Alright. I stand corrected.
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Penny-Arcade: "Marketers of the Avenger Controller are thieves and liars".
- Thread starter SpeedingUptoStop
- Start date
Alright. I stand corrected.
WarMacheen
Member
Read up on events again this morning, still laughing. Have proof of death threats? probably not
If only the gaming community could rally against overpriced and on disc DLC with the same fervor and enthusiasm.
If only the gaming community could rally against overpriced and on disc DLC with the same fervor and enthusiasm.
charlequin
Banned
Because there's an enormous difference between someone using a position of power to belittle, demean, threaten, harass, and scam a customer and someone using a position of power to expose such bad behavior, and the difference is extraordinarily obvious.
The position you and a few others are pushing on this issue is essentially that people or organizations that do bad things in secret should never have their misbehavior exposed, because it might result in some inconvenience or suffering on their part. That is a ghastly position to take.
Can you point to one example of someone advocating that his family be brought into it or, for that matter, any specific thing that's been done to his family besides maybe them having to shut off the phone because his 1-800 number rings on it?
Are you kidding me? When you find out from that one of your vendors is actively mistreating your mutual customer, canceling your business relationship is absolutely the first thing you do.
TheChewyWaffles
Member
By "bully" you mean expose his hostile behavior towards customers, right?
You're 100 percent right! The power company just phoned me (I'm a valued customer). They are DISGUSTED by this child-like bullshit. They told me they are shutting down the internets tomorrow!
planar1280
Banned
All he has to do is apologize and this news story and this thread will diminish into history, but instead he is standing his ground and the Internet is destroying him in the process
WarMacheen
Member
Would you rather we coddle his balls and tell him everything will be ok?
Omegasquash
Member
Just read that, and frankly....two thumbs up. Just don't go burning it down to the ground, now.
Though I do like the fact that Ocean has already been removed as the marketer. That was the right thing to do, and it'll likely end this career. At this point, it's probably OK to let it go.
Could be misreads of what's his official twitter account versus the ones created as a joke. Take things here and there and come to a conclusion that this guy has received death threats.
twitter - oceanmarketingg - "Chronic fatigue scientists get 'death threats"
reddit - comments from reddit
By that rationale, exposing the Watergate scandals was bullying Nixon.Poor dude had to resign because of bully journalists!
planar1280
Banned
you cant bully an aged adult. different term applies for adults
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Again, there's a difference between exposing the dude and harassing him. Some of the stuff in this situation has crossed that line, although its not nearly as bad as some of the truly embarrassing internet lynchings.
planar1280
Banned
all he has to do is apologize. he is still twisting and making up stories and lying. every minute he stands his ground on lies the radical elements of the internet will destroy his life. we have not even reached 4chan yet. you think this is bad? wait till those guys get into their act
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
Before the internet I was blissfully ignorant of the masses of white knights out there just waiting to awkwardly jump into any clash and defend the obviously at wrong party with the weakest and flimsiest of arguments. But here we are, and every day I read the words of pathetic people willing to just defend anything for the sake of it.
Education is going to have to radically change for the post Internet-everywhere culture lest society becomes the most passive aggressive bunch of pedantic fucks in the entire universe.
Comic is wonderfully self-referential. Gabe knows he's an asshole but this guy deserved to have his shit wrecked. A heart-warming tale of an incompetent, aggressive douchebag finally getting his comeuppance. Take heart white knights, there a millions, dare I say a billion similar assholes you can take word bullets for across the world.
Education is going to have to radically change for the post Internet-everywhere culture lest society becomes the most passive aggressive bunch of pedantic fucks in the entire universe.
Comic is wonderfully self-referential. Gabe knows he's an asshole but this guy deserved to have his shit wrecked. A heart-warming tale of an incompetent, aggressive douchebag finally getting his comeuppance. Take heart white knights, there a millions, dare I say a billion similar assholes you can take word bullets for across the world.
WarMacheen
Member
No... Not really.
This isn't the POTUS. It's some small time marketer on a power trip- Who has deservedly ruined his business and likely his chance of ever getting a respectable career now.
Damage done. Anything more at this point is just piling on.
Dance Inferno
Unconfirmed Member
What's your preferred alternative? Let him carry on harassing customers and making their lives miserable?
You need to think this through a little more.
Nice comparison. Lawbreaking occurred during Watergate. No laws were broken here, just a PR guy being rude to a customer. Nice try, though.
Duane Cunningham
Member
I don't know... I'm sure Nixon caught a lot of shit and had repercussions in his life beyond the "official" impeachment, too.
Why does that distinction matter at all? Yes, that's a difference, so what? The similarity being pointed out was that both cases involved someone misbehaving, and then being punished by public opinion when the misbehavior was exposed.
