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Overwatch |OT4| You Want A Good Genji, But You Need The Bad Hanzo
- Thread starter GraveRobberX
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Yeah but you also let McCree one shot 200hp heroes ;;
Happens a lot. Not much you can do about your teammates unless you pick them. You can tell them to come to the objective but they still might not. At higher levels in competitive it's rarely a problem though. If your team does overextend you might have to be prepared to speed boost them back to the team.
Who do you consider the best pick for all maps? I've played Junkrat on all maps and will do fine as long as I have a good coodinated team and I've done my fair share of taking down most of the enemy teams at times. I'm not even exaggerating. I've seen bad Junkrats play it too safe and they barely get any kills. It depends on how you play him just like with any other hero. It's not all set in stone.
Switching heroes is nothing new. Of course we will switch if there's a troublesome player on the other team that is domninating us. ex: I will switch to Winston for an annoying Genji or Soldier for Pharah. But if we're winning, there's no need to switch for the sake of switching.
Red Arremer
Member
Actually, I'm really interested in Bastion because he is the single character whose backstory is non-existent. Every other hero in the game right now has some sort of extensive backstory to them, even the less fleshed out heroes like D.Va or Zarya, but Bastion is a complete mystery.
I'm quite excited to see how he fits into the world of Overwatch.
JayWood2010
Member
Looking to build a 65+ team on competitive for PC. Anybody interested? Looking for players with peak 65+
As of two days ago I was level 67 and climbing at a pretty steady rate. Then I had some bad luck monday.....losing 12 games in a row. It didnt matter how good I played, things just always ended badly. Games with 4 golds, bad coinflips, team mates leaving even when we were dominating, etc. And apparently when you go on a losing streak it starts to rank you down an entire level per loss, which is kind of bs, but that is a different story.
Anyways, I think I have had enough of trying to solo it. I want to start building a well rounded team that can communicate and pick heros that are needed rather than being selfish.
My two mains are D.VA and Reaper. I have been working with Ana recently as well with some success, but still could improve on her.
Would love to get a good Rein and Zenyatta on my team. Anyways, if anybody is interested in building a team with me that would be awesome.
As of two days ago I was level 67 and climbing at a pretty steady rate. Then I had some bad luck monday.....losing 12 games in a row. It didnt matter how good I played, things just always ended badly. Games with 4 golds, bad coinflips, team mates leaving even when we were dominating, etc. And apparently when you go on a losing streak it starts to rank you down an entire level per loss, which is kind of bs, but that is a different story.
Anyways, I think I have had enough of trying to solo it. I want to start building a well rounded team that can communicate and pick heros that are needed rather than being selfish.
My two mains are D.VA and Reaper. I have been working with Ana recently as well with some success, but still could improve on her.
Would love to get a good Rein and Zenyatta on my team. Anyways, if anybody is interested in building a team with me that would be awesome.
Red Arremer
Member
I'd be interested and actually do play Zenyatta and Reinhardt (though mostly Lucio), but I'm not 65+.
Also what's your avatar from, can you PM me a full version pls.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Genji does have quite the butt.
Depends on the map, depends who you're playing with. Junkrat just isn't really that good compared to many other heroes- he gets too much aoe damage that does nothing while the majority of the dps characters you can take instead can really make work. You'd pretty much be better off with a McCree usually in his same role if no one is switching heroes for their mains, since he's more deadly and in similar positions, except he has tools to directly deal with flankers.
*Assuming everyone is competent
Now in reality you'll have a mccree anyways for the proper dps so he shouldn't be there so you can have a flanker or such, which is the choice between "do I want a junkrat or a <insert flanker>", in which case the flanker is much more efficient at killing high value targets.
He also gets maimed by flankers, adding to this. He's just not as good of a pick vs others as the game currently stands.
you didn't answer my question for best pick. and no, McCree is not that great especially on consoles. he hardly dominates Comp matches I've played. killed him more than he killed me cuz i always know he will try to flank and most of my groups know when to hide when he does his Ult. even when we got MMed with Top 500 group, I was destroying their McCree with my Junkrat constantly. but if you think Junkrat is weak then so be it. he's been working well for me.
Zarya is legit amazing. I would say the best hero.
Meet a better McCree
McCree isn't a sniper anymore, his flashbang is a tool to kill a flanker. If your McCree can't flash+fth hes awful, you need no aim.
