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[Hyperactivity]

Got replaced while I was sleeping, but I have been following the game and writing notes.

These were my reads last night:

------------------------
Townie (random order)
franconp
plop

Seems fine
Matt Attack
Nakito
Style
TheExodu5
exmachina64
Verelios

Null
11037
BlackBuzzard
Vanguard
WhereAreMahDragonz
Rats Off To Ya
Zippedpinhead

Uncertain
Flatearthpanda
FluxWaveZ
StarSketch

Scummy (ordered)
PK Gaming
Sorian

I've been unsure what to make of Flux and Sorian since the game started, but i liked Flux' prodding of PK Gaming. PK Gaming really struck me as off.

I didn't really scum read Style when he was pressured. Didn't have a strong town read, but he seemed to stick out too much and didn't feel like backpedalling scum when caught.

Franconp plays like I remember him in the last game and is very proactive.
plop just seems townie. He's not scared of joining the conversation and bringing it forward and seems genuinely interested in solving the game. He's my strongest town read.

Null read on Dragonz struck me as kinda weird. Her posts struck me as kinda townie when I went by them.
-------------------------------------------------------------
My reads are kinda awful right now

Townie
franconp
plop

Somewhat town
Nakito
exmachina64
Verelios

Less town
Matt Attack
Style
TheExodu5
WhereAreMahDragonz
Zippedpinhead
FluxWaveZ
Sorian

Null
11037
BlackBuzzard
Vanguard
Kerned
Hyperactivity

Lean scum
Flatearthpanda
StarSketch
PK Gaming

Scummy
-_-

The "less town" category is basically just shoehorn everybody I have any reason, however flimsy, to believe are town...

PK's tone seems better. Dragonz as I said felt kinda townie the last few pages, solvey (

Spoiler

her tone kinda reminds me of Lissa, Sorian

). Exodus still doesn't strike me as scum, but I haven't read into him post Sorian attack. I still like the tone of exmachina.

I probably won't be able to keep up let alone post and vote today at work :/

VOTE: TheExodu5

I could see him as scum and his flip would give me a better view of a lot of people like Sorian, PK, exmachina and Style. Don't think he's W/W with Sorian.

Alright, immediately, I think we can deduce a few things:

1) Since Ty4on never really hinted at who he would investigate, and given the nature of his role, he would try to safely investigate the town reads he felt solid about

2) The people he was most concerned with in relation to the TheExodu5 flip were Sorian, PK, exmachina, and Style. Style's connection to TheExodu5 was with TheExodu5 defending him, I doubt he looks better from TheExodu5 flipping.

Sorian and exmachina64 are town, they can be safely excluded from being blamed for Ty4on's death

The only remaining person is PK Gaming, who would indeed look better from TheExodu5's flip, but was also one of Ty4on's biggest scum reads.

From his two lean town groups, only Verelios would look better from TheExodu5's flip. I'm not sure if Ty4on would've thought through how Verelios chose not to save TheExodu5, but it's certainly possible.

There's also FEP and I, but we were a lean scum and null for Ty4on respectively.

As such, if I were to make a guess at who the scum Ty4on targeted thinking they were very likely town was, I would say that it is probably plop, but perhaps Verelios. I suppose Verelios having a much more solid claim to towniness imo is influencing how I choose between the two, but I feel fairly certain there is scum between PLOP and VERELIOS.

 

[CrimsonFist]

starsketch (1)
flatearthpandas 1776 (1898)
starsketch 1787
natiko 1801 (1814)

plop (1)
wherearemahdragonz 1811

blackbuzzard (2)
natiko 1814
plop 1870

hyperactivity (2)
11037 1848
flatearthpandas 1898

Day Ends:

Majority is 7

 

[Hyperactivity]

The fact that you just willingly pointed out that you mentioned him in previous posts (which I asserted in the very post you quoted) but said nothing in defense of the fact that you conveniently left him and only him off of your reads list is not a great look. That was kind of the entire point. You were fine with mentioning him in the context of other lists (who all voted for exmachina during the last day phase, who all voted for who during the first day phase) but then assigned no blame to him in either case and left him out of your reads is suspicious.

Or I just forgot

As for FEP: No, it's actually very typical of my posting style.

Go inactive for chunks of the game and post like crazy during other parts of the game? I did it in MGS, Bar, Love Boat, GAFIA 2, and Final Fantasy Mafia. I'm trying to avoid doing it right now though XD, because becoming so inactive that you ask to be subbed out in 3/5 of those games isn't something I enjoy doing, so I find it funny that Natiko thinks that I would go radio silent on purpose as scum.

 

[Hyperactivity]

Plop is officially on my scummy list, will be going through his posts and interactions with known scum players now

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

I would like to hear who everyone would pick as their three candidates for scum if they absolutely had to pick three. Somehow I doubt I'll get many answers but it's worth asking.

Zippedpinhead (now Septimus)
BlackBuzzard
Hyper
StarSketch

Mulling over what FEP (who I'd almost certainly call town) wrote, I'm considering a vote for Hyper instead of BlackBuzzard. Buzzard has been on my list for a long ass time, but the strength of my scum read for him has wavered. Meanwhile, Hyper has looked more and more scummy.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Alright, immediately, I think we can deduce a few things:

1) Since Ty4on never really hinted at who he would investigate, and given the nature of his role, he would try to safely investigate the town reads he felt solid about

2) The people he was most concerned with in relation to the TheExodu5 flip were Sorian, PK, exmachina, and Style. Style's connection to TheExodu5 was with TheExodu5 defending him, I doubt he looks better from TheExodu5 flipping.

Sorian and exmachina64 are town, they can be safely excluded from being blamed for Ty4on's death

The only remaining person is PK Gaming, who would indeed look better from TheExodu5's flip, but was also one of Ty4on's biggest scum reads.

