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Persona Community Thread |OT5| Pull up a chair! [NO PQ OR P4U SPOILERS!]
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DryEyeRelief
Member
Which one was Taka again?
3 definitely has its "that's not fair" moments but I think it's better for someone to decide for themselves whether it's tolerable.
3 does a better job of introducing you to the general game mechanics too.
Spectrasonic
Member
Agreed. I had a hard time going from P4's battle system to P3's.
I don't really follow the logic here. We've even seen in the thread that people will quit FES because it's not as easy to play as 4. It would be way easier to go from 3 to 4 where everything is more refined.
Green Mamba
Member
I think, had I played 3 before 4, I would have quit halfway because the game's pacing is ass and the story at the middle really didn't keep my attention at all.
Green Mamba
Member
3 is the harder of the two for the most part, but you can't control your party members directly.
Or you could play P3P first. You have good social links to keep you interested while the plot does nothing, and the combat is similar to P4 in most aspects. All you lose is presentation.
Speaking of which, one of my fears regarding P3P getting remade is it would inevitably require that they do cutscenes of FeMC, as opposed to just the two or three stills of her in P3P. Then again, since they're doing a whole nother round of P4:TA, maybe they'd feel okay giving girl her own scenes, too.
Speaking of which, one of my fears regarding P3P getting remade is it would inevitably require that they do cutscenes of FeMC, as opposed to just the two or three stills of her in P3P. Then again, since they're doing a whole nother round of P4:TA, maybe they'd feel okay giving girl her own scenes, too.
But seriously Atlus integrate the poor girl into male story as PC and SL.
Kiyotaka Ishimaru
FES requires more careful planning. But really, its difficulty is usually overstated. It's not that bad.
You'll be okay, then, I think. I still HIGHLY recommend P3P's female side to see more of the male party members, but I think you can survive without if FES is more your cup of tea.
Green Mamba
Member
Then you would do just fine.
Spectrasonic
Member
Presentation is a big part. My first try with P3 was P3P, and I couldn't finish it. The visual novel presentation doesn't really work with a silent protagonist. Half the time I wondered if the protagonist was even in the scene.
Isn't P3P the PSP version ? I don't have a PSP currently.
I only have access to the PSN versions of each game.
Chet Rippo
Member
A lot of it's difficulty comes from the fact that you're not in full control. If the main guy gets knocked over, the game basically plays itself.
I'm not going to defend P3P's presentation, but I managed eventually.
Or maybe it was the lack of a character in scenes that caused me to more or less make up the personalities of Makoto and Minako?
I think it's on PSN, but you'd probably still need a Vita to play it.
SloaneRisette
Member
Dangan Ronpa School Mode is so boring I literally fell asleep while playing it at one point.
Phantasmal Repose
Member
P3P is available on PSN. You'd need a Vita to play it. I still say that P3 FES is the best starting point.
Spectrasonic
Member
Yup, After you beat FES, you can give P3P a shot if you want to play has FeMC. Seeing the events in FES will help you visualize what's going on in P3P.
SloaneRisette
Member
I'd agree with this, but P3 FES was also my first Persona game and what hooked me into the series so I might be biased
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
Talking about Dangaronpa school mode.
+The idea as an extra is a really fun one
+Develops much better the characters than the main game.
+The good ending is surprising and fun.
+The building monukumas part, the hud and music there are great, and its fun to play the first and second time (by that I mean failing and completing it)
+It makes funnily stupid the character of Makoto because of the character endings.
-You need at least 4-5 walktroughs of exactly the same thing. The fun little experience then becomes repetitive in extreme.
-Some of the answers are random as hell in how many hearts they give, which makes the whole game an experience of saving before talking to the characters to max the hearts as soon as possible. BTW is really shitty that the best location for nearly all the characters is the dining room, why the hell did they made more options then, way to make the characters more distinctive.
-The building monokumas part becomes easy and a bore after the second playthrough.
-At the end the mode is nothing more that fastforwarding with circle and saving loading. And the fastforward goes too slow (unlike the super one in P4Golden).
-It makes even worse, if somewhat funny, the character of Makoto becuase of the character endings. (Yeah I know, this is a psoitive and a negative).
-I FUCKING HATE THE "SOCIAL LINK" MUSIC THE GAME HAS. Is the only music in the whole game I dont like, becuase the rest is pretty great, but the track is so horrible and is played non stop is school mode my ears bleed.
+The idea as an extra is a really fun one
+Develops much better the characters than the main game.
+The good ending is surprising and fun.
+The building monukumas part, the hud and music there are great, and its fun to play the first and second time (by that I mean failing and completing it)
+It makes funnily stupid the character of Makoto because of the character endings.
