Sibersk Esto
Banned
Well, Oda practically worships Dragon Ball and Toriyama so there is that.
One Piece Manga |OT| ZEHAHAHAHA! The Name of this Age is Blackbeard!
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Well, Oda practically worships Dragon Ball and Toriyama so there is that.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
Yes but Roger was not a Yonkou or anything like it, and the reason why the Yonkou are like that is because non of the can or want to reach Raftel.
What your referring to as conquering is literally just a protection racket. They don't actually hang around these areas and actually rule them just put their names up to warn off others. The closest thing shown to an actual pirate ruler is the Pirate Empress. Which is more akin to a country that ransacks nearby ships than a typical pirate since she actually lives on that island.
Lets agree to disagree
But yes I do agree, I do not mean King as in rule over the land, but protect the land in exchange for tax (candy, money, etc). I think you are looking at my meaning of PK too literally.
Neoriceisgood
Member
I much prefer OP over DBZ tho, lol..
I've not seen too much from DB itself so can't quite comment on how similar it is to OP.
Only that the fight scenes and fight build ups taking a whole episode or more, not too much as ar as I know.
As a young kid I liked DBZ, but then I realized their is no depth to the story, and everything felt tacked on as the story progressed.
DBZ isn't holding up well. It's too battle focused for a show that has sych uninspired fights. Ki blasts and people flaying on each other? Boring! Give me the creative fights of Hunter x Hunter or Kennichi any day over that.
I liked Naruto as a manga at the beginning. But the boy itself was horribly written and the power levels were rising stupidly.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
No I talking more about the supposition that a war is needed when no where n the story the this stated or implied and contradicted out right multiple times in the story by the stories own basic premise.
Your forgetting that Blackbeard exists and has been set up to be the major obstacle Luffy must face before becoming PK.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
One Piece humor is essentially the same as early Dragonball and Dr Slump. Big reactions, bug eyes and slack jaws, with characters frequently commenting on how ridiculous the current situation is. And it's no secret that Luffy serves essentially the same purpose in the plot as Goku did, only the story is heftier.
i think luffy will be considered the pirate king after he takes down the world government with the help of the people around the world. i'm not sure people will know when he finds one piece because at that point he will be lost at raftel and when he emerges it might end up with him fighting the world government. we don't know yet how it will lead to him declaring war on the world government. i'm not even sure if luffy will even be alive when the people around the world will end up saying luffy was the pirate king.
Yeah I definitely have no qualms about including Dragon Ball and One Piece in the same category, up to a point.
But DBZ shifted its focus almost ENTIRELY to the fighting aspect, and lost a lot of its humor, and basically dropped all elements of adventure that early Dragon Ball had. Dragon Ball Super has added a lot of the goofy humor back, and I'm hoping after the series is finished retelling the two recent movies, they'll start exploring the universe(s), instead of just going from fight to fight to fight. Really, really hoping!
Because the adventure and exploration aspects of early Dragon Ball and One Piece, along with the fun characters, is what makes these stories great for me. Fighting is fun, but when it's all fighting, it's significantly less fun.
(I definitely prefer One Piece, by a large margin, though.)
But DBZ shifted its focus almost ENTIRELY to the fighting aspect, and lost a lot of its humor, and basically dropped all elements of adventure that early Dragon Ball had. Dragon Ball Super has added a lot of the goofy humor back, and I'm hoping after the series is finished retelling the two recent movies, they'll start exploring the universe(s), instead of just going from fight to fight to fight. Really, really hoping!
Because the adventure and exploration aspects of early Dragon Ball and One Piece, along with the fun characters, is what makes these stories great for me. Fighting is fun, but when it's all fighting, it's significantly less fun.
(I definitely prefer One Piece, by a large margin, though.)
I am not forgetting BB at all. But the battle for One Piece is not Luffy vs BB. It will just about involve everyone of significance. WG, Shanks, Gorosei, maybe Kaido and Big Mom if they are still there at that point.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Read it, don't watch
That paneling, that consistency. So easy to follow. You could see the entire fight play out just by looking at Vegeta's arms.
This Z-pattern for example is the perfect use of a fight in manga, drawing your eye from movement to movement in right to left
Toriyama always knew how to use the right lines, the right placement of character, and the right effects to ensure that his fights were easy to follow, had impact, and could convey movement. In its prime Dragonball is one of the most visually impressive mangas ever made. Toriyama could display a character nuance with just a simple gesture. He was the best in the game, even better than most now, and it's a shame the anime could rarely keep up.
