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PixelJunk Shooter 2 |OT| - Can You Make It Past The Asteroid Belt?
- Thread starter kassatsu
- Start date
HiVision said:The strategies available are seriously good fun aren't they.
For me it feels like a strategy game more than an action game at times and even if I lose - especially to a good opponent - I don't mind (much the same way I feel when playing a game such as Red Alert 3 against Brutal AI - I just boot it up and try a different strategy). It's as if the strategic thinking part is where the true fun is and winning/losing is actually secondary to the enjoying.
I had some epic battles tonight - one guy was using fire resistance to quickly nip through all the falling magma without dying... b'stard! That came down to 4-3 (to him...).
I love firing reflective shots into small enclosed areas when I know the other guy is in there... it soon knocks him out
I agree that it's more strategy focused. I kind of appreciate how the action elements of the multiplayer kind of take a backseat. The key to victory seems to be the skillful and well-timed usage of your chosen special abilities.
On the other hand, I find losing much more rage-inducing than in other competitive multiplayer games. I can't quite put my finger on why. Perhaps because when I lose it's because I've been genuinely out-witted. :s
Loving the game all around!
Initially it was rage-inducing to me too but I learnt to relish watching the other player's strategy as much as enjoying my own. The people you are up against sometimes pull some incredibly cool moves and it becomes almost like chess as you plan ideas out to try and combat him.
This game can be pretty damn difficult and frustrating, if you are going for all of the survivors/gems. I usually spend 30-45 mins per level trying to do so, and while the end result can be satisfying, getting there is torturous! Don't get me wrong, I'm glad the game isn't easy. I like a good challenge, but this game goes too far at times.
Speaking of, I just beat the Episode 5 boss (
) and JESUS!
However, as frustrating at that boss fight was, the first level of Episode 6 made up for it!
Speaking of, I just beat the Episode 5 boss (
Terra Kingpin, the snapping turtle thing
That thing was far more difficult than necessary. I spend about a half hour of straight frustration trying to beat it. I got fairly good at the sections after a while, but I can't believe that there were no checkpoints. Quite often I would get to the bullet hell sections close to the end, and get screwed over, only to start at the veeeeery beginning of the fight. Seriously, no checkpoints? Even after I've died 15 times? The best part: I missed a single gem somewhere in the level. Can't wait to replay that boss fight...!
However, as frustrating at that boss fight was, the first level of Episode 6 made up for it!
I absolutely adored the level Can't Take My Eyes Off of You. The music is gorgeous, the art and dynamics were all really slick and beautiful. The design felt inspired, and it blew me away. Took me back to the really great levels in Yoshi's Island, or Soul Bubbles. Well done, Q-Games!
Beat this last night. I didn't have much trouble on the Level 5 boss that some people seem to be having. Died a few times sure, but no more than 3.
The final boss was great. Not that it was all original or anything, I just felt it was well executed. It felt difficult in the sense that I had to be good to get through it, not get lucky.
The final boss was great. Not that it was all original or anything, I just felt it was well executed. It felt difficult in the sense that I had to be good to get through it, not get lucky.
FantasticMrFoxdie
Mumber
Finally picking this up tonight after an exhausting week of midterms, can't wait!
My spaceship is ready.
My spaceship is ready.
Did you not feel it at all? Where are you at?Tntnnbltn said:Not meaning to sound shallow, but I checked the news today for the first time since yesterday morning, and now I understand why I couldn't find a single PJS2 multiplayer match last night when I got home from work.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
wow, the single-player is so damn bad.
how did this happen? PJS1 was a fantastic game. This just feels amateurish, as of World 6.
Was this made by a b-team, or the original team?
how did this happen? PJS1 was a fantastic game. This just feels amateurish, as of World 6.
Was this made by a b-team, or the original team?
Oh. That makes more sense.Tntnnbltn said:
I figured it would be kinda hard to be in Japan and not know about it at all for a whole day, haha.
wat.Rez said:wow, the single-player is so damn bad.
how did this happen? PJS1 was a fantastic game. This just feels amateurish, as of World 6.
Was this made by a b-team, or the original team?