From his two lean town groups, only Verelios would look better from TheExodu5's flip. I'm not sure if Ty4on would've thought through how Verelios chose not to save TheExodu5, but it's certainly possible.

There's also FEP and I, but we were a lean scum and null for Ty4on respectively.

As such, if I were to make a guess at who the scum Ty4on targeted thinking they were very likely town was, I would say that it is probably plop, but perhaps Verelios. I suppose Verelios having a much more solid claim to towniness imo is influencing how I choose between the two, but I feel fairly certain there is scum between PLOP and VERELIOS.

Maybe it's just because I'm not experienced, but I'd investigate someone I wasn't sure of. Day One, everyone had me as heavy town. Why investigate that? It'd be like wasting a check on FEP.

He likely died investigating someone. It wasn't me. I'd stake my eyes on it.

 

[flatearthpandas]

Or I just forgot

As for FEP: No, it's actually very typical of my posting style.

Go inactive for chunks of the game and post like crazy during other parts of the game? I did it in MGS, Bar, Love Boat, GAFIA 2, and Final Fantasy Mafia. I'm trying to avoid doing it right now though XD, because becoming so inactive that you ask to be subbed out in 3/5 of those games isn't something I enjoy doing, so I find it funny that Natiko thinks that I would go radio silent on purpose as scum.

Guess I've only seen post like mad phase. My bad. Anyway, let's hit that phase now. Going to leave my vote for now.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Also, before I get called out as going OMGUS with Hyper, I didn't read his post on this page until after that post about maybe changing my vote.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

My last few reads (Vanguard, fran, and exmachina) have me seriously doubting my current reads. The reason I'm on BB now is because he's been a target for so damn long. Maybe I should keep my vote there because it's where my head has been for a long time?

 

[Hyperactivity]

Maybe it's just because I'm not experienced, but I'd investigate someone I wasn't sure of. Day One, everyone had me as heavy town. Why investigate that? It'd be like wasting a check on FEP.

He likely died investigating someone. It wasn't me. I'd stake my eyes on it.

There are two common ways to approach the cop role:

1) Go for ambiguous, major effect players
2) Go for lower activity players that are more likely to survive to the end game, with the idea of confirming as many town for the end game as possible

The way Ty4on's role acted, only safely investigating townies, it would be utterly ridiculous to try and go for ambiguous or uncertain alignment choices. The only method by which Ty4on could have safely done so would be if he had very explicitly hinted at who his target would be.

The purpose of investigating you, even if you were heavily town read by everyone on day 1, is to confirm that there might be something behind those town reads. Most of those town reads were based on tone and the feeling people got from your posts.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Before the ugliness with exmachina happened, Zippedpinhead was on the chopping block. Now nobody (including me) is voting that way. Why? Part of me just doesn't want to be a dick to Septimus, but the other part says scum is scum and if he was good enough then...

I guess maybe we should give him time to talk so we can see if we get scummy vibes from him as well?

 

[11037]

This strikes me as curious. You vote Hyper for siding with scummy BlackBuzzard rather than voting for scummy BlackBuzzard himself? Why?

I mean, Hyper is also on my scum list too, but lower than BlackBuzzard.

Hyper contributes more than BlackBuazzard, that's why I voted for him. If it comes down to it I'll change my vote to BlackBuzzard.

I would like to hear who everyone would pick as their three candidates for scum if they absolutely had to pick three. Somehow I doubt I'll get many answers but it's worth asking.

Currently I would say

-Hyperactivity
-BlackBuzzard
-Septimus Prime/StarSketch

Unsure about the last one, I voted for Zipped the previous day phase but I still want to see how the new guy plays before voting for him.

 

[Hyperactivity]

Hyper contributes more than BlackBuazzard, that's why I voted for him. If it comes down to it I'll change my vote to BlackBuzzard.



Currently I would say

-Hyperactivity
-BlackBuzzard
-Septimus Prime/StarSketch

Unsure about the last one, I voted for Zipped the previous day phase but I still want to see how the new guy plays before voting for him.

Let me just address the full list of why you think I'm scummy, according to you:

1) I thought franconp was scum - how does this indicate I'm scum?
2) I defended BlackBuzzard, called him a top town read at some point - yeah, if you think BB is scum, this a decent contributing reason, but on its own it's weak and it's reliant on you being right on BB to begin with. In addition, I haven't taken any actions to save a scum BB from lynch, so it's still pretty weak evidence

3) Speculated about a 3rd party - LOL, did you even read the post (!796 iirc)? I speculated as to the fact that we had no evidence of a 3rd party because it was making me lean more towards there being a 5 person scum team with weaker powers. IF not, the neutral is likely benign, some sort of survivor role. And speculation on the number of scum isn't really that useless.

4) Vote shifting - I covered this thoroughly at the top of the last page, but on its own I fail to see how this is somehow indicative of scum. The vote shifting HELPED town, and that was a very purposeful move on my part.

 

[Natiko]

Alright, immediately, I think we can deduce a few things:

1) Since Ty4on never really hinted at who he would investigate, and given the nature of his role, he would try to safely investigate the town reads he felt solid about

2) The people he was most concerned with in relation to the TheExodu5 flip were Sorian, PK, exmachina, and Style. Style's connection to TheExodu5 was with TheExodu5 defending him, I doubt he looks better from TheExodu5 flipping.

Sorian and exmachina64 are town, they can be safely excluded from being blamed for Ty4on's death

The only remaining person is PK Gaming, who would indeed look better from TheExodu5's flip, but was also one of Ty4on's biggest scum reads.

From his two lean town groups, only Verelios would look better from TheExodu5's flip. I'm not sure if Ty4on would've thought through how Verelios chose not to save TheExodu5, but it's certainly possible.

