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Persona 5 |OT2| Someone must have been helping you go to bed early. Talk!

B

Bronetta

Ask me about the moon landing or the temperature at which jet fuel burns. You may be surprised at what you learn.
Ive had Whims of Fate on repeat for an hour now.


Pls send help.
 
O

Opa-Pa

Member
I mean yeah, if you screw up and don't have personas with good resistances then you're probably done for, even on easy I guess. It still doesn't change the fact that the game allows you to ambush 99% of the time and that Normal is simply too easu to to be called that and gives the fairly good combat (for the series' standard) a bad look. It's pretty annoying.

Perhaps Easy should remove game over upon MC's death as a mechanic, but it's pretty fair and I welcome it on Normal and above tbh.
 
E

Elaugaufein

Member
Son Of Sparda said:
No, but I do realize that we are living in very different worlds.

You know what's a impossible situation in my world? Going to defend your innocent client and then ending up in a cell right next to them, because you were defending your client too well. And then dying two years later in that prison and being dumped in a nameless grave. And that's just a very real yet ordinary news in my world.

So sorry, but I don't think the confidants in Persona 5 are stuck in impossible situations that need miracles.

Click to expand...

You have my sympathies then, but your situation being worse doesn't make someone else's any more winnable.

 
K

KO Traveling Hobo

Member
Juliano2016 said:
I changed difficulty to easy at some point to grind lvl and I was almost wiped by some random enemy who ambushed me. The boss of Palace 4 almost killed my whole party as well on easy. Balancing on the game is kinda all over the place.

But since I made Kaguya and Izanami Picaro I'm pretty much immortal. It doesn't bother me since I'm not one who likes difficult games and I appreciate Null Phys since it annoys me that MC can't die otherwise it's game over.
Click to expand...

The boss of Palace 4 is a beast on Hard. The
dive attack
will easily one-shot your entire party if you aren't fully healed/blocking.
 
R

rpg_fan

Member
Just finished tonight, 90 hours on the nose. I can see why some give up halfway, the game can be quite a slog through the middle. I do like the final act though. This won't be my favorite Persona game, but it was well worth the time.
 
E

Elaugaufein

Member
Opa-Pa said:
I mean yeah, if you screw up and don't have personas with good resistances then you're probably done for, even on easy I guess. It still doesn't change the fact that the game allows you to ambush 99% of the time and that Normal is simply too easu to to be called that and gives the fairly good combat (for the series' standard) a bad look. It's pretty annoying.

Perhaps Easy should remove game over upon MC's death as a mechanic, but it's pretty fair and I welcome it on Normal and above tbh.
Click to expand...

The worst thing about it in Persona is that it makes Light / Dark weak persona close to unusable from the point the insta kills debut until you get counter measures which is about 20 hours later.
 
J

Juliano2016

Member
Elaugaufein said:
The worst thing about it in Persona is that it makes Light / Dark weak persona close to unusable from the point the insta kills debut until you get counter measures which is about 20 hours later.
Click to expand...

If you just play casually and fuse personas with only the intent of getting higher lvled ones you will always struggle, e.g. Myself.
I only stopped struggling with the game once I went deeper on the web and got myself guides on personas, passives, using Gallows and keep entering and leaving the Gallows to increase stats. Inheriting skills and etc.
Yes, the game explain certain aspects of it, but a lot it's up to you to go out and understand, which is unfair considering the popularity of the popularity of the game.

It's a bit much that on Easy the boss of the palace is capable to almost OHK the whole party, even worst considering you can't have the MC die, so sometimes it means throwing items and heals on him even tho he's not that injured just to prevent a possible wipe. Even worst is at Palace 3, where ONI is a regular enemy and he has no weakness, is resistant to physical attack, and his Rampage hits 3-4 times. It almost wipes the party and you have to rely on Morgana's Lucky Punch to get him down.
Anubis = no weakness, resistant to light and curse. Hamaon (which quite often hits). Get 2-3 of them against you, if you haven't ambushed it and manages to crit them, suddenly half the party is dead.
 
