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[SentientStone]

I think it's not unreasonable to say that there should be some healthy skepticism at the very least when you look at this and some of the reports going around:

Vs. this marketing animation.

 

[sendit]

Well hey now... Surface's are dope and definitely nice than the macbooks the last 5 years

Nope. Not in build quality or usability. The trackpad alone which is the main pointing device for a notebook is leagues better on a Macbook.

 

[Lysandros]

I also think the animation is pretty misleading - I think bulk - more than 50% of the air for the heat sink would to come in from the large rear vents near the ports, not from the bottom. There's huge space below the heat sink, and also large amount of holes towards the backward of the console near by the HDMI/SSD ports.

Of course there will be a little bit of air coming in from bottom - but it will be more of helpful in terms of redirecting the airflow from the rear port than actual volume of air coming in.

ODD side does look quite cramped - so I'm little curious of how the airflow would be like. Perhaps that metal shielding between ODD and IO board would have more openings than demo unit? PSU unit would need some venting too... and we shall see what it's like in real thing, hopefully soon.

The 'large' rear vents are half covered.

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

Why don't you expand on the point you're trying to make instead of crying FUD. Otherwise why take you seriously?

You have no clue, but instead spread FUD. Do you know if it was release hardware or not? If you don't know, you can't state things as fact, right?

 

[Knitted Knight]

You have no clue, but instead spread FUD. Do you know if it was release hardware or not? If you don't know, you can't state things as fact, right?

You're going to have to try again. Make a coherent point and I'll gladly respond to it. You're asking the same dumb question twice.

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

You're going to have to try again. Make a coherent point and I'll gladly respond to it. You're asking the same dumb question twice.

So you have absolutely NO clue. Sounds about right.

 

[lachesis]

The 'large' rear vents are half covered.

True, but I think that inch-inch and half covering of the top vent would be necessary for smoother airflow. If they hadn't covered the vent, it's literally may expose the fins of the heatsink, and perhaps it would have some air escaping due to internal terbulance? I am not aerodynamic expert, so I can't only say some wild guess... and also wonder if they were gong to be covered, why put them there? Perhaps during later stage testing, they found covering it creates better airflow? Who knows...

I've just carefully looked Eurogamer's photos - that even the chasis seem to have air holes/airways - so at least IO part, looks okay. but the air intake for PSU has very little clearance - obstructed by ODD... and opening between PSU and ODD is almost like 1/8 inch. Tiny. Perhaps I'm not just seeing other airways in the photos - but no matter how you cut it - it's very tight, and also at tough angle to air to effectively go through - at near 90 degrees.

I think it all comes down to the performance of the fan itself, that how much air it can pull. It's not a blower, so static pressure is at disadvantage - but at 130mm with that thickness... I think it would move quite a bit of air, creating enough negative pressure within chasis, thus pulling air thru those vents more effectively. If you look at Mac Pro 2013, the intake slits are not drastically bigger or more plentiful than XSX too.

But I do wish the bottom circle would be slightly smaller by 1/4 inch around, as well as little taller by 1/8 inch or so - I could feel more comfortable of air coming in. Either way, I think I will be most likely lay on the side - so at least it would have more clearing..

 

[Knitted Knight]

So you have absolutely NO clue. Sounds about right.

I'm not the one incapable of making a rational point. You think your little baiting is not transparent. Cry some more.

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

I'm not the one incapable of making a rational point. You think your little baiting is not transparent. Cry some more.

Cry me a river. Can't support your reasonings. I'll be sure to ignore you for FUD threads, without any way to back them up. And can't argue any point at all. I'd be down for a discussion at least, but you aren't capable apparently

 

[Ps5ProFoSho]

I love how some people think that either one of these billion dollar companies would just "fuck up" making a console. There was no fucking up. Neither will fail horribly. Buy what you like and just STOP IT

 

[Knitted Knight]

Cry me a river. Can't support your reasonings. I'll be sure to ignore you for FUD threads, without any way to back them up. And can't argue any point at all. I'd be down for a discussion at least, but you aren't capable apparently

Can't be further from the truth. I replied to a claim that said the Xbox Series X design is efficient and proficient above all else. I replied by suggesting caution, using visual aids to explain potential design problem areas that detract from the ideal concepts shown in marketing rolls. As well as an explanation in word form. We should have some healthy skepticism when making any definite statements about the subject considering such evidence, as well as the reports we've gotten. In other words, that it's better to refrain from making such claim by basing them on marketing jargon from MS, influencers promoting a product or marketing animations of concepts at their most ideal state. The only thing you have done is accuse that post of FUD and play little baiting games to pigeon hole me into an argument or a misstep as if none the wiser. You've never been too bright and you're showing why once more. The offer stands, make a coherent point and I'll entertain a discussion. Keep trolling and get the same response.

