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PoliGAF 2011: Of Weiners, Boehners, Santorum, and Teabags
- Thread starter PantherLotus
- Start date
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BotoxAgent
Member
dave is ok said:
THE FUCK!!
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
President Lotus: I'll agree to a 5% repatriation tax if you agree to a 30% tax on exported dollars.
Deal?
Deal?
TacticalFox88
Banned
If Obama vetoes it , it will die right?....Right?
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
GhaleonEB said:
It really would be perfectly in line with every other thing he's done. That's who he is.
He's verbally progressive and makes us feel good about social issues, except what's unpopular and the right thing to do, and he's politically and fiscally retentive, except what's popular and the right thing to do.
speculawyer
Member
Oh Texas.
http://news.yahoo.com/teaching-evolution-debate-again-texas-090349712.html
What happened to jobs, jobs, jobs? No, we are back to usual GOP fare of abortion, gays, evolution, defunding planned parenthood, etc.
.
http://news.yahoo.com/teaching-evolution-debate-again-texas-090349712.html
What happened to jobs, jobs, jobs? No, we are back to usual GOP fare of abortion, gays, evolution, defunding planned parenthood, etc.
There are things more important than re-election.Manmademan said:
Also, enacting dumb policies that are not going to work is not going to help his re-election bid.
For example, look how brilliantly caving for the GOP over the Bush tax cuts worked.
I so called it.dave is ok said:
People don't really understand the issue and there's a giant pool of money at stake here; they'll just dump into the fine print of some omnibus bill.
speculawyer
Member
I think the Obama administration is desperate for anything that can juice the economy even if it is just for a short term burst and is actually really bad long-term policy.dave is ok said:
Invisible_Insane
Member
Which economy? It's parallel to QE--good for the markets and people with money, but no perceptible impact (or arguably, a negative one) on the people who actually need help.speculawyer said:
Manmademan
Member
speculawyer said:
except we've seen in 2004 that corporate tax holidays do absolutely nothing to "juice the economy." in fact they might even damage it by encouraging corporations to keep offshoring profits hoping for another holiday.
I don't mind Obama, but I would kill someone- literally kill someone- for President Franken to happen.
Dude Abides
Banned
Increasingly looks like the GOP has called Obama's bluff and he's gonna cave.
Manmademan
Member
DasRaven said:
This also.
edit: didn't realize scalia was that old. Why do supreme court justices seem to live forever, but our rock icons die so young
speculawyer
Member
Oh I agree that it is terrible awful shit policy and doesn't do much at all.Manmademan said:
But bringing the money into the USA and getting at least some small tax revenues from it is better than just having it remain parked outside the country.
Vicetrailia
Member
Damn man I feel like giving up on the US.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
Dude Abides said:
He kind of has to cave if he cares at all about the US and it's citizens. Republicans welcome a default. It's insanity.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Dude Abides said:
So its a regular weekday in the White House I guess.
speculawyer
Member
It is would be interesting to see what would happen to USA politics if Obama lost, Kennedy died, and abortion became illegal in much of the USA. I dread the prospect of that but it sure would make for interesting times. We would witness an acceleration in the USA's slide from super-power to silly-power.DasRaven said:
speculawyer
Member
Fuck that. He shouldn't cave. Perhaps let the deadline come & go and then order Treasury auctions to continue on a constitutional basis.quadriplegicjon said:
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
speculawyer said:
This. Let the world see the Tea Party Republicans for what they truly are. Ahhh hell, who am I kidding. Obama is going to cave, probably already has.
That's true, but I think that stuff like raising Medicare eligibility or another tax holiday are even more important than that.DasRaven said:
And while the GOP can probably do a tax holiday on their own, there is no way in hell that they're able to touch medicare, they need dems for that.
Also, I don't think picking those dumb policies that don't work is helping his re-election chances.
They will never ever overturn Roe v. Wade.speculawyer said:
It's the main thing that make evangelicals vote for the GOP.
Once that off the table those people might look at what Jesus said about poor people.
If we raise Medicare eligibility age, it's not going to come back for a long long long long time.DasRaven said:
Which is exactly my point: We ought to review bad administrations every 4 years and not default to the judiciary time table. The argument that we can't punish Obama because of the Supreme Court is the one that denies the urgency and importance of the 4 year Presidential term.DasRaven said:
Manmademan
Member
Evlar said:
"punishing" Obama and having the Supreme court turn over to neoconservatives for the next 20 years is the exact definition of cutting off your nose to spite your face.
And what... Rolling over for a President who is turning more and more conservative by the week is perfectly acceptable? "We got judges, who cares about the economy?" I think you're vastly understating the price we're paying for the possibility of Supreme Court nominations.Manmademan said:
Manmademan
Member
Evlar said:
So...moderate dem president with conservative leanings is too conservative for you, So Voting in someone even MORE conservative and stacking the supreme court with conservatives for decades is obviously the answer?
How about no.