P

Peff

Member
Juliano2016 said:
Even worst is at Palace 3, where ONI is a regular enemy and he has no weakness, is resistant to physical attack, and his Rampage hits 3-4 times. It almost wipes the party and you have to rely on Morgana's Lucky Punch to get him down.
Anubis = no weakness, resistant to light and curse. Hamaon (which quite often hits). Get 2-3 of them against you, if you haven't ambushed it and manages to crit them, suddenly half the party is dead.
Click to expand...

Status effects are your friends :p In my experience the balance gets shifted towards buffs and debuffs in the second half of the game where increasing or decreasing damage percentages make a much bigger diference, but up until palace five-ish (and even further in mementos) Forget, Brainwash, Confuse and Sleep can turn a battle around single-handedly.
 
I

iRAWRasaurus

Banned
rpg_fan said:
Just finished tonight, 90 hours on the nose. I can see why some give up halfway, the game can be quite a slog through the middle. I do like the final act though. This won't be my favorite Persona game, but it was well worth the time.
Click to expand...
I def feel like the middle can drag out.
 
S

Son Of Sparda

Member
PK Gaming said:
These are pretty extreme situations and not something most people tend to experience in daily life. I mean come on, the various Confidants have also lost their place in society... it's literally the point of commonality shared with every Confidant character. Your breakdowns don't paint an accurate picture at all. Also, explain to me how one would get out of:

Literally extorted for money forever or risk losing their job and having their life effectively ruined (Kawakami).
Being forced to work for a pyramid scheme because you owe your con-artist employer. (Chihaya)
Getting literally fucking perjured for an accidental death, and having your reputation destroyed. (Tae)
Overcome an impossible workload and being forced to quit an Investigation (Ohya)

These aren't things you just "work out on your own." And you're still ignoring the fact that the Confidants take care of everything on their own after the obstacles are gone. It's completely idealistic and total wish fulfillment, but it's a pretty typical case of "helping someone help themselves." And I haven't even talked about Sojiro and Tora, who are pretty fantastic.
Click to expand...
I've already talked about confidants in my previous post. If those situations seem impossible to you, then my friend you live in a decent part of our world.

PK Gaming said:
You're completely missing the forest of the trees. It's like you think any average Joe could do what
Shido did with Akechi at his side. The game literally beats it over your head via the shitty exposition scene; Shido is outright responsible for coming up with the plan itself, and it took a lot of planning and hard work for him to pull it off.
Click to expand...

Doesn't change the fact that all of his plans were completely dependent on
Akechi. What would've he done if Akechi simply had said no halfway through? Where would he be if Akechi had never showed up.
He is not an idiot, he is pretty smart. But he still couldn't do any of those without
Akechi's help
, and he acquired that help by pure luck.

PK Gaming said:
You're faulting someone
for assembling a case against Anime Donald Trump and being forced to rely on Joker as a witness because literally nobody else could testify, while also operating in the incredibly rigged Criminal Justice system, and still being the one responsible for convicting Shido in the end. My brain is trying to wrap itself around how someone like that could be "extremely incompetent" and it's just not possible.

You're making absolutely 0 sense.
Click to expand...

She had a confession. All she had to do was write those down on a paper and get Shido's signature on it. Even if that's not how Japan's Criminal Justice system works, a smart person would find much better ways to build their case than asking the person (a teenager nonetheless) who put his life on the line to save the world, to just ruin his life yet again.

People were already aware of Shido's crime and confession. She could've used her position and have mass media cover certain news/stories to rile people up and force the justice system into prosecuting Shido. But no, instead she just settles for possibly ruining a teenagers life. Then doesn't even do much to get that teenager the freedom that he deserves, AND at the end has the nerve to say that now the Phantoms can leave everything in her capable hands.
 
R

racketpunch

Member
Completed Palace 1.

This game is pretty good so far. My only issue is with saving the game. Damn them for having 30 min+ windows where I don't have the option to save. WTF
 
E

Elaugaufein

Member
Juliano2016 said:
If you just play casually and fuse personas with only the intent of getting higher lvled ones you will always struggle, e.g. Myself.
I only stopped struggling with the game once I went deeper on the web and got myself guides on personas, passives, using Gallows and keep entering and leaving the Gallows to increase stats. Inheriting skills and etc.
Yes, the game explain certain aspects of it, but a lot it's up to you to go out and understand, which is unfair considering the popularity of the popularity of the game.