There's also FEP and I, but we were a lean scum and null for Ty4on respectively.

As such, if I were to make a guess at who the scum Ty4on targeted thinking they were very likely town was, I would say that it is probably plop, but perhaps Verelios. I suppose Verelios having a much more solid claim to towniness imo is influencing how I choose between the two, but I feel fairly certain there is scum between PLOP and VERELIOS.

There wasn't much reasoning here for the plop inclusion, but you did say you're going to be coming with that next. The Verelios stuff is mildly interesting but I haven't seen much else from him that made me suspicious outside of a weird reads list at one point and a lack of voting yesterday.

Or I just forgot

As for FEP: No, it's actually very typical of my posting style.

Go inactive for chunks of the game and post like crazy during other parts of the game? I did it in MGS, Bar, Love Boat, GAFIA 2, and Final Fantasy Mafia. I'm trying to avoid doing it right now though XD, because becoming so inactive that you ask to be subbed out in 3/5 of those games isn't something I enjoy doing, so I find it funny that Natiko thinks that I would go radio silent on purpose as scum.

Well this is specifically related to this game, not any of your past ones as I can't account for those. All I know is once the pattern of killing high activity players became clear you dropped off suddenly.

Maybe it's just because I'm not experienced, but I'd investigate someone I wasn't sure of. Day One, everyone had me as heavy town. Why investigate that? It'd be like wasting a check on FEP.

He likely died investigating someone. It wasn't me. I'd stake my eyes on it.

Due to the nature of his role if he was being smart he most certainly would have investigated someone he was more sure of being town in an attempt to not die while gaining information that would clear players going forward.

Guess I've only seen post like mad phase. My bad. Anyway, let's hit that phase now. Going to leave my vote for now.

Can you please go back and respond to my post at the end of the last page? I genuinely don't understand how it would work and I feel it might be relevant at some point to know that.

 

[Verelios]

I would like to hear who everyone would pick as their three candidates for scum if they absolutely had to pick three. Somehow I doubt I'll get many answers but it's worth asking.

StarSketch
PK
BB (going over yesterday, the wave towards Exmachina was weird even though I have no bad feelings about BB. I'm more willing to believe in fuckery)

I feel there's scum here.

 

[Hyperactivity]

I can't disagree with too much that you said FEP. For the record, I told everyone before the vote flipping occurred that I wasn't going to let a no lynch happen because it would basically result in a skipped day. I also didn't want to vote for exmachina so I unvoted. I was clearly watching the vote so I didn't think purposefully allowing a tie was a good move for Town. If that was a bad call then sorry, but from reading those two past games I got the impression that no lynches are very frowned upon.

I do have another thing to follow up on - what is the significance of a scum framer and how would such a role have caused that pm to franconp? And why would it have only occurred once?

Scum framer essentially screws up the result on a person, typically for cop style investigations. So if a cop checks a framed town, they show up as not town, and vice versa.

Now, this would imply that town has another cop, as Ty4on's role would immediately be able to discern a framed player by whether he died or not.

There wasn't much reasoning here for the plop inclusion, but you did say you're going to be coming with that next. The Verelios stuff is mildly interesting but I haven't seen much else from him that made me suspicious outside of a weird reads list at one point and a lack of voting yesterday.

Wait, what?! I agree with you on Verelios btw, he's my top town read atm, but as for plop, did you not look at who Ty4on put at the top of BOTH of his read lists? Plop was his top town read so far as we last know, and a MAJOR candidate for who Ty4on would've investigated confident in the idea that he was most likely town.

 

[PK Gaming]

I would like to hear who everyone would pick as their three candidates for scum if they absolutely had to pick three. Somehow I doubt I'll get many answers but it's worth asking.

Hyperactivity and BlackBuzzard are my top 2

Unsure on the 3rd. Hyperactivity made some good arguments in regards plop being potential scum, though that would be predicated on the idea that he's town. Then there's the fact that everyone was so gung ho about voting for zipped, but he's dropped out of the game and been replaced with Septimus.

And pk, you want to speculate about p5, you say??? I can accommodate.

I was just thinking about it at work. Apparently P5 is the longest game in the franchise, with the late game being particularly gameplay heavy. Some users have complained about it, but it sounds super duper appealing to me. I think I've sunk over 200 hours on Persona 4 Golden, so the prospect of playing a Persona game for even longer is amazing.

 

[Hyperactivity]

Holy shit holy shit holy shit

I can't believe this shit right now

Plop, did you seriously parrot TheExodu5 for so much of Day 1? I'm honestly a little shocked at what I'm finding right now...

Still going through the thread, but if you don't want to wait for me to bring the quotes up, here are the post numbers so far:

TheExodu5 - post 260
Plop - post 317
TheExodu5 - post 343
TheExodu5 - post 359
Plop - post 369, 370
TheExodu5 - post 371
Plop - post 382
Plop - post 439

Pay attention to Plop's interaction with TheExodu5, the way both of them defend/distract from Style, the way they both choose BlackBuzzard and PK Gaming as the inactives they take issue with specifically, and the way Plop accuses PK Gaming of voting for Style to specifically draw attention towards Style and away from PK Gaming

Like HOLY SHIT, I'm so certain plop is scum, and am now feeling better about PK Gaming again.

VOTE: Plop

 

[11037]

Let me just address the full list of why you think I'm scummy, according to you:

1) I thought franconp was scum - how does this indicate I'm scum?
2) I defended BlackBuzzard, called him a top town read at some point - yeah, if you think BB is scum, this a decent contributing reason, but on its own it's weak and it's reliant on you being right on BB to begin with. In addition, I haven't taken any actions to save a scum BB from lynch, so it's still pretty weak evidence

3) Speculated about a 3rd party - LOL, did you even read the post (!796 iirc)? I speculated as to the fact that we had no evidence of a 3rd party because it was making me lean more towards there being a 5 person scum team with weaker powers. IF not, the neutral is likely benign, some sort of survivor role. And speculation on the number of scum isn't really that useless.