President Romney/Perry/Bachmann would be pushing policies infinitely worse than anything Obama would implement. Frustrated at the speed don't ask don't tell is being repealed? have fun seeing it re-implemented.
What progressives NEED to do to get their point across is to get themselves organized and heard as much as the Tea Party does- which is the only thing the Tea party is competent at, and the only area in which liberals and progressives have been failures.
And how do we do any of that without challenging Obama? If you want to emulate the Tea Party let's talk about their most fundamental tactic: supporting challengers against the Republican establishment who they disagreed with ideologically. I'm saddled with the dipshit Governor Rick Scott because he was able to challenge and defeat the Republican incumbent. EDIT: AND, incidentally, the Republican establishment candidate to unseat the Republican incumbent. Two levels of back-bench dissent.Manmademan said:
Being concerned isn't enough. Organizing for no purpose is obviously purposeless. If you aren't willing to challenge the structures in the Democratic party that makes this shit possible, challenge the incumbents who keep walking the line between the parties further and further rightward, we'll continue to be ineffective.
polyh3dron
Banned
it's like batman and the fucking joker.quadriplegicjon said:
Invisible_Insane
Member
Much as the idea of Obama sticking it to the Republicans (and the stupid concept of a debt ceiling) via Constitutional option appeals to me, it is worth remembering that the success of such a tactic depends on the willingness of bond markets to accept such debt as legitimate. If they don't, it doesn't really matter what he does.
Manmademan
Member
Evlar said:
The fact of the matter is midway through the presidency? you can't. You can vote for him, or vote for the opposing party. You don't have the ability to pressure a sitting president via primary elections. Want someone more progressive than Obama? you have to wait until 2016 to make your point.
In the meantime, You CAN put pressure on the democrats in the house and senate- If democratic politicians were as mortally afraid of primary challenges as republicans were, We'd see more pressure on Obama from within the party. as it is, they're content to take the "safe" route and drift rightward like everyone else.
PhoenixDark
Banned
dave is ok said:
"But he had to do it in order to get a deal!"
pathetic.
lo escondido
Apartheid is, in fact, not institutional racism
Invisible_Insane said:
The only way I can really see this being effective is if it through a supreme court ruling the debt ceiling itself is unconstitutional
And on the reparation. As much as it sucks. What is your solution for getting that money back to the US? They will increasingly stash it overseas (especially since the world is becoming evermore globalized). Its either get nothing or get 5%.
PhoenixDark
Banned
lo escondido said:
I don't care much about getting 5% - I'm more concerned that no jobs will come of this. It's just a money run.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
empty vessel said:
This is crazy talk EV and you know it. You know the DEMs would never enact Republican policies the way the GOP would. If they do it means that the country has probably moved a little to the right.
If the DEMs are passing a republican policy then that means the GOP would have passed a super right/super conservative bill.
It does matter. It's a matter of degrees.
Dude Abides
Banned
quadriplegicjon said:
Yep. Somebody on some show or podcast said that the best strategy in playing chicken is to remove the steering wheel from your car at the outset, and make sure the other player sees it, which is basically what the GOP has done.
aronnov reborn
Banned
speculawyer said:
Goes without saying we have to keep abortions going if we want to stay a super-power!
First of all, we can make it harder for them to stash it over seas.lo escondido said:
Like, oh, I don't know, stipulate that they need to pay taxes on it when they bring it back?
But more importantly, they need that money back so they can put it on their balance sheets and get those massive bonuses they want.
Why do you think they lobby so hard for another tax holiday?
And finally, if we do it again we'll effectively have a tax corporate tax rate of 5%, as companies would have be crazy (and negligent of its duty to the shareholders) to not try to do it again.
jamesinclair
Banned
Cyan said:
I have an idea. Elect me as preseident.
I'll tell corporate america this.
"Want to bring that money back? I suggest you do it now while it will be taxed at 35%, because Im about to implement a tax-break holiday. As of August 15, 2011, money brought back into the country will be taxed at 50%. Your move."
That way, money comes back AND we get our taxes AND we break the moral hazard cycle.
aronnov reborn
Banned
jamesinclair said:
You mean they wait 4 years until you're out of office?
PhoenixDark
Banned
mckmas8808 said:
At this point I'm starting to wonder how much of a difference there is between getting full fucked and half fucked. Both parties seem content to let the financial sector raid the economy and pave the way to the middle class's death.
I assume this is what you are referring to.Dude Abides said:
A Congressional aide briefed on ongoing negotiations between House Speaker John Boehner and President Obama says the two principals may be nearing a "grand bargain" on to raise the debt limit which would contain large, set-in-stone spending cuts but only the possibility of future revenue increases.
"All cuts," the aide said. "Maybe revenues some time in the future."
"All cuts," the aide said. "Maybe revenues some time in the future."
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/...ership-on-big-deal-with-boehner.php?ref=fpblg
Doesn't a grand bagain mean people on both sides give up things? If this comes to pass, then yes, they called Obama's bluff, and he folded.
Invisible_Insane
Member
Hope your plan comes with a cooperative Congress.jamesinclair said:
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