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Overwatch |OT8| Our love will last Pharah-ver
- Thread starter ExMachina
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interesting, thanks for trying tho.i guess i'll go give it a try just now.
Let me know your test results, I'm not entirely sure that 2 days of playing Horizon has messed up my internal aiming calibration for OW.
Well at least it seems that I'm not the only one. I guess I'll have to try it again tomorrow before I start up Horizon as well.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Also seriously I've barely seen any bastions today.
The ones that I've met are not really that much of a problem?
The ones that I've met are not really that much of a problem?
Usually the higher sensitivity you are the more noticeable the aim assist is.
I havent play bastion but from what i saw from stream, bastion is just a less agile 76 but better meatbag. Atleast its more killable than the previous ptr version.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Also apparently the koreans are kinda eh on bastion.
And they were the ones who are more willing to pull out old bastion than most.
I'd be interested to see if more new strategies can develop with the bastion change, but I'm just not seeing the panic now honestly. Like for real though, I had one match where we couldn't deal with bastion, but that was more due to the team being so fucking disorganised.
And they were the ones who are more willing to pull out old bastion than most.
I'd be interested to see if more new strategies can develop with the bastion change, but I'm just not seeing the panic now honestly. Like for real though, I had one match where we couldn't deal with bastion, but that was more due to the team being so fucking disorganised.
I play on very low sensitivity, 25/15.
Before this latest patch I can do what I need to do with Soldier and it feels good, somehow today he now feels incredibly sluggish in the training arena.
25/15? Holy shit, that's low.
it seems like winning at higher levels with bastion requires building the entire team around him and playing to support him, but if you do that it's super effective and the entire enemy team has to play to counter bastion.
Yeah I'm an old man, I don't have the hand eye coordination nor reflexes to play at high sensitivity. This is why I tend to stick to mid to long range characters and I can't play Genji nor Tracer very well (if at all).
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
The problem with building your team around one hero is that once that hero dies the entire team falls apart.
I've watched more matches, and here are my thoughts on how best to deal with him:
1) dive the shit out of him.
2) take advantage of how immobile a bastion siege comp is. The time it takes for bastion to adjust sightlines is honestly killer despite the speed buff.
I think the mindset that you have to devote your team to taking him out makes him OP is kinda the wrong one to take. You focus him down because it is easy to focus him down, and if bastion is in the comp it means that he's taking the place of a more mobile and harder to hit DPS. Once you get rid of their major source of DPS you can more often than not just snowball from that.
Of course, he chews through really disorganised comps which you get more often than not in solo Q.
well part of the problem with that is actually killing him. if he has a rein shield, zarya bubble, ana boost, and pocket mercy you have to kill basically all of them first starting with the mercy or he's not dying in the first place.
obviously it can be done but that kind of game isn't very fun to me.
I mean, I'm guessing (going by Reinforce on reddit) that most high level teams right now are counter stratting Bastion more than playing him right now.The character requires a different strat to deal with, but nothing that seems unmatchable by any means. Scrim rumors point to it not working out all that often but it's still p dangerous.
In soloq it's like people are trying to Rein + Zarya deathball into pocketed ass Bastions and that just doesn't work. It's troublesome that he is doign dumb ass shit in competitive ladder games, but it's mad overhyped because if the general playerbase has taught us anything it's that they can't counterstrat even the most basic bullshit.
It's not even like that though. If you just move around the thing and take your kills it can fall apart. If they wanna run a hard ass protect the Bastion comp they are gonna have issues with mobility specifically.
In soloq it's like people are trying to Rein + Zarya deathball into pocketed ass Bastions and that just doesn't work. It's troublesome that he is doign dumb ass shit in competitive ladder games, but it's mad overhyped because if the general playerbase has taught us anything it's that they can't counterstrat even the most basic bullshit.
It's not even like that though. If you just move around the thing and take your kills it can fall apart. If they wanna run a hard ass protect the Bastion comp they are gonna have issues with mobility specifically.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Also problem is solo Q dps are fucking boring most of the time and only run soldier + pharah more often than not lol.
It's rare to see anything divey at my level anyway.
But still, the times I've ran into him I haven't really thought "OMG I CAN'T DEAL WITH THIS". Even forced changes more often than not.
It's rare to see anything divey at my level anyway.
But still, the times I've ran into him I haven't really thought "OMG I CAN'T DEAL WITH THIS". Even forced changes more often than not.
