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Pokémon Community Thread 4: "Your Portal to What's Hip and Happening in Sinnoh!"
- Thread starter UltimateIke
- Start date
Hey, it worked, didn't it?
Serpens007
Member
Whatever the terminology, the anime is there to make money. Origins is there to bring back old fans, to make money. Two different products for two different audience, they both managed to succed in their goals.
Also, Rocket Team is the worst now? Behind The "we like to drees cool" Flare Team, the "we want to drown" Aqua Team and "we dont know what were doing" Galactic Team? Only Plasma Team is better and have a reasonable goal.
TR is a mafia. Wants to make money, they use pokemon to earn money, experimenting and using them in unfair ways. They even kill them. There is no other real villian in any of the gsme that fully acomplish that. Giovanni makes thst clear in Origins too.
Also, Red beats the E4 with the other pokemon. He beats Brocks Geodude with Nidoran if I recall right. Charizard comes at last in tje 8th gym and the Championship battle, against the last pokemon of green.
Satoshi uses a fucking Pikachu and Groovyle with bullet seed against dragon pokemon for fuck sakes, while Red used a Lapras.
Professor Beef
Banned
to be fair, that's how everyone suggests you play the games now. Put all your EXP into one, maybe two Pokemon, and screw catching anything else.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
One relied on nostalgia pandering complete with shilling a certain mon's form. And no, Greninja-Ash doesn't count considering how very iffy they are at treating it and they don't even pander to Greninja in the anime.
TR is a mafia. Wants to make money, they use pokemon to earn money, experimenting and using them in unfair ways. They even kill them. There is no other real villian in any of the gsme that fully acomplish that. Giovanni makes thst clear in Origins too.[/quote]
We're comparing their anime goals considering those are being compared. Also mafia doesn't really work when you have mons that can breath fire. It's why only Pokemon RBY does that - because even Monster Rancher and SMT realize the potential of the creatures they have.
Yes, glad they "showed" that, oh wait they didn't - we only got shitty frames and the whole thing is still Charizard pandering.
So what if Ash used those two? They're not bound by game rules and this allows the show to actually be creative in the fights. Hell, Origins pretty much shows how much a bad idea it is to be strictly similar to the games since not only it would look off (why is the pokemon just standing there waiting to be attacked?! vs. anime battles showing moments of mons actually reacting), it opens another can of worms like how the hell do they gauge the fight, etc.
And are you seriously telling me Origins "Jolteon and Victrebel the jobber" have better fights because of that fact?
No????? That's like one of the single WORST ways to play the game. That's how you play when you literally don't know any better. Evenly level out your Pokemon so that you don't just completely lean on one and use it a a crutch. That way all of your Pokes are usable for battling.
Professor Beef
Banned
I didn't say it was the best way.
dakkumauji
Member
RBG to Y yes, had some plot binding them together even though it was basically tossed into the end of RBG
GSC was basically another reset for most of GS. Only once C came in, did they threw back in Kanto stuff cause the games had Kanto in it
Every new set of games has been a hard reset only with old stuff coming in due to remakes and hell, DPP was as far as removed from the first three gens as possible
Might be LTTP, but the TCG is now available on Android Tablets as Beta version.
Works good so far!
http://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-news/the-pokemon-tcg-online-is-available-for-android/
Works good so far!
http://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-news/the-pokemon-tcg-online-is-available-for-android/
What do you mean?
Serpens007
Member
You cannot discredit the Greninja-Ash Cash grab when they are even releasing a TCG Box about it. That pretty much prooves my point about all of then beign Cash ins or grabs or whatever Pandering to different audiences.
Origins panders to Charizard because of nostalgia, but it works. Sorry if Charizard is so popular, its not like in the main anime some kepts the same iconic mon to keep selling, right?
And comparing the teams in both anime and Origins, of course TR is still a better Team. They do stuff that is proper of them as.bad guys. And the mafia does work if the mafia also uses mons that breath fire. Specially if no.ones dares to fight them, except for a Boy that wants to be a hero - like the 10 years old playing the game.