 

[sircaw]

Cry me a river. Can't support your reasonings. I'll be sure to ignore you for FUD threads, without any way to back them up. And can't argue any point at all. I'd be down for a discussion at least, but you aren't capable apparently

jeez, dude stop with the baiting and trolling.

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

Can't be further from the truth. I replied to a claim that said the Xbox Series X design is efficient and proficient above all else. I replied by suggesting caution, using visual aids to explain potential design problem areas that detract from the ideal concepts shown in marketing rolls. As well as an explanation in word form. We should have some healthy skepticism when making any definite statements about the subject considering such evidence, as well as the reports we've gotten. In other words, that it's better to refrain from making such claim by basing them on marketing jargon from MS, influencers promoting a product or marketing animations of concepts at their most ideal state. The only thing you have done is accuse that post of FUD and play a little baiting games to pigeon hole me into an argument or a misstep as if none the wiser. You've never been too bright and you're showing why once more. The offer stands, make a coherent point and I'll entertain a discussion.

Let's start with this, you have absolutely no clue about Microsoft's designs, and are stating things as fact, without any proof. You have no clue how the final design of the console is. You don't know what the internal temps are at the die, or the vrms, or anything on the board. You don't know what openings will be included on the final design on the XSX for airflow, or the ones blocked off. So let's not spread FUD without any background or clues to say otherwise.

 

[lachesis]

I love how some people think that either one of these billion dollar companies would just "fuck up" making a console. There was no fucking up. Neither will fail horribly. Buy what you like and just STOP IT

But every single console have some sort of "fuck up"... even after all that research. People just live with the issue many times...
I am 100% sure something would come up. As early adapter, I am hoping the best and crossing fingers.

So far, not too bad - only had a couple of RROD for OG 360, Corrupt memory malfunction for Wii, loading issues for PS1 (upside down), PS2 (red screen) and PS3 disc spitting... I even put my switch always docked and use pro controller to avoid the joycon issue... and that pro controller's got d-pad issue to!

So far only consoles that was really built like a TANK to me was OG Xbox, but my poor asian small hand just couldn't handle that Duke controller.

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

But every single console have some sort of "fuck up"... even after all that research. People just live with the issue many times...
I am 100% sure something would come up. As early adapter, I am hoping the best and crossing fingers.

So far, not too bad - only had a couple of RROD for OG 360, Corrupt memory malfunction for Wii, loading issues for PS1 (upside down), PS2 (red screen) and PS3 disc spitting... I even put my switch always docked and use pro controller to avoid the joycon issue... and that pro controller's got d-pad issue to!

So far only consoles that was really built like a TANK to me was OG Xbox, but my poor asian small hand just couldn't handle that Duke controller.

Thank you! Neither console will fail. The stupid jabs at both Xbox or PS are dumb as hell. NEITHER of them have cooling issues. As much as I've criticized the ps5 for it's size, I'll never say it'll overheat or have cooling issues, because it won't.

 

[I'm nobody]

I love how some people think that either one of these billion dollar companies would just "fuck up" making a console. There was no fucking up. Neither will fail horribly. Buy what you like and just STOP IT

Explain rlod?

 

[Knitted Knight]

Let's start with this, you have absolutely no clue about Microsoft's designs, and are stating things as fact, without any proof. You have no clue how the final design of the console is. You don't know what the internal temps are at the die, or the vrms, or anything on the board. You don't know what openings will be included on the final design on the XSX for airflow, or the ones blocked off. So let's not spread FUD without any background or clues to say otherwise.

