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[Red The Hunter]

Are wall scrolls still a thing? I remember having a totally sickknashtee Evangelion wall scroll when I was 13.

Yep there still a thing, I have like 8 of them in my room. Fooly Cooly(FLCL), Kingdom Hearts, Soul Eater, Black Butler, Case Closed, Persona 4: The Animation, and a pair of Solatorobo ones

I got most of mine from one booth that sells anime goods at the annual Washington State Fair. You can also get them online, they're nice wall decorations.

I'm gonna refer you to my previous post in this thread where you can see all of the wall scrolls I have.

 

[Gazoinks]

I'm glad to say that those drawings have accomplished their purposes.

And if any of you need it, Atlus USA just announced a sale on PSN for all Persona games on their facebook page.

Goddammit Atlus. Yesterday I had a $20 PSN card and I was like "Hmm, should I get P2? Nah I should wait till it goes on sale, I'll grab something else."

On the bright side I bought Dragon's Crown so it's not really a loss.

Doesn't the fact that Elizabeth called Igor Master and Igor himself has a Master imply that Elizabeth is obviously not the most powerful being in the world of Persona?

Well, Igor's master is Philemon,

Spoiler

who's all "Oh I can't interact directly with the world, oh you angsty teenagers go fight the incarnation of society's evils kthx." So who knows.

 

[kewlmyc]

Not if you have as much self-control as I do.

You implying I don't have self-control?

Spoiler

...you are absolutely right. ;_;

Couldn't stand what I played of TWD. Stiff voice acting and weirdly contradictory design. ("These decisions MATTER. Also, you have five seconds to make them. Yes, even when there's no immediate danger whatsoever.")

Glad TellTale is pleasing the fans though!

I'm disappoint Inorigo.

 

[Squire]

I'm disappoint Inorigo.

As was I.

I always figured The Last Of Us would probably be the game to really portray the desperation, the brutality, and on occasion the compassion of those left behind in a world gone to shit.

The oppressive tone and the fact I'm just not crazy about stealth kept it from being my game of the year, but it met my expectations. Was hoping TWD could, but... nope.

 

[Jintor]

ino has no heart

it's more like stiff engine rather than stiff voice acting imho, and the putting pressure on everything i think helps acclimatise you to making decisions in a timed environment. Besides, it's how conversation actually flows

 

[Gazoinks]

ino has no heart

it's more like stiff engine rather than stiff voice acting imho, and the putting pressure on everything i think helps acclimatise you to making decisions in a timed environment. Besides, it's how conversation actually flows

Yeah, I like the limits just like I did in Alpha Protocol, because the conversation actually flows and you have to think on your feet.

My main issue with TWD is that most of the choices are more smoke and mirrors than anything.

 

[Jintor]

I think that's okay for a small budget studio. I'd be more critical if it came out of, say, bioware or something. The illusion of choice is sufficient for what it is.

 

[Squire]

ino has no heart

it's more like stiff engine rather than stiff voice acting imho, and the putting pressure on everything i think helps acclimatise you to making decisions in a timed environment. Besides, it's how conversation actually flows

It's not. When you're in a weighty conversation with someone and you need to choose your next sentence carefully, that's exactly what you do. And that's what they want here.

You cannot ask me to be considerate and measured at the speed of a conversation you have sitting in a restaurant, shooting the breeze.

Obviously not ever single interaction in TWD is earth shattering by any means, but the circumstances under which these conversations take place alone ("The world has ended" "I don't trust you" etc) mean the timer has virtually no place in the design whatsoever. It's a cheap way to make you feel tension, when they should be doing that with the writing and presentation.

I'll give you the point about the engine. Sure.

 

[snow in jamaica]

it's okay p1 and p2 have zombies

 

[buddha0991]

MAJOR Persona 3 FES: The Answer spoilers:

Spoiler

02:51 buddha0991 i just got double megidolaon'd by yukari and mitsuru
02:51 buddha0991 rip in pepperoni
02:52 buddha0991 wow
02:52 buddha0991 Yukari does NOT take her key
02:52 buddha0991 interesting
02:53 buddha0991 people who say she just turned into a crazy bloodthirsty bitch were just proven wrong lol
02:56 buddha0991 i knew i had faith that yukari wouldnt just risk her friend's life

The context here is that every one of the arena battles against your friends in S.E.E.S. has a different game over screen, where the characters who won are deciding if they are going to take the key from Aigis. This could potentially result in her death, but it is not confirmed. Yukari prior do this seemed blood thirsty and willing to risk everything to gather all the keys and go back in time to see if they could save Makoto. This game over scene which I bet almost no one saw, including me when I playe and beat this ages ago, proves that Yukari would put her friend over her own wishes in the end. This shows a completely different side of Yukari in this part of The Answer than most people know about. Interesting and it provides some nice insight on the character. I have an even bigger respect for her now.