As for the rest, the fact of the matter is thst still he did use more pokemon, they did showed that, even if it was brief.
And so the anime can break the rules just.because and Origins cant? That just biased. The anime still uses thw typing rulea so Satoshi using bad choices, and pikachu for everything is still terrible. At least Charizard used Seismic Move with a rock Type instead of bullet seed against an Altaria.
When I first saw Origins I thought it was amazing because it actually kept ties with the games (Pokemon cries and such), but when I rewatched it recently, it really didn't hold up. Too small, focuses too much on uninteresting parts while skipping the better ones. I haven't seen the XY anime series yet, mostly because I don't have time and I don't want to watch a sub with Japanese names, but from all I've seen and read, it at least now has more of its own identity than in the past.
Yes but Charizard's appearances are limited, he's not the only Mon that Ash regularly uses, and he's still not an instant-kill button like in Origins
There's literally no reason to bother with being a mafia like organization when you have creatures that could literally be weapons of mass destruction in the wrong hands. Why bother with robbing banks or stealing weaker Pokemon when you could attempt to overthrow the world order
like literally every team has done since
Also, Team Aqua's plan was about the preservation of nature and Magma's plan about the advancement of technology and society. Pay attention, please.
You know what other season had Ash use a rotating team? Best Wishes.
yeah didn't work out then either
The anime...
really doesn't though?
Like they pay attention to typing charts when it can benefit them otherwise they don't really care at all. We have the "aim for the horn" meme for a reason, dude.
It also feels like the main anime has embraced it's inaccuracy. Especially when
Ash uses a Pokemon's future sight against itself!
Who the fuck cares about following stupid game rules, the game rules are full of your typical dumb video game logic which make no damn sense in any sort of context. The anime is by far the more realistic portrayal of what Pokemon battling would actually be like in real life(even then it has it's own BS, like Thunder armour, lol what?), which is what makes its battles 1000000000000000000x more fun and exciting to watch than the shit we get from the games. Like seriously, go and watch a VGC tournament and try not to fall asleep.
Shadow Broker
Banned
This is a little too aggressive for my taste but I agree with the meaning. If the anime never did or atleast did away with things like Thunder Armor and Ash's Pikachu OHKO a freaking Golem or Onix with Thunder Bolt and actually added more Pokémon battles and/or Pokémon tournaments besides the main league ones it would be more aligned with what you'll see in real life if Pokémon actually existed.
Granted, I know Pikachu hasn't OHKO any ground type recently (atleast to my knowledge) it doesn't erased my memories of it happening. That was just lazy writing on the Devs part. They could have had one of his other Pokémon beat Onix and Golem but nope. Gotta book Pikachu strong. And lol.... Thunder Armor... what a joke..
Fake Edit: Disagree with watching the video game tournaments VGC. I like watching those especially if someone is using different Pokémon then the norm.
Featuring idiotic peekaboo Slowbro and COME AT ME BRO Blastoise!
Man your Pokémon arts are awesome, may I ask you to do a Charizard for me?
Pokémon Adventure is faithful to the source Material and that told a better story than Origin did.
Wut? Blaine was very important as he was involved with the creation of Mewtwo and again Pokémon Adventure went one step further and invoved the Gym Leader into the story with Surge, Koga, Sabrina and Blaine being a part of Team Rocket, with Blaine defecting from Team Rocket after Red made him realise the error of his way.
The Gym Leaders are important as they test the players skill over the course of their journey and we don't see that with Red as we only see his first and last gym badge.
There's a good reason why everyone remembers Ash fight against Lt. Surge or his fight against Blaine because they actually challenged him and made him ask tough question like should he evolve Pikachu to defeat Surge?
Red never faces that as he leans way too heavily on Charizard to bail him out, heck I don't even know what Pokémon he had on this team as they never were the focal point.
Origin exist for two reason and that is to pander to the gen 1 crowd and to promote Charizard X nothing more and nothing less and if you enjoyed it great but let not act like that it was perfect or that Red is a better trainer than Ash because that is not the case.
