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[Green Mamba]

2) Your mileage my vary on this one, but I felt that the siscon jokes in Persona 4 Arena were actually pretty funny.

God Arena sucks.

EDIT: I've wanted to bring this up for a while, but this choice of character trait for Yu makes no sense. (major P4 spoilers):

Spoiler

When Nanako "dies" in P4, during the events of the good ending, the main character is the character who remains completely calm and is able to talk everyone out of killing Nametame. How you can jump from that to "major sister complex" is baffling. It's like picking a character trait out of a hat, and it's not even something you can attribute to what the MC does in P4.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I won't complain about anything on here for a month if you can give me a plausible context where that line would be anything other than awful.

What? I'm not going to come up with anything like that, and I don't really care whether you're complaining or not.

Yeah, it's just the one line that's bothering me. I think the rest of the trailer, and a lot of what we've seen of the game, is pretty cool. Admittedly, I do not. I don't speak Japanese, I'm just overreacting based on what others are saying. But incest vibes are like a huge turn off for me.

I see. And heh, can't say I disagree with the bolded.

 

[A Dead Diehard]

God Arena sucks.

EDIT: I've wanted to bring this up for a while, but this choice of character trait for Yu makes no sense. (major P4 spoilers):

Spoiler

When Nanako "dies" in P4, during the events of the good ending, the main character is the character who remains completely calm and is able to talk everyone out of killing Nametame. How you can jump from that to "major sister complex" is baffling. It's like picking a character trait out of a hat, and it's not even something you can attribute to what the MC does in P4.

No, but don't you see? It's a spinoff so characters are retreads rather than continuations. :/

 

[Dantis]

What? I'm not going to come up with anything like that, and I don't really care whether you're complaining or not.

I mean, that's not really the point. It wasn't an actual offer, because we both actually know that the context is irrelevant, unless it's worse than what we're assuming.

The point is that regardless of the context, it won't be 'better', so saying "Do you even know what the context is?" is meaningless.

 

[Setsu00]

Nanako: "Me and the others will be legends? Wow!"

I'm such a killjoy today.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I mean, that's not really the point. It wasn't an actual offer, because we both actually know that the context is irrelevant, unless it's worse than what we're assuming.

The point is that regardless of the context, it won't be 'better', so saying "Do you even know what the context is?" is meaningless.

Um... I can't ask if he knows what the context for that line is in the trailer because it won't make it better? That's some logic.

 

[Dantis]

Um... I can't ask if he knows what the context for that line is in the trailer because it won't make it better? That's some logic.

Well, I mean, you can ask, but it's meaningless.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Well, I mean, you can ask, but it's meaningless.

That's on me to decide, not on you. I simply wanted to know if he knew the context for that line in the trailer—for my own edification—and, to me, that was not meaningless.

 

[Venfayth]

RIP Nanako

 

[buddha0991]

RIP Nanako

 

[PK Gaming]

God Arena sucks.

EDIT: I've wanted to bring this up for a while, but this choice of character trait for Yu makes no sense. (major P4 spoilers):

Spoiler

When Nanako "dies" in P4, during the events of the good ending, the main character is the character who remains completely calm and is able to talk everyone out of killing Nametame. How you can jump from that to "major sister complex" is baffling. It's like picking a character trait out of a hat, and it's not even something you can attribute to what the MC does in P4.

Wait a sec, I think you missed something. The titles are intentionally disingenuous and over the top. I mean:

-Chie isn't a carnivore
-Kanji isn't a beefcake emperor
-Akihiko isn't
-etc

For the titles, they took a trait and twisted it, but Yu wasn't a character prior to Arena, so they had to improvise. They took something that every (well, most) players identified with (deeply caring about Nanako) and applied that to his character. In arena, he definitely isn't a siscon, and he's comfortable enough to not get annoyed by the said title.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

Wait a sec, I think you missed something. The titles are intentionally disingenuous and over the top. I mean:

-Chie isn't a carnivore
-Kanji isn't a beefcake emperor
-Akihiko isn't
-etc

For the titles, they took a trait and twisted it, but Yu wasn't a character prior to Arena, so they had to improvise. They took something that every (well, most) players identified with (deepy caring about Nanako) and applied that to his character. In arena, he definitely isn't a siscon, and he's comfortable enough to not get annoyed by the said title.

well, at least someone played arena

 

[Green Mamba]

Wait a sec, I think you missed something. The titles are intentionally disingenuous and over the top. I mean:

-Chie isn't a carnivore
-Kanji isn't a beefcake emperor
-Akihiko isn't
-etc

For the titles, they took a trait and twisted it, but Yu wasn't a character prior to Arena, so they had to improvise. They took something that every (well, most) players identified with (deepy caring about Nanako) and applied that to his character. In arena, he definitely isn't a siscon, and he's comfortable enough to not get annoyed by the said title.

