Fucking scum.
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Paris Terrorist Attacks, 120+ dead. Do not post hearsay/unsourced/old news.
- Thread starter chadskin
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Fucking scum.
You are obligated to carry an ID with you in Germany.
Stereogatari
Banned
Did they make an honest effort? Iraq and Adghanistan seemed like 95% Military and very little building works and business start ups or w/e else a country needs to kick start itself away from doom and gloom.
PJV3
Member
Tea party, American radio stuff etc.
He corrected me and he's right. You are not required to carry it with you. Police can bring you to aa police station though if you cannot show a valid ID.
Maninthemirror
Banned
Yes security check is a legitimate issue which could result in this if this is confirmed while real refugees is a legitimate humanitarian issues where if one doesnt let real refugees in there is a chance that the civilian deaths in the war will be in the thousands per year
Occupying a large swath of the Middle east rooted in the belief you can force western values at gunpoint and do so both successfully and without severe blowback from the natives is the height of naivety.
Logistically and strategically it is impossible. That's before even mentioning the problems we know arise when you try and govern a country under constant defacto martial law using a force that is primarily trained to kill and is largely ignorant of the culture and people they are occupying.
Marvel
could never
Yes, great job on security's part but I cannot imagine the horror they felt seeing the vest.
Shao Kahn on the Lawn
Member
People like that can be very myopic and suppressive when introduced to an idea that makes them uncomfortable.
It doesn't take much imagination to see the danger in allowing tens of thousands of migrants from a war-torn region to move in mass with little or no controls or tracking. Unfortunately, there are still people here who think that burying their heads in the sand and pretending that it isn't a problem will score them imaginary points among their peers.
The duty and responsibily of government should first and foremost revolve around providing safety and stability to one's own citizens. When that core responsibility is at stake, all other considerations should take a back seat.
Maninthemirror
Banned
Sick bastards
He sounds like a weapons dealer type of guy. Pretty much the one you call if you don't have the means to weapons, but the money to pay. Pure speculation, of course.
Fear always lead to poor decissions... 911 cought.. Iraq invasion.. Cought ISIS raising..
I have faith in Europe making a smarter response
It's 2003 all over again.
DXLelouch153
Banned
we really need to develop a way to disarm suicide bombers somehow
someway to neutralize the bomb itself
how i have no fucking idea
someway to neutralize the bomb itself
how i have no fucking idea
CitizenVectron
Member
Someone on another forum suggested this:
I'm not sure I agree with all the details, but the idea is interesting. Would treating the region like post-war Germany/Japan possibly produce a favourable outcome? It couldn't happen without China though, I think (politically). It would basically be a "the world has had enough, everyone is now going to fix your problems for you" situation. You'd need the US, EU, and China on board. Russia too if they want, but they could be left out if they are whiny enough. Not sure how you'd get China on board with fixing the region though unless you also allow them big investment opportunities like they are doing in Africa.
I'm not sure I agree with all the details, but the idea is interesting. Would treating the region like post-war Germany/Japan possibly produce a favourable outcome? It couldn't happen without China though, I think (politically). It would basically be a "the world has had enough, everyone is now going to fix your problems for you" situation. You'd need the US, EU, and China on board. Russia too if they want, but they could be left out if they are whiny enough. Not sure how you'd get China on board with fixing the region though unless you also allow them big investment opportunities like they are doing in Africa.
BlazingDarkness
Member
Well said.
newdayrocks
Member
What's the deal with Molenbeek?
Stereogatari
Banned
Kurds will only get Rojava and Northern Iraq.
I don't think Iran controlling Sunni Arabs would work.
But in general I like this idea.
DietRob
i've been begging for over 5 years.
Can you imagine patting someone down and finding what is worst case scenario? Great job by the security team.
Oh man that article is amazing.
"Immigrants are now all single males, as this video of a few random people proves"
And their "anonymous source", that wasn't even speaking to them, apparently has this amazing insider knowledge about essentially unknowable things. It's too great.
I hope this is sarcasm. I've always had you down as one of the more intelligent posters on this board but I really don't even know anymore. Wat
superdeluxe
Member
Holy cow..
Actually yes, they did. You should read some books like Imperial Life in the Emerald City that speaks about how the rebuilding effort tried to modernize Iraq and build back up their infrastructure and economy. It largely looks specifically at how America approached rebuilding their various ministries and the overarching strategy and why it failed.
But like always happens in imperialism things aren't sunshine and roses. Corruption, human nature, improper strategy, ego, the setback from the initial war, anti-occupation, lack of human resources, ignorance of culture and numerous other forces make it impossible to reach any semblance of an ideal.
The perfect Dark
Banned
Same on n-tv. Ist's worse than google translation
Stereogatari
Banned
Thanks for the suggested reading. I legitimately didn't know.
Awful. My condolences.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/25/w...onfronts-the-jihadist-danger-within.html?_r=0
This gives some more information. Molenbeek always been a problem zone for these kinds of things.
GoldenEye 007
Member
At this point, anything has to be on the table. If it's looking at an addressing historical issues that have led to that sentiment, military action, doing something with Saudi Arabia, etc.. then so be it. All I'm saying is that what is being done now isn't working and something else is likely going to have to be attempted. I don't know what that is. I don't think anyone does.
I got into a long discussion about this last light so I'm not going to retread much, but I'm not sure a large-scale, sustained, total conflict (coupled with competent rebuilding of the region) should be off the table.
Edit: And yeah I saw your other post. Iraq and Afghanistan certainly were not sunshine and roses. Many mistakes were made, corruption, etc. So yeah a long shot and unlikely at this time but, ideally there are checks to help prevent mistakes made in those countries by involving multiple countries in the process and finding competent local leaders that can establish legitimacy in government and control.