How does any of what you've typed refute the point I've made about being cautious with making hyperbole statements about the Xbox Series X design? I backed up my reasoning with the best up to date information we have about the Xbox Series X design. You don't seem to have a single problem with the hyperbole based on nothing but marketing jargon and concept animations of ideal airflow/conditions from MS. Calling it FUD is like me calling the other user's post astroturfing aka a potential mischaracterization based on nothing but alleged motive that can't be proven. That's is, in short, trolling.

Not to mention the nonsensical aspect of your argument. You're suggesting that the retail design could potentially somehow fix all the apparent design problem areas of the preview units (which clearly show a different picture than ideal conditions found in marketing material selling a concept). You can't bring yourself to admit the validity of what's presented in front of you but admit to it by omission of a proper argument to the contrary....deflecting to an ideal assumption of the future.

It's absolutely possible that retail units could fix all the little problem areas of the preview units. But so is it possible that little to no changes from the preview designs to retail units take place. Thus the flip would be... do you think any of the problem areas highlighted in those pictures that impede proper and ideal airflow (as opposed to marketing animations) will be completely erased in the retail units? If so what makes you so confident? What proof do you possess to make such claim? Clearly you're just trafficking with speculation. Will you bump this thread if proven wrong?

Any way you spin the attack you can't refute the argument made based on your prediction of what may be. You either debate what is in front of you and make coherent points using current up-to-date information or go on a rant accusing others of spreading Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt like a no good troll, a simple ad-hominem attack. You can't square that suggesting caution/healthy skepticism based on current info = FUD.

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

How does any of what you've typed refute the point I've made about being cautious with making hyperbole statements about the Xbox Series X design? I backed up my reasoning with the best up to date information we have about the Xbox Series X design. You don't seem to have a single problem with the hyperbole based on nothing but marketing jargon and concept animations of ideal airflow/conditions from MS. Calling it FUD is like me calling the other user's post astroturfing aka a potential mischaracterization based on nothing but alleged motive that can't be proven. That's is, in short, trolling.

Not to mention the nonsensical aspect of your argument. You're suggesting that the retail design could potentially somehow fix all the apparent design problem areas of the preview units (which are different than ideal conditions found in marketing material). That's absolutely possible, but so is it possible that little to no changes from the preview designs to retail units take place. Thus the flip would be... do you think any of the problem areas highlighted in those pictures that impede proper and ideal airflow (as opposed to marketing animations) will be completely erased in the retail units? If so what makes you so confident? What proof do you possess to make such claim? Clearly you're just trafficking with speculation. Will you bump this thread if proven wrong?

Any way you spin the attack you can't refute the argument made based on your prediction of what may be. You either debate what is in front of you and make coherent points using current up-to-date information or go on a rant accusing others of spreading Fear, Uncertainy, and Doubt like a no good troll, a simple ad-hominem attack. You can't square that suggesting caution/healthy skepticism based on current info = FUD.

Your prediction on the XSX holds no weight. You or I don't know the final release product, but to say it might have issues breathing, is completely insane. The surface guys are doing better than Apple at their best, which is design language. To think otherwise, makes you lose any credibility, as we all know it runs cool and quietly based on hundreds of reviewers, who have tested it in horizontal and vertical standings. If the console has no issues overheating, in a smaller shell, with more power, what negative FUD can you spread at this point?!

 

[Knitted Knight]

I'm not predicting anything. That's you mischaracterizing my initial statement to mean something it's not so you can form a basis for your argument. You have nothing.

I said that with the current info we have, healthy skepticism should be taken before making claims such as the one the other user made. And I backed that up with visual aids. School is back in session.

 

[DonJuanSchlong]

I'm not predicting anything. That's you mischaracterizing my initial statement to mean something it's not so you can form a basis for your argument. You have nothing.

I said that with the current info we have, healthy skepticism should be taken before making claims such as the one the other user made. And I backed that up with the current info we have and visual aids. School is back in session.

You literally posted this! LMAO.

I think it's not unreasonable to say that there should be some healthy skepticism at the very least when you look at this and some of the reports going around:

Vs. this marketing animation.

If the console never had any heat issues with prerelease hardware, to hundreds of people, with absolutely no issues, why are you trying to say MS might have heat issues?! Please explain that so you have a way out of getting banned for trolling?!

 

[Knitted Knight]

If the console never had any heat issues with prerelease hardware, to hundreds of people, with absolutely no issues, why are you trying to say MS might have heat issues?! Please explain that so you have a way out of getting banned for trolling?!