And I didn't answer it because it's not relevant. There is no 'best pick' for all situations or this meta gets even more boring (minus zencio) and it's moreso that junkrat gets melted by flankers while having an additional flanker in his spot is better. Unless you're replacing a different slot with him, which is a fairly bad idea anyways.
He's 'useable' if the other team is bad, but it's definitely making your day way harder than it needs to be.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Another match, another Genji running wild across my team. Fun.
Good.
Now put it in QP. And for the people who want it, just make a new mode called "degenerate trash" and put it there.
JayWood2010
Member
I'd be interested and actually do play Zenyatta and Reinhardt (though mostly Lucio), but I'm not 65+.
Also what's your avatar from, can you PM me a full version pls.
lol well what level are you? Ill give you a try and see if we have any synergy together
And it is Sabrewulf from Killer Instinct
i edited my post., I met a Top 500 McCree and I still slaughtered him. he was lucky he had a good D.Va who carried their team.
and why do you keep mentioning metas. i'm mentioning my own experiences and I've dominated with Junkrat so I will keep playing Junkrat. Plus he's a fun hero.
most likely true on PC but i wouldn't know since I only play console.
Yes. I want to argue reaper, but really, tracer is such a headache.
This meta has no pick variety. Even with McCree being worse, hes still the optimal choice for maiming flankers like no tomorrow just by hitting his CD. That's 3 slots filled, then you have your tank/2 tanks based on your other two choices.
It just doesn't leave much room for many other characters unless you're innovating. And sure, if you want to innovate with Mei or Junkrat, go for it, but if the pros aren't doing it every map, your strategy is probably not going to work better than them to win a 6v6 with a team kill.
You met a bad McCree then. There are some good ones.
And I mention the meta because in the 70s you meet some full teams who actually play the meta and will run you into the ground for running a defense hero on most maps.
Also Anne I'm pretty sure plays both PS4 and PC, so...
I think mccree is now 100% anti flanker following his latest update not a flanker. The buffed fth speed and need to his range.
Probably isn't a best for all maps but maybe best for all map types? Reaper on KoTH and capture is pretty good. On payload I'm not too sure as the comp is more varied.
Nah, I just play PC. I have friends that are 75~ on PS4 so I go hang with them and talk about the game with them.
The major thing about playing off meta on console is that console has a lower skill ceiling and is less competitive in general. Just meansaying you can get away with more off meta than normal on PC.
The major thing about playing off meta on console is that console has a lower skill ceiling and is less competitive in general. Just meansaying you can get away with more off meta than normal on PC.
sorry, but everything you said hasn't happened to me in my experience in Comp so if i do happen to play against another top 500 McCree who's good and can dominate our team, I'll let you know.
this is what i noticed. PC meta does not match up with consoles most of the time. some things people talk about have not occured in my games at all.
Red Arremer
Member
lol well what level are you? Ill give you a try and see if we have any synergy together
And it is Sabrewulf from Killer Instinct
I'm level 32 tho I did play a bit of the beta weekend and am an extremely rusty semi-pro arena shooter player (Quake 3 / UT99). I've been wanting to become better and play Overwatch more competitively for a while, but there's really no drive if all I have is solo queue.
I'm definitely willing to put more time into the game if I have a cause other than just fucking around in Quick Play, and will learn how to aim better on my own as well. I've been thinking of learning McCree too, just so I have an offensive character to fall back on.
New pic from the upcoming animated short.
This has to be the Black Forest, right? I knew they were going to announce the Germany map at Gamescom, Germany.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I don't know what to do against a good Zarya.
aww, thought you did. And yes, you can get away with some weird stuff on console that a smart team of 6
which rarely happens
Well you also just hit 65, it's...very different than top 500. Like an ocean apart in how people play. A counterargument to why Junkrat is a very bad pick on most maps isn't really "I haven't met a good McCree" since the role McCree fills nowadays is very easy. Junkrat should be taking a flankers spot, and in most cases, it just simply isn't worth it.
As Anne said, you can get away with a lot more on console, but a team that knows what it's doing will be able to autopilot a win.
PC meta=console meta minus snipers, just less people follow it because they're less competitive. It doesn't mean they still can't get punished for it.