Neoriceisgood
Member
I think that type of humor + action combination combined with a story that can actually be called a story works well for me.
More Fun To Compute
Member
I think that the reveal at the end will be that One Piece is a physical thing you can hold but that Pirate King is the thing that is a metaphor and has a spiritual aspect.
I agree with this, the people need to acknowledge you as a PK, One Piece is just the greatest treasure in the world. Obtaining it just means that the people understand that you must be super powerful in order to get your hands on it, so usually it will go hand in hand.
Which brings me to my next question. Do the people in the OP universe know what OP is? Or is it just hidden from the readers? My guess is that most people dont know including the readers, but I could be wrong.
I would go with that, if I felt it didn't lack in the areas where there ought to be depth, like the character relationships between the strawhats.
Naruto went above and beyond bad though. Beyond the character dynamics not making sense, they were poisonous, like justification for abusive relationships, lack of repentance and...just plain nonsense, really. Sasuke's character stopped making sense when he decided ALL of Konoha had to die for dishonoring Itachi's memory, a situation Itachi specifically manufactured because he wanted keep Konoha safe. The mental gymnastics that we're intended to believe he took were insanity inducing and Naruto's basic response is to just be his stubborn self and go "nah, we still cool".
I stopped reading a little after that point, when things stopped making sense altogether. I keep meaning to reread the whole series, so I can fully digest the inanity and do the writeup of all write ups on how fucking putrid the storytelling is, but I can't seem to get around to it.
I don't think they do, other than a few people like Whitebeard.
More Fun To Compute
Member
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Thats what I thought, cause Im wondering how Roger got the name PK when 99% of the population dont even know what OP is.
No, that's what the next Pirate King has to do.
With Roger, he created the legend of one piece because when he died, he said "I left everything I own in One Piece."
He became pirate king himself by being tough.
Edit: actually, why the hell hasn't the WG tried to get it? Just send a crew, find it, take or it destroy it, and they can go "see? Piracy does not pay off"
LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
No, most do not know what it is, and a lot of people don't even believe that it's real. In a flashback, a curious Whitebeard is seen asking Roger what One Piece is. I think only people close to Roger know what it is.
It's the Will of D.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Seems like a waste of manpower and resources just to prove a point (about a myth no less) when they have a threat closer to home and a government to maintain.
They began a fucking war with Whitebeard just so they could kill Ace publicly and discourage piracy. That was basically the whole point of the war, since they were hoping that killing Roger's son would be symbolically the end of Roger's Era. If they just wanted him dead, they could have slit his throat the moment he got caught.
LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
One Piece is probably not a physical object, and Raftel might not even be an ordinary island that anyone can visit. It's more like an idea.
I know people in this thread aren't usually caught up with theories and all that stuff, but the theory that One Piece is the goal to unite all seas and create ultimate freedom is still by far the best theory for what One Piece is. Roger couldn't do it because he was sick; he didn't have time. We know that Luffy will destroy Fishman Island at some point. We know the void century plays a part in it, we know being pirate king is all about being the freest person on the sea and we know that the weapons of mass destruction are involved. Fishman Island started so many things that will be brought back on in the end-game, no doubt.
I like to make presumptions rather than assumptions. There's been so much talk of the Will of D, there's no chance it's not important for end-game stuff.
I know people in this thread aren't usually caught up with theories and all that stuff, but the theory that One Piece is the goal to unite all seas and create ultimate freedom is still by far the best theory for what One Piece is. Roger couldn't do it because he was sick; he didn't have time. We know that Luffy will destroy Fishman Island at some point. We know the void century plays a part in it, we know being pirate king is all about being the freest person on the sea and we know that the weapons of mass destruction are involved. Fishman Island started so many things that will be brought back on in the end-game, no doubt.
I like to make presumptions rather than assumptions. There's been so much talk of the Will of D, there's no chance it's not important for end-game stuff.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
They took advantage of the fact that they had him in their custody to prove their point, which is much easier and more tangible than sending out men into highly dangerous waters to find something that most don't believe exists.
The theory that i was talking about just earlier ties in with this. In order to become PK or get OP, you need to beat the WG, because well they are the ultimate form of oppression.
