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[Savitar]

I just had the easiest Hollywood attack ever today. All 6 defenders were Widowmaker. Even as a Pharah I only died twice.



Oh my god that's amazing. Did you make that? Want to send it to OverwatchTXT but want to give credit.

Ha no, like many a person before me I found it upon the web and posted it elsewhere.

 

[Neoxon]

DiGi Valentine is now doing the Who Dat? series for the Overwatch characters, starting with Tracer. Until now, he's mainly done this for Street Fighter with the occasional dip into other forms of gaming & anime media (ranging from Sonic to Cowboy Bebop to even Mirror's Edge).

 

[Aaronology]

D.Va wrecks Winstons.

As a Winston player I really do hope people keep spreading this hilarious misinformation. Bastion utterly and completely nullifies Winston. From that extreme hard counter, we have Reaper, Roadhog, (an aggressive!) Reinhardt and Mei. Do you know what they all have in common? The ability to burst his health down before his mobility can be utilized OR the ability to neutralize that mobility altogether.

Tracer, Zarya and D.Va (lol) do not counter Winston any more than any other character. They don't do the damage to stop a Winston from disengaging and at best they are 50/50 encounters, which a Winston is (or should be) avoiding anyway.

Edit:

Winston counters in rough order of counter power: D.Va, Roadhog, Reaper, Mei. D.Va is way out in front, though.

Ok...

Explain how D.Va is more of a hard counter to Winston than Roadhog and Reaper. Or Bastion, who is missing from that list.

 

[Antiwhippy]

TBF unless it's KotH, if a DVA or winston is ever being constantly engaged with one another, one of them isn't doing their jobs properly.

Still think DVA wrecks winston 1 on 1 if that's the scenario we're talking about.

 

[Walpurgis]

As a Winston player I really do hope people keep spreading this hilarious misinformation. Bastion utterly and completely nullifies Winston. From that extreme hard counter, we have Reaper, Roadhog, (an aggressive!) Reinhardt and Mei. Do you know what they all have in common? The ability to burst his health down before his mobility can be utilized OR the ability to neutralize that mobility altogether.

Tracer, Zarya and D.Va (lol) do not counter Winston any more than any other character. They don't do the damage to stop a Winston from disengaging and at best they are 50/50 encounters, which a Winston is (or should be) avoiding anyway.

Edit:

Ok...

Explain how D.Va is more of a hard counter to Winston than Roadhog and Reaper. Or Bastion, who is missing from that list.

Yeah, I play Winston quite a bit and I don't give a crap about DVas. Bastions, on the other hand, often force me to hero switch. He is the only reliable cure against an entire team of Winstons.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

Anecdotal of course but I've never had trouble with Winston as D.Va. Even if I for some reason don't manage to kill them before my mech blows up, I just use my real gun to finish the job and then go fight someone else.

 

[Antiwhippy]

Also all winston teams is probably the most bullshit stack to play against. Forget about 6 torbs, I'd rather face that than 6 winstons. Double winstons or more is where I'll bring out bastion.

 

[Freezasaurus]

Also all winston teams is probably the most bullshit stack to play against. Forget about 6 torbs, I'd rather face that than 6 winstons. Double winstons or more is where I'll bring out bastion.

I've played against all-Winston teams before. They get wrecked pretty quickly.

 

[Bumbletron]

As a Winston player I really do hope people keep spreading this hilarious misinformation. Bastion utterly and completely nullifies Winston. From that extreme hard counter, we have Reaper, Roadhog, (an aggressive!) Reinhardt and Mei. Do you know what they all have in common? The ability to burst his health down before his mobility can be utilized OR the ability to neutralize that mobility altogether.

Tracer, Zarya and D.Va (lol) do not counter Winston any more than any other character. They don't do the damage to stop a Winston from disengaging and at best they are 50/50 encounters, which a Winston is (or should be) avoiding anyway.

Edit:

Ok...

Explain how D.Va is more of a hard counter to Winston than Roadhog and Reaper. Or Bastion, who is missing from that list.

Dude, again, his gun does absolutely pitiful damage to D.Va, she does sizeable damage to him, she can chase him without issue, and she can push him away from the squishes he's attacking. That counters every bit of utility he has other than be a pincushion. And if being a pincushion is the only thing you can accomplish as a Winston, you are being countered pretty hard.

 

[Antiwhippy]

I've played against all-Winston teams before. They get wrecked pretty quickly.

They get wrecked when I bring out bastion, but if you're not ready for it, it's just a mess of monkeys and electricity. Monkeys with great mobility, healthpool and electricity where the once pitifull damage is now multiplied by 6.

