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[Ether_Snake]

Three out of the seven identified as French nationals, so far. Three brothers were involved in the attack, one still at large.

One of the men arrested in Belgium is the brother of the man who rented the black Volkswagen Polo, BFMTV has reported. That man is still at large and being hunted by Belgian and French police.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/li...s-live-updates#block-5648abf1e4b0ced428cb2a82

West needs to put aside the rhetoric and support Assad.
I mean Jordan and Saudi Arabia governments are not there by the will of the people either yet they get full western support. Only the state can guarantee stability and health.

Support for Assad helps Iran and Russia, so the west is against it.

 

[Boke1879]

West needs to put aside the rhetoric and support Assad.
I mean Jordan and Saudi Arabia governments are not there by the will of the people either yet they get full western support. Only the state can guarantee stability and health.

Was just watching some news program here in the America. They had a former CIA Director on there I think.

He pretty much said. Maybe we need to look at the situation with Assad again. He said maybe he's part of the solution.

 

[outunderthestars]

West needs to put aside the rhetoric and support Assad.
I mean Jordan and Saudi Arabia governments are not there by the will of the people either yet they get full western support. Only the state can guarantee stability and health.

I'd like to see us find a way to work with Russia on fighting ISIS.

 

[FStop7]

Sometimes...even if people on social media, be it Facebook or Twitter, want to bring awareness to more atrocities/massacres it can come across in a very "You're not allowed to be sad about Paris" way...

I saw someone on my friends list basically eyeroll that FB had a french flag but doesn't have a corresponding flag for other countries that suffer...and someone else mentioned that in their case it's relative ignorance, not that they don't care but they don't always know.

It's sorta the same for me and I guess the same for a lot of people. Maybe there's more of a sense of hostility when you read text because you can't always see how someone typed it in the way you can hear someone speak.

They are people I know irl...but while there's nothing wrong with drawing attention to other causes when one of them starts reposting a person raving about it being a false flag and zionist conspiracies...someone else posted that the west's lack of reaction to events is one of the reasons people hate the west...which i can sorta understand but its also...

People on my FB/Twitter lists who were in a rush to politicize Paris have all been removed.

 

[Hex]

Looks like the one in the car being looked for still is one of three brothers involved.

 

[888]

Went back a few pages and didn't see it covered. I guess one of the bombers came in with the refugees as some expected could happen. I imagine this is going to change the processing of future refugees. I imagine any country that took them in is on high alert at the moment.

Which country was it that refused to take them in because they suspected something like this could happen?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/15/world/paris-attacks/index.html

 

[Resident_UA]

The whole thing is so fucked up. Now I see France leadership sending signals that they should be cooperating with Russia. RUSSIA? Really? The same Russia which is responsible for thousands of deaths in Ukraine.

I get that Beirut attacks are largely ignored in Europe. Just look at the thread abut Beirut bombing on NeoGaf. It's barely 3 pages. But Ukraine is part of European continent and it still got ignored in comparison. Even investigation of MH17 flight that was shot down over Ukraine was largely played down outside of Netherlands. And more people died there...

Sorry about this rant, but it looks like coverage of this horrific event in Paris has nothing to do with showing respect or informing people. It's used to scare people into agreeing with whatever the politicians want to do...

 

[-ImaginaryInsider]

There's been plenty of countries/nations throughout history that were screwed as a result of losing a war (and far worse than Germany after WW1), yet it's one of the few times that a nation willingly handed the power to warmongering genocidal scumbags and went with it for the next 12 years. You might see it as a natural and logical consequence of WWI, I see it as evil and cowardly on the part of the German nation of that era.

Carthage handed things over (specifically their war effort against Rome) to Hannibal after the loss of the first Punic War, and he was probably just as blood-thirsty and warmongering as Hitler. Also there is no exact comparison in history to what World War 1 was or what it specifically did to the generation that endured it.

*Notice I'm not actually justifying the holocaust.*

*Edited to clarify what Carthage handed over*

 

[Ether_Snake]

The whole thing is so fucked up. Now I see France leadership sending signals that they should be cooperating with Russia. RUSSIA? Really? The same Russia which is responsible for thousands of deaths in Ukraine.

I get that Beirut attacks are largely ignored in Europe. Just look at the thread abut Beirut bombing on NeoGaf. It's barely 3 pages. But Ukraine is part of European continent and it still got ignored in comparison. Even investigation of MH17 flight that was shot down over Ukraine was largely played down outside of Netherlands. And more people died there...