It's a bit much that on Easy the boss of the palace is capable to almost OHK the whole party, even worst considering you can't have the MC die, so sometimes it means throwing items and heals on him even tho he's not that injured just to prevent a possible wipe. Even worst is at Palace 3, where ONI is a regular enemy and he has no weakness, is resistant to physical attack, and his Rampage hits 3-4 times. It almost wipes the party and you have to rely on Morgana's Lucky Punch to get him down.
Anubis = no weakness, resistant to light and curse. Hamaon (which quite often hits). Get 2-3 of them against you, if you haven't ambushed it and manages to crit them, suddenly half the party is dead.
Click to expand...

This isn't my first SMT / Persona game by a long shot at this point. That was my gripe as a fairly experienced player. Rendering a bunch of persona useless kinds of sucks, the game over aspect severely overweights 1HKO attacks and weaknesses to them.
 
O

Opa-Pa

Member
Peff said:
Status effects are your friends :p In my experience the balance gets shifted towards buffs and debuffs in the second half of the game where increasing or decreasing damage percentages make a much bigger diference, but up until palace five-ish (and even further in mementos) Forget, Brainwash, Confuse and Sleep can turn a battle around single-handedly.
Click to expand...

Yup, Oni (and many no weakness demons, especially physical users) are extremely easy to inflict ailments to, and Anubis appears at the same time as you get to level where you can fuse Isis, who's immune to both curse and bless (she even shares the egyptian motif, so it's definitely deliberate). The game very rarely will throw you into unfair situations.

The protagonist is virtually as invincible as you want to make him too, which is the reason the game over upon MC's death mechanic exist.

Edit: Also I think that while the early personas that are weak to bless and curse being useless complaint had some truth to it, I believe tetraja is fairly common early in the game. Someone correct me if I got this wrong, because it's only an impression since I never needed it so I ignored it.
 
V

vaporeon

Member
exhume said:
Team Akechi here! Thanks to accidentally spoiling myself by flipping through the JP artbook, (mid game spoilers)
I knew he was going to join the party, and that's when I started to suspect the hell out of him. I still kept him in my party as long as I could though :)
Like others have said, he's a great foil to Joker and seemed like the only one thinking about things on the same level. In an alternate universe, the two of them would have made an excellent team.
Click to expand...
Akechi/late game spoilers
I would relish in a P5 sequel/installment that allowed Akechi to have a "change of fate."
 
F

Ferrio

Banned
Peff said:
Status effects are your friends :p In my experience the balance gets shifted towards buffs and debuffs in the second half of the game where increasing or decreasing damage percentages make a much bigger diference, but up until palace five-ish (and even further in mementos) Forget, Brainwash, Confuse and Sleep can turn a battle around single-handedly.
Click to expand...

Ann's Tentarafoo saved my butt so many times.
 
E

Elaugaufein

Member
Opa-Pa said:
Yup, Oni (and many no weakness demons, especially physical users) are extremely easy to inflict ailments to, and Anubis appears at the same time as you get to level where you can fuse Isis, who's immune to both curse and bless (she even shares the egyptian motif, so it's definitely deliberate). The game very rarely will throw you into unfair situations.

The protagonist is virtually as invincible as you want to make him too, which is the reason the game over upon MC's death mechanic exist.

Edit: Also I think that while the early personas that are weak to bless and curse being useless complaint had some truth to it, I believe tetraja is fairly common early in the game. Someone correct me if I got this wrong, because it's only an impression since I never needed it so I ignored it.
Click to expand...

It didn't seem overly common to me , but that will have a lot to do with your fusing paths and mine was more shaped by Social Links. Also it's super expensive early game (or even mid game).
 
P

PK Gaming

Member
Son Of Sparda said:
I've already talked about confidants in my previous post. If those situation seem impossible to you, then my friend you live in a decent part of our world.
Click to expand...