 

[Aaronology]

TBF unless it's KotH, if a DVA or winston is ever being constantly engaged with one another, one of them isn't doing their jobs properly.

Still think DVA wrecks winston 1 on 1 if that's the scenario we're talking about.

She does not wreck Winston. She has more damage up front, but is easy as hell to strafe for Winston/Symmetra to the point of hilarity primarily due to their freedom from having to aim. Winston doesn't have her armor and overall health pool if we're excluding his shield. An encounter between those two might go either way, but a good Winston is going to gtfo the second it's clear it isn't going in his favor.

You want to see Winston wrecked? Watch him go up against a Bastion or a Roadhog or a Reinhardt who is intent on bashing his cute gorilla face in. Winston and D.Va just annoy each other.

 

[Satch]

WE ALL GOT KICKED FROM A GREAT LOBBY NOOOO

 

[Satch]

Zarya is such an odd one for me. Some games i feel like an unstoppable wrecking ball with her. Some games i feel like I'm contributing absolutely nothing. Still can't get totally consistent with her.

The way i look at it is that u really really really would prefer to have another tank. If u have a reinhardt on ur team, you will get fifty energy right away by bubbling him with his shield up while the enemy is shooting at it. you get charged the easiest by doing that

 

[Antiwhippy]

She does not wreck Winston. She has more damage up front, but is easy as hell to strafe for Winston/Symmetra to the point of hilarity primarily due to their freedom from having to aim. Winston doesn't have her armor and overall health pool if we're excluding his shield. An encounter between those two might go either way, but a good Winston is going to gtfo the second it's clear it isn't going in his favor.

You want to see Winston wrecked? Watch him go up against a Bastion or a Roadhog or a Reinhardt who is intent on bashing his cute gorilla face in. Winston and D.Va just annoy each other.

I mean, good points, but I disagree with the aiming one because you have to be really bad to miss a strafing winston up close. Sym is more understandable, but the scatter on DVAs mech is actually especially useful against a strafing winston because his hitbox is so big.

Also really, a good DVA will also GTFO the moment things aren't in her favour, but aren't we talking about a duel to the death? Also it's not like it's hard for DVA to chase after winston, but the moment he GTFOs for healthpacks or whatever is a win for the team really, because he won't be bothering you for awhile.

 

[Papercuts]

The way i look at it is that u really really really would prefer to have another tank. If u have a reinhardt on ur team, you will get fifty energy right away by bubbling him with his shield up while the enemy is shooting at it. you get charged the easiest by doing that

Yeah, Zarya works really well in a dual tank lineup.

Even solo she's growing on me. Her HP has shields for a reason, be sure you're taking some damage first and then shield instead of doing it preemptively. Look out for characters like roadhog so you can shield people right after they get hooked since they commonly go right into the point blank shot that will power you up.

 

[Aaronology]

Dude, again, his gun does absolutely pitiful damage to D.Va, she does sizeable damage to him, she can chase him without issue, and she can push him away from the squishes he's attacking. That counters every bit of utility he has other than be a pincushion. And if being a pincushion is the only thing you can accomplish as a Winston, you are being countered pretty hard.

His gun does pitiful damage to everyone. That's not important. Why? He does not have to aim it. Like Symmetra, this gives him a unique edge against D.Va (and a shielding Reinhardt) due to how slowly she maneuvers while firing. Get right up in D.Va's face, strafe, watch and lol as she tries to keep you targeted. It's actually a little cute. Symmetra is much better at this than Winston, admittedly, due to her smaller frame. But the tactic still holds. If D.Va is ever buffed and loses that move penalty while firing, then she will be a true counter to Winston. As is you're talking about damage from a character who can barely apply it to someone walking circles around her who also does not have to keep her in view.

 

[Royal_Phalanx]

Did pretty well as Tracer today. Also tried adding a couple of GAF people, nobody accepted. Really struggling to find a group to play with. Going to ask around on Reddit.

 

[Antiwhippy]

That only counts for forward movement. I don't think I've ever felt the movement penalty on her turning radius because you really can't tune for it. I could just turn up my mouse's DPI for faster turning if there was a penalty there.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

His gun does pitiful damage to everyone. That's not important. Why? He does not have to aim it. Like Symmetra, this gives him a unique edge against D.Va (and a shielding Reinhardt) due to how slowly she maneuvers while firing. Get right up in D.Va's face, strafe, watch and lol as she tries to keep you targeted. It's actually a little cute. Symmetra is much better at this than Winston, admittedly, due to her smaller frame. But the tactic still holds. If D.Va is ever buffed and loses that move penalty while firing, then she will be a true counter to Winston. As is you're talking about damage from a character who can barely apply it to someone walking circles around her who also does not have to keep her in view.