Yup. Rember the rogue vs nrg ish hanamura match from seagull stream. Seagulls group play mobility and obj to their advantage that forced akm's bastion group to fall apart lol
Tbf I think Rogue 6 stacking into comp today has more to do with them fucking around trying things out rather than going super hard.
Idk. I think there are things about the character that are clearly just not okay for the sake of comp ladder, but at higher levels people haven't quite figured out what's going on with him yet.
I literally just said pub solo q can't deal with him lol
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Thing is dumb shit happen all the time in pub solo Q. I've even seen old bastion putting in work in pub solo Q.
Kor of Memory
Member
I really don't see an issue with the SR drop thing. I realize this is my opinion alone, but I don't think it's going to be that big of a deal.
My only complaint might be that the threshold for decaying SR should maybe be raised to 3500 or possibly even 4000.
I feel like people are interpreting this as if you don't play 7 times a week, then you're SR is going to drop to 3000 instantly, but the math is much more complicated than that.
Please keep in mind that anytime your SR drops from lack of playing, the way you earn SR also gets tampered with.
As someone who lost 700SR in Season 3 from lack of playing, my losses usually didn't impact my SR at all, and my wins were in the 60-80SR a game range.
My only complaint might be that the threshold for decaying SR should maybe be raised to 3500 or possibly even 4000.
I feel like people are interpreting this as if you don't play 7 times a week, then you're SR is going to drop to 3000 instantly, but the math is much more complicated than that.
Please keep in mind that anytime your SR drops from lack of playing, the way you earn SR also gets tampered with.
As someone who lost 700SR in Season 3 from lack of playing, my losses usually didn't impact my SR at all, and my wins were in the 60-80SR a game range.
Karsticles
Member
The only thing that might need to be adjusted with Bastion is the spread on his stationary mode. It's still pretty easy to turn people into mulch from afar. Otherwise, I think he's a great example of how a "Defense" character can be changed so that he's usable even on Attack.
I don't think we can really analyse what Seagull is doing on Bastion and compare it to the rest of us. He's one of the best Bastions in the world and was in a pro team 6 stack doing placements. They rolled everyone but they were very well coordinated and had everyone on their best heroes. Not the same as a normal queue experience.
My only concern from what I saw was that even Rogue's dive couldn't really do much vs Bastion. They had to commit too many resources and just lost the fight anyway.
My only concern from what I saw was that even Rogue's dive couldn't really do much vs Bastion. They had to commit too many resources and just lost the fight anyway.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
I think getting rid of ironclad might be the way to go but he's kinda terrible without it.
it's stupid to have a damage reduction passive at all, they should just add armor if they want him to be tankier
True, but like pocketed Bastion surviving nanoboosted ults that normally wipe entire teams? That's pretty wild. Like, conceptually I get how to deal with that and why it's kinda not the end of the world, but let's face it it's the end of the world for anybody not in a really organized setting.
Tbf I think Bastion being good and meta relevant is bad for anybody that can't play in a pretty organized environment. Like, fuck balance in that case tbh. Bastion should've just remained mostly ass at top/pro level. I love him but his mechanical fit in this game is just plain bad.
I actually think it's pretty cool. Tbh if there were more ways to reduce incoming healing besides lol Ana nade I don't think he'd be an issue. They wanted his advanced forms to feel distinctly more beefy and changing the healthbar on switch is clunky and hard to read and shitty. The solution they have is pretty good, but like it's broke. But, without the character is fucking garbage again.
He does kind of need armor or something like ironclad in turret mode because otherwise he instantly dies without even that much focused fire, just like old bastion.
I agree that Seagull's stream is not very representative of what to expect because they're all pros and Seagull's aim was impeccable with Bastion. We most likely won't see people that good or teams that are that coordinated in our own games.
I agree that Seagull's stream is not very representative of what to expect because they're all pros and Seagull's aim was impeccable with Bastion. We most likely won't see people that good or teams that are that coordinated in our own games.
finalflame
Member
Conversely, they were going up against GROUPED pros who also knew how to coordinate and try to effectively take down the Bastion, most of whom couldn't. It goes both ways.
Shake Appeal
Member
My guess is Blizzard are conscious that there are some underhand ways to deliberately tank the server if you were losing.
TheLetdown
Member
The more I see him, the more I feel the damage reduction isn't really the problem.
His self-heal is so rapid with no penalty anymore, that it keeps him dangerous. The speed he heals might need tweaking, because i really like the fast swap between modes, which makes him playable, and wouldn't want to see that change.