It's a game entirely centered on modern Japanese society though. The game makes it pretty clear that the Confidants find themselves in unusual circumstances, so your own living situations are irrelevant (no offense). Also we're talking about different things; It's not that the situations seem impossible to me (I'm pretty sure extortion and the like happens in Western society as well), it's just overcoming that by yourself is pretty much impossible. Like you still haven't explained to me how the various adult Confidants are incompetent.

Doesn't change the fact that all of his plans were completely dependent on
Akechi. What would've he done if Akechi simply had said no halfway through? Where would he be if Akechi had never showed up.
He is not an idiot, he is pretty smart. But he still couldn't do any of those without
Akechi's help
, and he acquired that help by pure luck.
Click to expand...

So you admit that he's pretty smart and resourceful, yeah? That's the definition of competence. Luck Is What Happens When Preparation Meets Opportunity is a saying for a reason.

(Late game spoilers)

She had a confession. All she had to do was write those down on a paper and get Shido's signature on it. Even if that's not how Japan's Criminal Justice system works, a smart person would find much better ways to build their case than asking the person (a teenager nonetheless) who put his life on the line to save the world, to just ruin his life yet again.

People were already aware of Shido's crime and confession. She could've used her position and have mass media cover certain news/stories to rile people up and force the justice system into prosecuting Shido. But no, instead she just settles for possibly ruining a teenagers life. Then doesn't even do much to get that teenager the freedom that he deserves, AND at the end has the nerve to say that now the Phantoms can leave everything in her capable hands.
Click to expand...

This is some pretty ridiculous armchairing. I mean how do I even refute this?
Your argument is basically predicated on this ridiculous hypothetical of "she could have...", And man i'm not going to lie, your suggestion is... dumb (used her position to rile people up? Did you forget how people were reluctant to lay the blame on Shido?! How would she even do that?!). And you keep saying she "ruined" Joker's life, but all she did was ask him to sacrifice himself to help take down Shido (because again, there was no other legal options) and he consents to it.

Even if I agreed to your silly suggestion of "she could have done better (I don't), that still doesn't make her incompetent, because the end result is that Shido is in prison.
 
Z

Zesh

Member
Uh, so I was fighting the NG+ boss, and
they just used an all-out attack and instantly killed me after 11 turns. Did I do something wrong, or do you have to win within that many turns? I had them down to like 2/3 health or something.
 
E

Elaugaufein

Member
Zesh said:
Uh, so I was fighting the NG+ boss, and
they just used an all-out attack and instantly killed me after 11 turns. Did I do something wrong, or do you have to win within that many turns? I had them down to like 2/3 health or something.
Click to expand...

You need to keep up a certain level of damage. There is a time limit too but it's nowhere near that strict.
 
S

Son Of Sparda

Member
PK Gaming said:
It's a game entirely centered on modern Japanese society though. The game makes it pretty clear that the Confidants find themselves in unusual circumstances, so your own living situations are irrelevant (no offense). Also we're talking about different things; It's not that the situations seem impossible to me (I'm pretty sure extortion and the like happens in Western society as well), it's just overcoming that by yourself is pretty much impossible. Like you still haven't explained to me how the various adult Confidants are incompetent.
Click to expand...
Let me give you a few examples on how they could've solved their situations on their own.

Kawakami -
Should've contacted a lawyer. With the help of a lawyer she could've gather evidence of blackmailing and then use that to threaten them and make them back the hell off.
Tae -
She just needed to do a better job of keeping a low profile. Then when the time was rights, she could've secretly (maybe even using a proxy) get in contact with another lab to finish the development of medicine.
Chihaya -
Stop selling fake stones to people and go to police.

Again, these aren't impossible situation.

PK Gaming said:
So you admit that he's pretty smart and resourceful, yeah? That's the definition of competence. Luck Is What Happens When Preparation Meets Opportunity is a saying for a reason.
Click to expand...
Yes I do.

And no, that saying has no weight here cause
Shido
wouldn't have been anyone without
Akechi
. Sure, if he had a backup plan that wasn't so dependent on one person, then I would've agreed with you, but we heard of no such thing during the story.

