Scratch the 'a bit of a perv' part and I'd be mostly fine with that.
I'd rather have a younger cast. Someone in their 40s would be as high as I'd want it to go.
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Persona Community Thread: The Butterfly Effect
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Scratch the 'a bit of a perv' part and I'd be mostly fine with that.
I'd rather have a younger cast. Someone in their 40s would be as high as I'd want it to go.
Aw..but old pervy people can be funny.
Yeah I'd prefer a younger cast too, but one older character should be fine if done right. Or at least a social link like that old couple at the bookstore in Persona 3.
Your main worry should be hoping that none of the characters are dancers and they add a dance battle mini game.
Your main worry should be hoping that none of the characters are dancers and they add a dance battle mini game.
Ulala dances the flamenco to negotiate with demons.
Mark danced crazy.
How could I forget the original.
Also, there was at least one old dude who had a Persona (early P2:IS spoilers).
The demon is not impressed, demon dances back and seduces Ulala.
Ulala leaves your team, negotiation failed.
How about when they enter the shadow world, they all become young again, they are all surprised at how everyone looks.
Later on doubts consume their minds on whether they want to stop the shadows or not, because they like being young again.
buddha0991
Member
What do you guys know about Dancing Furiously? Nothing, thats what. Everyone is doing it, but not you. You and your crazy dancin' and your flamenco dancin', don't know the OG stuff mang.
And I mean everyone is dancing furiously, everyone.
It's okay though, some of the new kids are learning the ways of furious dancing!
And I mean everyone is dancing furiously, everyone.
It's okay though, some of the new kids are learning the ways of furious dancing!
Persona 4 is actually a coma fantasy. The protagonist is knocked unconscious when he falls backwards and hits his head on his table, never to wake up again.
Aw..but old pervy people can be funny.
Yeah I'd prefer a younger cast too, but one older character should be fine if done right. Or at least a social link like that old couple at the bookstore in Persona 3.
Your main worry should be hoping that none of the characters are dancers and they add a dance battle mini game.
Hahaa, I said that like back in August.
Whilst that's an extreme example, I am genuinely concerned that they'll lean heavier on that particular type of anime influence.
That's because you can't get crazier than Innocent Sin second half.
As opposed to the original characters we got with 3, 4 and 1?
Is it really though? The Japanese sect of the fandom seems rather pleased with teenagers.
SloaneRisette
Member
"I can't go to (insert place where they fight shadows) today! I need to get my Metamucil before I can do any fighting!"
*shrug*
I don't read Japanese. But I see it requested constantly by the western fanbase.
As opposed to the original characters we got with 3, 4 and 1?
4's characters were cliche?
buddha0991
Member
Quite, yes. You could say every single character in the entire series is cliche in some way or another.
Disagree. Actually, I think most would say the whole thing about P4's characters was about subverting cliches.
Total subversions, more like. They start as cliches. It's an important distinction to make.
buddha0991
Member
^I feel that way about most Persona characters though.
Punk with a heart of gold, kung fu tomboy, yamato nadeshiko, steely young detective...
The majority of P4's cast is well treaded territory. Tropes, however, are not bad. It's all about execution.
Well, that's not really what you said, haha.
This is a drastic over-simplification.
Like I say, it's an over-simplification. The kinds of issues that they deal with aren't even issues which come up in other games, let alone frequently enough to become cliche.
It is. Anything can be boiled down to its most basic parts. Like I said, it's all about execution.
Persona 4 takes these well worn themes, and through its story, puts its own unique twist on them. However, their foundations are very clear.
SloaneRisette
Member
They really aren't all that simple though. At a base level, yes, but most characters are, as you said, built upon tropes and archetypes.
Although I prefer Persona 3, saying this about 4's characters is quite wrong in my opinion.
No, it's a fantasy set inside of a snowglobe that is owned by an autistic child.
As opposed to the original characters we got with 3, 4 and 1?
I'm not sure you two quite understand the meaning of what cliches are...
buddha0991
Member
It is in my opinion though that just about every single character type has been done before somewhere as a trope, but tropes don't have to be complete cliches and what matters is not that the character somehow breaks all cliche molds, but if the characters themselves are likable or not.
And now I report, Yu Narukami's journey is now over.
End game spoiler hidden behind link.
There is another though, that will be rising in his wake.
...buuuut for now, my revisit to Inaba is complete. Now, I just have some unfinished buiness to take care of in Sumaru City, and a journey in Tatsumi Port Island needs to be answered. Showtime, the psychological battles of the minds of these people are never done.
Other games, the vast majority of anime; to call P4's cast cliched gives waaaaay too much credit to the schlock that's out there.