4) Vote shifting - I covered this thoroughly at the top of the last page, but on its own I fail to see how this is somehow indicative of scum. The vote shifting HELPED town, and that was a very purposeful move on my part.

1) Thinking another town member was scum doesn't mean you're are mafia, of course, everyone makes mistakes and no one is going to to right all the time. However, the way you voted for Fran and you general interactions with him is what throw me off.

2) Well I do think that BlackBuzzard is scum so...

3) No, speculation about the number of scum remaining is fine, it's the bit under that where you start talking about the possibility of a 2nd killer acting night one. Its useless info that I don't know why you posted. Everyone realised that like day two.

4) Fine.

Hyper you think that Plop could be scum right? Who else do you think? Who would you vote for today? I do admit that I find your mention about Verelios interesting, he has certainly been a player who has stayed in my Null reads.

I was just thinking about it at work. Apparently P5 is the longest game in the franchise, with the late game being particularly gameplay heavy. Some users have complained about it, but it sounds super duper appealing to me. I think I've sunk over 200 hours on Persona 4 Golden, so the prospect of playing a Persona game for even longer is amazing.

I heard you can't date dudes in p5

 

[flatearthpandas]

I do have another thing to follow up on - what is the significance of a scum framer and how would such a role have caused that pm to franconp? And why would it have only occurred once?

Scum framer essentially screws up the result on a person, typically for cop style investigations. So if a cop checks a framed town, they show up as not town, and vice versa.

Now, this would imply that town has another cop, as Ty4on's role would immediately be able to discern a framed player by whether he died or not.

Fran's pm apparently came as a defense against framing.

As conversation isn't moving forward (let's try to avoid that during this day, last day was really bad) I will share what happened last night:

During the last night phase (yestarday exactly) I got a PM from the mods which said that I have been targeted as a potential scum, so I was given an option against being framed by the shadows (that were the words used on the PM, don't know if it's flavour or not). I was offered to buy an item: RANCID GRAVY (it even had the home shopping channel music) . I was not told at that time what would the item do but I could use a command buy to get it. So, having nothing to lose, I bought it.

During the hour prior to day 3 start I received another PM from the mods with the results. I had bought the RANCID GRAVY which "restored 2HP" (exact quote) but I'm now silenced, so I can't cast a vote during the day phase or do an action during the next night (not that I care).

I tried asking the mods why I did get the PM but they didn't wanted to share any info with me. The timming makes me think that I was targeted (I received the PM yesterday, not at the start of the night) but I don't know how, if I was targeted for a night kill (and the wording makes me think it wasn't by scum, maybe town vigilante or neutral) or in some other way. And neither why I was given the option to buy the thing.

tl;dr: I can't vote this phase.

This seems to suggest a scum framer is around. Not to mention, style mentioned one as well originally in sorian's alleged gossip chat.

I don't think it necessarily does imply another cop though. In this case the frame is not so much a way to take out a cop but basically a really strong counter to Ty. Without Ty reporting his targets in advance, which would amount to suicide with a framer, he isn't really any kind of counter to it.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Holy shit holy shit holy shit

I can't believe this shit right now

Plop, did you seriously parrot TheExodu5 for so much of Day 1? I'm honestly a little shocked at what I'm finding right now...

Still going through the thread, but if you don't want to wait for me to bring the quotes up, here are the post numbers so far:

TheExodu5 - post 260
Plop - post 317
TheExodu5 - post 343
TheExodu5 - post 359
Plop - post 369, 370
TheExodu5 - post 371
Plop - post 382
Plop - post 439

Pay attention to Plop's interaction with TheExodu5, the way both of them defend/distract from Style, the way they both choose BlackBuzzard and PK Gaming as the inactives they take issue with specifically, and the way Plop accuses PK Gaming of voting for Style to specifically draw attention towards Style and away from PK Gaming

Like HOLY SHIT, I'm so certain plop is scum, and am now feeling better about PK Gaming again.

VOTE: Plop

Now quickly, post all the times we didn't to post around each other.

And since everyone was calling me obviously town Day One, maybe he was trying to agree with me to get some of that good mojo. I honestly don't know.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

***Didn't happen to post around each other***

 

[flatearthpandas]

Also curious why Verelios is your strongest town read, hyper. I've been town reading him as well for the most part, but two days of no votes is not a great look, especially when you're relatively active.

 

[Hyperactivity]

Now quickly, post all the times we didn't to post around each other.

And since everyone was calling me obviously town Day One, maybe he was trying to agree with me to get some of that good mojo. I honestly don't know.

Take a second to go to those posts, none of what you said is relevant

YOU were parroting THEEXODU5. First a post by TheExodu5 where he votes for BlackBuzzard as the inactive to go for.

Then you post, saying that you're leaning towards BlackBuzzard (and you had earlier specifically acknowledged TheExodu5's post against him, at post 261, and were the only other person discussing him at that point iirc), that you're suspicious of exmachina64 (and specifically mention one of TheExodu5's posts here), and that....

Actually fuck it, I'm quoting post 317 right now, it incriminates you so badly it hurts:

So at the moment, I'm leaning toward BlackBuzzard. Him encouraging Rynam to be more active in the game (post 257) while saying almost nothing himself to that point is extremely sketchy.

Also eyeing exmachina64. His quick vote/unvote of Sorian seemed, I don't know, jittery I guess. Combined with the forceful rebuke of Vanguard at post 251, and I'm somewhat suspicious. Oh, and post 284, where Exodu5 noticed exmachia64 possibly trying to plant vanilla townie seeds.

