
Member
Just bought tickets for the Toronto stop on the Oceania tour
w00t
w00t
BigJonsson
Member
Pumpkins on Leno in a minute
Ugh, I feel dirty watching Leno
Ugh, I feel dirty watching Leno
The Leno performance was great. The guitars sound really really awesome.
I'll tip my hat and say that Billy has been really fine tuning the SP guitar sound and has it down to a science. Nicole is proving to be a better bassist than I thought. I just wish they had a better drummer. Oceania is growing on me a little, but again, the lack of a good drummer really hurts the overall scope of the album.
The MCIS reissue sounds epic.
I think I might just get the digital PI reissue for $20. The physical version is too expensive, and I'm really turned off by the 2012 Glynis mix. It starts out clean, then at the end they totally kill the vocal mix and include Billy laughing and whatnot. They basically ruined it. I'll stick to the old mix.
Back to Leno, it is pretty funny how Dunst and Corgan were on the same show since they look so alike. At the end, you could tell she was really excited to meet him and pointed at her face. He seemed to stop smiling at her after that; typical party pooper Billy. It would have been the perfect time to make a joke about it.
I'll tip my hat and say that Billy has been really fine tuning the SP guitar sound and has it down to a science. Nicole is proving to be a better bassist than I thought. I just wish they had a better drummer. Oceania is growing on me a little, but again, the lack of a good drummer really hurts the overall scope of the album.
The MCIS reissue sounds epic.
I think I might just get the digital PI reissue for $20. The physical version is too expensive, and I'm really turned off by the 2012 Glynis mix. It starts out clean, then at the end they totally kill the vocal mix and include Billy laughing and whatnot. They basically ruined it. I'll stick to the old mix.
Back to Leno, it is pretty funny how Dunst and Corgan were on the same show since they look so alike. At the end, you could tell she was really excited to meet him and pointed at her face. He seemed to stop smiling at her after that; typical party pooper Billy. It would have been the perfect time to make a joke about it.
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
i was looking for the leno performance on youtube and ran across this cover of disarm:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5PIO8X458U
one of the worst cover songs i have ever heard. what the fuck
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5PIO8X458U
one of the worst cover songs i have ever heard. what the fuck
TheDrowningMan
Member
I haven't listened to it in full, but having bought Iha's Look to the Sky, I like what I've heard. Waves is a highlight thus far, I gravitated straight to that because of Karen O's presence. Fades out too quickly though! The lyrics are trite, but that was to be expected - I can forgive that because he's not aiming for high-art, it's not as though he's written a load of bad lyrics and tried to sell them as a collection of even worse poetry or something.
I still haven't listened to Oceania and I doubt that I ever will. I can live with my musical heroes being complete dicks on a certain level, but Billy has really shredded all of the residual good-will I had. He was the icon of what were my musically formative years and I'll always be indebted to the Pumpkins, but it seems that almost every public statement he makes is precision engineered to be objectionable to me. His music, his lyrics would have to be utterly sparkling to nullify the impression of abject dickery he leaves upon me.
I still haven't listened to Oceania and I doubt that I ever will. I can live with my musical heroes being complete dicks on a certain level, but Billy has really shredded all of the residual good-will I had. He was the icon of what were my musically formative years and I'll always be indebted to the Pumpkins, but it seems that almost every public statement he makes is precision engineered to be objectionable to me. His music, his lyrics would have to be utterly sparkling to nullify the impression of abject dickery he leaves upon me.
Roland Deschain
Member
Also loving Oceania. Pale Horse is so good.
Man, the 2012 mix of Glynis is an abortion. I'm flabbergasted. I know the production of the original is quite dated, but they should have just left well enough alone, because the strength of the track on its own merits kept it afloat. They totally butchered it though with the new mix.
I will eat some of my own words and say that I do like Oceania, but I'm still really pissed that they have such an awful drummer.
And vintage SP would have never let a track like Oceania have a fade out. Oh no no. They cut it at a completely unexpected time.
I will eat some of my own words and say that I do like Oceania, but I'm still really pissed that they have such an awful drummer.
And vintage SP would have never let a track like Oceania have a fade out. Oh no no. They cut it at a completely unexpected time.
PotatoeMasher
Member
Yeah, it's rough.
thechristoph
Sir!
Wouldn't that just be the Aeroplane Flies High tracks?