-You need at least 4-5 walktroughs of exactly the same thing. The fun little experience then becomes repetitive in extreme.
-Some of the answers are random as hell in how many hearts they give, which makes the whole game an experience of saving before talking to the characters to max the hearts as soon as possible. BTW is really shitty that the best location for nearly all the characters is the dining room, why the hell did they made more options then, way to make the characters more distinctive.
-The building monokumas part becomes easy and a bore after the second playthrough.
-At the end the mode is nothing more that fastforwarding with circle and saving loading. And the fastforward goes too slow (unlike the super one in P4Golden).
-It makes even worse, if somewhat funny, the character of Makoto becuase of the character endings. (Yeah I know, this is a psoitive and a negative).
-I FUCKING HATE THE "SOCIAL LINK" MUSIC THE GAME HAS. Is the only music in the whole game I dont like, becuase the rest is pretty great, but the track is so horrible and is played non stop is school mode my ears bleed.
Trying to determine whether there'd be anything to look forward to in the upcoming #Spring issue of Official Persona Magazine (June 12), I came across this design in PM #10 on a page about Thanatos:
Some notes I made:
- ~41 pages of Persona game info in #Re:birth (12 others being related to P3M #1)
- ~4 pages for PQ, ~4 for P4D, ~6 for P5 + general game info, 27 for P4U2
- 27 pages of P4A info in PM #10 (most of them being standard character specific gameplay info), which was right after the P4A release (August 2012). Pretty much the only real game info pages, outside of stuff like P4G building architecture and Soejima Persona design philosophy.
- ~164 pages total in #Re:birth
- ~180 pages total in PM #10
- Stuff that will most likely be covered in #Spring will be: P4GA, PQ, P4U2 and P3M #2
Basically, there probably won't be anything cool outside of some interviews we won't be understanding anyways. Even PSC has scoops that the magazine doesn't get but, then again, maybe there'll be some cool exclusive P4U2 info since it'll be the only unreleased game they've started actively promoting featured in the revived issues.
Anyone know what that's about?
Some notes I made:
- ~41 pages of Persona game info in #Re:birth (12 others being related to P3M #1)
- ~4 pages for PQ, ~4 for P4D, ~6 for P5 + general game info, 27 for P4U2
- 27 pages of P4A info in PM #10 (most of them being standard character specific gameplay info), which was right after the P4A release (August 2012). Pretty much the only real game info pages, outside of stuff like P4G building architecture and Soejima Persona design philosophy.
- ~164 pages total in #Re:birth
- ~180 pages total in PM #10
- Stuff that will most likely be covered in #Spring will be: P4GA, PQ, P4U2 and P3M #2
Basically, there probably won't be anything cool outside of some interviews we won't be understanding anyways. Even PSC has scoops that the magazine doesn't get but, then again, maybe there'll be some cool exclusive P4U2 info since it'll be the only unreleased game they've started actively promoting featured in the revived issues.
Yeah, they're way too random and you can fuck up pretty easily and waste a card.
I just used a guide because I didn't feel like slogging through it more than I already had to.
Spectrasonic
Member
I wonder if Ken will keep his magic for P4 Ultimax. I doubt they'd put in a fifth zio character in. Wonder if they'll do something interesting with hama.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
Oh yeah, im using a guide of course, after the Idiscovered the first walktrough I did didn't make a lick of sense.
There are characters that have 3 right answers (as in full hearts) in a zone (the majority are the dining room), but other have only 2. What this means is you still need to save before speaking with this character because theres always the chance that there will be a question with an answer that only gives you half a heart.
This is of course if you want to do this mode in the least amount of walktroughs possible.
I also had a problem, I didn't now that to see the good ending for the first time you need to have the report cards for ALL characters (even the ones you haven't maxed) complete. So here I was having a perfect walktrough (the secon time I played, the first one of course was the bad ending) doing my most hated characters (Byakuya, Leon, Yasuhiro and Fukawa) with their complete report cards and their hearts full. Got to the ending thinking I was going to get ti and no good ending appeared. Had to repeat their shitty social links again in the third walkthrough.
The majority of guides don't tell you that you need to fill ALL the report cards before getting the good ending, I was doing the report cards and hearts at the same time for each character, before jumping to another.
There are characters that have 3 right answers (as in full hearts) in a zone (the majority are the dining room), but other have only 2. What this means is you still need to save before speaking with this character because theres always the chance that there will be a question with an answer that only gives you half a heart.
This is of course if you want to do this mode in the least amount of walktroughs possible.