Sorry about this rant, but it looks like coverage of this horrific event in Paris has nothing to do with showing respect or informing people. It's used to scare people into agreeing with whatever the politicians want to do...

Maybe they wouldn't have to cooperate with Russia if they weren't the only ones trying to help the Syrian government deal with IS.

 

[Resident_UA]

Maybe they wouldn't have to cooperate with Russia if they weren't the only ones trying to help the Syrian government deal with IS.

Russia couldn't care less about ISIS. Last I checked most of their bombings are outside of ISIS controlled area...

 

[Simon Belmont]

Carthage handed things over to Hannibal after the loss of the first Punic War, and he was probably just as blood-thirsty and warmongering as Hitler. Also there is no exact comparison in history to what World War 1 was or what it specifically did to the generation that endured it.

*Notice I'm not actually justifying the holocaust.*

Carthage did no such thing. Hannibal was a General, Carthage was still being run by it's Senate.

 

[888]

Russia couldn't care less about ISIS. Last I checked most of their bombings are outside of ISIS controlled area...

Yeah the way I took it, they were there mostly to hold up assad. Not directly target isis.

 

[KurtSloane]

Went back a few pages and didn't see it covered. I guess one of the bombers came in with the refugees as some expected could happen. I imagine this is going to change the processing of future refugees. I imagine any country that took them in is on high alert at the moment.

Which country was it that refused to take them in because they suspected something like this could happen?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/15/world/paris-attacks/index.html

More will do so, people being able to pass through countries without restriction is madness.

Poland is refusing the EU mandated quota, more will follow along with those that already have.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Russia couldn't care less about ISIS. Last I checked most of their bombings are outside of ISIS controlled area...

So France will coordinate with Russia to not attack IS? Yeah right.

You don't fight IS by taking down the Syrian government, did you learn nothing from Iraq and Libya? Everywhere the governments are weakened, the extremists take over.

 

[Violet_0]

Maybe they wouldn't have to cooperate with Russia if they weren't the only ones trying to help the Syrian government deal with IS.

probably has to do with the fact that they don't exactly want to cooperate with a murderous despot who is responsible for the mass exodus of Syrian refugees and ISIS rise to power in the first place

 

[Palette Swap]

The whole thing is so fucked up. Now I see France leadership sending signals that they should be cooperating with Russia. RUSSIA? Really? The same Russia which is responsible for thousands of deaths in Ukraine.

I get that Beirut attacks are largely ignored in Europe. Just look at the thread abut Beirut bombing on NeoGaf. It's barely 3 pages. But Ukraine is part of European continent and it still got ignored in comparison. Even investigation of MH17 flight that was shot down over Ukraine was largely played down outside of Netherlands. And more people died there...

Sorry about this rant, but it looks like coverage of this horrific event in Paris has nothing to do with showing respect or informing people. It's used to scare people into agreeing with whatever the politicians want to do...

So far, only the opposition leader and former president has sent that signal. That doesn't mean the government won't, obviously, but they haven't hinted at it so far.

Bear in mind this is the same opposition that had a congressman meeting Assad yesterday, completely disregarding our current foreign policy in the midst of a crisis. "Traitorous cunt" would be putting it mildly.

 

[Jackpot]

Support for Assad helps Iran and Russia, so the west is against it.

Assad has also killed way more civilians in the civil war than ISIS. Who do you think is dropping the barrel bombs?

There was even a thread about an article about Syrians fleeing attacks from Assad's air force and the very first post said it was terrible what ISIS was doing and he was sure Syrians would rather have Assad ruling them if it meant protection from ISIS.

 

[Resident_UA]

So France will coordinate with Russia to not attack IS? Yeah right.

You don't fight IS by taking down the Syria government, did you learn nothing from Iraq and Libya?

Look I'm neutral on Syria topic. I don't pretend to know motivations of every faction in Syria. It looks like Assad is an asshole but some of the factions fighting him are not better than him. I'm just 100% positive that Russia doesn't give a fuck about ISIS. All that will happen is France coordinates with Russia is that Russian media will be able to say "we were right all along and now France agrees". On the ground nothing will change because you can't fight ISIS by bombing. The only winner here is Russian propaganda.

 

[joedan]

If ISIS is trying to get rid of Assad, and Russia is trying to prop up Assad how could one say that Russia couldn't care less about ISIS?

 

[Resident_UA]

If ISIS is trying to get rid of Assad, and Russia is trying to prop up Assad how could one say that Russia couldn't care less about ISIS?

ISIS is trying to get rid of pretty much everyone on this planet. Not sure what your point is.