Serpens007
Member
I was talking about Ash using Pikachu for everything, because he is the iconic mon of him. It's the most popular, and the one that sells. It would be interesting if they part ways, but they wont do it because he sells.
Charizard also sells, and is the iconic "RGB" pokemon. A lot of people like Charizard, it causes butthurt when people bash him, etc.
Point is, they're handled very similar. For different audiences. Why is that hard to recognize?
Also, in the span of the mere 4 OVAS, Charizard does lose. It even gets wrecked with Nidoqueen. It isn't an insta-kill mon. And please, dont bring the "it was just one time", since we've already discussed that this is shorter than the houndreds of episodes of the main anime.
Because Giovanni doesn't give a shit about the world order? You know, what makes Rocket interesting to me, personally, is the fact that they use our western mentality in the world of pokemon. The Pokemon World is everything about these monster, you're right, the other teams focus on this. But Rocket don't care about it.
Our world could try and be respectful of animals, but we are not. We have used them as tools in the past, we use them as food, and we're biased to some species. You take this mentallity into Pokemon, and it does make sense that you should use them like tools to be the king of the world.
That, to me, makes Rocket Team a better "bad guys group", since they're basically our capitalist society in a totally different world.
Preservation of nature via drowning every non-water-living form. Yeah, it makes total sense.
I don't know why people try to make the other teams more smart. They aren't. Plasma team does come with a good question about the Pokemon world, and that's why they work.
Then there's literally no reason to blame Origin for supposedly spam Charizard into everything.
Ah, "but it tries to be like the Game!". I remember my first time with Pokemon Silver. I spammed Feraligatr into everything and still beated it.
I you don't like Origins, that's fine. It is an Anime about Pokemon maketed to a different audience that the main series. It's well recieved by their audience, since what wants to do, it does well. It has better dialoge, as you said it's slighly more brutal. etc.
The main series is all about making cool battles and stuff. It does well that. But it's a kid's show, and that's fine of course.
I like the VGC battles. I like the video game.
Again, 4 OVAS vs a show with lots of episodes.
I would have love to have a longer show like Origins telling everything else, but we won't, because the main series sells more and the kids buy more toys, and the games, and the cards, because of watching it.
Origins was awesome. Much more my style of anime and wish it wasn't just a 3 episode ova. Loved what they managed to squeeze in though. And honestly seeing Red use his OG trio starter against some of the most important opponents makes sense, especially since yes, they were promoting XY as well with M Charizard X. But.
You could boil any anime into pandering to a crowd or another. It's a commercially produced piece of art. There is someone making sure money is made for the project to move forward. "Pandering" to something so many people would enjoy is a no-brainer. Don't understand the apprehension toward anything harking back to gen 1 or otherwise using nostalgia as a feature. All of it is pretty great, old stuff and new. Keeping touch with all of its own iterations throughout future entries is a great part of Pokemon.
You could boil any anime into pandering to a crowd or another. It's a commercially produced piece of art. There is someone making sure money is made for the project to move forward. "Pandering" to something so many people would enjoy is a no-brainer. Don't understand the apprehension toward anything harking back to gen 1 or otherwise using nostalgia as a feature. All of it is pretty great, old stuff and new. Keeping touch with all of its own iterations throughout future entries is a great part of Pokemon.
Serpens007
Member
Agree 100%
Professor Beef
Banned
why did you quote me twice and not say anything
Featuring idiotic peekaboo Slowbro and COME AT ME BRO Blastoise!
Simply incredible! Your Pokémon arts are fantastic! Do you have a DeviantArt?
...and I must ask, could you draw a Totodile for me, please?