I replied to this:

The XSX has a design that is efficient and proficient above all else. People saying that's a poorly thought out design are idiots.

With what you quoted.

That quoted post is not a prediction of failure. It's a characterization of present state of hardware. As those visuals aid show, that is not ideal CFD with so many holes plugged (as well as other reasons) nor do they represent the marketing material that Microsoft used to sell its concept. There have been 2 reports of considerable heating of XSX preview consoles during both normal operation and standby by journalists. That; coupled with the pictures pointing those issues in its design should induce caution and healthy skepticism before lauding the design as excellence personified. Here comes the biggest part, it's not, in my opinion, for the time being, as is, efficient and proficient design above all else. So no matter what accusation you levy, it won't make you right and me wrong. It's simply just your opinion. Not to mention the accussation of FUD is well, simple, basic trolling on your part.

You can call it FUD, troll, you can ask for my ban, you could go to the off-topic thread and hang in there with the mods and lick more boots to see if you get your wish but it's definitely not going to make you right no matter the spin.

 

[Three]

I think that pic says a lot about the engineering argument. It does look crammed in. Like an old dell tower from a long time ago. It will be pretty amazing if that runs cool AND quiet.

It will be one or the other. If MS were really sneaky fucks what they can do is have the consoles they sent out running really hot but quiet. Have people give impressions on the console then up the fan speed later in an update. The same shit some of their games did with reviews and microtransactions.

 

[Three]

That quoted post is not a prediction of failure. It's a characterization of present state of hardware. As those visuals aid show, that is not ideal CFD with so many holes plugged (as well as other reasons) nor do they represent the marketing material that Microsoft used to sell its concept. There have been 2 reports of considerable heating of XSX preview consoles during both normal operation and standby by journalists.

The marketing material showing airflow is obviously bullshit as I've mentioned in another thread. I remember somebody using it to show amazing engineering or something. It's like those skin cream ads that show bubbles pushing the skin up. It's just meant to be a cool looking easy to understand graphic even if it doesn't represent the actual science behind it.

The XSX will not have heating issues. It's clocked low even by PC equivalents coming out and has a decent heatsink. It may not provide high airflow (in a bid to be quiet) hence it being toasty but it should be within the temp limit of the hardware.

 

[Knitted Knight]

The marketing material showing airflow is obviously bullshit as I've mentioned in another thread. I remember somebody using it to show amazing engineering or something. It's like those skin cream ads that show bubbles pushing the skin up. It's just meant to be a cool looking easy to understand graphic even if it doesn't represent the actual science behind it.

The XSX will not have heating issues. It's clocked low even by PC equivalents coming out and has a decent heatsink. It may not provide high airflow (in a bid to be quiet) hence it being toasty but it should be within the temp limit of the hardware.

I think we're in agreement that upping RPMs on the fan is in the cards if it needs it via firmware. The silence aspect is what could be at stake. We don't know.

 

[MasterCornholio]

The XSX will not have heating issues. It's clocked low even by PC equivalents coming out and has a decent heatsink. It may not provide high airflow (in a bid to be quiet) hence it being toasty but it should be within the temp limit of the hardware.

That's my belief as well. They chose to make a smaller box at the expense of a better cooling solution. But that's ok as long as the heat it produces doesn't affect it's performance. Just because the box may feel hot/warm to the touch doesn't mean it's having issues. Some people just need to accept that.

 

[Redlight]

I think we're in agreement that upping RPMs on the fan is in the cards if it needs it via firmware. The silence aspect is what could be at stake. We don't know.

Holy moly, this complete fiction that you've created about the fan being too slow is gloriously insane - 'Upping the RPM's is on the cards'. Oh Jesus.

Keep it up, it's like a scientific experiment to see how low a person's credibility can get. Could be a world record on the cards.

 

[Werewolfgrandma]

I think we're in agreement that upping RPMs on the fan is in the cards if it needs it via firmware. The silence aspect is what could be at stake. We don't know.

I'm quite confident that if it gets too hot the fan will spin faster, no firmware update needed. Also if hot air is blowing out the top how can you say it has bad airflow?