Symmetra's strength is not the auto-aim or small frame, but the damage output. They aren't even comparable in the manner you're suggesting.

Unless you're talking about console, why can't a DVA damage a winston? Walking circles? Are we talking about people who can't even aim? I can beat a symmetra who tries to walk around in circles, let alone a huge winston.

 

[Swapzism]

There is nothing more satisfying than beating a team of 6 Torbjorns...with a team of randoms that actually worked together to escort the payload.

 

[killdatninja]

There is nothing more satisfying than beating a team of 6 Torbjorns...with a team of randoms that actually worked together to escort the payload.

I disagree, it's completely unsatisfying the entire time!

 

[R0ckman]

Anyone run into an aimbot Tracer? Horrible experience.

Reticle was sticking to characters like glue the whole match. We won anyway...

They were doing everything, 3 Reapers, Winstons, double Lucio, aimbot... I think the Tracer turned it on mid match, they weren't that accurate before.

 

[Darryl M R]

Anyone run into an aimbot Tracer? Horrible experience.

Reticle was sticking to characters like glue the whole match. We won anyway...

They were doing everything, 3 Reapers, Winstons, double Lucio, aimbot... I think the Tracer turned it on mid match, they weren't that accurate before.

Is there proof that there was aimbots? This sounds like a serious accusation.

 

[Bumbletron]

His gun does pitiful damage to everyone. That's not important. Why? He does not have to aim it. Like Symmetra, this gives him a unique edge against D.Va (and a shielding Reinhardt) due to how slowly she maneuvers while firing. Get right up in D.Va's face, strafe, watch and lol as she tries to keep you targeted. It's actually a little cute. Symmetra is much better at this than Winston, admittedly, due to her smaller frame. But the tactic still holds. If D.Va is ever buffed and loses that move penalty while firing, then she will be a true counter to Winston. As is you're talking about damage from a character who can barely apply it to someone walking circles around her who also does not have to keep her in view.

Do you play on console, or PC? A D.Va you are able to strafe with winston is not one you play against on PC. D.Va doesn't really have to aim too much with her guns either. And his gun does much worse damage against D.Va because 2/3 of her health is armor. Also remember you have to reload, D.Va doesn't.

It's hard to believe that you think that D.Va can't hit you when you're playing the broad side of a barn.

 

[Satch]

Dva eats winston, im surprised by this argument

 

[Incendiary]

Just played against a Reaper with a name that's definitely going to the Reaper Names Twitter. Good Lord it's amazing some of the names on here.

 

[konjak]

It is super-easy to run circles around a D.Va with most characters, and Winston doesn't even have to aim. So I am in the camp that feels D.Va is not good against him.

Like, you're better off walking backwards against DVA than walking circles around her.

Hey, just saying. It's not my tactic, hah. I think D.Vas break like twigs unless someone really knows when to fall back with her.

 

[Antiwhippy]

Like, you're better off walking backwards against DVA than walking circles around her.

Again, are people just playing against DVAs that don't know how to turn around?

 

[Aaronology]

Symmetra's strength is not the auto-aim or small frame, but the damage output. They aren't even comparable in the manner you're suggesting.

Symmetra's ability to stay alive during that encounter is why her smaller frame is important. Not her damage, which would be completely irrelevant if she dies before she builds it up. Head to head, without strafing, D.Va murders Ms. Satya. Similarly, D.Va will not hit an up-close, strafing Winston 100%, while he will not suffer in the same manner. D.Va's movement penalty is a primary reason Winston (or Sym) is able to go toe to toe with her higher damage output.

Unless you're talking about console, why can't a DVA damage a winston? Walking circles? Are we talking about people who can't even aim? I can beat a symmetra who tries to walk around in circles, let alone a huge winston.

And I can beat a Bastion who isn't having a great day as Winston, too. I am not going to suggest Winston is at all ideal to deal with that hero, though. That you're not even acknowledging how easy it is for a Symmetra to sashay in circles around D.Va tells me you haven't had to deal with that very much. A shielding Reinhardt or a D.Va up close is just a large target to fuel her photon gun levels and not much of an urgent threat.

 

[cHinzo]

Playing more and more Roadhog lately. Screw those Tracers, they are toast.