I wasn't on the Style bandwagon until post 294, where he backpeddled like a pro cyclist on his "ass kissing" (as he put it) of Sorian. Reads almost like someone who got chastised by their fellow scum for being too obvious and is now trying to do damage control. However, the possibility exists that he's new and was just glomming on to whoever appeared to be the alpha dog (as I did). I'm not leaning heavily toward Style, but that post gave me pause. His sudden vote against Sorian (the ass he was kissing earlier--his words, not mine) in the very next post gave me even more pause.

Beyond that, I have to wonder about the other (mostly) silent ones, namely Kerned, Matt Attack, and 11037.

Also, did StarSketch ever try to explain the odd pre-game behavior? Or did she just figure that since the conversation about that fizzled out and suspicion seems to be off her, she'll just tiptoe away from it and hope we don't notice?

This is totally damage control for Style. It's a classic case of one scum being in trouble, and the other scum don't want to ignore them, label them as scummy, or label them as top town. It's so non-commital it hurts.

Then TheExodu5 brings up BlackBuzzard as his primary example of an inactive he has issues with

Then TheExodu5 brings up PK Gaming as suspect, and says that Style is the "easy" vote right now. (For reference, PK Gaming had just voted for Style)

Then (oh hey!) Plop mentions PK Gaming as being suspect, again being in the first in a pair to suspect a player.

And then Plop mentions that his specific issue with PK Gaming is:

Not gone, just not active. Maybe nothing. Maybe avoiding the spotlight.

That sudden vote just screamed "Hey guys, not me! Remember Style? He's the one you want! I vote Style!"

and votes for him in post 439.

Yeah, this isn't TheExodu5 trying to gain goodwill with you, it looks the opposite right now. You look REALLY suspicious right here, like TheExodu5 posted in the scum thread that he thinks he could point out or try and get something started on BlackBuzzard/Style, and you saw it and decided to help him.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Also, the issue I had with PK wasn't just inactivity. It was suddenly appearing when mentioned, but only then. And admitting to lurking. It looked scummy Day One when nobody knew anything about anything.

If agreeing with (soon to be) confirmed scum and not immediately jumping on (soon to be) confirmed scum makes a person scummy, exmachina64 was also scummy.

I agree with Exodu5 that having three inactive players is hurting the game. Currently, I don't feel strongly enough toward players like Style or Vanguard to vote for them. For the moment, I'm going to vote for BlackBuzzard. Hopefully, Rynam, BlackBuzzard and Kerned can be more active today.

VOTE: BlackBuzzard

 

[Hyperactivity]

Also curious why Verelios is your strongest town read, hyper. I've been town reading him as well for the most part, but two days of no votes is not a great look, especially when you're relatively active.

Simple

He didn't save TheExodu5. Yeah, he voted at 3:00 pm right after the day ended, but I voted right before at 8:00 pm, and regardless he could have stepped in at any point to vote for exmachina64, breaking the tie and making sure neither Flux or I would vote for TheExodu5. It's not a matter of him being the key vote FOR TheExodu5's lynch so much as he chose not to save scum when he could have

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Take a second to go to those posts, none of what you said is relevant

YOU were parroting THEEXODU5. First a post by TheExodu5 where he votes for BlackBuzzard as the inactive to go for.

Then you post, saying that you're leaning towards BlackBuzzard (and you had earlier specifically acknowledged TheExodu5's post against him, at post 261, and were the only other person discussing him at that point iirc), that you're suspicious of exmachina64 (and specifically mention one of TheExodu5's posts here), and that....

Actually fuck it, I'm quoting post 317 right now, it incriminates you so badly it hurts:



This is totally damage control for Style. It's a classic case of one scum being in trouble, and the other scum don't want to ignore them, label them as scummy, or label them as top town. It's so non-commital it hurts.

Then TheExodu5 brings up BlackBuzzard as his primary example of an inactive he has issues with

Then TheExodu5 brings up PK Gaming as suspect, and says that Style is the "easy" vote right now. (For reference, PK Gaming had just voted for Style)

Then (oh hey!) Plop mentions PK Gaming as being suspect, again being in the first in a pair to suspect a player.

And then Plop mentions that his specific issue with PK Gaming is:



and votes for him in post 439.

Yeah, this isn't TheExodu5 trying to gain goodwill with you, it looks the opposite right now. You look REALLY suspicious right here, like TheExodu5 posted in the scum thread that he thinks he could point out or try and get something started on BlackBuzzard/Style, and you saw it and decided to help him.

He was mimicking my reads.

I agree.

Vote: PKGaming

You're trying really hard to paint a narrative where none exists. It really makes me wonder about you. On one hand, would scum push this hard on someone only to look like absolute shit when that person is revealed to be town (especially since so many have had me pinned as town from the beginning)?

Conversely, you can always try to cover it by pretending you were just fighting the good fight. But you're too knowledgeable about this game to not know you're inventing links out of whole cloth.

 

[Hyperactivity]

Also, the issue I had with PK wasn't just inactivity. It was suddenly appearing when mentioned, but only then. And admitting to lurking. It looked scummy Day One when nobody knew anything about anything.

If agreeing with (soon to be) confirmed scum and not immediately jumping on (soon to be) confirmed scum makes a person scummy, exmachina64 was also scummy.

You missed the point multiple times now:

1) The issue with what you found suspicious of PK Gaming was that you TAKE ISSUE WITH HIS VOTING ON STYLE. You accuse PK of distracting from himself towards Style while you distract from Style to PK. And do you remember Style's alignment?

2) My issue isn't with agreeing with scum, it's with multiple examples of a pattern where you echoed TheExodu5, put pressure on the same players, and distracted from a scum player. That IS an issue. Especially when you and TheExodu5 were the only ones on BlackBuzzard and PK for a little while there.