 

[DiipuSurotu]

More will do so, people being able to pass through countries without restriction is madness.

Poland is refusing the EU mandated quota, more will follow along with those that already have.

Poland is about to have a change of government. The new government (Conservatives) never intended to uphold the quota actually.

 

[Stereogatari]

It all comes back to abject poverty. Groups like ISIS don't happen when you have a population with a thriving economy that can afford to feed, clothes, and shelter itself. Groups like ISIS happen because they approach people who've been watching their children starve to death and they say "strap this bomb to your chest and we'll give your family $10,000". We don't need to send 100,000 troops to the Middle East, we need to send 100,000 doctors and teachers along with freighters full of food and supplies.

It's not just that. It's Islamist Supremacism. These guys are the Islamist equivalent of White Nationalists, except they're actually putting their crazy bullshit into action. I think these European born Muslims in particular that are joining, grow up with a mentality that Muslims are getting shat on Worldwide (which is an incorrect mentality), so joining ISIS is their way of fighting back. I doubt these people had much pride in their ethnic backgrounds, and so are easy prey to Salafi Jihadist brainwashing.

But the core of how ISIS started is on the lines you've said. Disenfranchised people from Iraq and Syria make up the bulk of ISIS. Fueled by zealotry, they feel it's their time to shine after years of being in the shit. If these guys could have just been given a smooth transition to democracy all those years ago post-WW1...if only, if only! Hell I'd go as far as to say they would have been better off under Turkish rule, but who knows if a Turkish hegemony would have also fueled such zealotry fueled backlash...Looking at the mentality of Arabs from Turkey though perhaps it would have been fine...

 

[Frustrated_me]

If ISIS is trying to get rid of Assad, and Russia is trying to prop up Assad how could one say that Russia couldn't care less about ISIS?

As far as Assad is concerned, ISIS isn't the main threat in Syria, it's the rebel factions.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Look I'm neutral on Syria topic. I don't pretend to know motivations of every faction in Syria. It looks like Assad is an asshole but some of the factions fighting him are not better than him. I'm just 100% positive that Russia doesn't give a fuck about ISIS. All that will happen is France coordinates with Russia is that Russian media will be able to say "we were right all along and now France agrees". On the ground nothing will change because you can't fight ISIS by bombing. The only winner here is Russian propaganda.

Russia can't get rid of IS, so they are defending their Syrian ally. Trying to do more than that would probably be futile and put themselves at risk. Obviously, defending Syria means preventing IS from making gains in Syria, not just other factions.

And it's not Russia that created this mess to begin with.

 

[Herb Alpert]

If ISIS is trying to get rid of Assad, and Russia is trying to prop up Assad how could one say that Russia couldn't care less about ISIS?

The strange thing is that ISIS cares more about Killing other islamists like al nosra than Killing assad.
Assad and IS depend on each other. Assad is partly responsible of IS rise, when he let islamists go from state prisons at the begining of syrian spring to say "look, it's me or them"
IS needs assad because he is a source of division among international community that prevent it to strike them.
It's a mess.

 

[-ImaginaryInsider]

Carthage did no such thing. Hannibal was a General, Carthage was still being run by it's Senate.

"Carthage, in a desperate spot put a warmongering blood thirsty individual in a position of power" was the general point, not that Hannibal was Dictator of Carthage ala Hitler in Germany. Unhinged individuals being given power in desperate times isn't exactly new, Germany didn't invent that.

 

[AngryNapkin]

probably has to do with the fact that they don't exactly want to cooperate with a murderous despot who is responsible for the mass exodus of Syrian refugees and ISIS rise to power in the first place

Assad didn't create ISIS

 

[cartoon_soldier]

When it comes to Syria, Vox has some good info on what a clusterfuck it is

And a 5 minute video:
http://www.vox.com/2015/11/14/9735102/syria-isis-history-video

 

[Herb Alpert]

Assad didn't create ISIS

He just helped them grow.

 

[Nivash]

Assad didn't create ISIS

Assad is a genocidal dictator with blood on his hands. His attempt to stop the political protests against him by massacring the protesters directly ignited the Syrian civil war and set the stage for ISIS in its current form.

 

[Frustrated_me]

Assad didn't create ISIS

He sure assisted in sending ISIS members into Iraq though. What goes around comes around, don't harbour terrorists.

 

[E-phonk]

Currently stuck in hamburg airport because of suspicious luggage. They closed everything down. People seem nervous (although that could just be because missing their flight)

 

[Simon Belmont]

"Carthage, in a desperate spot put a warmongering blood thirsty individual in a position of power" was the general point, not that Hannibal was Dictator of Carthage ala Hitler in Germany. Despots coming to power in desperate times isn't exactly new, Germany didn't invent that.