 

[Jintor]

I think the decisions that ask you to be weighty and considered give you a far longer wait timer than the 'in-flow of conversation' normal ones.

Part of making choices that matter is also making choices that matter under pressure and living with the consequences, whether that pressure be 'respond in time to a conversation otherwise people think you're weird' or 'oh my god zombies'.

In any case, it's far less immersion breaking to my mind than every other game's 'Yes, I will wait for you without any sign of impatience for you to choose what to say from a dialogue tree'. That shit bugs the hell out of me.

 

[Moonlight]

Quick, Shepard. This fleet's about to be destroyed and you need to intervene before it's too late!

[stands there for five minutes]

MAJOR Persona 3 FES: The Answer spoilers:

Spoiler

02:51 buddha0991 i just got double megidolaon'd by yukari and mitsuru
02:51 buddha0991 rip in pepperoni
02:52 buddha0991 wow
02:52 buddha0991 Yukari does NOT take her key
02:52 buddha0991 interesting
02:53 buddha0991 people who say she just turned into a crazy bloodthirsty bitch were just proven wrong lol
02:56 buddha0991 i knew i had faith that yukari wouldnt just risk her friend's life

The context here is that every one of the arena battles against your friends in S.E.E.S. has a different game over screen, where the characters who won are deciding if they are going to take the key from Aigis. This could potentially result in her death, but it is not confirmed. Yukari prior do this seemed blood thirsty and willing to risk everything to gather all the keys and go back in time to see if they could save Makoto. This game over scene which I bet almost no one saw, including me when I playe and beat this ages ago, proves that Yukari would put her friend over her own wishes in the end. This shows a completely different side of Yukari in this part of The Answer than most people know about. Interesting and it provides some nice insight on the character. I have an even bigger respect for her now.

Spoiler

This is actually super-cool. And a surprising degree of thought and characterization to a 'simple' game-over screen. Funny, that this is the way The Answer winds up surprising me.

 

[buddha0991]

Quick, Shepard. This fleet's about to be destroyed and you need to intervene before it's too late!

[stands there for five minutes]

Spoiler

This is actually super-cool. And a surprisingly thoughtful degree of thought and characterization to a 'simple' game-over screen. Funny, that this is the way The Answer winds up surprising me.

I just died again so ill describe it in more detail:

P3FES ANSWER SPOILERS REDUX

Spoiler

03:11 buddha0991 i didnt die against akihiko so i dunno what his is about
03:11 buddha0991 junpei decides to not risk Aigis
03:11 buddha0991 so he walks off to fight yukari without any keys
03:11 buddha0991 yukari does what i said
03:11 buddha0991 she really struggles with it
03:12 buddha0991 but she just turns around and walks away without saying a word
03:12 buddha0991 im about to die again lol
03:12 buddha0991 so maybe i can describe it
03:12 buddha0991 FUCKING STOP MEGIDOLAON SPAMMING
03:12 buddha0991 ITS LIKE IM PLAYING SMTIV
03:12 InsaneElite lel
03:12 buddha0991 so yea
03:12 buddha0991 aigis can no longer stand and she falls
03:13 buddha0991 and yukari says aigis like shes worried about her
03:13 buddha0991 you know the
03:13 InsaneElite yeah
03:13 buddha0991 "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..." "Yukari..."
03:13 buddha0991 way that was 50% of Mitsuru's dialog in this
03:13 InsaneElite lol i remember the exact way she says it
03:14 buddha0991 and then mitsuru tells yukari that she won and she will get what she wished for, and she asks her if she is going to take her key from her, sort of hesitating slightly
03:14 buddha0991 yukari .....'s like a good anime character
03:14 buddha0991 then she just turns around and walks away
03:14 InsaneElite deep
03:14 InsaneElite i want to say akihiko and ken would walk away too for the sake of consistency but idk
03:15 buddha0991 i have a save prior to shit hitting the fan
03:15 buddha0991 i could beat Shadow MC and see how it goes
03:15 buddha0991 ill do that when i beat this whole thing

 

[Squire]

I think the decisions that ask you to be weighty and considered give you a far longer wait timer than the 'in-flow of conversation' normal ones.