 

[Hyperactivity]

He was mimicking my reads.



You're trying really hard to paint a narrative where none exists. It really makes me wonder about you. On one hand, would scum push this hard on someone only to look like absolute shit when that person is revealed to be town (especially since so many have had me pinned as town from the beginning)?

Conversely, you can always try to cover it by pretending you were just fighting the good fight. But you're too knowledgeable about this game to not know you're inventing links out of whole cloth.

Right, he was mimicking your reads, which is why he brought up those reads on exmachina64, BlackBuzzard, and PK Gaming ALL before you...

or did you bring it up in some shared chat with him before he posted those reads before you?

The only read you beat him out on was your defense/indecision about Style. Yeah, looks real great for you there.

I'm going to let the rest of the town decide on this, but I think the evidence is pretty damning right now

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

You missed the point multiple times now:

1) The issue with what you found suspicious of PK Gaming was that you TAKE ISSUE WITH HIS VOTING ON STYLE. You accuse PK of distracting from himself towards Style while you distract from Style to PK. And do you remember Style's alignment?

2) My issue isn't with agreeing with scum, it's with multiple examples of a pattern where you echoed TheExodu5, put pressure on the same players, and distracted from a scum player. That IS an issue. Especially when you and TheExodu5 were the only ones on BlackBuzzard and PK for a little while there.

1) Yep. I also remember being the first in line to roast his ass Day Two. You're inventing a narrative based fact that I didn't know Style was scum Day One? Okay. You got me. I confess. I didn't know he was scum Day One. Now what?

2) Yes, and I'm still on BalckBuzzard. And by the looks of things, you're one of the few people here who isn't. How does me being on him make me look bad again?

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Right, he was mimicking your reads, which is why he brought up those reads on exmachina64, BlackBuzzard, and PK Gaming ALL before you...

or did you bring it up in some shared chat with him before he posted those reads before you?

The only read you beat him out on was your defense/indecision about Style. Yeah, looks real great for you there.

I'm going to let the rest of the town decide on this, but I think the evidence is pretty damning right now

Yes, leave it to the town.

Folks, if you lynch me, you lynch me. But I absolutely want you to remember all thru the night phase who led you to do it. Do not forget it.

 

[Natiko]

Scum framer essentially screws up the result on a person, typically for cop style investigations. So if a cop checks a framed town, they show up as not town, and vice versa.

Now, this would imply that town has another cop, as Ty4on's role would immediately be able to discern a framed player by whether he died or not.



Wait, what?! I agree with you on Verelios btw, he's my top town read atm, but as for plop, did you not look at who Ty4on put at the top of BOTH of his read lists? Plop was his top town read so far as we last know, and a MAJOR candidate for who Ty4on would've investigated confident in the idea that he was most likely town.

Oh, the framer didn't cause the pm by himself but instead the pm was someone aware of the framer?

And I just meant that alone couldn't have been your only reasoning since I was read at the same level as plop by Ty and you didn't mention me in your conclusion. I wasn't disagreeing, plop is near the bottom of my list as well. I more or less was just mentioning it to say that I assumed your follow up would explain your thoughts on plop.

I'm behind on what all has been said but wanted to reply to this before I forgot.

 

[Hyperactivity]

Let me make sure everyone can see how much bullshit your claim about TheExodu5 mimicking you is:

Is there any chance playing the death Arcanum would be considered a command of some kind? Or do all commands need to be highlighted?

I'm not feeling Style at this point. It's pretty typical for a new player and especially a townie to be indecisive and flip votes a lot in my experience. I don't get a particularly scummy read.

PK Gaming seems a bit more suspect in my eyes. Style seems like the easy vote and it seems overly bandwagonny at this point. Possibly scummy and trying to take attention off of fellow scummates.

PKGaming being mostly gone, then posting almost immediately after getting called out for it (meaning he's likely been lurking), then following that up with a vote on the suspect du jour has me heavily leaning in his direction at the moment.

I meant to say PKGaming casting a bandwagon vote on the suspect du jour**

Also, welcome WAMD!

I agree.

Vote: PKGaming

So I'm changing my vote from RNG to PK Gaming. The more I think about it, the more it doesn't sit right with me the way he was mostly silent (but has admitted to lurking) and suddenly appears to answer accusations that he's scum, then goes right into the spotlight-shifting vote against Style (who had been a prime target the day before).

If new info arises, I'll obviously change my vote, but until then:

Vote: PK Gaming

As an aside, I'm going back thru flatearthpanda's posts. His latest post hit me as strange. The way he was so quick to just push the scum narrative on franconp after being called out seemed like a desperation swing (like "I'm not scum! YOU'RE scum!"), though maybe that's just a normal reaction for some.

Also, his first game post was about StarSketch's pre-game chuckle about her role PM. It's post 82, and he says: "The example role pm isn't that funny. This is a better direction to go than whether or not to nl day one imo."

Oh jeez, that last post has the whole 'discourage from voting on Style' thing again. Hmmm, I WONDER why?

 

[Septimus Prime]

Hey, so I still don't really know what Zipped said or did to seem suspicious, but I'm town.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Let me make sure everyone can see how much bullshit your claim about TheExodu5 mimicking you is:

Oh jeez, that last post has the whole 'discourage from voting on Style' thing again. Hmmm, I WONDER why?

I'm not discouraging anything. Obviously I don't want to be lynched, and I'll try to fight it if it happens. But you've become strangely obsessed with creating links where there are none.

So if I'm lynched, I'm just asking that town not forget who created and fueled this nonsense.

 

[Hyperactivity]

1) Yep. I also remember being the first in line to roast his ass Day Two. You're inventing a narrative based fact that I didn't know Style was scum Day One? Okay. You got me. I confess. I didn't know he was scum Day One. Now what?