 

[Bumbletron]

It is super-easy to run circles around a D.Va with most characters, and Winston doesn't even have to aim. So I am in the camp that feels D.Va is not good against him.

She isn't if D.Va does burst fire. Sure continuous fire slows her aim, but a good D.Va isn't going to just hold down the fire button.

That you're not even acknowledging how easy it is for a Symmetra to sashay in circles around D.Va tells me you haven't had to deal with that very much.

Sym and Winston are completely different animals. Sym is a small human, Winston is a 747 with barely functioning engines.

 

[Triz]

I had the dreaded oh a legendary in my box moment and then its 500 currency. Feels bad man.

 

[Aaronology]

Like, you're better off walking backwards against DVA than walking circles around her.

No! Both Winston and Symmetra need to be close themselves to deal damage. If they try to back up, they die. Winston from not out-DPSing her, and Symmetra from not having the health pool to engage in any length fight. A close to midrange battle and D.Va beats them both. They have to get immediately up in her face and strafe. Their unique advantage of having aim-free weapons means they don't have to worry about keeping her completely in view while they deal damage. She is a large target, after all.

 

[patchday]

I had the dreaded oh a legendary in my box moment and then its 500 currency. Feels bad man.

why? All I need is another 500 or so and I can buy a legendary. maybe in another 20 boxes I'll raise the money.... L28 right now. So maybe by the time I'm L50

 

[Antiwhippy]

Symmetra's ability to stay alive during that encounter is why her smaller frame is important. Not her damage, which would be completely irrelevant if she dies before she builds it up. Head to head, without strafing, D.Va murders Ms. Satya. Similarly, D.Va will not hit an up-close, strafing Winston 100%, while he will not suffer in the same manner. D.Va's movement penalty is a primary reason Winston (or Sym) is able to go toe to toe with her higher damage output.


And I can beat a Bastion who isn't having a great day as Winston, either. I am not going to suggest Winston is at all ideal to deal with that hero, though. That you're not even acknowledging how easy it is for a Symmetra to sashay in circles around D.Va tells me you haven't had to deal with that very much. A shielding Reinhardt or a D.Va up close is just a large target to fuel her photon gun levels and not much of an urgent threat.

Again, the movement penalty does not apply to her turning radius.

Also a good reinhardt knows to get swinging before sym gets any buildup, and I should know this because I play a lot of sym against rein. The only time I'll go against him is if he's preoccupied by someone else. You're better off orbing at midrange because her beam doesn't go through the shield anyway while the orb does.

 

[eek5]

I don't really run into dva much as winston. Usually I'm in their back lines and the dva is in our back lines.

It seems weird to me to suggest dva as a winston counter because winston is going to be in your back lines disrupting things and that's not really dva's strengths, to be chasing someone around behind the rest of your team.

I mean winston jumps into your back lines, you use your mobility to chase him down then he jumps back to his team after he does his job. Now what? It's a wash not a counter. Reaper, bastion, etc. on the other hand are already with their team and can melt winston when he comes in.

Just my take on it at least. I don't think I have a single memorable 1v1 battle with dva while playing Winston.

 

[Hyun Sai]

https://www.twitch.tv/gosugamers

Team Liquid VS Cloud9

 

[Prelude.]

I'm still salty about the game not registering several wins because of shenanigans at the end. I had one godlike Mei match where I absolutely destroyed the other team.

 

[patchday]

https://www.twitch.tv/gosugamers

Team Liquid VS Cloud9

thanks tuning in now

 

[Bumbletron]

I don't really run into dva much as winston. Usually I'm in their back lines and the dva is in our back lines.

It seems weird to me to suggest dva as a winston counter because winston is going to be in your back lines disrupting things and that's not really dva's strengths, to be chasing someone around behind the rest of your team.

I mean winston jumps into your back lines, you use your mobility to chase him down then he jumps back to his team after he does his job. Now what? It's a wash not a counter. Reaper, bastion, etc. on the other hand are already with their team and can melt winston when he comes in.

Just my take on it at least. I don't think I have a single memorable 1v1 battle with dva while playing Winston.

Depends on the map. KotH or Payload offense are examples I've come across. Payload is typically only when the D.Va is healing up. You also come across it when there's a big push on the point.

Also, a D.Va in these situations causes winston to back up, or pushes him away from the squishies by force. This prevents him from doing his job.

 

[R0ckman]

Is there proof that there was aimbots? This sounds like a serious accusation.