Yes, but the twisted trait for most of the other characters is based on something from their established character. Chie does like meat, and Kanji does have issues with masculinity, etc. I'm saying their improvisation sucks, because it's something that is actually deliberately contradicted by the P4MC's actions in the good ending. Of course they had to improvise, but their choice was a poor one.

 

[Dantis]

Wait a sec, I think you missed something. The titles are intentionally disingenuous and over the top. I mean:

-Chie isn't a carnivore
-Kanji isn't a beefcake emperor
-Akihiko isn't
-etc

For the titles, they took a trait and twisted it, but Yu wasn't a character prior to Arena, so they had to improvise. They took something that every (well, most) players identified with (deepy caring about Nanako) and applied that to his character. In arena, he definitely isn't a siscon, and he's comfortable enough to not get annoyed by the said title.

This is a very reasonable and very true post.

I still think it's gross though.

Yes, but the twisted trait for most of the other characters is based on something from their established character. Chie does like meat, and Kanji does have issues with masculinity, etc. I'm saying their improvisation sucks, because it's something that is actually deliberately contradicted by the P4MC's actions in the good ending. Of course they had to improvise, but their choice was a poor one.

Also valid.

I think the titles were just dumb, for the most part. I've never understood what they're there for. The things they're twisting are at best shallow and at worst non existant

Spoiler

Except for Akihiko which is 100% accurate post-P3.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

This is a very reasonable and very true post.

I still think it's gross though.



Also valid.

I think the titles were just dumb, for the most part. I've never understood what they're there for. The things they're twisting are at best shallow and at worst non existant

Spoiler

Except for Akihiko which is 100% accurate post-P3.

they were created by general teddie in order to make the competitors more uneasy and more willing to fight.

 

[A Dead Diehard]

they were created by general teddie in order to make the competitors more uneasy and more willing to fight.

You mean besides already warping their friends words and actions to provoke fights? Even though almost all of them were done in self-defence?

 

[DryEyeRelief]

For the titles, they took a trait and twisted it, but Yu wasn't a character prior to Arena, so they had to improvise. They took something that every (well, most) players identified with (deepy caring about Nanako) and applied that to his character.

Yeah, that's the Yu Narukami character. Much like how Margaret calls him a gigglo in the anime. This is because in game, if you complete your social links, it seems like everyone wants a piece of the main character. It's representative of player experiences.

Spoiler

this is why yu narukami is infinitely more interesting when he is treated as a player insert than just a regular main character

But as far as the Nanako wanting to marry big bro thing, that isn't derived from the same source. I'm with Dantis on that one. Though, it isn't Sword Art Online level shameless.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

You mean besides already warping their friends words and actions to provoke fights? Even though almost all of them were done in self-defence?

well yea, the whole scenario in the first place was designed to make them uneasy. The titles came from the introduction video on the midnight channel

 

[Dantis]

well yea, the whole scenario in the first place was designed to make them uneasy. The titles came from the introduction video on the midnight channel

I don't mean the in-universe explanation. I mean, literally, why are they in the game? They're not cool, they're not funny, they serve no practical purpose... They're just... there.

 

[PK Gaming]

Yes, but the twisted trait for most of the other characters is based on something from their established character. Chie does like meat, and Kanji does have issues with masculinity, etc. I'm saying their improvisation sucks, because it's something that is actually deliberately contradicted by the P4MC's actions in the good ending. Of course they had to improvise, but their choice was a poor one.

I'm not seeing how his actions at the end contradict the trait they were going for in Arena.

Spoiler

Caring for someone doesn't preclude you from acting rationally, especially if you're a calm individual. But honestly, this is kind of a moot point considering Yu wasn't even a character in Persona 4, just an audience surrogate (no teenager would react the way he did). I don't think there's any point to scrutinizing his actions since they were contrived to keep the game going. The original P4 anime actually did a pretty good job of adapting this scene. "Yu" is understandably broken up about Nanako's death, and almost considers throwing Nametame into the TV right there, but he manages to compose himself.

I'm pretty content with it. I don't think they could have used any alternatives.