2) Yes, and I'm still on BalckBuzzard. And by the looks of things, you're one of the few people here who isn't. How does me being on him make me look bad again?

Wait, you were one of the first in line to roast his ass Day Two? Wasn't that a near unanimous decision?

This isn't you not knowing Style was scum Day One, this is you and TheExodu5 actively defending and distracting from him

And the issue with BlackBuzzard is simple: there are a lot of inactives to choose from, so why did TheExodu5 choose to go for BB? He didn't go for Style, obviously because scum don't want the inactive that people pile onto to be scum. They're more likely to go after a town inactive, it's safer.

And who do we see TheExodu5, alongside you (plop), who already looks suspicious with the stuff about Style and PK Gaming and the way you seem to be parroting TheExodu5, going after among the inactives? Right, BlackBuzzard.

I feel safe in town reading PK and BB now

 

[Hyperactivity]

Was pretty set on Rynam...but seeing as how he just backed out of the game I think his lack of posting was just non committal from him. I'm leaning regular townie for Ty4on...usually the type of role that would have someone quit the game over.

I would like to pressure Rats or StarSketch since they've said about nothing...but I can see that will go absolutely nowhere.

I'm left with PK and Style to move this forward. PK has been confrontational, but he's sticking with his guns and doesn't strike me as scum. Styles play has just been weird as hell.

I'd rather get this moving now than end up with more indecision or a no lynch. We need a lynch candidate NOW. Not 15 minutes before day's end. No one has been under any real pressure so far. We're getting nowhere.

Vote: Style

Oh...thought the day ended today. Maybe not the time for a bus.

Style. You seem to be watching the infighting and posting reactions without really saying much. I would like some actual reads from you.

BWAHAHAHA holy shit Sorian called it perfectly didn't he

There's no way that 2nd post wasn't meant for the scum thread XD

 

[Natiko]

In a bit of a pickle here trying to decide what to think. I did call earlier in this day phase that Hyper was setting up to dunk on plop. But I also don't really trust plop. I'll have to look it all over more.

 

[Verelios]

Hyper is somewhat persuasive in his reasoning and going off of yesterday this would be the perfect springboard to nail Plop. It's this opportunity that makes me uneasy. Surely scum wouldn't be that blatant in a thunderdome right?

 

[Natiko]

Hyper is somewhat persuasive in his reasoning and going off of yesterday this would be the perfect springboard to nail Plop. It's this opportunity that makes me uneasy. Surely scum wouldn't be that blatant in a thunderdome right?

I think it depends. If say Star isn't scum but someone under the radar is then they might decide the gambit is worth it. If Hyper is scum he knows he's getting lynched in the next day phase or two anyways. He might be using his time to try and push a mislynch through hoping his final two teammates can finish up since we would likely mislynch on Star soon too.

 

[Matt Attack]

What really makes me wonder about plop is from Hyper's post #1901, where he quotes Ty saying that plop is his "strongest town read". Ty4on is not a bad player. Even if he truly believed plop was town, I strongly believe he would have breadcrumbed his target, and he undeniably singled out plop. If there's a breadcrumb, there is a good chance that this is it. The nature of Ty's ability makes his strongest town reads the most likely targets, in order to minimize his own chance of death while confirming the largest number of town players. If he went for a player lower on the list and died without making it apparent who he checked, what good would his power have done? Especially early on when he's barely had a chance to use it. I refuse to believe Ty would have been so irresponsible with his power- he must have checked somebody high on his town list, and there must have been a clue as to who that individual was.

This now makes me wonder about the day of Style's lynch. Plop was one of the leaders of that charge, and you know who very quickly decided not to raise a single finger to defend Style? Style himself. Pushing for the lynch of a scum is not scummy obviously, but there is a serious possibility of Style's lack of defense being coordinated to implicate anybody who did want to defend him, while allowing his scum teammates to bus him for town credibility, should they so choose. In this scenario, a scum lynch was effectively confirmed, leaving scumteam a large playground to shape the day's events as they desired. Plop's "aha" vote for exmachina could have been a semi-justifiable and rather opportunistic decision because we'd already seen the term "bus" accidentally used by scum before, and it's led to his new somewhat defeatist attitude in regards to his own reads, a far cry from his play on, say, D2, when we had an effectively guaranteed scum lynch.

 

[flatearthpandas]

Simple

He didn't save TheExodu5. Yeah, he voted at 3:00 pm right after the day ended, but I voted right before at 8:00 pm, and regardless he could have stepped in at any point to vote for exmachina64, breaking the tie and making sure neither Flux or I would vote for TheExodu5. It's not a matter of him being the key vote FOR TheExodu5's lynch so much as he chose not to save scum when he could have

And we would have had a nice little pile of scum what showed up at the end of the day to rescue exodu5. As it stands is still possible half the scum team was already on machina. i doubt the rest were super eager to jump in. Much better to wait and hope a townie breaks the tie toward machina. Or try a last second pk swing. Not creating what would be a ridiculous scum pile up on d1 is not proof of being town in my eyes. Especially when you and flux could still have both voted exodus and still finished with a majority if verelios came in too early. Coming in too late risks a tie, possible policy lynch, and exposure of multiple scum.

If there was scum on exodu5 at all getting townie points, it was you or verelios. PK and I were on exodu5 early and had plenty of time to shift off without suspicion. Me too votes aren't super impressive once town has created a majority.

 

[Hyperactivity]

Im speaking in terms of evidence right now.