Part of making choices that matter is also making choices that matter under pressure and living with the consequences, whether that pressure be 'respond in time to a conversation otherwise people think you're weird' or 'oh my god zombies'.

In any case, it's far less immersion breaking to my mind than every other game's 'Yes, I will wait for you without any sign of impatience for you to choose what to say from a dialogue tree'. That shit bugs the hell out of me.

If you're playing a game and that's how you feel then those conversations need better dialogue. I've never got that sense from, say, a BioWare game. Because those are always interesting conversations with interesting characters that I'm engaged in. I get through them at a natural pace because I'm involved. I want to hear the next piece of dialogue, give my response and reach the end of that moment. That's immersion.

If I'm sitting there realizing I could press no buttons at all and the characters would just idle, the devs have a much larger issue - I don't care to have the conversation to begin with.

Quick, Shepard. This fleet's about to be destroyed and you need to intervene before it's too late!

[stands there for five minutes]

That's the thing: If you cared about what was happening, the bolded would never happen. It may as well not even be a concern.

 

[kewlmyc]

MAJOR Persona 3 FES: The Answer spoilers:

Spoiler

02:51 buddha0991 i just got double megidolaon'd by yukari and mitsuru
02:51 buddha0991 rip in pepperoni
02:52 buddha0991 wow
02:52 buddha0991 Yukari does NOT take her key
02:52 buddha0991 interesting
02:53 buddha0991 people who say she just turned into a crazy bloodthirsty bitch were just proven wrong lol
02:56 buddha0991 i knew i had faith that yukari wouldnt just risk her friend's life

The context here is that every one of the arena battles against your friends in S.E.E.S. has a different game over screen, where the characters who won are deciding if they are going to take the key from Aigis. This could potentially result in her death, but it is not confirmed. Yukari prior do this seemed blood thirsty and willing to risk everything to gather all the keys and go back in time to see if they could save Makoto. This game over scene which I bet almost no one saw, including me when I playe and beat this ages ago, proves that Yukari would put her friend over her own wishes in the end. This shows a completely different side of Yukari in this part of The Answer than most people know about. Interesting and it provides some nice insight on the character. I have an even bigger respect for her now.

Spoiler

Then what was the entire point of them fighting if she wasn't going to use it anyway?

I know you can't really answer this, just a general question.

 

[Jintor]

Funny you single out bioware games - that's always how i feel about them

 

[Dantis]

My problem with TWD was that I found it booooooring. Episode 1 and 2 were great, then I completely lost interest.

MAJOR Persona 3 FES: The Answer spoilers:

Spoiler

02:51 buddha0991 i just got double megidolaon'd by yukari and mitsuru
02:51 buddha0991 rip in pepperoni
02:52 buddha0991 wow
02:52 buddha0991 Yukari does NOT take her key
02:52 buddha0991 interesting
02:53 buddha0991 people who say she just turned into a crazy bloodthirsty bitch were just proven wrong lol
02:56 buddha0991 i knew i had faith that yukari wouldnt just risk her friend's life

The context here is that every one of the arena battles against your friends in S.E.E.S. has a different game over screen, where the characters who won are deciding if they are going to take the key from Aigis. This could potentially result in her death, but it is not confirmed. Yukari prior do this seemed blood thirsty and willing to risk everything to gather all the keys and go back in time to see if they could save Makoto. This game over scene which I bet almost no one saw, including me when I playe and beat this ages ago, proves that Yukari would put her friend over her own wishes in the end. This shows a completely different side of Yukari in this part of The Answer than most people know about. Interesting and it provides some nice insight on the character. I have an even bigger respect for her now.

This is really cool actually. I mean, it's still a shit part of the game, but it's neat either way.

 

[buddha0991]

Spoiler

Then what was the entire point of them fighting if she wasn't going to use it anyway?

I know you can't really answer this, just a general question.

P3FES SPOILER

Spoiler

She was acting purely on her own emotions going haywire with both despair and hope obviously!

 

[kewlmyc]

P3FES SPOILER

Spoiler

She was acting purely on her own emotions going haywire with both despair and hope obviously!

Upupuu....

Spoiler

I guess Aigis is heartless for taking the keys from everyone when no one else was willing to. Unless taking the key from Aigis would kill her and taking the keys from other wouldn't kill them. Haven't seen The Answer in a while so I forget.

 

[Squire]

Funny you single out bioware games - that's always how i feel about them

Not many games do this, so that's what I figured.

That is my stance though. I'll make an important decision quickly in Mass Effect. But because I'm compelled to.