PK Gaming said:
This is some pretty ridiculous armchairing. I mean how do I even refute this?
Your argument is basically predicated on this ridiculous hypothetical of "she could have...", And man i'm not going to lie, your suggestion is... dumb (used her position to rile people up? Did you forget how people were reluctant to lay the blame on Shido?! How would she even do that?!). And you keep saying she "ruined" Joker's life, but all she did was ask him to sacrifice himself to help take down Shido (because again, there was no other legal options) and he consents to it.

Even if I agreed to your silly suggestion of "she could have done better (I don't), that still doesn't make her incompetent, because the end result is that Shido is in prison.
Click to expand...
Now is my time to ask if you were paying attention to the later parts of the game.

The whole reason why people reacted that way was because of Mementos. After Phantoms destroyed that, people started seeing Shido for who he truly was. Also, I know she "asked" him, but that wasn't really a choice. "Either you give yourself up and help my case, or police will screw all of you while I stand there and do nothing."

And no, Shido being in prison does not make Sae competent. Thanks to Phantoms, Shido went to prison despite Sae's incompetence. I don't know what you are defending here, cause she didn't do anything of note to help with either Joker or Shido's case.
 
K

KO Traveling Hobo

Member
Son Of Sparda said:
The whole reason why people reacted that way was because of Mementos. After Phantoms destroyed that, people started seeing Shido for who he truly was. Also, I know she "asked" him, but that wasn't really a choice. "Either you give yourself up and help my case, or police will screw all of you while stand there and do nothing."

And no, Shido being in prison does not make Sae competent. Thanks to Phantoms, Shido went to prison despite Sae's incompetence. I don't know what you are defending here, cause she didn't do anything of note to help with either Joker or Shido's case.
Click to expand...
The public just made some comments like "eh, Shido seems kind of iffy. Have you heard those rumors?" Without Joker's testimony, they never would have been able to put the final nail in Shido's coffin.
 
L

LotusHD

Banned
kobu said:
This game really did not need to be 90 hours
Click to expand...

While there is definitely shit you could cut out or minimize in P5, my stance has always been that I generally wouldn't mind a game being this long, so long as I was engaged with the story all the way through. With P5 that did not happen, so meh. But if I was, I'd be of course far less inclined to say stuff like "It should've been shorter"

So I dunno, when I think about whether I'd suddenly like how the story turned out if it was a more compact package, I feel doubtful that I would, at least to any significant degree, since my issues with parts of the story wouldn't just magically go away.

Bronetta said:
Ive had Whims of Fate on repeat for an hour now.


Pls send help.
Click to expand...

No, listen to it more!
 
Sequence Six

Sequence Six

Member
toastyToast said:
I finished it at 115 not really grinding or anything. Game stretches itself out unnecessarily. The prior two games took about 70
Click to expand...

It took me ~78 personally. I really have no idea how anyone hit 90 let alone 100+ unless they're fishing junkies or really love grinding money in Mementos during seasonal effects.
 
S

StoneFox

Member
I finished the game at 88 hours, going to start NG+ in a few minutes.

Honestly it took me longer to beat P4... but I don't know how.
 
cj_iwakura

cj_iwakura

Member
Right before Palace 7 treasure...

Good god, that was a gauntlet and a half, straight out of SMT IV A.

Intense as all hell, though. Loki, it fricking figures.
 
B

Bronetta

Ask me about the moon landing or the temperature at which jet fuel burns. You may be surprised at what you learn.
Sequence Six said:
It took me ~78 personally. I really have no idea how anyone hit 90 let alone 100+ unless they're fishing junkies or really love grinding money in Mementos during seasonal effects.
Click to expand...

I just started Palace 6 at 80 hours in.

I havent grinded or anything plus I fast travel everywhere.


I may or may not have idled a few of those hours at night just cause Beneath the Mask is just so damn bangin'
 
P

pixxxelz

Member
cj_iwakura said:
Right before Palace 7 treasure...

Good god, that was a gauntlet and a half, straight out of SMT IV A.

Intense as all hell, though. Loki, it fricking figures.
Click to expand...
that part is the one that made the 7th palace my favorite, and it also made me hate that asshole even more because thanks to him we didn't get Loki.
 
M

MSMrRound

Member
Elfstruck said:
God, I hate Blood Temple gimmick minigame. How the heck do I get the south east arrow down?
Click to expand...