I have going for me as solid solid evidence the whole end of day 1. Against me is my suspicion of a townie that never was lynched and for supporting a player that you guys don't even know is scum

Plop has these nasty connections to scum players, distracted from a scum player, was the top town read of a role that died if it investigated scum, and led a lynch against a ridiculously obvious town (on a pretty flimsy basis). The main thing he has going for him is that players were town reading him up the wazzoo for that earnest newbie town tone, which is far from being as solid as any if the other evidence for or against either of us in this post

Seriously, I encourage everyone to go through pages 5-9 or 10 himself

 

[PK Gaming]

Holy shit holy shit holy shit

I can't believe this shit right now

Plop, did you seriously parrot TheExodu5 for so much of Day 1? I'm honestly a little shocked at what I'm finding right now...

Still going through the thread, but if you don't want to wait for me to bring the quotes up, here are the post numbers so far:

TheExodu5 - post 260
Plop - post 317
TheExodu5 - post 343
TheExodu5 - post 359
Plop - post 369, 370
TheExodu5 - post 371
Plop - post 382
Plop - post 439

Pay attention to Plop's interaction with TheExodu5, the way both of them defend/distract from Style, the way they both choose BlackBuzzard and PK Gaming as the inactives they take issue with specifically, and the way Plop accuses PK Gaming of voting for Style to specifically draw attention towards Style and away from PK Gaming

Like HOLY SHIT, I'm so certain plop is scum, and am now feeling better about PK Gaming again.

VOTE: Plop

Post #261 is also worth considering. The way he backs TheExodu5 but then immediately adds that he also finds him suspicious seems. It just seems like an obvious feint.

I heard you can't date dudes in p5

Yep

The protagonist's social link with Yusuke can get pretty baitey too :<

 

[flatearthpandas]

Thing is, if scum team was going to just let Style go, why have him claim Sorian's gossip?

 

[Matt Attack]

Thing is, if scum team was going to just let Style go, why have him claim Sorian's gossip?

I feel like the plan changed at some point early in the day. Style seemed to be trying to apologize, defend himself... then it all stopped, he disappeared and let everybody pile on him. I think that's kind of weird.

 

[Hyperactivity]

And we would have had a nice little pile of scum what showed up at the end of the day to rescue exodu5. As it stands is still possible half the scum team was already on machina. i doubt the rest were super eager to jump in. Much better to wait and hope a townie breaks the tie toward machina. Or try a last second pk swing. Not creating what would be a ridiculous scum pile up on d1 is not proof of being town in my eyes. Especially when you and flux could still have both voted exodus and still finished with a majority if verelios came in too early. Coming in too late risks a tie, possible policy lynch, and exposure of multiple scum.

If there was scum on exodu5 at all getting townie points, it was you or verelios. PK and I were on exodu5 early and had plenty of time to shift off without suspicion. Me too votes aren't super impressive once town has created a majority.

I quoted myself on the last page (the post with highlight times), quoting a post from day 2.

The text at the 2:27, 2:35, and 2:36 timestamps along with the end of the post are probably the most important. As far as I'm concerned, I was already safely on the theexodu5 train. I suppose verelios has a weaker argument behind him, but I still trust him.

And honestly, I disagree. The foundational votes say so much less than the votes that can or did tiebreak the vote or cause the vote to swing a certain way. If I wasn't otherwise town reading you, I would suspect you and pk more, and was a little worried about pk before I started going back and reading day 1

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

My fuckup yesterday was huge. But to use it as a springboard to lynch another innocent is silly.

The fact that Hyper never saw me as shady when nobody else did and suddenly sees scum in everything I've ever posted after I shit the bed is rather convenient.

He's either looking for an innocent town lynch or a PR reveal from me or someone else who maybe checked on me and can see I'm town.

 

[flatearthpandas]

I quoted myself on the last page (the post with highlight times), quoting a post from day 2.

The text at the 2:27, 2:35, and 2:36 timestamps along with the end of the post are probably the most important. As far as I'm concerned, I was already safely on the theexodu5 train. I suppose verelios has a weaker argument behind him, but I still trust him.

And honestly, I disagree. The foundational votes say so much less than the votes that can or did tiebreak the vote or cause the vote to swing a certain way. If I wasn't otherwise town reading you, I would suspect you and pk more, and was a little worried about pk before I started going back and reading day 1

Foundational votes aren't important because they're foundational but because they give so much opportunity to influence balance passively without drawing much suspicion.

Anyway, after remembering you started the tie shenanigans when machina was actually in the lead, I don't really have much suspicion for you anymore.

Still have lingering doubts about plop and to a lesser degree natico. But the nulls are starting to bother me more. Dragonz, 11037, septimus, Buzzard. Buzzard is weird for me because he's caught heat and I've just never cared about him. Probably go through his posts next.

 

[Hyperactivity]

My fuckup yesterday was huge. But to use it as a springboard to lynch another innocent is silly.

The fact that Hyper never saw me as shady when nobody else did and suddenly sees scum in everything I've ever posted after I shit the bed is rather convenient.

He's either looking for an innocent town lynch or a PR reveal from me or someone else who maybe checked on me and can see I'm town.

What do you want me to do? Should I have gone after you yesterday when I wasn't posting? Or the day before, when Style hadn't even flipped yet? Or maybe I should have waited a day, for no real reason, to go after you?

Here's a plausible idea: Your fuckup yesterday broke the straw on the camel's back for me. On top of that, after night 3, to make sure the extra kill during night one might not have been due to some sort of odd night only neutral killer, I decide it makes sense to assume Ty4on died investigating one of his top town reads, and who woulda thunk it, there's that plop fellow again.

And perhaps because this Hyperactivity dude had already said that it was Plop's early posts that made him town read plop, and that his 'recent' (relative to when I posted) posts didn't do that so much or even felt a little scummy (pretty sure I said that during 2nd half of day 1, day 2, and day 4), he wants to make sure that his original reason to town read Plop was really legitimate, and not some throwaway day 1 only type read.

So yes, I'm bringing this up now, because your fuckup made me want to check a blind spot of mine really badly.