Sutton Dagger
Member
So ever since the rerelease of the original games I'm getting into pokemon again...like big time 
I'm in Japan and I bought a Japanese copy of Sapphire, that wasn't enough I've been trying to get a pokemon 2ds but it's sold out everywhere. So my Airbnb host helped me order the green version this morning, arrives tomorrow and then I'm going to go get that shiny Ho-oh. So excited
I'm in Japan and I bought a Japanese copy of Sapphire, that wasn't enough I've been trying to get a pokemon 2ds but it's sold out everywhere. So my Airbnb host helped me order the green version this morning, arrives tomorrow and then I'm going to go get that shiny Ho-oh. So excited
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
They have to sell him yes. But my point is at least they circulate Ash mons around on the center stage.
The main anime didn't have that problem. That is my point. Yeah they shill, but they shill equally. Yes, even if Pikachu is the star at most is that he's most on the screen. He never takes up much of the fight.
It doesn't make sense because you got shit like mons with elemental powers that can tear the world. That's why I brought up villain groups in other games, hell even Digimon in both games and anime. It doesn't make them better, it makes them look low-bit, and it adds more stupidity when you do that (how come no one stops them when everyone has access to mons? how come he was only stopped because of some kid who beat him in gym badges? etc.)
It showed how in the grand scheme of things, they were unimportant. That is what the presentation evoked.
The anime right from the bat didn't go on screaming "we're accurate!" The anime prefers going for drama or something that works better for showing battle drama. Yeah they bring up typings ever so often, but mostly for the benefit of battle drama. Origins doesn't have that - doubly more if Origins' fanbase like to scream like that.
So this makes me wonder if you remember much of the anime.
Yeah Pikachu is the mascot, but the way the anime did it is that it never took up much of the screentime, but in fights and pretty much character development. That's why people are fine with him.
Hell let's look at XY, out of the 7 gym badges so far, he only participated in 4, and in one of those he was knocked out. Hawlucha had more fights that him (pretty much all gym battles since his catch). But Pikachu was never treated anything special. He just a battler there. The closest you get is that he stood toe to toe with Mega Lucario, but that match was more or less build up since Korrina's intro.
That is the point. It's not like how Charizard was handled, where every scene featured him, win or lose. If the anime handled what you said, Pikachu was shown with long battles while the rest are just clip shows.
And that's why they fail - they apply mundane shit on fantasy monsters. That's like a space pirate trying to rob a bank - why would a space pirate rob a bank?
That's the thing though - Origins did shit that something can't be seen in the games, like one shot attacks or even the Mewtwo fight.
And then you bring up the "it's better" crap while going for the "it's fine", you're just asking yourself for an argument. Better dialog? It's one of the more stilted lines because they are using Gen 1 script. Outside of the first fight nothing about it is brutal as it went into standard battle animation which the anime has been doing better. And well, XY battles are just better period.
Featuring idiotic peekaboo Slowbro and COME AT ME BRO Blastoise!
So awesome....
This only makes the wait for Hawlucha harder
Serpens007
Member
For the pikachu stuff, of course it rotates the Team. They have to sell more toys. Hell, Hawlucha is probably one of the most popular mons in gen 6, so they spam it into most gym fights. Hey, but the fights are.better, period, so its Fine.
Origins has one job to do, and is to get back old players. It did, for my audience, the audience that for years stopped caring about Pokemon because the anime was too comedic and childish, and brought something more serious, while still beign Pokemon.
About the Team Rocket, I dont know whats so hard to get. Red passion makes Giovanni to remember how he felt about Pokemon when he growed up. Its silly, but not as silly as reviving Ash using tears.
Mundane into fantasy, thsts subjective. To me its fantastic because it shows how shitty our Mentality is.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
What I'm getting at is that you traded one shit to another shit. Red "chatting to Giovanni" is pretty much cliche'd writing, nothing special or unique. And hell, Ash tears is so old and worn out.
And Origins is far from serious, something that kept getting tossed around. Yeah that Marowak who died - more like it just proved how stupid the dex entry is. And that crying battle... which only happened once.
In fact, most of your arguments rely mostly on shit that never happens nowadays. You compare it to OS when XY already did away many things OS did.
And Origins is far from serious, something that kept getting tossed around. Yeah that Marowak who died - more like it just proved how stupid the dex entry is. And that crying battle... which only happened once.