I also had a problem, I didn't now that to see the good ending for the first time you need to have the report cards for ALL characters (even the ones you haven't maxed) complete. So here I was having a perfect walktrough (the secon time I played, the first one of course was the bad ending) doing my most hated characters (Byakuya, Leon, Yasuhiro and Fukawa) with their complete report cards and their hearts full. Got to the ending thinking I was going to get ti and no good ending appeared. Had to repeat their shitty social links again in the third walkthrough.
The majority of guides don't tell you that you need to fill ALL the report cards before getting the good ending, I was doing the report cards and hearts at the same time for each character, before jumping to another.
It'd be funny if Ken's not even in the game. We've got, like, 2.5 hints indicating his presence (with the big one being the BB leak), but it'd be great if it was all misleading.
I think electricity could be implemented in his moves much like ice is implemented in Chie's 2C in P4AU or electricity in Kanji's 5C. It would probably be fairly difficult to figure out a novel way of implementing electricity in a special or super given all of the other zio based moves in the game, yeah.
Green Mamba
Member
I don't know if I would consider Akihiko a zio character considering how infrequently he uses it. Unless he's been changed a bunch in Ultimax.
I did think it was kind of strange how they retained all of the electric attacks for the electric using characters but dropped the proper ice magic for two of the three ice using characters (Teddie's ice cube doesn't count).
I did think it was kind of strange how they retained all of the electric attacks for the electric using characters but dropped the proper ice magic for two of the three ice using characters (Teddie's ice cube doesn't count).
They could copy Naoto's Fate Gauge system for his Hama skill. Zio's always been a secondary skill for Ken, so they could just make it a standard skill (or even a Persona Attack)
Regardless of what they do, I really hope his Hama skills aren't like Elizabeths; her instant skills are a complete waste of space.
He uses Zio skills for 2 of his supers + his new Persona move in Ultimax. (The one that causes silence)
They definitely would not do this. If there's one thing ASW doesn't do, it's copy and paste fundamental character gameplay mechanics onto another completely different character.
I've started using Liz' IK moves when going against opponents that I think I can use them against. Surprisingly effective, at least in terms of messing with the opponent's mind.
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Perhaps they could give him a "Hama gauge" that fills up depending on how many times you land a Hama skill. When maxed out, the next Hama skill you land will OHKO.
That sounds better and more plausible, though perhaps a bit too much like a reverse Fate gauge for me to think they'd do that either. If he's in the game and he were to keep his Hama/Mudo skills... well, can't personally think of what they could do myself. Naoto and Liz pretty much cover how those skills could be implemented in the game, in my mind.
A major part of Naoto's design revolves around the Megido triggers and other attacks in order to lower the Fate gauge to perform an IK. Liz's IK moves depend on time passed in order to trigger. Ken's wouldn't be able to be like either of the two, and what other conditional properties could they implement to an IK move like that aside from time or a lowering/increasing gauge?
Timer base IK skills are just frustrating (frustratingly useless, or frustratingly overpowered) so they're out. Perhaps they could implement a system similar to Bang's Fu Rin Ka Zan. Basically, Ken could have a Persona normal(D?) that casts "Hama." Said version Hama wouldn't cause an instant kill, but it would activate 1 of 4 seals. After all 4 seals are unlocked, the "Hamaon" super, would work as an instant kill. Presumably the seals wouldn't transfer between rounds, and they would be difficult to use. It's tough to come up with a Hamaon concept that doesn't mirror Naoto's, but I won't accept a Ken moveset that doesn't feature Hama.
If they're not going to incorporate his primary element into his moveset, then he shouldn't even be in the game.
There is more to his character than just instant kills. It doesn't need to be a fundamental mechanic when there are two other characters who already incorporate it. I would think his spears would be a more primary mechanic anyhow.
Green Mamba
Member
That seems kind of extreme. Teddie's moveset is essentially entirely made up, but I wouldn't trade it for no Teddie.
Not really
His Persona is a Hama type that specializes in Hama skills. The number of IK users shouldn't stop them from making Ken into a IK character (especially since Elizabeth barely counts as an IK user.) Basing a primary mechanic on a weapon strikes me as a bad idea.
Actually, I'm not a fan of Teddie's moveset.
Go big or go home.
That sounds further abstracted from the Fate gauge concept, so it's a bit better. But still, yeah, it's kinda like Naoto's in that it revolves around using certain moves to build up to a point where the ability to immediately kill an opponent is unlocked. Still seems too similar to me.