While missing the only target he intended.
There should be marines that know better. I mean, I have no doubt that the reason that OP is a myth is because the Gov encourages that shit the way a priest encourages people to not have sex except for procreation.
And they were always hunting for Ace, they just didn't get him until Blackbeard showed up.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Not really, it was his own personal choice. Aikoji just said that wasnt part of the plan or something to that effect.
LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
Something can be a persons job and still be morally repugnant. Something being one's occupation doesn't act like some kind of buffer about who they are as a person.
Not that I hate him for it. Like I said, I have no empathy for OP's characters, but if you posit that killing innocents is wrong, then it's hard to argue that that is nullified by the fact that he gets a paycheck for doing it.
LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
I never said anything about neither job nor money. Again this is another discussion that has already been had in detail and it's not really the right forum for philosophical enquires but it's about several philosophical stances, in particular the idea of killing innocents for the greater good, ie to help the greater majority, similarly to how CP9 could be subjectively justified.
I agree killing innocents for the greater good can be subjective.
I just dont think thats what he did. He couldve slowed down, lock them all up, and then do some individual interrogations, but he went for the quick fix.
LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
pelicansurf
Needs a Holiday on Gallifrey
Saw the OP episode for this week and it's always so jarring when the animation quality suddenly spikes to an actually good degree. You were just piecing together frames and all of a sudden you hit me with this? It happens a lot with big finishes, but the last one this blatant was when Ace got "rescued".
Well, since it's part of Akainu's character, it should be considered. No reason not to talk about it.
But Akainu's own perspective should be considered. I don't feel he is a man who is concerned only is about destroying evil. Like, his perspective, as I understand it, is similar to Rorschach's from Watchmen in that he is so determined to destroy that which he sees as evil that he no longer is concerned with preserving good. So, theoretically, lets say there are two people, and one of them was going to murder the other. He sees the murderer as evil and will do anything to kill him. Meaning that if the only way he could kill the murderer is to kill the other person along with him, he'd do that, even though the only reason the would be murderer was evil was because he was going to kill the other guy.
Akainu has only ever been concerned about the WG's lethality against the dangers that other things pose. He was going to be willing to kill Luffy and Ace just for being the son of a pirate and revolutionary because piracy is in the blood, ignoring that they have as much marine blood in them as well. He killed or was going to kill a marine just because he didn't want to throw his life away attacking Whitebeard, who he wouldn't have been able to do anything against anyway.
So while it's debatable to talk about if sacrificing innocents for greater good can be morally right, that's not the dilemma that Akainu faces as far as I can tell. He's sacrificing innocents to eliminate evil.
gundamkyoukai
Member
One piece is a physical object or at least some sort of treasure.
Oda said this during one of his interviews.
robin's dad is vegapunk!
gundamkyoukai
Member
Also catching up on the thread it seem people forget that one of the reason Roger became PK is because he got to raftel .
We already know that going to raftel is not simple because Roger was asking WB if he wanted to know how to get there.
Truth is luffy not going to become PK like how roger did because i expect more than one group going to get to raftel .
We already know that going to raftel is not simple because Roger was asking WB if he wanted to know how to get there.
Truth is luffy not going to become PK like how roger did because i expect more than one group going to get to raftel .
More Fun To Compute
Member
We don't know cause and effect. It could be that what Roger called being Pirate King was some sort of strength or ability that is needed to complete the journey.
I expect that Vegapunk could make a ship that could get to Raftel and also that Enel could get there in the Ark Maxim. Probably the place will have some sort of fighting since that's the sort of thing that happens.
gundamkyoukai
Member
I mean of course you have to be strong but him getting to raftel is one of the reasons he became know as PK .
Roger crew is the only crew that has ever been there and he did become PK after he conquered the grandline.
Also i don't think it so simple to get there or people would have already gone it has been 24 years since roger left the one piece there.
Side note this is where roger hearing the voice of all things could be use .
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Green haired guy looks like Vegapunk to me. Mechanized features and all.I've been re-reading the series via the colors recently.
I wonder if the green hair guy was supposed to be an important character of some sort when Oda was planning things early on in the series.