Right, but Hannibal and Carthage is not a good example of that. Carthage wasn't desperate when they started that war, and Hannibal was one of many generals in a war, not a political figure. Furthermore, it's hard to say he was a despot because he didn't really govern anywhere.

 

[raindoc]

The whole thing is so fucked up. Now I see France leadership sending signals that they should be cooperating with Russia. RUSSIA? Really? The same Russia which is responsible for thousands of deaths in Ukraine.

I get that Beirut attacks are largely ignored in Europe. Just look at the thread abut Beirut bombing on NeoGaf. It's barely 3 pages. But Ukraine is part of European continent and it still got ignored in comparison. Even investigation of MH17 flight that was shot down over Ukraine was largely played down outside of Netherlands. And more people died there...

Sorry about this rant, but it looks like coverage of this horrific event in Paris has nothing to do with showing respect or informing people. It's used to scare people into agreeing with whatever the politicians want to do...

Uhm... are you really suggesting France should intensify it's military efforts in Syria without cooperating with the other forces involved?

 

[dc89]

One man, probable attacker, on the run after #ParisAttacks, French police say http://bbc.in/1N55pBa

 

[Herb Alpert]

I was wondering : The claim issued by ISIS saturday was about 8 "brothers". Were they lying to cover the remaining ones?
If so, they should have written the note at the end of the events. But why are they mentionning the 18th arrondissement, where nothing happened?

 

[Resident_UA]

Uhm... are you really suggesting France should intensify it's military efforts in Syria without cooperating with the other forces involved?

I'm suggesting that this horrific event is used for political gains while other horrific events were/are completely or partially ignored by the world community. Fucked up things that Russia did is just an example that hits me the most, but Beirut bombing being ignored is another recent example as are many others.

 

[azyless]

I was wondering : The claim issued by ISIS saturday was about 8 "brothers". Were they lying to cover the remaining ones?
If so, they should have written the note at the end of the events. But why are they mentionning the 18th arrondissement, where nothing happened?

It hasn't been communicated that there were more than 8 so far (7 dead + 1 on the run) but I wouldn't be surprised if they were just talking shit.

 

[Ether_Snake]

I was wondering : The claim issued by ISIS saturday was about 8 "brothers". Were they lying to cover the remaining ones?
If so, they should have written the note at the end of the events. But why are they mentionning the 18th arrondissement, where nothing happened?

7 are dead, one is on the loose, but originally it was reported that 8 were dead. So they probably thought everything went as planned, or didn't care.

The others involved might not have been ever planned to be on the scene.

 

[Always-honest]

I was wondering : The claim issued by ISIS saturday was about 8 "brothers". Were they lying to cover the remaining ones?
If so, they should have written the note at the end of the events. But why are they mentionning the 18th arrondissement, where nothing happened?

That claim is in doubt.
I also think it's a bit premature to declare war.
But i can understand the outrage towards ISIS.
But this is exactly what they want.

 

[pgtl_10]

As far as Assad is concerned, ISIS isn't the main threat in Syria, it's the rebel factions.

For the time being. After Assad can regain rebel territories then Russia could focus on ISIS. It makes sense really.

 

[Kadayi]

Russia couldn't care less about ISIS. Last I checked most of their bombings are outside of ISIS controlled area...

ISIS are a threat to everyone. You'd understand this if you could pull your reactionary head out of your ass whenever Russia comes up (I well recall your relentless BS power posting in the Ukraine thread). This idea that 'fuck working with those guys' because *reasons* whilst ISIS continue to put tens of thousands under the knife and have driven millions to migrate to the west in recent weeks because their particular firebrand interpretation of the Koran means if you're not with them you're either fit for a life sexual slavery or a slit throat and a shallow grave, and nothing in between.

If your priorities in life are fretting about the geopolitical nature of Eastern Europe that in truth doesn't amount to a hill of beans save the great game the US love to play with Russia over who got the smaller peen, versus the actual shitheels that just butchered 120 plus civilians in Paris on Friday, you honestly need your head examined.

You feign concern on one hand over the 'thousands in Ukraine', but the truth of the matter is all you're concerned about is US foreign policy. With you its never been about saving lives, if it was you'd readily acknowledge the greater threat ISIS pose to world stability and the necessity for countries to work together to defeat it despite their political differences, just like the US and USSR did in WWII

 

[pgtl_10]

Jaques Chirac said that attacking Iraq would be opening Pandora's box. I wish America listen to him instead of calling the French cowards and calling their french fries freedom fries.