-stand far enough away where leazer beam wont hit you
-shoot her a couple of times to bait out the bubble
-wait for the bubble to end
-shoot her and kill her
Bastion is super good against Zarya surprisingly.
Shouta
Member
Not much at all? Most Ana players are pretty terrible but as a character right now, she's pretty damn good. She heals way faster than any other healer, has an excellent Ult, and can pinch hit on offense. The most difficult thing is getting your team to actually stay in visual range so you can heal them.
Nothing as satisfying as healing your them then immediately picking off a Pharah that's pestering everyone, lol.
Some points on KOTH maps can be a decent place for Torb to set up shop while everything is going on. I've done it once or twice myself but definitely not a normal pick, lol.
Nah. Using it willy-nilly is bad and gets it destroyed quick but using it in conjunction with pushes makes it a pretty effective tool. Even if you don't kill someone with it, you can still force them to scatter like D.Va's Ult.
How can you have too much AOE? lol.
In an ideal situation, Junkrat is softening folks up while the others are are picking them off. If he's getting too many kills himself, that itself is an anomaly. He should be dealing the most damage for sure but not most kills.
I do feel like Defense heroes are pretty misunderstood currently. Most don't capitalize on their strengths on an individual and a team level which is a real shame.
I'm a fairly competent Zenyatta, Zarya, & Roadhog player. PM me, as I want to play with someone that is a good sport.
FYI, i'm 66 now and i've played with plenty of players in 70's on most of my games. we're constantly get matched up with high 60's to low 70's including top 500 players.
Correct. Also, I'm that anomaly.
I mean there's nothing wrong with playing off meta if you don't intend to climb to the top and you have fun on a character. You should probably know the game well enough at some point to know there's almost always a better choice than Junk rat, but until you hit a point that you can't win or aren't having fun with him you can keep playing him.
In LoL I'm actually pretty trash so I just play off meta champs I have fun on if they can work in the comp. It's nbd. If I did wanna climb though I'd have to learn some meta picks but that's not my jam.
I know I talk about meta a lot, but just because you know meta doesn't mean you have to always play it. I run Mei picks sometimes cause I like Mei and im confident I can make it work on some maps, but I know there's a less risky pick.
In LoL I'm actually pretty trash so I just play off meta champs I have fun on if they can work in the comp. It's nbd. If I did wanna climb though I'd have to learn some meta picks but that's not my jam.
I know I talk about meta a lot, but just because you know meta doesn't mean you have to always play it. I run Mei picks sometimes cause I like Mei and im confident I can make it work on some maps, but I know there's a less risky pick.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I know Bastion works, but he's a bit hard to work against her when there's a Genji on your ass and a Junkrat spamming shit at you lol.
Reaper is like a 50/50 battle, McCree flashbang fucks up Zarya, the key is just to bait out the bubble. She has no movement options, and once the bubble is gone, you should be able to out dps her depending on her charge. Sometimes, it's also a good idea if you just move away from a very pissed off Zarya
I mean yes, but sadly this discussion isn't on that, it's moreso on the bolded part. I don't really understand defending a character as viable in most sitautions near the top when theres a better pick in almost every situation. I know you don't need to perfectly run the meta, it's just junkrats a very poor choice at the top versus most other characters.
Top 500 can be 60s. Just like 70s can play with 80s, it's still a different world.
Because Zencio keep them alive and suddenly the roadhog you've been lobbing nades on has his ult ready very fast from self heals, and you can also replace him with a flanker to solo kill the same high priority targets.
Shouta
Member
I just don't enjoy meta talk when it's framed in the "This is the right way to do it" rather than the "This is the most popular and followed upon." It makes the discussion feel suffocating especially when this game has a lot of moving parts that change how things should be approached at any given time.
Kor of Memory
Member
KotH has been flooded with a lot of Genji's and Tracers. Turrets are easy deterrents for those two.
Similarly, I've seen a few Bastion pop up when teams go heavy on the tanks. As long as there isn't a DVa, Bastion can usually get a couple kills in before he gets wiped out. Especially against a Roadhog, Winston, or Zarya.
The sad part about OW at the moment is it isn't balanced at all. Certain picks are much much better than others the vast majority of the time.
It's really a shame really- this thread shouldn't even be able to say "please stop using hanzo or any defense hero", because it's really on blizzard to fix that.