Yeah, that's the Yu Narukami character. Much like how Margaret calls him a gigglo in the anime. This is because in game, if you complete your social links, it seems like everyone wants a piece of the main character. It's representative of player experiences.

Spoiler

this is why yu narukami is infinitely more interesting when he is treated as a player insert than just a regular main character

But as far as the Nanako wanting to marry big bro thing, that isn't derived from the same source. I'm with Dantis on that one. Though, it isn't Sword Art Online level shameless.

Yeah "representative of player experiences" is a good way of putting it. I still don't think her comment is that big deal, but I guess I could be a little more sensitive to the feelings of the people who were unnerved by it.

 

[A Dead Diehard]

well yea, the whole scenario in the first place was designed to make them uneasy. The titles came from the introduction video on the midnight channel

Okay, I know I'm going too far into this, but hear me out.

The scenario wasn't just to make them uneasy, it was to make them feel Labrys' pain.
She didn't just have to fight her friends, she had to ruthlessly kill them. The idea that it's supposed to be comparable to a simple fight that doesn't even go so far as a k.o. is ludicrous.

It's obvious Atlus wouldn't go so far as to kill off members of the cast (not knocking them for that, I'm glad they didn't), but Shadow Labby's plan was really weakly implemented.

Spoiler

Then again, I suppose the true mastermind wouldn't have been able to get a shadow he could use out of a dead fighter, so I guess he would have stopped it from becoming fatal so he could try again?

Realistically, it's because the story was built around the game, not the other way around. Which was definitely a smart decision. That doesn't stop the story from being bad though.

Exactly so. Understandable, but still flawed.

 

[Dantis]

Okay, I know I'm going too far into this, but hear me out.

The scenario wasn't just to make them uneasy, it was to make them feel Labrys' pain.
She didn't just have to fight her friends, she had to ruthlessly kill them. The idea that it's supposed to be comparable to a simple fight that doesn't even go so far as a k.o. is ludicrous.

It's obvious they wouldn't go so far as to kill off members of the cast, Shadow Labby's plan was really weakly implemented.

Spoiler

Then again, I suppose the true mastermind wouldn't have been able to get a shadow he could use out of a dead fighter, so I guess he would have stopped it from becoming fatal so he could try again?

Realistically, it's because the story was built around the game, not the other way around. Which was definitely a smart decision. That doesn't stop the story from being bad though.

 

[VegiHam]

I see. And heh, can't say I disagree with the bolded.

I'm sorry, I know it's not best posting practice. Would anyone disagree with that?

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I'm sorry, I know it's not best posting practice. Would anyone disagree with that?

See, I was originally going to say something akin to, "Heh, who would disagree with the bolded?" but... well, we know that those people exist.

 

[arue]

Given how you guys love to comb over every single detail of everything, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned how fucking gormless Kanamin's surprised face is in Nanako's trailer.

I noticed this too and I didn't comment on it because I feel like this is just another rushed portrait done by Soejima, just like how the newcomers (Ken, Yukari) in P4AU look like.

I reeeeaally hope that the portrait quality is not this bad in Persona 5. I feel like it would ruin the game *a little bit* for me.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I reeeeaally hope that the portrait quality is not this bad in Persona 5. I feel like it would ruin the game *a little bit* for me.

If there even are portraits. What I took from the Persona 5 trailer is that those page rips that happen sometimes for effect and an emphasis on character expressions are what would be replacing "portraits," with dialogue mostly occurring with close-up shots of the 3D models like Catherine.

Edit: Follow-up to Poll #008 (which isn't done yet, but that 9 people—including me—lost): Poll #009: Will anything new happen at all concerning Persona 5 on May 5, 2015?

People have been talking about 2015-05-05 as it approaches. I want to have a feel of what most think. This would include something as minor as Hashino saying, "It's still happening," to something big like a new trailer.

 

[arue]

If there even are portraits. What I took from the Persona 5 trailer is that those page rips that happen sometimes for effect and an emphasis on character expressions are what would be replacing "portraits," with dialogue mostly occurring with close-up shots of the 3D models like Catherine.

True, true. I could see that happening. At first I didn't want the 3D models/page rips to replace 2D portraits, but if they look as good as Catherine's then I have no problem. I still hope for 2D portraits to return though.