In TWD I do it because of a timer. It feels fake.

I prefer the emphasis on actually compelling the player with the narrative, not forcing their hand with a blatant mechanism.

 

[Jintor]

so tell me how you feel about social links

Spoiler

i don't really mean anything by this, it's kind of just a pithy one-liner. But mechanics that support the narrative are fine by me

/edit actually more to the point tell me how you feel about paragon/renegade interrupts

 

[buddha0991]

Upupuu....

Spoiler

I guess Aigis is heartless for taking the keys from everyone when no one else was willing to. Unless taking the key from Aigis would kill her and taking the keys from other wouldn't kill them. Haven't seen The Answer in a while so I forget.

p3fes answer spoiler blah blah blah you know the drill

Spoiler

It was only said that Aigis was at risk, because according to Metis, since she inherited the power of the P3 MC, she might share his fate. She warns that taking the key from Aigis may result in her death. The others are apparently in no danger, only if you take too long and they remain flames for too long.

 

[Squire]

so tell me how you feel about social links

Spoiler

i don't really mean anything by this, it's kind of just a pithy one-liner. But mechanics that support the narrative are fine by me

/edit actually more to the point tell me how you feel about paragon/renegade interrupts

They're alright. I mean, they're basically no-risk QTEs. They're cool moments to trigger, but I don't really view them through the same lens as the dialogue.

 

[Jintor]

maybe the most awkward 'conversation/response' engine I've seen recently was probably DX:HR, at least outside of the social boss battles. Sooooo stilted

 

[Squire]

maybe the most awkward 'conversation/response' engine I've seen recently was probably DX:HR, at least outside of the social boss battles. Sooooo stilted

Oh man. Sooooo much of that was cringe-worthy.

 

[cj_iwakura]

My biggest problem with TWD is that your choices really don't matter most of the time. I HATE games like that.

Danganronpa's even worse about this.

-Tell her
-Don't tell her (oh wait you have to tell her)

 

[ScraftyDevil]

Sorry to hear that you weren't a fan, Inorigo. How far did you get before calling it quits? Episode 2 is when the game really goes into its own and starts giving the choices longer timers and more narrative weight, and Episode 5 has some amazing emotional payoff.

My biggest problem with TWD is that your choices really don't matter most of the time. I HATE games like that.

This is like, 99% of all games which include a choice system. I can only think of 2 games off the top of my head in which your choices create a significant branch in the narrative, and one of them is absolute garbage. Besides, TWD's choices do have some impact on the story, and the game does a great job of making you feel the consequences of your actions (even if they are apparently pre-determined). So far, S2 has been much better about this too, as three of the "major" choices I've made so far have changed the story in pretty great ways (which I can attest to as I'm playing through each episode twice to experience the differences), so I guess TT's been listening to the criticisms to at least some extent.

I feel like the whole "choices don't matter" mentality is a really cynical one in general though, and playing through any game in that mindset is going to do nothing but rob you of your enjoyment and immersion.

I dunno. I thought it was a good game. I liked it better than The Citizen Kane of Video Games, personally.

 

[Dantis]

As far as Walking Dead's choices go, you're looking at them the wrong way, CJ.

The leads on it do a podcast called IdleThumbs, and Sean Vanaman (The lead writer) talks about the choices on one of the episodes.

Basically, he thinks that large visible consequences are dumb and essentially arbitrary because it's a branching path. The choices he tried to add were meant to affect a character, not alter the route.

It's hard to discuss specifics without going into spoilers for the first season (And from now on, I think we should keep spoilers from other games out of here as a general rule), but what he says makes a lot of sense. Choices in games like Mass Effect actually remove character, where Walking Dead's add it.

 

[Lollipop Dave]

Choices in games like Mass Effect actually remove character, where Walking Dead's add it.

I disagree with this completely, but I thought the Walking Dead game was boring and pretty bad and I absolutely love Mass Effect so I won't bother with my (probably) biased reason on why.

 

[Jintor]

i like that choices affect things and reveberate through the entire trilogy in ME3 but in a way I kind of feel like its choices end up feeling like they mean even less than in TWD despite changing more. Like, you save the rachni queen in 1, you get an emissary in 2, she shows up as a battle asset or whatever in 3. Great, except it doesn't really mean anything and you don't really give a damn about it. Even something like deciding what to tell Clem about this, that or the other could be a more powerful thing in TWD. Of course, it all kind of depends how much you buy into the character relationships, etc. But I still think Ep 5 was probably one of the most personal, most effecting stories I've been a part of before.