In fact, most of your arguments rely mostly on shit that never happens nowadays. You compare it to OS when XY already did away many things OS did.
The Shadow Knight
Member
Now this is a bit of a weird comparison. The appeal of watching competitive Pokemon games is not flashiness, it's about being invested in the game itself. Just like it goes with spectating most competitive things. Feels like apples and oranges to me.
Serpens007
Member
Origins is more serious. 4 OVAS and you get: Squirtle torturing Charmander, Team Rocket killing Marowak, Rocket Team experimenting on Pokemon, Mewtwo nearly killing both Green and Red, etc.
While watching XY&Z, in the second chapter you already get a stupid filler episode of a Quilladin giving flowers to an Eevee because it was in love.
Now, you can say that stuff of Greninja-Ash making him feeling the pain is better (I don't even know what to make of it, it's too cheesy), it should be considered that Origins came before XY, the tone shift may be due to one of them showing that it can be done well.
You can dislike Origins, if it isn't for you. But you can't deny is a different take on Pokemon Anime. Both have silly stuff, but they are made for different audiences, that's what I'm getting at. The main anime is more child-friendly and that take away a lot of us when watching it. And many of us don't feel like that when watching Origins. Thus, we'd love to watch more of that.
Aaronrules380
Member
Why can't things be enjoyable because they're fun and entertaining, and not because of super serious dark shit. Serious is not the same as more mature. Origins really wasn't mature at all tbh. It didn't really have any actual themes. It didn't explore any unique or interesting ideas. It was just a rote telling of the original story.
Serpens007
Member
I didnt say its mature. Its Pokemon after all. Its more serious.
It doesnt have to be, but some of us enjoy it. Again, two diferrent shows with silly stuff for two different audiences.
It's really not that serious. If it were serious the battles would be full-length and all have real emotional drive behind them. The only 'serious' moment is that first battle. After that, everything's pretty much a nosedive into shallow fanfare.
Serpens007
Member
As I said, we had serious moments in every chapter. But is still Pokemon.
Again, its only 4 ovas. Origins was and will never be the focus of TPC.
Why cant we have something we like if you have houndreds of episodes of what you like?
Jesus, its like if Origins is the antichrist of Pokemon.
Aaronrules380
Member
I liked Origins. But calling it much better than the current anime is ludicrous. For example, you complained about filler. But filler is absolutely unavoidable with a long running pokemon anime if you want to actually keep in pace with the current games (and since anime isn't cheap, and the main purpose of a Pokemon anime is to sell games and merchandise, this is a necessity for a long running series).
People who say the main anime should be like origins miss the point that Origins could not have been the way it was as a long running series
Honestly, if we got a new pokemon anime, I'd love for it to be based on the Pokemon Special (Pokemon Adventures) manga.
They can be, but they're not.
I'm of the same coin, that XYZ is too kid focused for me to thoroughly enjoy and follow the series. They have their share of awesome episodes tho. XYZ first episodes were pretty awesome.
It's not being dark or mature or whatever that makes it awesome. Its being stylized and more oriented toward our age group.
It's not hard to understand why people over 21 have a hard time watching Pokemon as a real show and not a little kids after school show.
But yeah it's a product of Pokemon being an anime designed to potentially run forever.
If they ever did an origins series it should just be a mini - medium series hand have a definitive start and end.
I enjoy both but honestly my tolerance for cute anime and Pokemon related things is easily much higher than my peers. But I'm no bossdoggie either
I am almost finished with Twilight Princess HD then I can continue my Pokémon run by playing Pokémon Silver.
But first I have to deal with, urgh the Cave of Shadow.
I get what you're saying and I kinda agree which is why I pretty much stick to Pokémon Adventure and the Main series animé and just tune into the animé when I am not playing the game or just want more sustenance from the series, like how a certain move would work outside the video game realm.
The only exception was the Sinnoh arc as the Paul Vs Ash rivalry was interesting and appealed to me as Paul represented the players who primary focused on the competitive battling scene and Ash represented the players who just dabbled with the main games with their favorites.