Rez said:wow, the single-player is so damn bad.
how did this happen? PJS1 was a fantastic game. This just feels amateurish, as of World 6.
Was this made by a b-team, or the original team?
I think this is a bit harsh, but I was also not impressed with the single player. Nothing surprised me or challenged me, so I blasted straight through it with no problems. I got 95% of survivors and treasures on my first run and have little desire to go back
FantasticMrFoxdie
Mumber
I just realized Q-games is in Tokyo right? Hope all of them are okay =/
MustacheBandit_
Member
Rez said:wow, the single-player is so damn bad.
how did this happen? PJS1 was a fantastic game. This just feels amateurish, as of World 6.
Was this made by a b-team, or the original team?
i think you are being a little extreme haha.
personally I loved part 2. it was just like the first but slightly more challenging.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
I'm having a shitty day so FUCK EVERYTHING and so on.
I'm biased but for me personally as a gamer Shooter 2 is x10 as addictive and fun as the original in adventure mode. The combination of the powered up missile barrage and the spin dash combo attack keeps me going back for more and I should be bored of it already.
It's a shame the odd person here and there feels that way but perhaps they are just in the wrong mood for it. My suggestion is to let off some of that angst in the multiplayer mode
PS. we felt the quake in Kyoto which is quite remarkable considering we are 1000km away from the epicenter. Apart from that we are all ok here at Q. Thanks for thinking of us everyone.
It's a shame the odd person here and there feels that way but perhaps they are just in the wrong mood for it. My suggestion is to let off some of that angst in the multiplayer mode
PS. we felt the quake in Kyoto which is quite remarkable considering we are 1000km away from the epicenter. Apart from that we are all ok here at Q. Thanks for thinking of us everyone.
RyanardoDaVinci
Member
Vexidus said:
The most frustrating thing about the game! It seems like it's intentionally there to artificially extend the length of the game by forcing the player to replay entire sections/collect everything again.
Like, in Pixeljunk Eden, having to collect the spectra in order: 1, 1-2, 1-2-3, 1-2-3-4, 1-2-3-4-5 in every garden instead of just letting the player collect 1-2-3-4-5 on the first go.
I like 2 but I miss the chill vibe and difficulty of the first game. I liked 1 the best of all PJ games because it was the first that let me relax and not get balls hard at any real point like they did with Monsters and Eden (both I never finished because it got more frustrating than fun).
And I've already resigned myself into not getting all diamonds because replaying the levels and usually spending more than 30 mins to complete them to try and 100% is a detriment to me enjoying the game.
And I've already resigned myself into not getting all diamonds because replaying the levels and usually spending more than 30 mins to complete them to try and 100% is a detriment to me enjoying the game.
It's weird that people are finding the game frustrating. It's anything but frustrating imo. It's a nice challenge, and there are very clear patterns and design which you can rely on. Unless you don't like this sort of game to begin with, then I guess there isn't much for debate.
RyanardoDaVinci
Member
For me, it's not frustrating because of the difficulty of the levels or boss fights; it's finding every gem, rescuing every survivor, then dying because I touched a tiny bit of lava that is so small I couldn't even see it on the screen. THAT is what's frustrating.duckroll said:
When you can die from the stupidest crap and you must do everything you just did again.
P.S.
Flick the ear, very hard, of the person(s) that decided to make you vulnerable to lava while you're using a ship that shoots out lava! >:[
The final boss will be quite easy once you understood its pattern. I had to do the level again because I missed a treasure, and armed with the knowledge from the first time, I beat it on the 3rd try.
When the boss starts attacking with fire walls, throw a water bomb near top of a wall such that it'll become mud. At this point the boss will stop doing anything and become a sitting duck, probably thinking the wall is still there. That makes it the easiest section to beat.
And don't forget to take advantage of the 2 shield items. You never overheat when you have it with you, so you can just shoot continuously.
When the boss starts attacking with fire walls, throw a water bomb near top of a wall such that it'll become mud. At this point the boss will stop doing anything and become a sitting duck, probably thinking the wall is still there. That makes it the easiest section to beat.