This is an incorrect way to look at it. think of it like a review of a service.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
...I don't understand your point. He's an asshole and a douche. His career has already been ruined. What reason is there to harass him further?
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
All this.
Practically every local TV news cast in existence has had a "consumer advocacy" segment for at least the last 30 years, where a screwed-over customer writes the station and they publicly shame the business or businessperson.
planar1280
Banned
the point is he still acting as if what he did was right. the internet does not forgive those kinds of people. I am not saying this is not overboard but certain people online will never let go of him with this behavior. the ball is in HIS court to come clean. he has never backed down once. not a single proper apology, just changing twitter names and making 'accusations' his family and life is threatened.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Sure, I don't disagree with you. What I'm saying is that I disagree with "the internet". I don't like how often times situations like this devolve from exposure to straight out petulant harassment. It makes both sides look bad.
Keep in mind, I think this is a mild case. "The internet" hasn't really ripped into him like sometimes happens.
I suppose, but I don't take that as a "badass" thing. Relentless, in right or wrong, isn't necessarily that. Especially when we're talking about arguments. They're too much of a hassle so just agree with them now rather than deal with the endless bullshit.
GAF -> GAF -> GAF
To be fair, there's probably someone out there who's made the "better off dead" variant of comment. This is the internet after all.
WarMacheen
Member
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
PA were totally justified in outing this guy, but they have the same problem they've had forever - they still don't when to stop when they're ahead.
They should get locked in a room with only a water cooler and Rex Ryan for a week. Whomever emerges alive should finally know when to censor themselves.
They should get locked in a room with only a water cooler and Rex Ryan for a week. Whomever emerges alive should finally know when to censor themselves.
His firm has lost the account with N-Control. What more needs to be done?
planar1280
Banned
unfortunately this is the free internet where (some) people will not back down until he backs down and comes clean.
charlequin
Banned
Which information is public now that was previously private, exactly? The two particularly embarrassing revelations I've seen (the steroid site postings and the DV charge) were both already public information, found just by googling his name or public email address.
The Internet is a giant magnifier of all elements, both good and bad, of human nature. When it works out well you get people coming together to do unprecedented works of charity or create things that weren't possible before; when it works out badly you get spite-fueled contrarians who rage meaninglessly at invented bugbears or the wastoids who look at a situation like this and think "I know, I should send anonymous death threats to the dude!"
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Sure, and I'm allowed to think that they're assholes. Because I think there is a line over which situations like this become about a petty sense of "justice" or just enjoying the ability to anonymously troll.
planar1280
Banned
yes you are.
I think too many people are expecting that if something is not told to them outright, then it's clearly off-limits. Public domain is public domain, like it or not; it may be a private matter to you but if it's in the wind, so to speak, then you deal with it if it comes up.
Incidentally, is there any proof that the DV charge is actually him?
RoninChaos
Member
I love how you're making excuses for a guy that used his position to belittle a customer.
Everything that you just described is EXACTLY how business SHOULDN'T be run. There are hundreds of thousands of people out there WITHOUT jobs that would be greatful to be in a position to tell the customer "Hey, we're sorry, and we'll make it right". And the fact that you don't seem to get that is baffling.
Perhaps Christoforo should have been thinking of his wife and child before he opened his mouth. I have a family, and I think about the shit I do and what kind of blow back it would create for my family before I do something. You know what that's called? Not being a fucking idiot. When you have a family, your actions aren't your own, and if you aren't thinking about your family when you do stupid shit, then you aren't a man, you're a fucking idiot, which this guy is. He name dropped everyone he could think of to make himself feel bigger and now not only is the industry saying they want nothing to do with him, his client dropped him too.
Now he's apologizing to PA, not because he's sorry, he's sorry he got exposed. He deserves the outrage he's getting. Anyone who treats their customers in these ways deserves it. And, to be clear, what he did was a larger step than just not being helpful. Christoforo used his position to treat the customer like shit, and wield his position to make the customer feel powerless.
Do you know what could have prevented all this? Simply apologizing to the customer. Not talking down to the customer, not berating the customer, not trying to bully the customer, simply apologizing, taking ownership of the situation, and doing what was in his power to make it right.
And Penny Arcade made the right move by taking away their booth at PAX. I wouldn't want to take money from a person who would treat a mutual customer like that.
Duane Cunningham
Member
I don't think anything more really will be done, other than we talk about it for another day or two, the whole things fades out, and Christiforo's shitty reputation precedes him in this industry going forward. He goes on to some other industry with his overseas manufacturing connections (which I can personally assure you don't give a shit about this or anything else) if he really has them. Also, wherever he goes next won't give a shit either.
Ya but at that point you're complaining about Human Nature. The same thing that gives people some fetishistic glee when ribbing some asshole on the internet allows them to watch Reality TV with a straight face.