Pirate skull kind of opposes that idea, though. I bet it's just an early design of a character who never made it. Although I would love if it ended up being the seventh Shichibukai or someone else important.
raftel is where luffy might end up indirectly killing blackbeard. if raftel is extremely hard to get to then the sea might be the harshest there is. luffy can possibly fight him at the island before raftel and beat him and blackbeard mighty try getting revenge on luffy while he sails to raftel. it will be similar to how blackbeard tried to get to luffy before he went to sky island and was instead shipwrecked by the knock up stream. this time around though blackbeard will end up forever lost at sea with his entire crew and never heard from again.
Watch Da Birdie
I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
That guy honestly makes me think of Zoro with the hair and bandanna.
You guys are putting way too much value on that. That's not even a canon portrait of an instory event. That character design might show up again, and Oda even might have planned it for something, but this isn't like the Rayleigh incident where the character had a clear placement in the story. This is just a random ass drawing, and the character designs reappearance will not be made more significant for having appeared before.
Besides, it's obvious that the guy with the ax that is hidden behind Buggy's tassle is the seventh Shichibukai.
Besides, it's obvious that the guy with the ax that is hidden behind Buggy's tassle is the seventh Shichibukai.
It's Sogeking.
Re: other shounens, I really really recomemnd My Hero Academia. One Piece quality manga, and sometimes even better.
No joke, Oda's said that Law's a spotted seal.
They don't actually say it anywhere, but Blackbeard gets depicted as a hippomotamus in merchandise. Buggy has nothing atm.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
Re: in-universe logic for the Yonkou, there are four of them because that's what the new world can support as an ecosystem. The name isn't a group that was established and looked for members, it's a description of the current state of the world. I doubt the World Government actually coined the name, it was likely coined naturally by the people/pirates of the New World in response to how the balance of power ended up.
You've got four roughly-equal pirate factions vying for control of the New World, not necessarily in physical size of territory, but in overall military strength. When one group was weakened (Whitebeard after the Paramount War), it created a power vacuum. Conceivably the other three players could've expanded to fill that void, but Blackbeard made a concentrated effort and ended up creating a solid enough foothold to be considered the fourth emperor. There's no hard and fast reason why there couldn't just be the Sankou or the Gokou, depending on how the factions clashed and ended up.
Now the Shichibukai, to understand their makeup you have to consider the Three Great Powers, comprised of the Marine Headquarters, the Shichbukai, and the Yonkou. They exist in a delicate balance, and the status quo of pirates vs Marines is dependent on their makeup. Crocodile's deposement set the WG in a tizzy because the balance tipped away from the Marines/Shichibukai, thus their desire to quickly replace him. For one reason or another, they've decided that seven is the appropriate number of warlords that, when combined with the Marines, can keep the Yonkou counteracted. Not really actively, but you gotta think of them more like nuclear deterrents. Because the military force of the Shichibukai exists and can be called upon, the Yonkou don't have an overwhelming advantage should they choose to attack the Marines directly.
I can only speculate as to why the number is specifically seven and not some other number, but my guess is that seven is the balance between enough power to counter the Yonkou and not so much that they become too powerful and unmanageable, since they really are just pirates, and are prone to betrayal.
You've got four roughly-equal pirate factions vying for control of the New World, not necessarily in physical size of territory, but in overall military strength. When one group was weakened (Whitebeard after the Paramount War), it created a power vacuum. Conceivably the other three players could've expanded to fill that void, but Blackbeard made a concentrated effort and ended up creating a solid enough foothold to be considered the fourth emperor. There's no hard and fast reason why there couldn't just be the Sankou or the Gokou, depending on how the factions clashed and ended up.
Now the Shichibukai, to understand their makeup you have to consider the Three Great Powers, comprised of the Marine Headquarters, the Shichbukai, and the Yonkou. They exist in a delicate balance, and the status quo of pirates vs Marines is dependent on their makeup. Crocodile's deposement set the WG in a tizzy because the balance tipped away from the Marines/Shichibukai, thus their desire to quickly replace him. For one reason or another, they've decided that seven is the appropriate number of warlords that, when combined with the Marines, can keep the Yonkou counteracted. Not really actively, but you gotta think of them more like nuclear deterrents. Because the military force of the Shichibukai exists and can be called upon, the Yonkou don't have an overwhelming advantage should they choose to attack the Marines directly.
I can only speculate as to why the number is specifically seven and not some other number, but my guess is that seven is the balance between enough power to counter the Yonkou and not so much that they become too powerful and unmanageable, since they really are just pirates, and are prone to betrayal.
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