And don't forget to take advantage of the 2 shield items. You never overheat when you have it with you, so you can just shoot continuously.
Dylan here again: I've said this before elsewhere but I'll say it again, we don't make our games to try and please everyone, if we do that we water down the richness of the overall experience - like the Harrison Ford voice-over in the original shitty cut of Blade Runner.. sure, it makes it a smoother experience but it also makes it a shittier one.
Also, our games simply cannot be perfect; all games have flaws and our games have them too, but we do our best to give each game something you have never seen before (either visually or gameplay/control-wise) in a game. I created PixelJunk to let me do that as working under the regular publisher/developer system I was forced to water everything down.
Frustration is in the eye of the beholder; if you can't enjoy the original concepts we have brought to our games, and a lot of this is because there is a lot of stuff that is both familiar and unfamiliar, then you are going to be frustrated. However, if you relax a bit and take what we have made as it is, learn to get good at it (all our games require you learn), you will be rewarded with lots of cool and imaginative stuff.
Also, our games simply cannot be perfect; all games have flaws and our games have them too, but we do our best to give each game something you have never seen before (either visually or gameplay/control-wise) in a game. I created PixelJunk to let me do that as working under the regular publisher/developer system I was forced to water everything down.
Frustration is in the eye of the beholder; if you can't enjoy the original concepts we have brought to our games, and a lot of this is because there is a lot of stuff that is both familiar and unfamiliar, then you are going to be frustrated. However, if you relax a bit and take what we have made as it is, learn to get good at it (all our games require you learn), you will be rewarded with lots of cool and imaginative stuff.
Fair enough. Managing frustration is the bread and butter of good game design. Finding that tipping point has got to be hard as hell. For me, it's just a couple of things that tip the scales:HiVision said:
1) Levels get long towards the end, and deaths result more often than not from lapses in judgment, not from failures in skill. Having to restart a long level because I ran into an enemy just as it was spawning is annoying.
2) The focus on collection. Not seeing the "true" ending until you collect all the treasure is annoying. Not that the story is all that important, but the standard ending is abrupt and unsatisfying. The game simply ends. And seeing the constant reminder that I only have 14 out of 15 treasures/survivors is a compulsive player's nightmare.
Otherwise, I love the music, love the art style, love the core mechanics, and love the puzzle design. And because I'm such a compulsive person, I'm collecting all treasure and survivors despite (or is it because of?) my frustration. But I'm not sure if that says more about me or the game.
conman said:
My suggestion is still to relax a bit, enjoy the controls first and foremost, get really good with them. However, if we release a patch we will definitely try to address some of the stuff in 1). As you say, difficulty balance is always difficult and it becomes a matter of taste - by making things easier we turn off some players, and by making things hard we make it tougher for the other players. The problem is that PixelJunk games tend to have a lot of new or different (or even could be called weird) concepts in them so the player is forced to think quite a bit for themselves. This can be frustrating for some and a challenge for others (in the same way sudoku is fun for some and frustrating for others). All players are different and some of our ideas are bound to turn off some people (and turn on others). We saw this particularly with Eden which has a huge loyal fan base and also a bunch of people who *really* didn't like it.
FantasticMrFoxdie
Mumber
I love the challenge the PxJ games bring. Not too frustrating but keeps me coming back for more.
inb4casualmode XD
I read its longer than the first, but i'm not entirely sure how much longer though.
inb4casualmode XD
Jinfash said:
I read its longer than the first, but i'm not entirely sure how much longer though.
I came a bit late to the PJS series but i'm really enjoyed finishing 1 and going through 2.
Yes, no doubt that 2 is harder than 1 ( or it could be that i'm a bit of a wuss ) but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I do agree though with the point made about more saved points during each levels are needed.
Anyway, I do have to say that both the games are fantastic value in terms of gameplay and cost of the games. £6.29 is great value for each game. Hell, a gaming magazine here in the UK can cost over £5.
Yes, no doubt that 2 is harder than 1 ( or it could be that i'm a bit of a wuss
) but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I do agree though with the point made about more saved points during each levels are needed.Anyway, I do have to say that both the games are fantastic value in terms of gameplay and cost of the games. £6.29 is great value for each game. Hell, a gaming magazine here in the UK can cost over £5.