All Paul has to do at this point is make himself sympathetic, but he hasn't even TRIED to do that. It's as if he craves the attention so much he will continually be this caricature of a complete waste of humanity as long as there are hundreds of people tweeting @OceanStrategy. It's pathetic really.
I don't believe for one second that his family is being negatively effected by this, only because I wouldn't believe Paul at this point if he told me the sky was blue. I'd have to receive independent confirmation on that at this point. I agree that the Internet as a singular mass looks bad for continuing it's campaign of destruction, but if you're talking about the Internet as a singular mass then Youtube makes it look TERRIBLE everyday.
Posting pictures from his FB account and digging into his personal history, regardless of whether or not this information is readily accessible, is completely unnecessary. It's just irrelevant to the situation at hand.
Again, my point is that this story had enough legs on it's own to bring him down completely. It doesn't need anything else.
Yes, and he'll lose his job without question. Doesn't change the fact that the rest of this garbage is completely unnecessary.
RoninChaos
Member
Do you realize how fucking retarded that sounds?
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
...well yes, I think part of human nature includes the "asshole" behavior. That's no reason not to call them out on it.
There's a little of that, but I think it's also Tycho disavowing himself of any responsibility for what happened, since he wouldn't be able to make Gabe back down even if the cause was unjust.
Eh.
flyinpiranha
Member
"Oh my! Death threats on the family"
"Not true"
"Oh my! Private information made public!"
"That didn't happen"
"Oh my! He's had enough, he's apologized!"
"He apologized for being caught, not the same"
"Oh my! Nobody deserves this!"
"He said in the original email I hope you post this"
"Oh my! Let it rest! Can we move on!"
"Don't click on the thread? There's only one on the entirety of GAF"
"Look at me, I'm attacking somebody's Facebook from mother's basement!!!!! And then tonight I'm going to sit in a park and shit myself while yelling at rich people to give me free money!!!!!"
"Dude ... what the ... ?"
"We're just bullying bullies who bully now you bullies!"
"You obviously haven't read the thread."
"Not true"
"Oh my! Private information made public!"
"That didn't happen"
"Oh my! He's had enough, he's apologized!"
"He apologized for being caught, not the same"
"Oh my! Nobody deserves this!"
"He said in the original email I hope you post this"
"Oh my! Let it rest! Can we move on!"
"Don't click on the thread? There's only one on the entirety of GAF"
"Look at me, I'm attacking somebody's Facebook from mother's basement!!!!! And then tonight I'm going to sit in a park and shit myself while yelling at rich people to give me free money!!!!!"
"Dude ... what the ... ?"
"We're just bullying bullies who bully now you bullies!"
"You obviously haven't read the thread."
"You either die bullied, or you live long enough to see yourself become the bully."
charlequin
Banned
So no private information was posted anywhere, you just don't think that people should have collated the public information they googled up. I don't think that's a reasonable standard at all. Think about the dating test here: if this dude had gone out on a date with someone and they wanted to check his history out before committing to a second, would they have been able to find this info? Nobody knew what exactly they were going to find when they googled the guy in the first place, and expecting people to actively hide these things once they came up is unrealistic.
You are calling on every single person who's participated in this drama in any way to self-edit to an extraordinarily conservative level, and presumably for curators of communities where it's been discussed to shut down and delete discussion (again, of publicly available info found through google searches of someone's public name and email) to prevent the spread of this information. That's completely implausible and not particularly reasonable.
RoninChaos
Member
How does anything that happened before apply to this situation? The guy got exposed for being a douche, and people rallied around it. We live in a connected world. This shit happens.
How has he been harassed besides being called out on his shit? Have you ever watched the news when a consumer report comes on and a random business is exposed for something it pulled on it's customers? THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS. Only before people would make phone calls or go to the place and tell them they aren't doing business any more. Now it's just taken a different form because every one and their mother can get in on it via twitter and facebook.
Also, after going through more of this thread... the amount of people willing to outright defend this fucking clown is astonishing.
How would you, Technomancer, liked to have seen this situation go down?
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
Oh no knock on the internet at all, its just exhausting seeing the lengths people seemingly desperate for attention or need to slap their own spin on something for whatever agenda will go doing mental gymnastics to get there, each and every day on the internet.
As you said, internet can bring about some great changes. But then its the faceless nature of the internet that enabled this thug to seem like a genuine marketing arm when he's just some roided up nutter with a computer and can felch an internet site and start getting work as a bigshot.
I love seeing incompetent downright vile shits getting fired making way for the competent to finally pick up business. Its heartwarming, especially in this sort of economic climate when every day you probably encounter 5 or 6 people you just have to wonder how they keep their jobs while desperate and incredibly employable people go without interviews.