 

[Lumpy Onion]

My facebook is either full or people saying France and the inocents who died deserved what happened because the French government has done baf stuff.

People suddenly remembering Syria and saying france doesn't matter in comparison

or people calling to kill all muslims and religious people arguing atheists would never kill people.

I feel sick of this world. If anything I can know unfriend a lot of these fuckers

One of my close friends irl tried to shame me when I told him how saddened I was by what happened. He said "who cares, worse stuff happens in the Middle East every day". As if that somehow means I cannot care about both. And then started bringing up the fact that I should feel bad because I care so much about this but not what's happening anywhere else because the death toll is lower in the France attacks vs attacks in the Middle East in the past. It made me really angry because he insinuated I didn't care at all what was happening anywhere but France.

Anyway this whole thing is disgusting through and through.

 

[FeelTheKick]

https://twitter.com/AFP/status/665940453456506880

3 months of state of emergency

 

[q_q]

There's been plenty of countries/nations throughout history that were screwed as a result of losing a war (and far worse than Germany after WW1), yet it's one of the few times that a nation willingly handed the power to warmongering genocidal scumbags and went with it for the next 12 years. You might see it as a natural and logical consequence of WWI, I see it as evil and cowardly on the part of the German nation of that era.

What a childish interpretation of history this is. Go read a book.

 

[szaromir]

ISIS are a threat to everyone. You'd understand this if you could pull your reactionary head out of your ass whenever Russia comes up (I well recall your relentless BS power posting in the Ukraine thread). This idea that 'fuck working with those guys' because *reasons* whilst ISIS continue to put tens of thousands under the knife and have driven millions to migrate to the west in recent weeks because their particular firebrand interpretation of the Koran means if you're not with them you're either fit for a life sexual slavery or a slit throat and a shallow grave, and nothing in between.

If your priorities in life are fretting about the geopolitical nature of Eastern Europe that in truth doesn't amount to a hill of beans save the great game the US love to play with Russia over who got the smaller peen, versus the actual shitheels that just butchered 120 plus civilians in Paris on Friday, you honestly need your head examined.

For you it's just a game that doesn't amount to anything, for the peoples of Chechnya, Georgia, Ukraine etc. Russian imperialism is very real and has brought a fuckton of victims in the last 25 years. (American imperialism isn't much better, but hey that just a game that leaves developed countries unaffected so who cares)

 

[Jb]

One of my close friends irl tried to shame me when I told him how saddened I was by what happened. He said "who cares, worse stuff happens in the Middle East every day". As if that somehow means I cannot care about both. And then started bringing up the fact that I should feel bad because I care so much about this but not what's happening anywhere else because the death toll is lower in the France attacks vs attacks in the Middle East in the past. It made me really angry because he insinuated I didn't care at all what was happening anywhere but France.

Anyway this whole thing is disgusting through and through.

Was he talking about the attacks in Turkey, Beiruth and the rest of the region when they actually happened? I know I was because that's my field of interest, but it seems like a lot of people, especially on the radical left, are just bringing it up now because they're sick of hearing about the Paris attacks, framing it in an incredibly reductive muslims vs white europeans narrative.

I still remember this gem from January after Charlie Hebdo was massacred.

Oh yes, I'm still salty.

 

[Resident_UA]

ISIS are a threat to everyone. You'd understand this if you could pull your reactionary head out of your ass whenever Russia comes up (I well recall your relentless BS power posting in the Ukraine thread). This idea that 'fuck working with those guys' because *reasons* whilst ISIS continue to put tens of thousands under the knife and have driven millions to migrate to the west in recent weeks because their particular firebrand interpretation of the Koran means if you're not with them you're either fit for a life sexual slavery or a slit throat and a shallow grave, and nothing in between.

If your priorities in life are fretting about the geopolitical nature of Eastern Europe that in truth doesn't amount to a hill of beans save the great game the US love to play with Russia over who got the smaller peen, versus the actual shitheels that just butchered 120 plus civilians in Paris on Friday, you honestly need your head examined.

Russia caused way more that 120 civilian deaths in Ukraine. MH17 alone is more deaths than in Paris. Even then I can agree that ISIS is worse than Russia. I'm just saying that EU ignores things that are not politically convenient. Not sure why you are getting personal. I also mentioned Beirut. Do you have a vile response to that?!

 

[Kurtofan]

https://twitter.com/AFP/status/665940453456506880

3 months of state of emergency

Probably to cover the big international ecological summit in November-December.