SloaneRisette
Member
And now I report, Yu Narukami's journey is now over.
There is another though, that will be rising in his wake.
SPUDD LOVE LIVES ON FOREVER
See this post.
As I said, you can clearly see their foundations. As the story progresses, however, more and more is revealed about the characters allowing them to expand into more unique characters with more depth.
Tropes are not bad in and of themselves. Cliches are when you fail to use tropes appropriately.
SloaneRisette
Member
I agreed with what you said. I agree that, at the base, like most characters are, they have certain ideals backed behind them used to create a foundation for the characters. You can definitely see that with Persona 4's, but, as you agreed, they definitely become much deeper as you go on.
Sorry about any misunderstanding there may have been in my post.
We disagree on what counts as cliche, I think.
If something takes an established trope and puts a spin on it, then it isn't a cliche. A cliche is when something has been overdone to the point of tedium, and its meaning is lost.
Well, it was probably unfair of me to say that in the context of Persona, because they'd no doubt spin it in some significant way, but in something like a Tales game, the idea of a wizened old man is eye-roll worthy.
buddha0991
Member
I'd totally accept someone like this except maybe not as monk like as a party member
What's the "spin" on P4's characters though? No animosity, i honestly don't see it.
As an aside, why aren't you a part of the Steam group? :O
I was trying to talk about how great Tomb Raider looks yesterday in chat, but everyone else is lame and just kept telling me how shit Tomb Raider and Uncharted are. IF YOU WERE THERE I COULD HAVE TALKED ABOUT IT TO YOU AND I WOULDN'T HATE EVERYONE LIKE I DO NOW.
Which character? If we take Naoto for example, can you think of many other characters like her? She's stern, confident and unsociable, and unaccepting of the fact that she's a girl. She is of average general intelligence but incredibly observant and perceptive. She sees her gender as a flaw and so she masquerades as a man, apparently to great success. Her strengths are her logic and rational, and her weakness is that she is strongly emotional when her rationale fails.
Are there really so many game characters like that to the extent that she is a cliche?
We need more people in the steam group chat in general. It's usually just me, Omi, Dai, and Buddha in there.
buddha0991
Member
^Clearly the best people
SloaneRisette
Member
I always forget to join in. ;_;
I'll hop on in once I finish this homework, GAF distracts me enough as is, lol.
I'll hop on in once I finish this homework, GAF distracts me enough as is, lol.
We need more people in the steam group chat in general. It's usually just me, Omi, Dai, and Buddha in there.
After last night, I'm never joining in again.
We are nemeses.
Haha, it's fine. I think it was the "saying this about 4's characters is quite wrong in my opinion," that threw me off.
You're contradicting yourself, but I'm not sure how to articulate it.
If your definition for cliche is simply something that's been overdone, then the P4 cast is very much cliche. Few if any of casts' basic characterizations are unique. However, because of the amount of depth we're given through S Links and all the random events that happen over the year, what would typically be cliched territory becomes much more well-rounded and deep.
[Lancer/Butt Monkey/ Cool Guy] Yosuke's hidden streak of jealousy and boredom, [Tomboy] Chie's secret need for girly Yukiko's dependence, [Traditional Japanese Stereotype] Yukiko's desire to escape from the 'perfect' fate already decided for her, [Delinquent] Kanji's insecurities about his hobbies, [Team Pet] Teddie's role only as an 'empty' team mascot with nothing else within him, [Idol] Rise's difficulties keeping all her acting personalities balanced, and [Boy Detective] Naoto's desire to prove herself to the extent where she denies who she actually is.
Wait. We weren't nemeses before?
Exaggeration of the events. We were mainly talking about Uncharted 3 being crap more than anything. None of us had anything really bad to say about Uncharted 2.
Chick that passes herself as a man for her family tradition/other reasons is one of the oldest trope ever. I can see while the commentary about sexism being somewhat original, but the character? Meh.
Oh thank god, I thought you'd all gone mad or something.
3 was still good, not as good as 2. Take out the ship graveyard in 3 and you'll have a much better game.
To be fair, I was largely judging 3 on it's inferior multiplayer to 2 more than anything. I love UC2's multiplayer. <3
Wait. We weren't nemeses before?
Exaggeration of the events. We were mainly talking about Uncharted 3 being crap more than anything. None of us had anything really bad to say about Uncharted 2.
The way I remember it is this:
"HEY GUYS, MAN TOMB RAIDER LOOKS GOOD, HUH?"
"SHUT THE FUCK UP DANTIS, ALSO UNCHARTED SUCKS AND SO DOES EVERYTHING YOU LIKE"
And then you beat me up and stole my wallet.
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