 

[CrimsonFist]

I'm not sure what to think about 5/5/15. At this point I think that we won't see anything major until Dancing, and I feel like that was always Atlus' plan. I kind of wonder if they've said at any point that the bluray would be our next look, and that it just got missed or not translated. I know the crazy old woman talked about it a bit at the end of Super Live.

I want to believe that they'll show something in a few days, and it's really the perfect opportunity too, but there's been no hints or anything, and in the end, 5/5/15 speculation is just a fan thing because the date looks nice. There's really no reason for Atlus to actually use that date for anything.

But, I voted yes, because I want to believe.

 

[Meia]

they were created by general teddie in order to make the competitors more uneasy and more willing to fight.

I think it says a lot about Yu's character that he can hear what they came up for him and he's able to shrug his shoulders about it, uncaring.


It was like probably the worst they could come up with for his character, and you cannot possibly imagine the lack of fucks he gives.

 

[Reanimatoin]

True, true. I could see that happening. At first I didn't want the 3D models/page rips to replace 2D portraits, but if they look as good as Catherine's then I have no problem. I still hope for 2D portraits to return though.

To be honest, I'd be happier if 2D portraits weren't in the game at all.

Having it all be Catherine-esque but with a few stylish cut-ins would be perfect. The 2D portraits, as nice as they were in the old games, need to stay in the past.

Otherwise, its almost like they haven't done anything new, or learned from 'the Catherine experiment', it would just be the same old stuff but at a higher resolution.

 

[Modest Mauser]

To be honest, I'd be happier if 2D portraits weren't in the game at all.

Having it all be Catherine-esque but with a few stylish cut-ins would be perfect. The 2D portraits, as nice as they were in the old games, need to stay in the past.

Otherwise, its almost like they haven't done anything new, or learned from 'the Catherine experiment', it would just be the same old stuff but at a higher resolution.

I always thought of the portraits as a kind of crutch to get around the graphical limitations of the time, since the in game models were kinda chibi-fied.

Now that the characters can be modelled and look pretty much like the artwork, there's no real need for them anymore.

 

[VegiHam]

See, I was originally going to say something akin to, "Heh, who would disagree with the bolded?" but... well, we know that those people exist.

And those people don't deserve to play Persona Dancing which is a serious game for classy folk.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

To be honest, I'd be happier if 2D portraits weren't in the game at all.

Having it all be Catherine-esque but with a few stylish cut-ins would be perfect. The 2D portraits, as nice as they were in the old games, need to stay in the past.

Otherwise, its almost like they haven't done anything new, or learned from 'the Catherine experiment', it would just be the same old stuff but at a higher resolution.

what they should learn from the catherine experiment is that they need to make another catherine

 

[Reanimatoin]

what they should learn from the catherine experiment is that they need to make another catherine

I'd play another Catherine.

I mean, I didnt finish the game, but still........

 

[TheMrPliskin]

I vastly prefer the page rips to just static portraits as they are more stylish, plus we don't need portraits now that the character models don't look like garbage. Regardless of if portraits are used in P5 we will still get them at some point anyway.

 

[Bio5ith]

Hi, I'm a long time lurker of this thread, thought I'd finally post something.
I don't see the 2D portraits being in P5, personally. They seem like a product of the time that the previous games were made, and the P5 gameplay trailer shows the cut-ins and the new 3D models can functionally replace them. I'd be interested to see if the 3D cutscenes were more dynamic than the previous games' too.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Yeah, I was on the side of "I don't mind the absence of 2D portraits, opting instead for a Catherine-like presentation," ever since Catherine, so I agree with most.

I'd be interested to see if the 3D cutscenes were more dynamic than the previous games' too.

Already, I think the Persona 5 PV01 showed that its mundane scenes that could be comparable to Persona 3's or Persona 4's will be way more dynamic already. Just that scene where the teacher is throwing his chalk at the protagonist has so much activity and expression going on, it's crazy. When you put both games side-by-side, it kind of makes P3/P4 look bad... in a good way! It's been 7 years; it's only normal that the presentation would have advanced.

 

[Green Mamba]

Bah, no one respects 2D art anymore.

I'm pretty content with it. I don't think they could have used any alternatives.

I think, ultimately, I entirely disagree how they have attempted to make "Yu" into just another one of the P4 characters. He stands apart in P4, and should stand apart in spinoffs as well, not just in how the other characters treat him, but how he himself acts. In fact, I think a better title for him would be something to the effect of "The Fantastic Mr. Perfect," or something. He's not just another dude on the team, and I think giving him a similar title to the other characters belies that.