And I don't know about that. Much like Chie or Teddie's lack of ice and Aigis' lack of... well, practically any of her Persona moves, I don't think it's all that important. As long as they stay true to Ken's fighting style in terms of movement and ability as well as what one would consider appropriate moves for his Persona, perhaps with a few of his physical moves, I think it'd be fine. IK moves are typically useless, anyways. Even in Naoto's case, they're pretty situational.
Haha, but Teddie's was the most consuming moveset requiring the most effort and thought from the dev. team. They also said it was one of the most satisfying to nail down.
His Persona has one instant kill ability at any given moment. Sometimes two if we count Hama Boost. That's hardly "specializing" in such skills, and he has a wide variety of skills. Including one that makes his Spear attacks pretty powerful.
You are looking at this far too narrowly. Especially considering other characters (as Green Mamba mentioned) have entirely new moves for P4A, and ArcSys isn't one to usually trend over the same mechanics.
I don't like to play Teddie myself, but I admire the amount of detail they put into his abilities. There's a lot of animation there.
Personally for Ken, I'd incorporate the Hama mechanic into his Instant kill in some way, then have the rest of his character be more about spear attacks (for himself) or for other Light/Electric based abilities (for his Persona.) They could incorporate Holy skills that don't need to specifically be of the expel/instant kill type, like Judgement Light or stats effects.
Chie's moveset works because she barely specialized in Ice skills anyway (and even then, I was annoyed until they added the freezing effect to her 2C). I've already admitted to my disdain for Teddie's moveset and as for Aigis... her moveset in P3 was entirely of consisted support of skills. I think her only offensive skill was Akasha Arts and God hand.
I dunno, Naoto's IK were pretty integral to her moveset. She can could into them for an easy kill if the opponent's fate gauge is drained, and she can use Mudoon as a combo extender. I mean i'm sure they, but I won't be be satisfied if his primary element wasn't a core part of is moveset.
Oh come on. Hamaon + Hama boost made him strong Hama user in P3. Add in the fact that he's immune to it, and it's pretty clear that he specializes in Hama. Should they have abstained from giving Junpei Agi skills because of the fact the he only had one Agi skill in P3? I don't care how they do it, Hama needs to be in the equation.
I totally respect the amount of effort put into making Teddie's moveset work. I just don't like it.
Guess I'm thinking it more from the perspective of higher levels of play, but Naoto players didn't often depend on her Hama/Mudo moves to kill opponents since the Fate gauge is too restrictive (which is a good thing) in those kinds of matches (aside from using Mudoon for the wall stick in P4A like you mentioned, though that's not really a thing anymore in P4AU). Hers are much more effective than Liz's for a quick kill, though, I'll give you that.
Yeah, I don't know. Can't say I'd really care if he didn't have any Hama/Mudo skills, but if he did (and he's in the game), I'd be interested in seeing how they were implemented.
Last I checked, Junpei's primary mechanic revolves around his baseball skills, befitting his primary moveset from Persona 3 of Strike skills. Agi skills only make of a fraction of his abilities in Ultimax.
Or essentially: Exactly what I was suggesting for Ken.
so I decided to go with persona 4 upon my friend's urging.
Been playing for about 3 hours now pretty unique experience for me.
It almost feels like playing through a TV show almost.I like how the game takes time to introduce the setting and the characters deliberately without forcing action.
Gotta love the character designs.Very classy and distinct.
So thanks for everyone's suggestions in this thread.You guys are helpful and awesome.
Been playing for about 3 hours now pretty unique experience for me.
It almost feels like playing through a TV show almost.I like how the game takes time to introduce the setting and the characters deliberately without forcing action.
Gotta love the character designs.Very classy and distinct.
So thanks for everyone's suggestions in this thread.You guys are helpful and awesome.
Green Mamba
Member
Glad you're enjoying it! I do recommend avoiding this topic until you beat it though. We're pretty good with most spoilers, but not airtight.
Last I checked, Junpei's primary mechanic revolves around his baseball skills, befitting his primary moveset from Persona 3 of Strike skills. Agi skills only make of a fraction of his abilities in Ultimax.
Or essentially: Exactly what I was suggesting for Ken.
All of his supers (save Victory Cry) + 5C incorporate Agi in some way, so it's a fairly significant part of his moveset. And I was refuting your previous claim anyway. Like I said, I don't care how they do it, Hama needs to be a part of his main moveset.
Sounds like Danganronpa 2 is a better game? I'm still early in the game, but damn. I'm liking it, but I'm already learning tonot get attached to anyone.
Rule #1: Cherish the time you spend with your favorite characters, because they will die.
Heh, I remember when there was like an almost entire (50ppp) page of people freely discussing the murderer once. No spoiler tags at all. I was utterly furious when I saw that.
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