 

[Xaero Gravity]

If you know there are intake on the port side, why even post that to insinuate FUD? All of your posts recently incite a bit of FUD.

We're exposing the Xbot/XboxGAF conspiracy. The fact that you're trying to shutdown him down tells me you're a part of it. Disappointing, I used to think you were cute.

 

[FrankWza]

nope. Neither. Because the first one is not why they used this cooling solution. I've explained to you why they did. And I've explained why you cannot over engineer something that is addressing the one major complaint of your last console. They can't have a crazy noisy fan again.They didn't skimp on other parts to get this done. They were coming in at these specs and were going to do everything they could to see that a noisy console would not happen again. I used the 360 to XB1 example because it is a comparable situation. Regardless of when it happened or how long ago it happened. Except Msoft DID skimp and came in way underpowered to BEGIN last gen after THEIR last major complaint.(RROD)
If it ends up being overkill nobody will even know or care. It was still worth the size to try and guarantee a quiet console as long as they didn't sacrifice performance in other areas. Judging by the gameplay trailers, they haven't. More people would have had second thoughts if they didn't do everything they could to address the noise than people concerned with its size, because again, it was THE issue that PS4 owners had. The quote below is from the blog post that had the tear down.

"We felt it was inevitable to make a generational leap in terms of performance in order to deliver a new, next-generation gaming experience. However, to do so, we had to balance every aspect of the system, from focusing on reducing the noise level to enhancing the cooling capacity, more than ever before."

We're exposing the Xbot/XboxGAF conspiracy. The fact that you're trying to shutdown him down tells me you're a part of it. Disappointing, I used to think you were cute.

I'm not predicting anything. That's you mischaracterizing my initial statement to mean something it's not so you can form a basis for your argument. You have nothing.

I said that with the current info we have, healthy skepticism should be taken before making claims such as the one the other user made. And I backed that up with visual aids. School is back in session.

Don't sweat it. If you notice, when you make a point that shuts down the argument all you get as a response is a laugh emoji. Refer to the insanity about draw power. Also, you can't bring up RROD because it was too long ago. Even though it was a reason for xb1 being bigger than ps4 to begin current gen. Don't bother.

 

[Xaero Gravity]

Don't sweat it. If you notice, when you make a point that shuts down the argument all you get as a response is a laugh emoji. Refer to the insanity about draw power. Also, you can't bring up RROD because it was too long ago. Even though it was a reason for xb1 being bigger than ps4 to begin current gen. Don't bother.

I'm not sure why I'm quoted here

 

[bitbydeath]

If the console never had any heat issues with prerelease hardware, to hundreds of people, with absolutely no issues, why are you trying to say MS might have heat issues?! Please explain that so you have a way out of getting banned for trolling?!

Keep in mind that they all signed an NDA which stated that they're not allowed to say anything negative about the hardware. This was confirmed by a dev here.

Also @d'ghost wasn't saying it has heating issues or that it has any issues at all. You jumped the gun there. He said to be wary as IF it does have heat issues then these images could be an indication as to why.

The forums don't need to be good/bad only. There is room for grey or the healthy skepticism based on what facts we do know. That's what forums are meant to be about. (And not taking it so personally)

Trying to ban such speech makes you no better than the Reee-tards.

 

[Tmack]

I love how some people think that either one of these billion dollar companies would just "fuck up" making a console. There was no fucking up. Neither will fail horribly. Buy what you like and just STOP IT

huh? What? They already did in the past. Both of them.

 

[Dodkrake]

Yeah it doesn't really make much sense to think the Xbox will use more power lol.

Remember, the whole thing about the variable clock speeds on the PS5 is because it has a power budget. It has a constant power draw. If the power draw is known and constant then why would they use a psu thats 50+ watts more than needed? The XSX can use maximum 300 watts. The PS5 can use maximum 350, and while the xbox power draw isn't constant, the PS5s is - so again, if the PS5 power draw is constant, why put a much bigger power unit in than necessary? It makes no sense.

Your PSU needs to support everything connected to the console, not just the APU. So any external hard drive, remotes that will be charging, and the internal SSD, peripherals, etc.

PSU's operate best at around 80% load, not more, not less, so your PSU also needs to scale.

So while your system only needs X watts out of box, it doesn't mean you shouldn't get a PSU rated for X watts.