TriggerShy
Member
Poke-GAF, I’ve just started watching XY Anime I’m actually shocked how good it is! The sidekicks are actually likeable this time around.
This is the first time since Orange island that I don’t feel like I’m forcing myself to watch it, my nostalgia glasses have officially been thrown in the bin sorry…. Kanto you’ve been dethroned.
This is the first time since Orange island that I don’t feel like I’m forcing myself to watch it, my nostalgia glasses have officially been thrown in the bin sorry…. Kanto you’ve been dethroned.
Okay that's awesome.
Yes
Serena can use headbutt on a ghost type Pokémon...she must have Scrappy for her ability. ;p
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
That's not torture, that's battle. You just regurgitated what I said on how it was "serious", with the serious being silly when you take it apart and short. Also don't give me that etc., those were the only "serious" moments, also Mewtwo doesn't count because Ash puts himself in plenty of near-death moments so much.
What are breathing room eps? You do realize you just came off from a rather intense XYZ1 ep right?
You imply nothing serious happened in XY or even prior.
Again just because it isn't overt or in your face doesn't mean XY can't have serious moments. The fact that you even cite Ash-Greninja shows how you miss a lot of things that are serious. XY alone had genocide caused by war of finite resources, handling grief (twice!), handling separation at an early age (twice!), visible torture because of the idea of having greater good (much worse than "torture for funsies"), and small things like raising a child.
I do love Bonnie episodes like that.
And that's okay, what I dislike and argue is how you take away what XY did and somehow put Origins in a pedestal. When you do things like that, you're putting up arguments which you must prepare to discuss/argue with.
enjoy the ride
curious, you sub or dub?
As long as people don't forget what the show is aiming for and figure out how it ends, they shouldn't have trouble watching this. As they say, enjoy the ride.
Also stop with that "real show vs not real show" bullshit. That's bad and gives the impression that children should not be given quality work.
What I dislike is the viewpoint on Origin like "catered for the fans" when the more you look at it and break it down, it feels more like an insult to fans. That it only caters to fans who don't put much thought to what is fed to them.
*coughcough Digimon Tri coughcough*
also mind you I'm not fan of the anime as much as I am fan of XY anime particularly, but at the same time I am more of a "get your facts straight" guy than anything else so if you see me arguing towards the series outside of XY it's more of me correcting misinformation than being a fan of the series outside of XY
like I would be at your throat when you say "Ash doesn't like to evolve his Pokemon!", not because I am a fan of the anime per se (XY only), but because it's a baseless statement that is actually false.
dakkumauji
Member
i'm not surprised they kinda skimped out on the last showcase episode with making the semi-finals really short or skipping most of elle's showcase
but even then it was still a great episode and basically felt like serena could have left the group at the end of it and it would have felt completely satisfactory for her character
also using her ED at the end of the episode was a really nice touch
but even then it was still a great episode and basically felt like serena could have left the group at the end of it and it would have felt completely satisfactory for her character
also using her ED at the end of the episode was a really nice touch
Inquisitive_Ghost
Member
Holy shit these are so good.
If you're still drawing some, if you do a Furret or natutal-form Furfrou I'd love to see them. They're my favorite Pokemon.
All right, I'll get the official art a--
DUDE
You had an opportunity for a dog in a top hat and you DIDN'T TAKE IT
I'm sorry, I'm going to have to employ a little artistic license here. If I can't put it in a top hat, I'm at least making it as snooty as I can.
Seriously though, this was a fun set.
I feel like a new person, LOVEEEEEEE it, thanks very muchAll right, I'll get the official art a--
DUDE
You had an opportunity for a dog in a top hat and you DIDN'T TAKE IT
I'm sorry, I'm going to have to employ a little artistic license here. If I can't put it in a top hat, I'm at least making it as snooty as I can.
Seriously though, this was a fun set.
Dub, I usually stick to subs, but the convenience of it being on Netflix has persuaded me to it.
If I was to switch to subs at some point what group do you recommend?