Yeah during my ult they were able to keep the reticle on me the whole time as I was leaping at close quaters, did not have to track me. It was like watching soilders 76 super. Another person who died to her said in his cam she killed a person and then simply looked in his direction and was right on him with headshots. We had all sorts of stuff today, a troll Symm got on our team as well.

 

[LAM09]

That's a good way to encourage people to play supports /s

I was wondering about that earlier, it kind of sucks if it's true. I don't understand why every character doesn't receive equal points, at least theoretically. You have to have a healer to run a good team, and if everyone is gunning to increase their own rank as much as possible, I'm afraid it's going to make it even harder to find good dedicated heals in comp placements, if not Comp itself.

Also, I'm kind of 'John'ing here, but I played Lucio through 8/10 of my placements, and the others were Rein. If I would've known... I would have been part of the problem.

I know. The points system does seem a bit messed up ATM.

 

[eek5]

Depends on the map. KotH or Payload offense are examples I've come across. Payload is typically only when the D.Va is healing up. You also come across it when there's a big push on the point.

Also, a D.Va in these situations causes winston to back up, or pushes him away from the squishies by force. This prevents him from doing his job.

Winston's job isn't really to engage squishies that are all grouped together with tanks and other heroes though. His job is to disrupt and kill lone stragglers. I guess if the argument is Dva is winston's counter by escorting squishies around the map then I can buy that argument but if winstons are giving the team a problem I don't see one person switching to Dva as being some kind of hard counter. I mean I'm not going to jump into Dva's face or look for a 1v1 but I'm not going to switch off winston either because I can still do my job by jumping to areas where she isn't.

 

[truestatic]

His gun does pitiful damage to everyone. That's not important. Why? He does not have to aim it. Like Symmetra, this gives him a unique edge against D.Va (and a shielding Reinhardt) due to how slowly she maneuvers while firing. Get right up in D.Va's face, strafe, watch and lol as she tries to keep you targeted. It's actually a little cute. Symmetra is much better at this than Winston, admittedly, due to her smaller frame. But the tactic still holds. If D.Va is ever buffed and loses that move penalty while firing, then she will be a true counter to Winston. As is you're talking about damage from a character who can barely apply it to someone walking circles around her who also does not have to keep her in view.

His damage on d.va is a fraction of his damage on anyone else, though. Cuz of the armor reduction. So it's a fraction of pitiful. The only complication I ever have as D.va when a Winston gets in my face is the other people on his team. Cuz he's doing very very little to me himself.

 

[Seductivpancakes]

A lot of Widowmaker's I'm running into just sit back and snipe poorly. If its payload, they'll rush forward at like the last 60 secs just blazing away.

starting to dislike seeing her on my team.

 

[Bumbletron]

Winston's job isn't really to engage squishies that are all grouped together with tanks and other heroes though. His job is to disrupt and kill lone stragglers. I guess if the argument is Dva is winston's counter by escorting squishies around the map then I can buy that argument but if winstons are giving the team a problem I don't see one person switching to Dva as being some kind of hard counter. I mean I'm not going to jump into Dva's face or look for a 1v1 but I'm not going to switch off winston either because I can still do my job by jumping to areas where she isn't.

Right, but you can do the same thing by jumping to areas where, say Reaper or Roadhog aren't as well. I'm not saying D.Va is a counter pick. But if you're running D.Va and a Winston is giving your team trouble while you're nearby for any reason, he won't be a problem for long. She is still a counter, just not one you pick solely to counter Winston.

 

[Vestal]

Also all winston teams is probably the most bullshit stack to play against. Forget about 6 torbs, I'd rather face that than 6 winstons. Double winstons or more is where I'll bring out bastion.

Bastion + Reaper + Roadhog or DVA wreck the living shit out of all winston.

 

[patchday]

so weird watching pro players and not seeing any turret users or snipers. I knew this already but still weird to see

watching live c9 vs TL

 

[Antiwhippy]

Yeah if I specifically want to counterpick winston I'd go bastion or reaper, but if we're already in the game anyway I'm not going to be afraid of chasing him off as DVA and I'm not going to bother picking bastion or reaper.

 

[eek5]

Right, but you can do the same thing by jumping to areas where, say Reaper or Roadhog aren't as well. I'm not saying D.Va is a counter pick. But if you're running D.Va and a Winston is giving your team trouble while you're nearby for any reason, he won't be a problem for long. She is still a counter, just not one you pick solely to counter Winston.

Right, but this whole discussion is about what Winston's counter is though. Dva is just another hero, not a Winston counter. I'm not even sure what people are arguing about at this point.