I do appreciate it when stuff does change over time - I really liked the Citadel DLC for ME3 because it was basically a showcase of 'hey, here's the awesome adventures you guys went on! Here's everyone reflecting on the kind of Sheperd and crew member dude you were! Woo!' - but often it doesn't really feeling like it means much.

 

[animaSerah]

Just stopping in quick before I get buried in work: that new Persona Q cross-promotion site features an adorable picture of Teddie, so here's an avatar:

 

[cjkeats]

Just stopping in quick before I get buried in work: that new Persona Q cross-promotion site features an adorable picture of Teddie, so here's an avatar:

I assume that girl on the bottom in the picture with Yu and Teddie is part of whatever that site is supposed to be? I like that picture.
I love it when other characters are tossed into persona outfits.

 

[Dantis]

I have no idea what this crossover is, but that picture is pretty cool.

 

[Lollipop Dave]

I have no idea what this crossover is, but that picture is pretty cool.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wooser's_Hand-to-Mouth_Life

Just in-case you really wanted to know.

 

[kewlmyc]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wooser's_Hand-to-Mouth_Life

Just in-case you really wanted to know.

Never heard of it. Is it any good?

 

[Lollipop Dave]

Never heard of it. Is it any good?

I couldn't really give a fair opinion, I dislike watching shorts to begin with.

 

[Nachos]

Never heard of it. Is it any good?

It's made by one of the members of Supercell, so...maybe? I'm kinda curious myself. I thought that the crossover might not make sense if the show really is for kids, but if it's made by a Supercell artist, then maybe they're really not too far off, tone-wise.

EDIT: Oh wait, there's a Steins;Gate reference apparently.

 

[Lollipop Dave]

I thought that the crossover might not make sense if the show really is for kids, but if it's made by a Supercell artist, then maybe they're really not too far off, tone-wise.

I figure it's mostly because of the mascot, and a fan put the two together, nothing more.

 

[Dantis]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wooser's_Hand-to-Mouth_Life

Just in-case you really wanted to know.

So what's the crossover? Are Narukami and Teddie going to be in the show or what?

 

[kewlmyc]

So what's the crossover? Are Narukami and Teddie going to be in the show or what?

No, I doubt it. Just crossover art. Happens all the time in the anime world.

 

[Lollipop Dave]

So what's the crossover? Are Narukami and Teddie going to be in the show or what?

As far as I know it's just fan-art. cross-over art is probably a better word.

 

[PK Gaming]

No, I doubt it. Just crossover art. Happens all the time in the anime world.

Yeah

Western crossovers are pretty common too

 

[Dantis]

As far as I know it's just fan-art. cross-over art is probably a better word.

Oh.

So it's pretty much nothing then.

 

[Caladrius]

I want Persona x Paper Mario

Or Persona x Transformers

Or Persona x Mai Chan's Daily Lifeetroid

Okay that 3rd one isn't funny.

 

[SloaneRisette]

I want Persona x Paper Mario

Or Persona x Transformers

Or Persona x Mai Chan's Daily Lifeetroid

Okay that 3rd one isn't funny.

Persona x Seinfeld

 

[ScraftyDevil]

Persona x Seinfeld

I WAS IN THE POOL

Spoiler

BEING INTIMATE WITH HERRRRRRR

!

 

[Lollipop Dave]

Oh.

So it's pretty much nothing then.

I don't think so. I mean, the show's second run started this January, so it's probably because of that. But I'll have a proper look when I'm not at work just to make sure.

 

[Lunar15]

I WAS IN THE POOL

Spoiler

BEING INTIMATE WITH HERRRRRRR

!

*dead*

 

[animaSerah]

I WAS IN THE POOL

Spoiler

BEING INTIMATE WITH HERRRRRRR

!

I wasn't sure what I'd find under the spoiler tags, and I wasn't disappointed! XD

I could also see:

*Makoto and Akihiko are standing by and staring out of the dorm window. Junpei enters in a huff, walks over and slams money down on the table*

"That's it, I'M OUT!"

 

[Dantis]

I wasn't sure what I'd find under the spoiler tags, and I wasn't disappointed! XD

I could also see:

*Makoto and Akihiko are standing by and staring out of the dorm window. Junpei enters in a huff, walks over and slams money down on the table*

"That's it, I'M OUT!"

This is a web-comic waiting to happen.

I WAS IN THE POOL

Spoiler

BEING INTIMATE WITH HERRRRRRR

!

The joke that just keeps on giving!