Think of it as a natural quarter circle motion you should be doing.

It might help if you are using your most dominant hand to pull off the motion. I was struggling a bit with my left hand till I attempted using my right, where I could pull it off right away

Or if you are using your thumb, basically just do a sweep down arrow->down+right arrow->right arrow+x

cj_iwakura said:
Did anyone catch the P4 shoutout on 12/7?

'Taro Namatame, a newcomer who worked his way up as a secretary from Inaba..."
Click to expand...

Pan-hime actually had a list of dates that one can look out for with regards to possible references

https://twitter.com/regularpanties/status/856671061450137602

For those on the edge about date spoilers, don't click on it.

4/29
5/7
6/1
7/1
7/22
11/30
12/2
12/9
12/12
12/14
 
S

Son Of Sparda

Member
KO Traveling Hobo said:
The public just made some comments like "eh, Shido seems kind of iffy. Have you heard those rumors?" Without Joker's testimony, they never would have been able to put the final nail in Shido's coffin.
Click to expand...
That's because the media wasn't focusing on it. As we all know, media has a very big influence on the people in this game (and reality).
 
P

PK Gaming

Member
Son Of Sparda said:
Let me give you a few examples on how they could've solved their situations on their own.

Kawakami -
Should've contacted a lawyer. With the help of a lawyer she could've gather evidence of blackmailing and then use that to threaten them and make them back the hell off.
Tae -
She just needed to do a better job of keeping a low profile. Then when the time was rights, she could've secretly (maybe even using a proxy) get in contact with another lab to finish the development of medicine.
Chihaya -
Stop selling fake stones to people and go to police.
Click to expand...

Kawakami - Where's this magical evidence? She hands them money and they keep quiet... that's literally it. I love how you suggest she hires a lawyer, as if that'll magically fix everything (nevermind that hiring a lawyer fact is expensive as hell). It doesn't prevent them from contacting the school and telling them about her other jobs. Problem unsolved.
Tae - Oh yeah, keep a low profile while people are literally dying of disease. But that's not even the issue here; the issue is that she's under the mistaken belief that the girl she was treating is dead, and that she was set up for it. There's no "getting over" that.
Chihaya - She legally owes them money, and the police can't do shit. (Not that they would want to, considering it's Japan)

I'm not sure i'm even refuting these ridiculously shallow "suggestions." You still haven't proven how any of these characters are actually "incompetent." Relying on help in your time of need doesn't make you an incompetent person, and being be able to turn your life around with help is pretty fucking impressive..

And no, that saying has no weight here cause
Shido
wouldn't have been anyone without
Akechi
. Sure, if he had a backup plan that wasn't so dependent on one person, then I would've agreed with you, but we heard of no such thing during the story.

Now is my time to ask if you were paying attention to the later parts of the game.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, keep zeroing on this one point that's completely unrelated to my main argument regarding Shido. Shido is a competent adult, period.

The whole reason why people reacted that way was because of Mementos. After Phantoms destroyed that, people started seeing Shido for who he truly was. Also, I know she "asked" him, but that wasn't really a choice. "Either you give yourself up and help my case, or police will screw all of you while I stand there and do nothing."

And no, Shido being in prison does not make Sae competent. Thanks to Phantoms, Shido went to prison despite Sae's incompetence. I don't know what you are defending here, cause she didn't do anything of note to help with either Joker or Shido's case.
Click to expand...

Yeah i'm done, haha. You just have this profound misunderstanding of pretty much the entire back half of Persona 5.
 
P

Professor Renegade

Banned
Finally time for palace 7 on NG+
trying to Platinum the game here, should I try to do this palace in one go? I'm lvl 95 and want to try to get some money and exp as well because I'm trying to make an invincible Yoshitsune for the secret boss.
 
T

TruSpindash

Member
Recently finished my first playthrough, and loved every bit of it. Already feeling the same sense of melancholy I had upon finishing P4. Going to go ahead and start NG+ over the next few days.
 
S

ShadowSoldier89

Member
well...I think I'm good now.
eBS9EP7.png
Click to expand...
 
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