Frogfucious
Member
So is there some kind of reward for reaching the sun? (spoilers obviously) I'm about 75% through Venus now.
I found this game extremely frustrating when I began in the asteroid belt, but I must say, once you learn how to play, and learn to be stealthy instead of rushing for the first survivor you see, the possibilities for mind games are endless
Also the music for the first level in the 3rd section is awesome. Great Job Q games!
I found this game extremely frustrating when I began in the asteroid belt, but I must say, once you learn how to play, and learn to be stealthy instead of rushing for the first survivor you see, the possibilities for mind games are endless
Also the music for the first level in the 3rd section is awesome. Great Job Q games!
MustacheBandit_
Member
finally finished it and completely enjoyed the game. well worth the purchase. i loved the extra bit of challenge it was compared to the first and the boss fights were well designed as well. With the added difficulty, however, I have no interest in going back to pick up all the gems. Multiplayer was a nice add-on as well. Didn't feel tacked on, it actually is pretty fun. Anyhow, another Pixeljunk game fails to let me down again and I look forward to their next game!
A little change has been made from tonight - the money earned even when you lose has been increased from $10 to $25 to help prevent people get into a negative spiral where they can't get new items to try out.
The money for a draw has been increased to $50 and the money for a win is the same as before.
This might help stop people disconnecting just because they are worried about losing - it's worth it to play just for the extra $$$ if you happen to lose now.
The money for a draw has been increased to $50 and the money for a win is the same as before.
This might help stop people disconnecting just because they are worried about losing - it's worth it to play just for the extra $$$ if you happen to lose now.
HiVision said:
That's a really nice change. For a while when I was in Asteroid, I was only being matched up with people in much higher leagues, and didn't have a chance. It made things really unfun and frustrating. After a while, I started declining matches until I got someone else in Asteroid to play with, so we had the same weapons at least.
With the decreased losing penalty, I wouldn't mind as much to play uneven matches and lose.
I don't get how people consider PixelJunk Shooter frustrating. Monster and Eden I can understand, but Shooter is rather forgiving as a game. Yes the level are rather long and you can die easily, yet you have infinite life and you only need to redo that particular screen. The only way you need to redo the whole stage is by letting too many survivors die, and a couple combos can fix that.
I've been finding that I can just come to Shooter 2 when I need to relax, finish a level, and then leave it for a bit. It feels like gaming comfort food to me I definitely think that it's better than the first one! It feels a lot more "bullet-hell" at points too, which is pretty sweet
(By the way Dylan, the writer of the Eurogamer review tweeted me after I complained about reviewers not giving the multiplayer a fair shake)
I definitely think that it's better than the first one! It feels a lot more "bullet-hell" at points too, which is pretty sweet (By the way Dylan, the writer of the Eurogamer review tweeted me after I complained about reviewers not giving the multiplayer a fair shake
)HiVision said:
"Hi! I did play the multiplayer and very much enjoyed it (as I pointed out in the review). Not sure what's 'lazy' about that.
Other tweets just gave the impression that he thought I was attacking his review... which is fair. I suppose the review culture of wanting to have the review out on release for maximum hints is partially to blame. But that was easily remedied by you guys having had the game on PSN for weeks in advance. Plenty of time to play it fully, like Kass/Chris did for the site. He played it so much
Spotless Mind
Member
Don't listen to the disappointment! It *is* your best game and the difficulty is perfect. It may have been hard at first, but, once i mastered the mechanics, it became a breeze to quickly make my way through the levels and rack up combos.HiVision said:Joystiq gave us 4/5 but also called shooter 2 our most disappointing game, WTF
Shooter 2 is our best game yet and to open a review by saying that makes me disappointed in them.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
Playing Shooter 1 again really emphasises what went wrong with 2. It's the tiny things. I really enjoyed the push and pull of water and lava in PJS1. As you moved through each level new things were really cleverly introduced, played with and then disposed with. In PJS2, the additions are much more shallow and the returning bits and pieces aren't handled with the same level of precision as they were in 1. It's like cover of a really good song that's mostly competent but lacking the little something that made the original a classic.