This is exactly how I feel every time I come in here and people tell me I'm playing it wrong even tho I've been doing well. Whatever, I think I'm done with this meta talk. If I reach 70's before deadline, I will let you know if you meta guys were right or not. Comparing us to pros is not how I want to think of this game.
Responding to the bolded. WOW! What Rank are you? I have 42 hours total play time with a little over a 1/4th of them on Lucio. I am small potatoes.
Eh, you do remember the last meta report from Captain Planet, right? Junkrat jumped up right underneath D.Va and Tracer in the last tournament and occupies the same tier as Roadhog. Captain Planet's analysis was "Finally, Junkrat gained significant ground this week – escaping the F Tier as pros realized they still needed a consistent, AOE damage-dealing replacement from the liability that Pharah has become."
I've linked this before and I don't think anyone paid it any attention but Junkrat is most certainly not useless and most certainly still has a role, even in the new meta. It's telling when the Pros break a hero out to change the meta and I believe Junk is still effective at killing Lucio and Zen from a distance and over obstacles and can make life difficult for Genji and Tracer.
Edit - linking the Captain Planet meta report that I am referecing. https://www.overbuff.com/blog/2016-08-04-overwatch-hero-tier-list-and-meta-report-zenyattawatch
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Well, matchmaking sucked this morning. Four matches in a row where I got stomped, went from 56 to 53.
Enough of that for a day or so.
Enough of that for a day or so.
It won't really prove that much though. Many teams could probably run Mei on every map, they're just making it a harder win, it's not impossible.
He has a role, it's just very situational. He rose out of F tier to D tier as Illios got picked a stupid amount due to everyone agreeing to a stage they all hate, which junkrat is good on for the death pit. It's the same reason the tanks had their roles flipped largely.
He isn't someone you can use on the majority of the maps though. He's viable in some cases, but it's not anything like whats being said in here.
We should also note D Tier is still pitifully low for a character.
I mean you can argue the semantics about it, but there are times when it is flat out incorrect to be outside of meta once it's been established. I like it when stuff gets busted and surprises happen, but it just doesn't usually. You know me, I'd rather know as much as possible about what I can do to win and see what I can do to have fun. If the meta is fun I climb, if not I play more casually or not at all.
I mean, I get that most people dgaf, but when people talk about balance and what is good or isn't I'll talk about meta because that's our best understanding of current balance. I like talking about it
if people wanna play off meta for fun and not give a fuck that's fine and great, but I also will chime in when those same people wanna talk about balance and strats.Also yeah current meta OW is kinda shit and restricted. I hope it gets fixed after Gamescom.
Edit: on trash mouse specifically he's D tier cause niche, but that doesn't make him a good DPS. He just has "usable" moments is all.
i said i'm done talking about it!
orthodoxy1095
Banned
I mean, some of the characters I play go against the meta. There's nothing wrong with that as long as you're aware of the shortcomings of the character you've picked over a better one.
I always get confused when people say defense heroes are weak when junkrat behind reins shield is a solid alternative to pharah in terms of aoe damage and he can out put solid damage to take out enemy reins shield or just spamming grenades on payloads to get enemies off.
He might be overshadowed by pharah but he is no slouch. Defense heroes are weak yes but not junkrat.
He might be overshadowed by pharah but he is no slouch. Defense heroes are weak yes but not junkrat.
My rank is 215 I think. In competitive highest was 68 (like 1% off 69) but right now it's 67.
https://www.overbuff.com/players/psn/Undignify
If interested included my profile.
Junkrat is the exception to this rule, though. The others are situational, and if given the choice, I would rather help my team with a Support or Tank Hero, as at least I can feel like I'm contributing to the cause.
Dead Prince
Banned
what would it be if zen was faster (i don't meant when he ults).
he's just as fun as Lucio but i need that lucio to stay on speed lol.
discording people is fun. i think i'm more aware of my surrounding than some of my teammates. because i'm backline.
harassing widow is fun too lol.
he's just as fun as Lucio but i need that lucio to stay on speed lol.
discording people is fun. i think i'm more aware of my surrounding than some of my teammates. because i'm backline.
harassing widow is fun too lol.
If we're solely talking balance
Junkrat is situational
In the cases where he isn't situational, the matches are casual enough that no one is situational and the win comes from outplaying them or such.
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