Stereogatari
Banned
I've had enough of these god damned terror attacks. That's the long and short of it. I've never felt as sad over a terror attack as I do for this one. Even the recent bombings in Turkey didn't leave me this upset and reactionary.
Damn... Rest In Peace to the victims, and hopefully won't have anymore death.
Please stop spewing garbage.
Abinash117
Member
The idea the guy posted is unrealistic and pretty dumb. Something like some idealistic WW2 scenario. Going after Saudi Arabia who is an ally to the US and in part some European countries is dumb as all hell as it would cause another enemy to deal with and hurt military and political interest between the US and SA. SA has deep pockets and has many connections; trying to go after them without any good reason ( because there evil or something like that is not a good reason ) is just opening a can of worms. Heck, the US prevented SA/ Gulf Nations from doing dangerous things ( like spending MANPADS to the rebels) because they are allies.
China is not an active military country and have shown no signs getting involved you're right about that. NATO countries aren't willing to work with Russia and they don't trust Russia. Lastly, having foreign people split a country like whatever you want is unfair and dangerous. You are going to start conflicts that way.
And you think trying to forcibly convert people to a new culture (and religion, I assume) would make things better and not worse. Okay.
It's not to say Iraq couldn't of had a better outcome had those in charge of the occupation not been so philosophically wrong and ignorant of local forces. It probably could have. Certain measures all but guaranteed failure from the moment they were put into place.
Had they not been committed we probably could of had a much smoother occupation and transition of power. But what You are calling for: complete takeover of a territory and to model it in the ideal of western society is a task of monumental proportions. Which would require far more resources - both human and non-human - then Iraq and Afghanistan. With no clear way I can see how it wouldn't turn into a clusterfuck.
The Lamonster
Member
No tolerance. Instant death penalty - immediately shoot them in the head? Obviously that's very extreme. I don't know either.
Dead man's switch detonates if you try to kill a suicide bomber before they manually set off
hydragonwarrior
Member
The only proper solution is to gather enough intel to know exactly where each major group or subdivision of the Islamic state is, go after a group, and repeat.
The better solution is to do this, but to also have all local governments that appear to be housing this group to co-operate so this is all done within the same 24-48 hours.
I think this is a good solution without having to create another quagmire in Syria or what not, because ISIS is also a group that is small. This was a tally from last year:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/isis-b...ch-the-militant-organization-may-be-1.2746332
Any army of 20k (let's say) in 2015. But has no nation. They are split up on top of that, and even if they are armed to the teeth, taking them out in a co-ordinated fashion should be possible.
It means also that you'd have to co-operate with one "evil" government to eliminate another. Because we all know what happens if you try to force your own government onto others...
Yeah I don't know how they trigger the devices - is it by hand or something? Either way, the moment you realize they have it on them (and it's mostly likely a law enforcement guy), they'll probably pull it within 2-3 seconds. You would have to be an expert shot to pull it off...
Dogs or a type of animal with a sensitive smell might be the best answer. I'm sure strapped explosives have a particular smell that you can't get away from.
The better solution is to do this, but to also have all local governments that appear to be housing this group to co-operate so this is all done within the same 24-48 hours.
I think this is a good solution without having to create another quagmire in Syria or what not, because ISIS is also a group that is small. This was a tally from last year:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/isis-b...ch-the-militant-organization-may-be-1.2746332
Any army of 20k (let's say) in 2015. But has no nation. They are split up on top of that, and even if they are armed to the teeth, taking them out in a co-ordinated fashion should be possible.
It means also that you'd have to co-operate with one "evil" government to eliminate another. Because we all know what happens if you try to force your own government onto others...
Yeah I don't know how they trigger the devices - is it by hand or something? Either way, the moment you realize they have it on them (and it's mostly likely a law enforcement guy), they'll probably pull it within 2-3 seconds. You would have to be an expert shot to pull it off...
Dogs or a type of animal with a sensitive smell might be the best answer. I'm sure strapped explosives have a particular smell that you can't get away from.
The Lamonster
Member
Is that standard practice with these types of bombs?
SkylineRKR
Member
Molenbeek has a lot of shit. It has areas the police hardly even comes anymore. Its a breeding area for terrorists and they know it. Such places are a huge issue for Belgium and Europe in general.
Abinash117
Member
That's start up imperialism.
Stereogatari
Banned
Nope. I'm saying go to those countries and make them like Turkey (ideally without a brown equivalent of Erdoğan). I want every Muslim country to be as economically and socially "Westernised" (brackets emphasised) as Turkey. I don't see any other way to do it except by hitting the Islamist Militants hard. That's how we solved the Nazis isn't it?
I mean, if you were a suicide bomber, wouldn't it be?
Surely that's the first thing they learn at suicide bomber school.
theignoramus
Member
As bad as the Iraq invasion turned out, it wasnt inherently doomed to fail:if the Americans had secured the borders and been more moderate in their application of "deBaathification" (which alienated the Sunni minority) they may have prevented the carnage that broke out.
And occupying the ISIS "caliphate" wouldnt be about "forcing western values" on the population, it would be about putting an end to a regime that promotes sexual slavery, commits mass executions, threatens ethnic minorities with genocide and exports a fanatic terrorist ideology to rest of the world.
soundscream
Member
Ha, if only that was the plan........there was no plan.
This incident has me attempting to re-consider this ISIS issue as a whole. Some have said it is the most dangerous warfare of our time... would you guys consider ISIS harder to defeat then, say, the Nazis or Japanese? Of course the aforementioned forces resulted in a full on war, but combating ISIS requires something different then simple explosions and overwhelming through numbers.
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