 

[Meia]

I am kind of curious what the presentation of P5 is going to be. Always got the impression that with portraits, it's almost like the character looking at you(which is why it changes based on emotion to what's being said/acted out by the model). Not sure how to convey that without using portraits, unless they go almost first person in conversation scenes. Though maybe the idea of the MC almost being a self-insert is going away to begin with come P5 anyway.


I mean, the Catherine presentation works because Vincent was his own actual character. Maybe that's what the P5 MC will be like this go around.

 

[TheMrPliskin]

If the P5MC does have dialogue choices I don't see why they would need to change the cutscene presentation dramatically from Catherine.

 

[PK Gaming]

Bah, no one respects 2D art anymore.


I think, ultimately, I entirely disagree how they have attempted to make "Yu" into just another one of the P4 characters. He stands apart in P4, and should stand apart in spinoffs as well, not just in how the other characters treat him, but how he himself acts. In fact, I think a better title for him would be something to the effect of "The Fantastic Mr. Perfect," or something. He's not just another dude on the team, and I think giving him a similar title to the other characters belies that.

Fair enough.

Like I said, i'm pretty content with the current setup, but your suggestion has its own appeal.

 

[A Dead Diehard]

If the P5MC does have dialogue choices I don't see why they would need to change the cutscene presentation dramatically from Catherine.

Exactly. Catherine had plenty of dialog options to make. It's the entire basis on which ending you get.

 

[Busaiku]

Junes with lyrics sucks.

 

[Lunar15]

God Arena sucks.

EDIT: I've wanted to bring this up for a while, but this choice of character trait for Yu makes no sense. (major P4 spoilers):

Spoiler

When Nanako "dies" in P4, during the events of the good ending, the main character is the character who remains completely calm and is able to talk everyone out of killing Nametame. How you can jump from that to "major sister complex" is baffling. It's like picking a character trait out of a hat, and it's not even something you can attribute to what the MC does in P4.

This, it's a totally random attribute to assign. I would have made more fun of his mary-sueness/spotlight hogging.

Either way, Arena just plan sucks. I hope none of the main series writers were involved in any of the spinoffs.

Also, we've already seen 2D portraits for Persona 5, you guys.

Not sure if they're going to be THE main character portraits or just used in special scenes, but it should give us a strong idea about the quality of the character portraits in the rest of the game. It looks absolutely great, and the characters blink and animate as well. I have no fears whatsoever when it comes to character portraits in P5.

 

[Dantis]

Didn't characters blink in P4 too?

This, it's a totally random attribute to assign. I would have made more fun of his mary-sueness/spotlight hogging.

Either way, Arena just plan sucks. I hope none of the main series writers were involved in any of the spinoffs.

I'm confident Hashino will keep it all in check for P5. All of his games have had great writing.

 

[GamingBird]

I didn't see any character convos delivered Catherine style in the trailer. I saw page rips with cool looking 2d portraits during convos.

 

[Lunar15]

Didn't characters blink in P4 too?



I'm confident Hashino will keep it all in check for P5. All of his games have had great writing.

They might have. I forget. Either way, these portraits are top notch.

And yes, I have faith in Hashino. I can only assume he wasn't terribly involved in the writing of the spinoffs.

 

[Dantis]

They might have. I forget. Either way, these portraits are top notch.

And yes, I have faith in Hashino. I can only assume he wasn't terribly involved in the writing of the spinoffs.

Pretty sure Hashino was barely involved in any of the spinoffs at all. He said in an interview once that he was more involved in P4G than people probably realise, but I think that's about it.

I think he oversaw the projects at most, but didn't really contribute to them.

 

[Lunar15]

Pretty sure Hashino was barely involved in any of the spinoffs at all. He said in an interview once that he was more involved in P4G than people probably realise, but I think that's about it.

I think he oversaw the projects at most, but didn't really contribute to them.

He's not the only writer though, I'd assume. The Wiki page lists Yuichiroh Tanaka and Akira Kawasaki as the lead writers. I'll have to look up some stuff to see what their real role was and how actively involved in the spinoffs they were.

 

[Andrefpvs]

Hi, I'm a long time lurker of this thread, thought I'd finally post something.
I don't see the 2D portraits being in P5, personally. They seem like a product of the time that the previous games were made, and the P5 gameplay trailer shows the cut-ins and the new 3D models can functionally replace them. I'd be interested to see if the 3D cutscenes were more dynamic than the previous games' too.

Hey, welcome!