In 1, heating up and cooling down, water and lava, they work visually, thematically and mechanically in such a fantastic, satisfying way. In 2, both are present, but there's no build-up or sense of progression, they're treated like they're 'just a given', like 'this is just the way things are'. It doesn't earn it. I assume because they expected this to literally be the second half of the first game? I don't buy that. I paid full-price for both. I hadn't played the first in months. You can't expect me, as a player, to behave like I just finished episode three. It just cheapens the impact of PJS2.
In 2, we spend so much time with the stomach acid, which doesn't read nearly as well in relation to water as lava did in the first game, and mostly feels tedious rather than satisfying. Heating up and cooling down? I get that. It reads well. Having acid eat away at, what, my shields on an arbitrary timer? It's clumsy. It's not a terrible idea, it's just a one trick pony. There is never a time in the game where it is anything more than what it was initially. Whereas the genius of PJS1 was that each liquid continued to have interesting, unforseen uses thanks to either fantastic level design or really interesting suit additions. The inverse suit, for instance, remains a fantastic idea that was introduced in 1 and, much like everything from 1, just shows up for a brief moment without actually introducing a new layer to its function.
In a nutshell, that's my problem with 2. Everything is either a reprise of ideas from 1 (that don't really add anything of substance to the original idea) or a one-trick pony (stomach acid, hungry suit, arbitrarily using ice enemies to block off paths). The light-dark mechanic is an exception to this, and it reads and plays really damn well, but it's the LAST idea that's introduced when I feel like it should have been the first.
I mean, seriously, the Hungry Suit? Who thought limiting movement to four directions and then not adjusting the art to reflect this was a good idea? Why even bother implementing Pacman-like directional controls (push a direction and he'll keep moving until he hits a wall) if it's only ever a nuisance rather than something that makes sense within the levels created?
I don't get it. Outside of the light and dark suit and some pretty decent boss ideas (that are arbitrarily difficult, but I can overlook that), I just found myself thoroughly disappointed.
In 1, heating up and cooling down, water and lava, they work visually, thematically and mechanically in such a fantastic, satisfying way. In 2, both are present, but there's no build-up or sense of progression, they're treated like they're 'just a given', like 'this is just the way things are'. It doesn't earn it. I assume because they expected this to literally be the second half of the first game? I don't buy that. I paid full-price for both. I hadn't played the first in months. You can't expect me, as a player, to behave like I just finished episode three. It just cheapens the impact of PJS2.
In 2, we spend so much time with the stomach acid, which doesn't read nearly as well in relation to water as lava did in the first game, and mostly feels tedious rather than satisfying. Heating up and cooling down? I get that. It reads well. Having acid eat away at, what, my shields on an arbitrary timer? It's clumsy. It's not a terrible idea, it's just a one trick pony. There is never a time in the game where it is anything more than what it was initially. Whereas the genius of PJS1 was that each liquid continued to have interesting, unforseen uses thanks to either fantastic level design or really interesting suit additions. The inverse suit, for instance, remains a fantastic idea that was introduced in 1 and, much like everything from 1, just shows up for a brief moment without actually introducing a new layer to its function.
In a nutshell, that's my problem with 2. Everything is either a reprise of ideas from 1 (that don't really add anything of substance to the original idea) or a one-trick pony (stomach acid, hungry suit, arbitrarily using ice enemies to block off paths). The light-dark mechanic is an exception to this, and it reads and plays really damn well, but it's the LAST idea that's introduced when I feel like it should have been the first.
I mean, seriously, the Hungry Suit? Who thought limiting movement to four directions and then not adjusting the art to reflect this was a good idea? Why even bother implementing Pacman-like directional controls (push a direction and he'll keep moving until he hits a wall) if it's only ever a nuisance rather than something that makes sense within the levels created?
I don't get it. Outside of the light and dark suit and some pretty decent boss ideas (that are arbitrarily difficult, but I can overlook that), I just found myself thoroughly disappointed.
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