His self-heal is so rapid with no penalty anymore, that it keeps him dangerous. The speed he heals might need tweaking, because i really like the fast swap between modes, which makes him playable, and wouldn't want to see that change.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Who might also not know how to play him. Who knows.
Things written by players playing in high level scrims is that a bastion comp can be pretty dangerous, but there are counter comps that can be easily pulled out against him and once that happens, what do? People are still learning to play with him and around him but people like Reinforce thinks it's overhyped.
Yeah I feel like his self heal is possibly the strongest part of his toolkit atm. It builds ult, he can move whilst doing it and self heal has a lot more value now in sentry/tank form. Like I couldn't really do anything with tactical visor vs Bastion in sentry who's self healing.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Healing? What healing?
<_< >_>
<_< >_>
Ana main
Tbf if he is self healing he isn't dealing damage. Like, so what if you can't kill it, but if it's stuck healing or moving or something that's something.
I know everybody wants to wipe teams with their ults and walk around behind a Rein shield but Idk if Bastion is going to allow that to happen :T
I know everybody wants to wipe teams with their ults and walk around behind a Rein shield but Idk if Bastion is going to allow that to happen :T
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Also i did have a pretty sweet first point hold with a friendly bastion as the only ones on point just by boosting him.
As ana i kinda love playing with and against bastions.
As ana i kinda love playing with and against bastions.
Bumbletron
Member
To me the most fucked up thing about bastion is that it makes Ana even more necessary on BOTH teams.
Fuck that shit
Fuck that shit
Tactical visor wouldn't do any better than normal against bastion. It doesn't increase his damage I think does it? And I think you don't headshot with it? Not sure though. All it does DPS wise is faster reload.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
You speak as if not buffing bastion would make ana fall out of the meta.
Bumbletron
Member
It wouldn't, but adding yet more things she's required to run/counter is not good at all
LucidMomentum
Member
So I might not get to play my placements until next week.
Is it looking like Season 3 part two SR wise, where people end up 1-200 below their season end rank and then get points boosts up to around their season high?
Is it looking like Season 3 part two SR wise, where people end up 1-200 below their season end rank and then get points boosts up to around their season high?
Yea, I noticed that too and it seems ot happen with Symm for me way more than other heroes. I wish it wasn't included. Default sucks.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Maybe. I feel like a zen dive team is pretty good against him too.
And a siege comp that you need for bastion usually requires an ana anyway.
Whatever though, i love playing ana so make more comps where she's necessary, I don't care.
TheLetdown
Member
In an optimal min/max perspective, yeah. But in a practical sense, outhealing damage from a Lucio, for example, who used to punish stationary targets, might be on the extreme side.
And for the record, I don't want any changes to Bastion at all ATM. I think there's a learning curve that needs to happen. Frankly, I'm happy he was buffed at all. Not because I like the character (he's not really my playstyle) but because I don't want a character on the roster who is flat unplayable. And he was. And now he isn't.
I want to see where this goes. And I agree that it's cool to have Bastion there to stop those wombo combo lulz moments. That's fresh and fun.
I just found it interesting that a solo DPS ult couldn't kill him in sentry form. He can heal through a lot of stuff in sentry mode because your HP is more valuable.
https://clips.twitch.tv/ConfidentSuspiciousMilkAMPTropPunch
If you're talking about this he has:
Self healing
Damage reducing passive
Ana nade
Zen orb
edit: also a hit regged on Zarya shield and not on him.
That we can see. Not even counting if Ana is healing him. I get it looks wild but seriously there's a lot going on there. Any tanky hero can survive nanoblade with Ana nade + 3 sources of healing.
Well that's a shame. I play at 65-70 (except for Winston, I've got him at 85), but if a week passes and I haven't played a single game it's really hard to get the aiming "right" again.
Bumbletron
Member
After thinking about it last night, honestly the best strat against Bastion comps is going to be trip/quad dps comps without McCree or (probably?) Reaper. The spread on his gun is too much for any pressure on Pharah. You also straight up need more than two sources of consistent damage on the thing. Playing any tank against him will suck, but D.Va/Winston will be your best bet just hoping to take him out with the team before he tears through your DM/Bubble.
Really hope next tank is something that can benefit dive or provide unique positioning options
Really hope next tank is something that can benefit dive or provide unique positioning options
He gets the Zen orb last second. Pretty funny that Ana nade can make Bastion survive nanoblade. He still had 50% HP left lol.
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